I am so sick and tired of God and stuff.....

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- NoToPrejudice
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I am so sick and tired of God and stuff.....
OP - June 11, 2015, 11:10 PM

Disclaimer: I turned ex-muslim / atheist at a very young age and all was well until recently when religion kind of bit back and avenged it by ruining my life. Hence, I am upset and angry with god and religion.

What I want to say is that all religions are so full of ridiculous and laughable supernatural stuff that if I trued to intriduce one hundreth of any such dogma now, I will be sent to mental assylum. The whole concept of a personal god / deity who interferes with humans the way like Abrahamic God does is so childish and comes with a whole bunch of even more ridiculous stuff ( hell, heaven, adam, eve, thousands of messengers, angels, jinns, afterlife, free will / soul, etc etc ).
When atheists appear to be arrogant, they are actually not, they are just frustrated. The idea of god/gods and their religion to me is such a nonsense that I do not think that there should be any discussion or debate about it among grown ups. It is like I am debating about fairy tales. I am truly sick and tired of this god thing and I am astonished that in this day and age it is still being debated. Those who allegedly created these religions, if they ever truly existed and if so, and if they come back now, for instance Mohammad, he will be so confused and bewildered to see what has become of what he never started....
In true honesty, I do sometimes wish that there was a God, a true, just and kind God but then quickly I fall back into the realms of real truth, that is, it is all natural/physical/ deterministic and there is nothing supernatural or non physical...and whatever seems non physical is at the most emergent from physical and would not exist without the physical.
How long more and with how much more hatred, prejudice, conflict, bloodshed and exploitation, will man have to go through all this self created punishment!
I wish I could see the back of reliogion before I return my atoms to the whole that I am a part of, the universe.
I know I have just had a rant, not made much sense, but I had to say it out loud today. Thanks for listening / bearing it.

Every true faith is infallible. It performs what the believing person hopes to find in it. But it does not offer the least support for the establishing of an objective truth. If you want to achieve peace of mind and happiness, have faith. If you want to be a disciple of truth, then search - Neitchze
- countjulian
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I am so sick and tired of God and stuff.....
Reply #1 - June 11, 2015, 11:15 PM

No worries. I have often felt the same way, even though like Hassan I still identify, sometimes, as an agnostic Catholic. What you're saying is very reasonable though.

إطلب العلم ولو في الصين

Es sitzt keine Krone so fest und so hoch,
Der mutige Springer erreicht sie doch.

I don't give a fuck about your war, or your President.
- countjulian
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Reply #2 - June 11, 2015, 11:19 PM

Quote from: NoToPrejudice on June 11, 2015, 11:10 PM
Those who allegedly created these religions, if they ever truly existed and if so, and if they come back now, for instance Mohammad, he will be so confused and bewildered to see what has become of what he never started....

This is really, really good. Muhammad almost certainly considered himself, or at least grew up as, some type of Christian. Jesus without a doubt was a pious Jew. Yet in the modern day people who claim to love Muhammad burn Christian churches, kill and castrate Christian men who love Muslim women, kidnap and rape Christian girls, cut the heads off of Christians and put the videos online for the world to see, lynch them in mobs on the street, and generally make their lives a living hell. Meanwhile people who worshiped Jesus as a god, something Jesus would almost certainly find bizarre and horrifying, as well as blasphemous, tormented Jews and demonized them for thousands of years, culminating in a holocaust of 6 million innocent Jews including women and children. It's shocking to think how radically these traditions changed over the years.

إطلب العلم ولو في الصين

Es sitzt keine Krone so fest und so hoch,
Der mutige Springer erreicht sie doch.

I don't give a fuck about your war, or your President.
- Zimriel
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I am so sick and tired of God and stuff.....
Reply #3 - June 11, 2015, 11:33 PM

I'm not sure Muhammad disapproved the burning of Monophysite and Maronite churches himself; both communities recorded his immediate followers doing some of that in Egypt, Palestine, Syria, and Armenia. Source: Thomas the Presbyter directly (on a burned monastery), Sophronius (on obstructing pilgrimages), Pseudo-Sebeos (general chaos) all per Hoyland, "Seeing Islam". Also John of Nikiu, for what that's worth (his history's badly preserved).

The Nestorians perceived the Muhajirun (syr. Mhaggraye) as more tolerant, likely because their theology was at the time more compatible to Muhammad's at the time.

Circa 20 / 640, Mu'awiya took over in Syria; he seems to have put a stop to the chaos there. I suspect he prevailed upon his cousins 'Uthman and 'Amr to lighten up in Egypt too. I generally get the impression that Mu'awiya had an IQ of at least 135.
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Reply #4 - June 12, 2015, 02:04 AM

I think all of us know people with an IQ of 135.

Don't let Hitler have the street.
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Reply #5 - June 12, 2015, 02:54 AM

Me too OP. When I first deconverted I was reading all the atheist/skeptical material I could get my hands on as well as debating anyone I could. Lately I've given it a rest and focused on more positive and productive pursuits. Once I was past even remotely considering it as possibly true, I lost pretty much all interest in religion.

I guess for me it has had a different result though. I don't care too much to talk people out of their beliefs and am totally fine with them holding them as long as it does not negatively effect me. I actually kind of look at it with amusement and also find it fascinating how gullible humans are. Going to Church is like a study in anthropology as I tend to evaluate the psychological make-ups of those who are the most devout.

I understand that there are many who suffer because of stupidity imposed on them by religion worldwide. But most of the bad things out there come from traits in human nature such as jealousy, hate, control, and propensity towards violence and religions are just used as a tool by those who indulge such emotions in deconstructive ways.

"I moreover believe that any religion that has anything in it that shocks the mind of a child, cannot be a true system."
-Thomas Paine
- NoToPrejudice
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Reply #6 - June 12, 2015, 07:34 AM

I have experienced that there is no debate possible between faith and all what can be put together as non faith. A lot of faith based topics are actually non topics. Even bringing in the concept of God, does not help solve anything, instead just adds an unnecessary dimension that is much harder to understand and explain than any other question out there.
I have been told, time after time, "whatever....we will follow what Quran and Hadith say...." And Quran and Hadith and Sunnah....has something to say about everything and many a things what it says is nothing but absurd. Hypocrisy of people of faith that I have seen lately is that they cherry pick, things that are useful to them, things that they can use to their advantage...and when you challenge them about so many things that they do which is against the teachings, they come up with interpretation and excuses...and finally...God is all forgiving....and that these are not important...etc etc.
I think non believers / atheists / ex-religionists should stop debating with people of faith as I think that there is no debate possible between faith on one side and whatever on the other, be it science, logic, history, evidence...
Let the sects debate within, with other sects, let the religions debate within and with other religions, let them have debate based on faith....it dies not mix with anything outside the faith....it is pointless. Non believers should just deckare that they cannot reason with anything which comes under the umbrella of faith and just come out of the mess.
I have been told time after time that taleban, alqaeda, isis and boko haram and all the rest similar ideologies/groups have nothing to do with religion and it is, as it has akways been in the history of mankind, geopolitical, controlling tactics and the way humans take out there inherent emotions like hatred and prejudice and jealousy. I find it hard to believe but do see part truth in it. There are then people who believe in conspiracy theories and say that it is all a big con and this and that are actually behind it.
I have totally given up on all kinds of discussion and debate with people with faith on all matters that are linked to faith. I have no hatred or anger against any person. They are just as good as anyone else and are lovely people. I love and respect them but I do not talk about or discuss anything that might offend someone or they start taking cover under faith, etc.
I am just fed up. If it was limited to debate, it was okay but it is hitting hard in so many important areas of life in general and family life in particular, that is a bit too much.
Thanks everyone for listening and sharing.

Every true faith is infallible. It performs what the believing person hopes to find in it. But it does not offer the least support for the establishing of an objective truth. If you want to achieve peace of mind and happiness, have faith. If you want to be a disciple of truth, then search - Neitchze
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I am so sick and tired of God and stuff.....
Reply #7 - June 12, 2015, 09:57 AM

There can be discussion, though a lot of it depends on both attitude and the person you're discussing it with.

`But I don't want to go among mad people,' Alice remarked.
`Oh, you can't help that,' said the Cat: `we're all mad here. I'm mad. You're mad.'
`How do you know I'm mad?' said Alice.
`You must be,' said the Cat, `or you wouldn't have come here.'
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