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 Topic: Are We Flucked ?

 (Read 10755 times)
  • 1« Previous thread | Next thread »
  • Are We Flucked ?
     OP - May 09, 2010, 11:53 AM

    Excellent video by Criss:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yymzurPlLxA
  • Re: Are We Flucked ?
     Reply #1 - May 09, 2010, 12:06 PM

    Awesome video and I wholeheartedly agree.
  • Re: Are We Flucked ?
     Reply #2 - May 09, 2010, 12:11 PM

    Excellent but scary at the same time! I also have always wondered, why do people want to make new children when there are others who already exist and are desperate need of homes? If I ever decide to have kids I'll definitely adopt. for me, I personally do not want produce a new baby, not with my genes. I fear that life's gonna suck way more very soon with this stupid overpopulation.

    I know someday you'll have a beautiful life, I know you'll be a star
    In somebody else's sky, but why, why, why
    Can't it be, can't it be mine

    https://twitter.com/AlharbiMoe
  • Re: Are We Flucked ?
     Reply #3 - May 09, 2010, 12:14 PM

    Great video, great message. I agree.

    But.

    Humans aren't the most successful species. You'd have to define successful to specify a certain field. Humans aren't more successful than all other animals as a whole.

    "If intelligence is feminine... I would want that mine would, in a resolute movement, come to resemble an impious woman."
  • Re: Are We Flucked ?
     Reply #4 - May 09, 2010, 12:15 PM

    I endorse this video.

    FWIW, I also have little interest in producing biological offspring for the reasons she mentions.

    Each of us a failed state in stark relief against the backdrop of the perfect worlds we seek.
    Propagandhi - Failed States
  • Re: Are We Flucked ?
     Reply #5 - May 09, 2010, 12:52 PM

    Hmmm, I don't know, many a valid point, but maybe she could have spoken about how hard they actually make it to adopt, instead of making it sounds like such an easy process to consider.  It's not.

    For some people years of fertility treatment is all they have as an option because adoption has been denied to them, or they practically know it will be.

    Also, it's all well and good to speak about humanity as a fungus that's growing rapidly, but aside from adoption what other methods is she suggesting?  no kids?  one child rule like China?

    These are problems many people talk about, but no real solutions are offered.  I'd like to see some suggestions for solutions.

    Other than that, I like the way she makes videos, they are easy to follow, have a few jokes in there, and not boring enough to make me switch off before the end, which is always a plus lol.   parrot

    Inhale the good shit, exhale the bullshit.
  • Re: Are We Flucked ?
     Reply #6 - May 09, 2010, 01:09 PM

    Quote
    Are We Flucked ?


    Huh.. What the hell is "Flucked".. It sounds horrible..

    Do not let silence become your legacy.. Question everything   
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim
     
  • Re: Are We Flucked ?
     Reply #7 - May 09, 2010, 01:27 PM

    Awesome video and I wholeheartedly agree.

    You don't want to have kids Aurora?
    (only kidding.. you asked Ephemeral the same question the other day Cheesy)


    Regarding the video, I also agree that the world needs to come to its senses and recognise the problem.  David Attenborough made a documentary about this last year. See http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/7996230.stm
    I'm really surprised India hasn't followed China's lead on the one-child-per-couple policy.  China has had that policy for nearly 30 years now.  India's population continues to mushroom while the people are poor.
    It seems the sheeple are just trying to conform to the group, and not having kids is taboo in many cultures.  After I left Islam, I thought and thought about whether I wanted kids or not. There are pros and cons.  The pros being that your kids are cute and fun to play with, and they will look after you when you grow older.  Although, given the direction society is taking in the West, there's no guarantee for that either.  If I get too disabled or get Alzheimers, I'll just get myself humanely euthanased and donate my body for scientific research.
    Of course, the cons of having kids are, firstly that the world is overpopulated, and secondly, that kids are hard work to bring up (nappy changing, sleepless nights etc).  Also, not having kids makes you free to enjoy life in other ways (sex life etc).

    "Many people would sooner die than think; In fact, they do so." -- Bertrand Russell

    Baloney Detection Kit
  • Re: Are We Flucked ?
     Reply #8 - May 09, 2010, 01:37 PM

    No I didn't, I refuse to admit it.  nyanya
  • Re: Are We Flucked ?
     Reply #9 - May 09, 2010, 01:40 PM


    I'm really surprised India hasn't followed China's lead on the one-child-per-couple policy.  China has had that policy for nearly 30 years now.  India's population continues to mushroom while the people are poor.



    The trouble with implementing a one child rule in India, and TBH I think anywhere else in the world, is that it will lead to female infanticide on a much larger scale than we see already.

    All we need is to tell backwards people that they can only have 1 kid, in an age where girl children really still aren't valued as highly as boys and the world loses yet more women.

    Inhale the good shit, exhale the bullshit.
  • Re: Are We Flucked ?
     Reply #10 - May 09, 2010, 01:49 PM

    I also have always wondered, why do people want to make new children


    Because of natural instincts?

    He's no friend to the friendless
    And he's the mother of grief
    There's only sorrow for tomorrow
    Surely life is too brief
  • Re: Are We Flucked ?
     Reply #11 - May 09, 2010, 01:53 PM

    I agree, Berbs - I have never liked the idea of forcing a limit on people - I am generally against forcing anything on people if at all possible.

    I think if people manage to shake of religious mentality that would help reduce population. I know I always felt that it was my God-given duty to have children and thought it selfish of those who chose not to.

    Now - without religion - I think quite differently. In fact it could be argued that the whole "I must have children to for God, religion, tribe, carry my name etc.." is quite selfish - while giving that up and perhaps adopting for the sake of humanity is unselfish and noble. (and I'm sure also loving/rewarding.)

    I also agree with Berbs that adopting is a minefield.
  • Re: Are We Flucked ?
     Reply #12 - May 09, 2010, 02:00 PM

    You don't want to have kids Aurora?
    (only kidding.. you asked Ephemeral the same question the other day Cheesy)

    No I didn't, I refuse to admit it.  nyanya

    Lying is a grave sin according to the Noodle Almighty (The Most High, the Most Merciful).
    You will be tied up with noodle and whipped with noodle if you don't repent. 040

    "Many people would sooner die than think; In fact, they do so." -- Bertrand Russell

    Baloney Detection Kit
  • Re: Are We Flucked ?
     Reply #13 - May 09, 2010, 02:06 PM

    You have no proof!

    and I would be honored to be whipped by his noodly appendage!
  • Re: Are We Flucked ?
     Reply #14 - May 09, 2010, 02:10 PM

    I agree, Berbs - I have never liked the idea of forcing a limit on people - I am generally against forcing anything on people if at all possible.

    I think if people manage to shake of religious mentality that would help reduce population. I know I always felt that it was my God-given duty to have children and thought it selfish of those who chose not to.

    Now - without religion - I think quite differently. In fact it could be argued that the whole "I must have children to for God, religion, tribe, carry my name etc.." is quite selfish - while giving that up and perhaps adopting for the sake of humanity is unselfish and noble. (and I'm sure also loving/rewarding.)

    I also agree with Berbs that adopting is a minefield.

    I suppose you are right that telling people how they should live their lives would go against the 'individual freedom' mantra. However, I think in a country like India (or most developing nations) where most people don't think for themselves (no offence intended, I'm Indian myself), legislating on such an important issue should be considered.  Trying to educate the masses would take too long, and trying to unindoctrinate people about their religious dogma would take even longer.
    (Although, I agree that the unintended consequences that Berbs talked about should be thought through first.)

    "Many people would sooner die than think; In fact, they do so." -- Bertrand Russell

    Baloney Detection Kit
  • Re: Are We Flucked ?
     Reply #15 - May 09, 2010, 02:12 PM

    Has any one heard this Hadeath?

    تناكحوا اني مفاخر بكم الامم يوم القيامه

    translated: have sex (get married) I am gona show off in the judgment day infront of other religions (people of other faiths).

    I think Muslim mentality dictates that you have loads and loads of children...

    ...
  • Re: Are We Flucked ?
     Reply #16 - May 09, 2010, 02:22 PM

    Has any one heard this Hadeath?

    تناكحوا اني مفاخر بكم الامم يوم القيامه

    translated: have sex (get married) I am gona show off in the judgment day infront of other religions (people of other faiths).

    I think Muslim mentality dictates that you have loads and loads of children...


    Yes, sounds familiar.

    Without doubt Muslims are encouraged to have children - and as many as one can - and it feels sinful if one does not without good reason.
  • Re: Are We Flucked ?
     Reply #17 - May 09, 2010, 02:25 PM

    You have no proof!

    and I would be honored to be whipped by his noodly appendage!

    @Aurora:
    Here's the proof: http://www.councilofexmuslims.com/index.php?topic=9349.msg261222#msg261222
    The internet records every word you say my dear, unlike Kiraman Katibin.  Cheesy

    "Many people would sooner die than think; In fact, they do so." -- Bertrand Russell

    Baloney Detection Kit
  • Re: Are We Flucked ?
     Reply #18 - May 09, 2010, 02:27 PM

    Yes, sounds familiar.

    Without doubt Muslims are encouraged to have children - and as many as one can - and it feels sinful if one does not without good reason.

    Other religions do this too.  Catholics and orthodox Jews have big families for religious reasons.

    "Many people would sooner die than think; In fact, they do so." -- Bertrand Russell

    Baloney Detection Kit
  • Re: Are We Flucked ?
     Reply #19 - May 09, 2010, 02:30 PM

    @Aurora:
    Here's the proof: http://www.councilofexmuslims.com/index.php?topic=9349.msg261222#msg261222
    The internet records every word you say my dear, unlike Kiraman Katibin.  Cheesy


    That was fabricated, stop trying to prove me wrong! I am always right, even when I'm not!
  • Re: Are We Flucked ?
     Reply #20 - May 09, 2010, 02:30 PM

    Without doubt Muslims are encouraged to have children - and as many as one can - and it feels sinful if one does not without good reason.

    Why? To help spread Islam?
  • Re: Are We Flucked ?
     Reply #21 - May 09, 2010, 02:35 PM

    yes its the dreaded Islamic meme, programmed to grow at all costs

    My Book     news002       
    My Blog  pccoffee
  • Re: Are We Flucked ?
     Reply #22 - May 09, 2010, 02:35 PM

    Why? To help spread Islam?


    Without doubt that is one motivation.
  • Re: Are We Flucked ?
     Reply #23 - May 09, 2010, 02:45 PM

    yes its the dreaded Islamic meme, programmed to grow at all costs

    Various books have been written about the God Virus or Religion Virus.  I found it interesting to note that some religions have more of a vertical infection strategy (thro having more babies) and certain religions have more of a horizontal infection strategy (by evangelising, like scientology and Jehovah's witness).  Islam's best strategy right now would be to retain its followers, IMO, because it already has a very large numbers of followers.

    "Many people would sooner die than think; In fact, they do so." -- Bertrand Russell

    Baloney Detection Kit
  • Re: Are We Flucked ?
     Reply #24 - May 09, 2010, 02:48 PM

    Yes - I think you're right.  I dont think I posted this link since you've been here, its a bit too strong but think you might like it http://www.citizenwarrior.com/2007/10/terrifying-brilliance-of-islamic.html

    My Book     news002       
    My Blog  pccoffee
  • Re: Are We Flucked ?
     Reply #25 - May 09, 2010, 02:50 PM

    I wonder what people here think about the idea of the world population leveling out by about 2300? Do you agree or do you think our global population will continue to increase? This interests me. Anyway, I'd adopt children, not because I'm gay, but because I think there's nothing more special than giving a child a stable upbringing who may not have that opportunity.

    An interesting picture of fertility rates through history, I've picked some countries where the rates have dropped quite rapidly:

  • Re: Are We Flucked ?
     Reply #26 - May 09, 2010, 02:53 PM

    The direct instructions to have large families occur in the hadith.

    Quote
    "Marry women who will love their husbands and be very prolific, for I wish you to be more numerous than any other people."

    Mohammad, quoted in the Mishkatu 'l-Masabih, book xiii


    Quote
    “Narrated Ma'qil ibn Yasar: A man came to the Prophet (peace_be_upon_him) and said: I have found a woman of rank and beauty, but she does not give birth to children. Should I marry her? He said: No. He came again to him, but he prohibited him. He came to him third time, and he (the Prophet) said: Marry women who are loving and very prolific, for I shall outnumber the peoples by you.”

    Sunan Abu Dawud, Book 11, Number 2045


    My Book     news002       
    My Blog  pccoffee
  • Re: Are We Flucked ?
     Reply #27 - May 09, 2010, 08:03 PM

    http://www.councilofexmuslims.com/index.php?topic=8672.0

    The most important video you'll ever see:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F-QA2rkpBSY&feature=player_embedded



    Yes - I think you're right.  I dont think I posted this link since you've been here, its a bit too strong but think you might like it http://www.citizenwarrior.com/2007/10/terrifying-brilliance-of-islamic.html

    That was a nice read. Thanks for sharing  Afro
  • Re: Are We Flucked ?
     Reply #28 - May 09, 2010, 11:21 PM

    The world is not overpopulated; it's just overly capitalistic and puts profit over everything else. Saying that it's overpopulated just gives reasons for people to privatize and be more greedy, as if there isn't enough to feed everyone, as if we need to fight against each other to survive. The reality is that there's more than enough for every single person on the planet. The problem stems from the global political economic system, not a lack of resources.

    Quote
    Are there too many people for the available food supply?

    With the cover of Earth 3.0 depicting a fish bowl teeming with goldfish, the symbolism is hard to miss. For many people, the global food crisis that caused huge increases in chronic malnutrition alongside food riots in over 30 countries last year only underlined the fact that there were just too many people and not enough land to feed them. Maybe Malthusian arguments have been repeatedly and self-evidently wrong in the past, but this time is different—humanity has finally reached, exceeded, or will soon exceed, the total number of humans the earth can possibly feed.

    Obviously, population is not a completely irrelevant consideration when it comes to food provision. It would be anti-materialist to argue otherwise. But we are not talking about some hypothetical future population number; with almost 1 billion people suffering chronic malnutrition we are talking about whether or not we have exceeded the capacity of the earth to feed everyone right now.

    The reality is that overpopulation arguments come at a time when enough food is produced globally, according to the UN Food and Agriculture Organization (FAO), to more than feed everyone. At the beginning of the food crisis in 2007, the world’s farmers produced 2.13 billion tons of grain, which included record or near record levels of rice, wheat, and corn.16 According to a World Bank report,

        droughts in Australia and poor crops in the E.U. and Ukraine in 2006 and 2007 were largely offset by good crops and increased exports in other countries and would not, on their own, have had a significant impact on prices. Only a relatively small share of the increase in food production prices (around 15 percent) is due directly to higher energy and fertilizer costs.17

    The FAO’s June 2009 Report states that food stocks are back from their lows last year as a result of a bumper food crop: “With the second-highest recorded cereals crop expected this year and stocks replenished, the world food supply looks less vulnerable to shocks than it was during last year’s food crisis.”18 In a quite shocking revelation given the extra tens of millions of people thrust into trying to survive starvation last year, the report states that “even larger crops than originally forecast” were harvested making 2008 the highest production year on record.

    The increased global production was sufficient to meet demand for food and other uses but also facilitated a replenishment of global reserves to pre-crisis levels. With the new 2009–10 marketing seasons commencing, prospects continue to be positive, as world cereal production is expected to be the second largest ever, after last year’s record.19

    Even at the height of the food crisis last year when the number of seriously malnourished people rose to 963 million, from 923 million in 2007, according to the UN—?almost one in every seven people on the planet—there was more than enough food available to give every single person 2800 kilocalories per day, enough to make every person on the planet overweight. By 2030, with population growth continuing to decline and agricultural output predicted to rise, the UN forecasts enough food will be grown worldwide, despite a global estimated population of 8.3 billion, to give everyone 3050 kilocalories per day.20

    Contrary to those who argue population continues to grow exponentially or geometrically, the rate of population growth peaked in the 1960s and has been declining ever since. The rate is set to decline further from the 1.7 percent it has been over the last 30 years to 1.1 percent. World population, rather than increasing exponentially, is predicted to continue to slowly rise through this century before leveling off at around 9 billion.21 In fact, according to the latest report from the U.S Census Bureau, “An Aging World: 2008,” the fastest growing segment of world population is the over 65 age bracket. For the first time in human history, the over 65 demographic is predicted to outnumber children under five within ten years.22

    As a side point, it is noteworthy that in all the debates about curtailing population growth, there is no campaign against the French and Australian governments paying women to have a third child in order to avert national population decline, even though both countries have far higher per capita environmental impacts than any developing country. It is also noticeable that these governments would rather pay women to procreate than relax ever-stricter immigration controls and allow in more workers to offset the decline.

    The reason that food reserves have declined over the last 15 years is not because there is not enough land to grow crops for the extra people. The problem comes down once again to social relations. Under neoliberal deregulation, developing countries were pressured by the IMF and the World Bank’s Structural Adjustment Programs to move away from food self-sufficiency and assured that the market would take care of any shortfalls. In order to keep up with their debt payments to Western financial institutions, countries of the Global South were told that they had to grow certain crops—ones that earned cash but couldn’t be eaten such as coffee and flowers—that held a “comparative advantage” for them on the world market.

    This meant that they could drop all their trade barriers and, in theory, still be able to compete on the world market while earning the capital to develop and pay off their debt. Quite the opposite happened. Local farmers were driven out of business and off the land into burgeoning city slums, land degradation expanded because the crops now being grown were not suited to the soil, and farmers were pushed onto more marginal land, thereby accelerating soil erosion. The farmers who remained were now in debt due to the amounts of fertilizer and pesticide they had to use (and the IMF-forced conditions for the suspension of fertilizer subsidies), and water use for the necessary irrigation of high water-demand crops shot through the roof. Some of this is documented in the excellent film Life and Debt, which focuses on the effects of “free trade” arriving in the Caribbean and the devastating effects on local agricultural production.

    Since the 1980s, IMF- and World Bank-imposed Structural Adjustment Programs (SAPs) have been imposed on 90 developing and transitional economies. It is impossible to explain how the home of corn domestication, Mexico, could have become a net importer of U.S. corn without looking at the role of the coercively imposed SAPs and the North American Free Trade Agreement (NAFTA), which drove 15 million Mexican farmers from the land.23

    International Socialist Review
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