Is allah effected by time ?

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Is allah effected by time ?
OP - March 15, 2011, 06:07 AM

First of all if this in the the wrong place then mods please feel free to move it i didn't knew wherei should start this thread here or on Science and reason >->.

secondly I am no expert in interparation of the quran and i am poor at arabicc so anyone finds any mistake i made quoteing the verses then please let me know.

If you ever have an encountered the watchmaker arugement (which i am sure you have because its the most commen among theist) + zakir naik has made it alot famouse in the muslim world. This is how it basicly goes.

(neglecting evolotiion and everything)

1 - Evrething around is desgined so evething must have a designer

2- (if you accept the first arugument you offcorse ask) Okay i agree with you but who desgin the desginer.

3- the most likely awnser "Allah is beyond the relem of time and he is eternal"

but in the folowing verses isn't allah implying that he is in the relem of time but its only slow for him?

22:47 Yet they ask thee to hasten on the Punishment! But Allah will not fail in His Promise. Verily a Day in the sight of thy Lord is like a thousand years of your reckoning.

32:05 He rules (all) affairs from the heavens to the earth: in the end will (all affairs) go up to Him, on a Day, the space whereof will be (as) a thousand years of your reckoning.

70:04 The angels and the spirit ascend unto him in a Day the measure whereof is (as) fifty thousand years:

I don't know about the other 2 verse but isn't verse 22:47 aplying that god him self has days? even though that day = 1000 years for humans. But like i said it just shows that time is slowed where he is but he still bound by it.

This can be a very week argument but i had it on my mind. I would really aprecaite some opinions on this :/.

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Re: Is allah effected by time ?
Reply #1 - March 15, 2011, 06:24 PM

Sorry for bumping but care to comment anyone

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Re: Is allah effected by time ?
Reply #2 - March 15, 2011, 06:35 PM

By default, allah has to be affected by time, else he wouldn't have had 6 days of creation;
The mere fact that it took that long implies that there were reasons (such as deciding and construction) beyond its control, thus being subject to its own/or other limitations that exist, time being one of them.
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Re: Is allah effected by time ?
Reply #3 - March 15, 2011, 06:37 PM

We can use theory of relativity.. But anyways, it doesn't really matter, because there is indeed no Allah.

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Re: Is allah effected by time ?
Reply #4 - March 16, 2011, 08:39 AM

Quote from: mighty_cats on March 15, 2011, 06:35 PM
By default, allah has to be affected by time, else he wouldn't have had 6 days of creation;
The mere fact that it took that long implies that there were reasons (such as deciding and construction) beyond its control, thus being subject to its own/or other limitations that exist, time being one of them.

Ha didn't gave much thought to that thanks cats

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Re: Is allah effected by time ?
Reply #5 - March 16, 2011, 06:53 PM

A timeless entity not bound by time can operate "under time". That is to say "it takes a certain amount of time" to "perform" something. What happens is that the state of the thing which the entity worked upon was of a certain duration - that is the time. Not the entity itself which is free from the limits of time.

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Re: Is allah effected by time ?
Reply #6 - March 16, 2011, 07:58 PM

Quote from: maxwell on March 16, 2011, 06:53 PM
A timeless entity not bound by time can operate "under time". That is to say "it takes a certain amount of time" to "perform" something. What happens is that the state of the thing which the entity worked upon was of a certain duration - that is the time. Not the entity itself which is free from the limits of time.

But doesn't 22:47 sugest that allah lives by days?

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Lost somewhere between immensity and eternity is our tiny planetary home. [carl sagan]
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Re: Is allah effected by time ?
Reply #7 - March 16, 2011, 08:03 PM

I wasnt just referring to Allah...

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Re: Is allah effected by time ?
Reply #8 - March 16, 2011, 08:08 PM

Quote from: maxwell on March 16, 2011, 08:03 PM
I wasnt just referring to Allah...

Oh sorry about that i thought you were refring to allah

So taking to acount that a supernatural being (or mabye you met something else again) so powerfull who can creat time why would want to operate under time when he can do it with a clap of hand ?

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Lost somewhere between immensity and eternity is our tiny planetary home. [carl sagan]
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Re: Is allah effected by time ?
Reply #9 - March 18, 2011, 03:38 PM

The way xian apologists get around this is a verse that states "beloved do not marvel, a day is as a 1000 years unto the lord and a 1000 days as a day". Thus, the whole concept of what we know to be a very old earth plus evolution is merged and they a free to carry on in their delusion. Then they tell you the scripture is the literal wurd of gawd.

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