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Theme Changer

 Topic: The Quran

 (Read 3981 times)
  • Previous page 1 2« Previous thread | Next thread »
  • The Quran
     Reply #30 - April 08, 2013, 08:59 PM

    In taichi there are various schools and variants and teachers.

    Does Islam have schools that say how one should pray, wash, bow etc?  Are the conflicts about what is "Islamic" only the views of certain schools?  Why have they become violent?  I do not recall taichi masters being at war with each other!

    My taichi instructor continually tells us to work out our own taichi.  Is there such a thing as working out one's own Islam?

    How much has China changed Islam?


    I always wondered why Allah didn't send his message to the chinese, considering that they were a much more advanced society.
  • The Quran
     Reply #31 - April 08, 2013, 09:07 PM

    Christianity reached China about 600 and very quickly was changed into a far more peaceful religion. 

    http://www.sevenpillarshouse.org/article/the_jesus_sutras_an_ancient_message_for_a_post_modernist_future/

    I do not understand how it is Islam seems not to have changed that much when it met different peoples.  It must have.

    When you are a Bear of Very Little Brain, and you Think of Things, you find sometimes that a Thing which seemed very Thingish inside you is quite different when it gets out into the open and has other people looking at it.


    A.A. Milne,

    "We cannot slaughter each other out of the human impasse"
  • The Quran
     Reply #32 - April 08, 2013, 09:12 PM

    They are different religions moi. The original teachings of Islam are more accurately preserved, and are vividly detailed. Ofcourse, the religion has thousands of disagreements. But it's just incomparable to Christianity.
  • The Quran
     Reply #33 - April 08, 2013, 09:39 PM

    Is it just me, maybe i might be biased. But growing up Christian there were a lot less head-butting over what it true Christianity is.
    Islam seems to nit-pick over the finer (more often insignificant details) causing all these different debates and arguments over laws, rights, lifestyles, clothes, spouses etc.
    There are many sects of Christianity but no one really makes it a huge issue.  Can't Islam just be satisfied with it's followers worshiping Allah and Muhammad and get over everything else.

    ***~Church is where bad people go to hide~***
  • The Quran
     Reply #34 - April 08, 2013, 09:51 PM

    All religions have their head butters!  It seems Islam is more efficient at collecting and improving them than others!

    When you are a Bear of Very Little Brain, and you Think of Things, you find sometimes that a Thing which seemed very Thingish inside you is quite different when it gets out into the open and has other people looking at it.


    A.A. Milne,

    "We cannot slaughter each other out of the human impasse"
  • The Quran
     Reply #35 - April 08, 2013, 09:55 PM

    Wow, this thread is an interesting read. Great posts from HM.

    Believe those who are seeking the truth. Doubt those who find it.
  • The Quran
     Reply #36 - April 08, 2013, 10:17 PM

    Yeah HM, good job (Y)
  • The Quran
     Reply #37 - April 08, 2013, 10:33 PM

    Thanks guys. It was an intersting topic.
  • The Quran
     Reply #38 - April 08, 2013, 10:49 PM

    Quote
    My taichi instructor continually tells us to work out our own taichi.  Is there such a thing as working out one's own Islam?

    How much has China changed Islam?


    Moi, I literally jumped out of my chair when I read this question! I have thee PERFECT article for you to read, from my favorite American Muslim scholar, Dr. Umar Farooq Abd-Allah

    Enjoy!

    http://www.nawawi.org/wp-content/uploads/2013/01/Article5.pdf

    And I am glad to hear that you are a student of the Tao and TaiChi.  It's pretty life changing stuff.  I have heard that same line from my Sensei (I am a student of Jun Fan Jeet Kune Do)...that we have to make the art "our own" and really as a former Muslim, let me tell you that that concept is utterly foreign to the way my mind had been brainwashed for over a decade into thinking that we had to shove ourselves into the mold of "the path" or "the deen" rather than applying the deen to our already existent personality, creativity and unique sense of "self. 

    This topic (eastern philosphy vs Islamic philosphy) fascinates me to no end and the more I am studying the more I am amazed at the differences.   Taoism and Buddhism gave me the keys to unlocking my individuality, creativity and helped me live life to my fullest potential.  Now, some women are able to do that and remain in the mold of Islam....I was unable.  Too many roadblocks, taboos and contradictions, sorry. 

    Please take the time and read the article.  I really think you will thoroughly enjoy it!


    Do not go gentle into that good night.
    Rage, rage against the dying of the light.
  • The Quran
     Reply #39 - April 09, 2013, 09:28 AM

    Quote
    The notion of the sinicization of Islam in China is based on a false preconception of Islam and its at- titude toward indigenous cultures. It presumes that the only valid (“orthodox”) expression of Islam is Middle Eastern. In reality, neither Muslim societies in history nor classical Islamic law produced uni- form patterns of cultural expression. Muslims have always formulated distinctive indigenous forms of Islamic cultural expression wherever they went, and the process was encouraged by Islam’s religious law.9


    Martin Palmer is very interesting about what happened to Christianity when it arrived in China in the 600s.  It was put in a religious "zoo" in the emperors gardens and very quickly adapted to Chinese ideas.  It looks like Islam had a similar experience.

    It does look like the concept of the ummah is a fiction and everyone develops their own "way"!

    Quote
    My colleagues and I had come to Lou Guan Tai, the site of the greatest official Daoist temple. I believed that the earliest Christian church in China was located nearby.

    West of the main temple, we saw a perilously leaning seven-storey pagoda. We asked an old woman, a vendor of amulets, sitting nearby what religion it represented. “It is Buddhist,” she replied. As we turned away disappointed, she added, “But it wasn’t always Buddhist.”  

    Our hopes were aroused until she continued, “It used to be Daoist,” she told us. Crestfallen, we again prepared to leave. With impeccable timing, she again prevented us from departing.

    It doesn’t really belong to either of them, though,” the old woman confided. “It was built by five monks who came from the West and believed in one God.”

    To explore further, we climbed the steep hill into which the site had been cut. We scrambled to the top—and were welcomed by another aged lady, a Buddhist nun who informed us that she was 115 years old.

    We searched for proof that the pagoda had once been Christian. No evidence offered itself. Only when I climbed still higher did I discover that we had found what we had sought. Daoist, Confucian, and Buddhist temples, almost without exception, run north-south. This terrace, cut to hold the temple, ran east-west: the cosmic alignment for Christian churches.


    http://www.sevenpillarshouse.org/article/the_jesus_sutras_an_ancient_message_for_a_post_modernist_future/

    When you are a Bear of Very Little Brain, and you Think of Things, you find sometimes that a Thing which seemed very Thingish inside you is quite different when it gets out into the open and has other people looking at it.


    A.A. Milne,

    "We cannot slaughter each other out of the human impasse"
  • The Quran
     Reply #40 - April 09, 2013, 11:50 AM

    Quote
    It does look like the concept of the ummah is a fiction and everyone develops their own "way"!


    I agree.  If you look at Islam historically...pre 100-200 years ago, it (for the most part) did it's utmost to NOT be a culture basher/destroyer.  What the hell happened to it in the modern era with it's "one size must fit all" mentality is beyond me.

    I am not sure if the quote is in that article, but the way Dr. Umar put it (he was quoting someone) was that Islam should be like the clear water running through a pristine river bed.  It should always allow the colors of the stones that it flows over to come through bright and clear....never changing them, but amplifying their beauty.

    Unfortunately nowadays that is definitely not the case.  Everything needs to fit this "perfect" vision of a "monolithic Islam" that ironically enough, never even existed in reality.  The Hizbu-Tahrir Khilafah fairytales are a primo example of revisionist history, run amok.   I think if Muslims where to study history a bit more, they would have their "idealized" bubbles burst.

    But Muslims are far too busy pumping out the next generation of engineers and doctors than *god forbid* historians, archeologists, sociologists and cultural anthropologists...so good luck on that front. 

    Do not go gentle into that good night.
    Rage, rage against the dying of the light.
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