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Theme Changer

 Poll

  • Question: When you were a muslim, what was your interpretation on the penal code of Islamic law(corporal punishment)
  • Rejection in application and in theory - 1 (8.3%)
  • Rejection of application through use of loopholes and acceptance in theory - 7 (58.3%)
  • Support in practice and in theory - 4 (33.3%)
  • Total Voters: 12

 Topic: Sharia penal code, rejection,rejection through loopholes or applikation

 (Read 4448 times)
  • 1« Previous thread | Next thread »
  • Sharia penal code, rejection,rejection through loopholes or applikation
     OP - February 26, 2015, 02:10 PM
    There are three ways that different muslims deal with the interpretation of the penal code of Islamic law(barbaric laws such as limb chopping,stoning and flogging) . The first one is rejection both in theory and in practice. The second one is acceptance in theory, but rejection through the use of loopholes in practice, either because of emotional(moral) reasons or because of interpretation. The third one is one of both acceptance in theory and in application.

    In the first case, no matter what conditions are fulfilled, rejection is clear both in theory and in practice. In the second case, a person may believe in ideal conditions that would render application practically impossible, but theoretically possible. An ideal condition could be that there's absolute certainty, or that there are no liars and sinners. It could be that those condition haven't been fulfilled for hundreds of years or since the death of the prophet anywhere in the world. This is similar to the loopholes given to avoid riba(interest or usury) in Islamic banking. In the third case the application itself is believed to produce such ideal conditions.
    Which type were you
  • Sharia penal code, rejection,rejection through loopholes or applikation
     Reply #1 - February 26, 2015, 02:16 PM
    "Rejection of application through use of loopholes but acceptance in theory"

    Yes, I'm afraid I used to be one of those who thought that in some 'perfect' Islamic State everything would be wonderful and the punishments were just deterrents that would never be implemented.

    I tried to avoid thinking about it too deeply and if people pointed to examples of barbaric Muslim regimes I would use the standard:

    "Oh that's not a true Islamic State" or "they are misinterpreting Islam"

    Yep, 'fraid so... <hangs head in shame>
  • Sharia penal code, rejection,rejection through loopholes or applikation
     Reply #2 - February 26, 2015, 03:51 PM
    Yeah, funny you would mention that, Abu. I used to justify (to myself) the implementation of Sharia in an "ideal Islamic State" as well, but somehow after I apostatized I lost the ability to even understand that argument anymore. What the fuck does "ideal Islamic State" even mean and why is that a pre-requisite for applying Sharia? Islam does weird thing to the brain.
    He's no friend to the friendless
    And he's the mother of grief
    There's only sorrow for tomorrow
    Surely life is too brief
  • Sharia penal code, rejection,rejection through loopholes or applikation
     Reply #3 - February 26, 2015, 04:00 PM
    lol... true.

    I guess it's the way the mind tries to cope with contradictions.
  • Sharia penal code, rejection,rejection through loopholes or applikation
     Reply #4 - February 26, 2015, 04:35 PM
    Quote from: Naerys on February 26, 2015, 03:51 PM
    Yeah, funny you would mention that, Abu. .........What the fuck does "ideal Islamic State" even mean ??

     
    what a simple and silly question from Naerys., I guess CEMBers are loosing their Islamic minds..  Let me give good links to answer that question..

    How would an ideal Islamic state in today's world be?


    he Ideal Islamic State

    Ideals of the Islamic State

    brainless fools talk superficial Utopian nonsense to make  1000 year old cave dwellers silly statements as rules for building modern state and 21st century life..



     
    Do not let silence become your legacy.. Question everything   
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim     
  • Sharia penal code, rejection,rejection through loopholes or applikation
     Reply #5 - February 27, 2015, 06:36 PM
    My guess is that those who'd vote 'support in practice and theory'  are ex salafists, if outside of pakistani/indian/bangladeshi heritage, where it could be ex deobandi(?). Am I right?
  • Sharia penal code, rejection,rejection through loopholes or applikation
     Reply #6 - February 27, 2015, 06:56 PM
    I certainly wasn't salafi or deobandi, and I supported them in both practice and theory, and I didn't really think they needed to wait until an "ideal Islamic state", as things that were good as a part of Islam had a moral good in and of themselves. Then again I was pretty young and naive though, so that might have played a role in that whole outlook.  Tongue
    Quote from: yeezevee on February 11, 2016, 02:05 PM
    how fuck works without shit??


    Let's Play Chess!

    harakaat, friend, RIP
  • Sharia penal code, rejection,rejection through loopholes or applikation
     Reply #7 - February 28, 2015, 06:39 PM
    I think that it's often salafists/deobandis,when talking about sunni Islam, that are the most likely to fit nr 3, but others may do so also.Though Im not sure if its common.
  • Sharia penal code, rejection,rejection through loopholes or applikation
     Reply #8 - February 28, 2015, 08:10 PM
    To comment on my own position...I didn't believe in apostasy from Islam being punishable either in theory or in practice. I also found many of the laws in the penal code to be awful, though the only way to interpret them seemed to have been by setting impossible conditions to avoid application. I must say it felt like a punch in the gut every time I discovered something awful, and I wasn't even comfortable with even the impossible conditions.
  • Sharia penal code, rejection,rejection through loopholes or applikation
     Reply #9 - March 08, 2015, 08:31 PM
    .
  • Sharia penal code, rejection,rejection through loopholes or applikation
     Reply #10 - March 08, 2015, 10:33 PM
    I supported it in theory, and partially in practice. I was a bit uncomfortable with accepting it, but hey, Sadaqallahul azeem, so I had to accept it. I accepted that every punishment should be practiced, but then I heard that apostates should also be killed, this was too much for me, and I was scared to look up the hadith on that, so I just shut up when people talked about that subject and hoped that they were wrong. They were not..
  • Sharia penal code, rejection,rejection through loopholes or applikation
     Reply #11 - March 16, 2015, 12:21 PM
    Though this isn't a scientific poll, does this mean that exmuslims prior to leaving adopt either position 2 or 3, before leaving Islam. Essentially, that it comes to a point were you have to believe the text or you deliberately reject it. How many, I wonder, go from alternative 1 and 2, to alternative 3 before leaving as a consequence....
  • Sharia penal code, rejection,rejection through loopholes or applikation
     Reply #12 - January 05, 2016, 11:19 PM
    Maybe more will comment...POWER BUMP!
  • Sharia penal code, rejection,rejection through loopholes or applikation
     Reply #13 - January 05, 2016, 11:25 PM
    I would choose  #1 mainly

    However, for child murderers, peodophiles, murders, rapists and heinous crimes against humanity in sorry I would agree to some sort of corporal punishment. It's sounds harsh writing it but if someone raped or murdered my child  Huh?
  • Sharia penal code, rejection,rejection through loopholes or applikation
     Reply #14 - January 05, 2016, 11:28 PM
    How could anyone call themselves Muslim, unless it's some sort of ideological standpoint (agnostic Muslims wink wink), while rejecting shariah? I've never met one. Unless thet viewed themselves as first non-believing, eho then became religious "born again", to eventually leaving it all together. Even met thugs who do drugs and other law breaking practices, along with morally "questionable" acts, still say (very vaguely) that they think "shariah is good".
    "The healthiest people I know are those who are the first to label themselves fucked up." - three
  • Sharia penal code, rejection,rejection through loopholes or applikation
     Reply #15 - January 05, 2016, 11:48 PM
    Do mean those who voted nr 2, Cornflower?
  • Sharia penal code, rejection,rejection through loopholes or applikation
     Reply #16 - January 06, 2016, 07:38 AM
    1 complete recection
    2 loopholes etc
    3 complete acceptance.

    ?
    "The healthiest people I know are those who are the first to label themselves fucked up." - three
  • Sharia penal code, rejection,rejection through loopholes or applikation
     Reply #17 - January 06, 2016, 01:12 PM
    I mean who do you consider in this category
    Quote
    How could anyone call themselves Muslim, unless it's some sort of ideological standpoint (agnostic Muslims wink wink), while rejecting shariah? I've never met one. Unless thet viewed themselves as first non-believing, eho then became religious "born again", to eventually leaving it all together. Even met thugs who do drugs and other law breaking practices, along with morally "questionable" acts, still say (very vaguely) that they think "shariah is good".

  • Sharia penal code, rejection,rejection through loopholes or applikation
     Reply #18 - January 06, 2016, 01:29 PM
    What category? The "thugs"? They aren't an intelectual bunch, but some of them say we Muslims and shariah is just but know nothing about it. When confronted by reality, it's "not real Islam, those are lies". Etc...
    "The healthiest people I know are those who are the first to label themselves fucked up." - three
  • Sharia penal code, rejection,rejection through loopholes or applikation
     Reply #19 - January 06, 2016, 01:33 PM
    I mean
    Quote
    How could anyone call themselves Muslim, unless it's some sort of ideological standpoint (agnostic Muslims wink wink), while rejecting shariah?

  • Sharia penal code, rejection,rejection through loopholes or applikation
     Reply #20 - January 06, 2016, 02:47 PM
    I don't get what your point is.
    "The healthiest people I know are those who are the first to label themselves fucked up." - three
  • Sharia penal code, rejection,rejection through loopholes or applikation
     Reply #21 - January 06, 2016, 02:51 PM
    I mean if you consider
     ''Rejection of application through use of loopholes and acceptance in theory''
    to be unIslamic. then thats a large part of the Islamic world
  • Sharia penal code, rejection,rejection through loopholes or applikation
     Reply #22 - January 06, 2016, 02:57 PM
    I'm still talking about nr 1. That was my point. As for nr 2, that's a large part of the Muslim world, and that is what is keeping people from progression. Clinging on to something that doesn't work.
    "The healthiest people I know are those who are the first to label themselves fucked up." - three
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