Are scientists suckers for Jihad?

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- SCM
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Are scientists suckers for Jihad?
OP - December 08, 2015, 08:14 AM

According to a study described in this article they are...

http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2015/dec/03/scientists-easy-prey-jihadis-terrorists-engineering-mindset

Quote
The terrorists’ black and white worldview appeals to an ‘engineering mindset’, a study suggests. A broader education would give vulnerable students the tools to question authority

What kind of person becomes a jihadi terrorist? Specifically, what kind of educated person? The overwhelming majority of graduates recruited into Islamist terrorism studied engineering, science and medicine. Almost none are social science or arts graduates, according to research. The insight could have important implications.

Almost half (48.5%) of jihadis recruited in the Middle East and north Africa had a higher education of some sort, according to a 2007 analysis by Diego Gambetta that is cited in Immunising the Mind, a new paper published by the British Council; of these 44% had degrees in engineering. Among western-recruited jihadis that figure rose to 59%.

A study of terrorists in Tunisia – where an electrical engineer went on a murderous rampage in June – showed similar proportions. And a study of 18 British Muslims implicated in terrorist attacks found that eight had studied engineering or IT, and four more science, pharmacy and maths; only one had studied humanities.
- dr_sloth
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Reply #1 - December 08, 2015, 09:15 AM

engineers aren't scientists.

Lots of Muslims in general, study engineering or medicine, rather than evolutionary biology (to take the most obvious example). You could take any category where Muslims are disproportionately represented, such as 'men with beards', and engineering graduates would also be disproportionately represented.

http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Engineers_and_woo
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Reply #2 - December 08, 2015, 09:39 AM

I wasn't taking the study itself all that seriously I have to say. I'm a scientist myself and I had the impression the artsy types that did the study were using to say 'arts are important otherwise ... ISIS!'

I did wonder if they had controlled for subjects muslims prefer to study. Reading some stories of ex-muslims here and elsewhere it seem studying science is one thing that caused some of them to doubt the Quran.
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Reply #3 - December 08, 2015, 10:54 AM

Didn't read the article but I've made similar conclusions myself a long time ago. It depends how you define "science". Are we talking biology, astrophysics etc or are we talking computer enginering... get my point? Studying Social sciences and Humanities often opens up a lot of new insights and more or less forces you to let go of the black and white thought pattern that often leads to some sort of -ism or the other. Nearly all ex-Muslim ladies I personally know of who have some sort of education, say they started questioning Islam when they started studying issues like source criticism, Sociology, Gender studies or other subjects within those areas.

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Reply #4 - December 08, 2015, 11:15 AM

Quote from: SCM on December 08, 2015, 09:39 AM
................... Reading some stories of ex-muslims here and elsewhere it seem studying science is one thing that caused some of them to doubt the Quran............

In your mind what kind of science studying and what level will cause people to leave faiths SCM??

High School??

And...and there are 1000s of people who left stupid faiths who were never scientists never studied in science and never worked for science. So should I give you some 1000 examples from different faiths ??

Do not let silence become your legacy.. Question everything
I renounced my faith to become a kafir,
the beloved betrayed me and turned in to a Muslim
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Reply #5 - December 08, 2015, 11:46 AM

I wasn't saying it was the *only* thing that caused people to leave Islam Yeez! Just that some people mentioned studying evolution or similar scientific topics at University (or indeed high school) caused them to have doubts because it is at odds with texts in the Quran - and I can certainly imagine the same for gender studies and some other social studies too!

If it is a real effect I wonder if it is the same kind of thing with engineers and (to a lesser extent) theoretical physicists being over represented in climate skepticism. (Though in that case it seems to be something that mainly happens around retirement age!).

Having said that the Gender/social studies fans from Goldsmith Femsoc & LGBTQ+ soc don't seemed to have developed much in the critical thought department :-(.

...

I found the actual paper - https://www.britishcouncil.org/sites/default/files/immunising_the_mind_working_paper.pdf if anyone wants a look.
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Reply #6 - December 08, 2015, 01:34 PM

Al Ghazali is relevant here. I can't exactly what he was blabbering about, but he thought you should stick to the scientific or mathematical disciplines with obvious practical benefit. Theoretical pondering is not only a waste of time, but dangerous for your iman. Don't risk it.
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Reply #7 - December 09, 2015, 09:55 PM

It's been noticed before that among the more vocal YEC's (Christian Young Earth Creationists) there do seem to be a large number that have engineering qualifications. I have no idea if or how that would relate to recruits for Islamic extremism.

It had occurred to me that the relationship between engineering and YEC's may have something to do with engineering attracting people whose mindset sees everything as designed. I have no support for this. It was just something I was wondering about. However, it may have some relation to fundamentalism in any religion.

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