Discussion about "My Ordeal with the Qur'an"

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- Blade Gunner
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Re: Discussion about "My Ordeal with the Qur'an"
Reply #480 - May 28, 2010, 04:01 PM

Quote from: debunker on May 28, 2010, 03:39 PM
Hello, first of all, please forgive me for the way I behaved the other day.. anyway, there is a (Muslims?) member who truly need your help... he believes that Hell is only *mental* disorder and that worship now (these days) only mean that we should be good towards each other (no need for prayers, fasting, etc)... please help him... his name is AbuYunus2...

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Re: Discussion about "My Ordeal with the Qur'an"
Reply #481 - May 28, 2010, 04:02 PM

Quote from: IsLame on May 28, 2010, 03:56 PM
I thought it was an excellent point.

of course you did.

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Re: Discussion about "My Ordeal with the Qur'an"
Reply #482 - May 28, 2010, 04:03 PM

Quote from: abuyunus2 on May 28, 2010, 04:01 PM

Abu... what if I posted my debate at your blog, will you still ignore me?

btw, do you pray? do you fast?

A googolplex is *precisely* as far from infinity as is the number 1.--Carl Sagan
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Re: Discussion about "My Ordeal with the Qur'an"
Reply #483 - May 28, 2010, 04:07 PM

Quote from: debunker on May 28, 2010, 03:42 PM
Is there no limits for your intelligence?

As usual I was commenting on what you said for the benefit of everyone rather than addressing you. I don't have any problems being civil though if you wish to discuss it with me. Therefore the rest of this post is addressed to you.

Don't you think that giving up a mortal fear of your god is much more difficult than giving up something you enjoy recreationally such as alcohol?

I don't come here any more due to unfair moderation.
http://www.councilofexmuslims.com/index.php?topic=30785
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Re: Discussion about "My Ordeal with the Qur'an"
Reply #484 - May 28, 2010, 04:09 PM

i never said i'd ignore you even if you posted here - i'd read what you have to say - but i'm not sure if i would be bothered to get into a debate.

i do pray and fast

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Re: Discussion about "My Ordeal with the Qur'an"
Reply #485 - May 28, 2010, 04:10 PM

Quote from: abuyunus2 on May 28, 2010, 04:09 PM
i do pray and fast

What do you think the purpose of fasting is, and how does it make you feel?

I don't come here any more due to unfair moderation.
http://www.councilofexmuslims.com/index.php?topic=30785
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Re: Discussion about "My Ordeal with the Qur'an"
Reply #486 - May 28, 2010, 04:13 PM

both praying and fasting make me feel humble - i'm not just saying that - they honestly do

they're both also a good way of feeling 'closer' to God - if a person feels this he may be more likely to do good in his life

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Re: Discussion about "My Ordeal with the Qur'an"
Reply #487 - May 28, 2010, 04:25 PM

Quote from: abuyunus2 on May 28, 2010, 04:13 PM
both praying and fasting make me feel humble - i'm not just saying that - they honestly do

they're both also a good way of feeling 'closer' to God - if a person feels this he may be more likely to do good in his life

Praying is like a form of meditation or self reflection.
Being well fed keeps you somewhat sedated so that your body may digest your food (which is why you throw up if you eat then exercise.) When you go hungry you become less sedate, your senses become more sensitive and your brain more alert, this is so that you can hunt for food.

Even us atheists experience the same thing, we just don't imagine a fairy tale creature is involved

I don't come here any more due to unfair moderation.
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Re: Discussion about "My Ordeal with the Qur'an"
Reply #488 - May 28, 2010, 04:33 PM

Quote from: abuyunus2 on May 28, 2010, 04:13 PM
both praying and fasting make me feel humble - i'm not just saying that - they honestly do

they're both also a good way of feeling 'closer' to God - if a person feels this he may be more likely to do good in his life

My brother's driving makes me feel closer to God.
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Re: Discussion about "My Ordeal with the Qur'an"
Reply #489 - May 28, 2010, 04:36 PM

Quote from: Hassan on May 28, 2010, 04:33 PM
My brother's driving makes me feel closer to God.

I don't come here any more due to unfair moderation.
http://www.councilofexmuslims.com/index.php?topic=30785
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Re: Discussion about "My Ordeal with the Qur'an"
Reply #490 - May 28, 2010, 04:36 PM

Quote from: TheRationalizer on May 28, 2010, 04:07 PM
As usual I was commenting on what you said for the benefit of everyone rather than addressing you. I don't have any problems being civil though if you wish to discuss it with me. Therefore the rest of this post is addressed to you.

Don't you think that giving up a mortal fear of your god is much more difficult than giving up something you enjoy recreationally such as alcohol?

ok, I'm sorry I thought you were addressing me... now, would you be so kind as to remove the word *debunker* from the quote so I might not get confused and think you're actually addressing me... I'm humbly asking you to just remove "debunker" from the head of the quote...

A googolplex is *precisely* as far from infinity as is the number 1.--Carl Sagan
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Re: Discussion about "My Ordeal with the Qur'an"
Reply #491 - May 28, 2010, 04:37 PM

Quote from: debunker on May 28, 2010, 04:36 PM
ok, I'm sorry I thought you were addressing me... now, would you be so kind as to remove the word *debunker* from the quote so I might not get confused and think you're actually addressing me... I'm humbly asking you to just remove "debunker" from the head of the quote...

Sure, if I can remember each time I will remove the "author=" part and inside the quote write "Debunker said". You see, my intention isn't to piss you off

I don't come here any more due to unfair moderation.
http://www.councilofexmuslims.com/index.php?topic=30785
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Re: Discussion about "My Ordeal with the Qur'an"
Reply #492 - May 28, 2010, 04:41 PM

Quote from: abuyunus2 on May 28, 2010, 04:13 PM
both praying and fasting make me feel humble - i'm not just saying that - they honestly do

they're both also a good way of feeling 'closer' to God - if a person feels this he may be more likely to do good in his life

and what if I decided to keep remembering God most of the time (for example, by reading Quran, etc) but without praying... I mean let's be honest, despite our best efforts, prayer is a torture (imagine trying to concentrate so hard trying to keep track of what you've been reciting 5 times a day for over 20 years of your life... it's almost impossible!)

So what say you, dear friend? I really don't like prayer (or fasting)... would you say in my case, "just being good with others" is enough for worship? yes/no?

A googolplex is *precisely* as far from infinity as is the number 1.--Carl Sagan
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Re: Discussion about "My Ordeal with the Qur'an"
Reply #493 - May 28, 2010, 04:42 PM

Quote from: TheRationalizer on May 28, 2010, 04:37 PM
Sure, if I can remember each time I will remove the "author=" part and inside the quote write "Debunker said". You see, my intention isn't to piss you off

Awwww! Ok, do whatever you want... I'll skip over your posts anyway, like I do Yezvee.

A googolplex is *precisely* as far from infinity as is the number 1.--Carl Sagan
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Re: Discussion about "My Ordeal with the Qur'an"
Reply #494 - May 28, 2010, 05:33 PM

Quote from: Hassan on May 28, 2010, 04:33 PM
My brother's driving makes me feel closer to God.

astaghfirullah, no need to mock brother

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Re: Discussion about "My Ordeal with the Qur'an"
Reply #495 - May 28, 2010, 05:40 PM

Quote from: debunker on May 28, 2010, 04:41 PM
I really don't like prayer (or fasting)...

Aren't you supposed to have the 'niyya' for it?
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Re: Discussion about "My Ordeal with the Qur'an"
Reply #496 - May 28, 2010, 05:47 PM

Quote from: debunker on May 28, 2010, 04:41 PM
and what if I decided to keep remembering God most of the time (for example, by reading Quran, etc) but without praying... I mean let's be honest, despite our best efforts, prayer is a torture (imagine trying to concentrate so hard trying to keep track of what you've been reciting 5 times a day for over 20 years of your life... it's almost impossible!)

So what say you, dear friend? I really don't like prayer (or fasting)... would you say in my case, "just being good with others" is enough for worship? yes/no?

Yes

In fact even before i took my recent stance i thought that prayer could be in any suitable form where we think about God - even sitting down quietly and reading the Qur'an for example could be considered a prayer - i always felt this because the Qur'an does not state how to pray. in addition i didn't think 5 times a day prayers were necessary - since the only thing the Qur'an says is to perform prayers regularly.

but in general 'just being good with others' is not what i am defining as worship - it's doing good and forbiding evil that our God-given intelligence and soul tells us is good/evil - I believe when we do this we are submitting to God's will.

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Re: Discussion about "My Ordeal with the Qur'an"
Reply #497 - May 28, 2010, 05:57 PM

in addition it's also worth noting that the Qur'an repeatedly says that fasting has been prescribed so that we may learn self-restraint - something generally considered 'good' qualities to have by humans

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Re: Discussion about "My Ordeal with the Qur'an"
Reply #498 - May 28, 2010, 05:57 PM

I think your stance is far more consistent that other quran-onlies or sahih hadith accepters who pick & choose hadith when its suits them.

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Re: Discussion about "My Ordeal with the Qur'an"
Reply #499 - May 28, 2010, 09:31 PM

OK, just added a bit but have posted it on the thread with no discussion.
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Re: Discussion about "My Ordeal with the Qur'an"
Reply #500 - May 28, 2010, 11:11 PM

Quote from: abuyunus2 on May 28, 2010, 05:57 PM
in addition it's also worth noting that the Qur'an repeatedly says that fasting has been prescribed so that we may learn self-restraint - something generally considered 'good' qualities to have by humans

that's NOT true... (or at least show me the verse).

Anyway, Abu, screw it, I decided to start a (one way?) discussion with you in the Exclusive Rooms... I'll make you admit that you don't believe in the Quran.. I'm busy at the moment, but now, this has become a final decision... I'll make you admit you don't believe in this book (the Quran).

A googolplex is *precisely* as far from infinity as is the number 1.--Carl Sagan
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Re: Discussion about "My Ordeal with the Qur'an"
Reply #501 - May 28, 2010, 11:12 PM

Quote from: Zebedee on May 28, 2010, 05:40 PM
Aren't you supposed to have the 'niyya' for it?

elaborate. (it seems you don't understand what niyya means).

A googolplex is *precisely* as far from infinity as is the number 1.--Carl Sagan
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Re: Discussion about "My Ordeal with the Qur'an"
Reply #502 - May 28, 2010, 11:14 PM

Debunker how are you
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Re: Discussion about "My Ordeal with the Qur'an"
Reply #503 - May 28, 2010, 11:30 PM

I'm fine thank you, how about your good self?

btw, I have finally decided to take Abu down... he's a full blown Quranist and those really don't believe in the Quran... I'll just need to show him that.

A googolplex is *precisely* as far from infinity as is the number 1.--Carl Sagan
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Re: Discussion about "My Ordeal with the Qur'an"
Reply #504 - May 28, 2010, 11:35 PM

lol habibi stop that stuff, life is too short

i am drunk and you know what life is beautiful. i wish i had more love in my life, thats what we need azizi more love, not more hate, i swear if i believe in anything i believe in love, please let it go my brother, and just relax and let things be
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Re: Discussion about "My Ordeal with the Qur'an"
Reply #505 - May 28, 2010, 11:39 PM

well, I don't hate Abu! I just want him to come to grips with the fact that he worships an entirely different God.

A googolplex is *precisely* as far from infinity as is the number 1.--Carl Sagan
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Re: Discussion about "My Ordeal with the Qur'an"
Reply #506 - May 28, 2010, 11:42 PM

Quote from: debunker on May 28, 2010, 11:30 PM
I'm fine thank you, how about your good self?

btw, I have finally decided to take Abu down... he's a full blown Quranist and those really don't believe in the Quran... I'll just need to show him that.

Abu doesn't need your debate - he doesn't need you to show him anything - Abu is his own greatest critic - Abu is a nice guy - Thats ALL THAT MATTERS - like you, like BD, like Z10 or whatever his name is - like all of us here...

Talk is all bullshit... it's all BULLSHIT - there's just us!

Human fucking beings!

Frail, stupid and desperate for attention and affirmation. An arm around us - a pat on the head - someone to tell you they love you and understand you.

That's all.

Tired of wanting God to hug me!
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Re: Discussion about "My Ordeal with the Qur'an"
Reply #507 - May 28, 2010, 11:43 PM

Quote from: debunker on May 28, 2010, 11:39 PM
well, I don't hate Abu! I just want him to come to grips with the fact that he worships an entirely different God.

stop it bro! if there is a god i am sure he loves abu yunus how could he not? when we love him? how can god not understand love more than we do?
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Re: Discussion about "My Ordeal with the Qur'an"
Reply #508 - May 28, 2010, 11:45 PM

Damn fucking right BD!
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Re: Discussion about "My Ordeal with the Qur'an"
Reply #509 - May 28, 2010, 11:45 PM

When I'm drunk I'm wise
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