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Theme Changer

 Topic: Hijab

 (Read 33791 times)
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  • Re: Hijab
     Reply #90 - May 24, 2010, 10:49 PM
    Sorry if this comment seems in appropriate, but I thought in the desi culture in the West, once a woman is married, she isn't really under the control of her parents any more.  I thought you were married but I might be wrong (sorry).
    The only thing I would say from my experience, is that if you have controlling parents, it is best to try to gradually break out of that control.  Once they realise that the control is slipping away, they will relinquish that control anyway.  Search the internet for "how to deal with controlling parents".  And I apologise, in advance, if this seems patronising at all.

    I had very controlling parents and unfortunately I broke out of that control far too late, and far to abruptly, but that's a long story.


    Quote from: BlackDog on May 24, 2010, 10:39 PM
    Anchoring is a NLP method. Forget it, I used to be into all of this until I realized most of it is a load of crap. Just another thing that's too good to be true, according to me at least.

    @BlackDog an HighOctane:  I agree, with regards to the specific meaning of NLP, it all a load of b/s.
    "Many people would sooner die than think; In fact, they do so." -- Bertrand Russell

    Baloney Detection Kit
  • Re: Hijab
     Reply #91 - May 24, 2010, 10:56 PM
    Quote from: ateapotist on May 24, 2010, 10:49 PM
    I had very controlling parents and unfortunately I broke out of that control far too late, and far to abruptly, but that's a long story.

    Yes, thats pretty much the right way.  I think if you dont do it as when doubts first appear then it might come as a shock.  With mine they were pretty much bored with the issue, after I had raised it a billion times and made my apostacy less of a shock for them.
    My Book     news002       
    My Blog  pccoffee
  • Re: Hijab
     Reply #92 - May 24, 2010, 11:10 PM
    The problem with me was that I had no time at all.  By the time I realised that Islam was false, I was already well into my 20s and coming under increasing pressure to get married.
    Oh well, time to move on I guess. sad
    "Many people would sooner die than think; In fact, they do so." -- Bertrand Russell

    Baloney Detection Kit
  • Re: Hijab
     Reply #93 - May 24, 2010, 11:12 PM
    so what is the situation at the moment? Do you think they will ever come round?
    My Book     news002       
    My Blog  pccoffee
  • Re: Hijab
     Reply #94 - May 24, 2010, 11:42 PM
    Basically, they are not prepared to maintain good relations with me, as long as I am an apostate.  It's like they are angry with me and will not help me in any way.  I feel I can rebuild my life without their support, but I'm going to have to carefully limit the amount of commitment/responsibility I take in life; but I'm prepared for that.  I obviously see them as victims too.  They've lost a son, and that's no light matter for a mother/father.  It's awful what religion does in society.  And there is debuker saying he will do the same thing on the other thread just now.
    I don't want to give away too much personal info on this forum.  I might PM you with more details about my situation.
    "Many people would sooner die than think; In fact, they do so." -- Bertrand Russell

    Baloney Detection Kit
  • Re: Hijab
     Reply #95 - May 24, 2010, 11:49 PM
    OK
    My Book     news002       
    My Blog  pccoffee
  • Re: Hijab
     Reply #96 - May 25, 2010, 01:03 AM
    I was listening to an extremely articulate and persuasive Muslim woman called Marnia Lazreg arguing against hijab and niqab on Radio National the other day. You can still download the podcast. Rumy Hasan has some excellent arguments in the chapter devoted to the issue in his book as well. Perhaps these arguments won't work on your folks but they're more mental ammo.
    The language of the mob was only the language of public opinion cleansed of hypocrisy and restraint - Hannah Arendt.
  • Re: Hijab
     Reply #97 - May 25, 2010, 09:09 PM
    Quote from: ateapotist on May 24, 2010, 10:49 PM
    Sorry if this comment seems in appropriate, but I thought in the desi culture in the West, once a woman is married, she isn't really under the control of her parents any more.  I thought you were married but I might be wrong (sorry).
    The only thing I would say from my experience, is that if you have controlling parents, it is best to try to gradually break out of that control.  Once they realise that the control is slipping away, they will relinquish that control anyway.  Search the internet for "how to deal with controlling parents".  And I apologise, in advance, if this seems patronising at all.

    I had very controlling parents and unfortunately I broke out of that control far too late, and far to abruptly, but that's a long story.

    @BlackDog an HighOctane:  I agree, with regards to the specific meaning of NLP, it all a load of b/s.


    I agree most desi women after they get married are their husband's property and responsibility, but it doesn't really work like that for me, a) I'm the youngest in the family and b) my husband isn't desi, therefore they feel that they can still have their way over me.  Perhaps it's just my orthodox family.   

    I do think there is a controlling issue here, however it's not just that, I want to limit the pain and distress I will put them through.  Therefore, again, professing my apostacy won't be fruitful.
    'The greatest glory of living lies not in never falling but in rising everytime you fall'
  • Re: Hijab
     Reply #98 - May 25, 2010, 09:10 PM
    Quote from: abdalwali on May 25, 2010, 01:03 AM
    I was listening to an extremely articulate and persuasive Muslim woman called Marnia Lazreg arguing against hijab and niqab on Radio National the other day. You can still download the podcast. Rumy Hasan has some excellent arguments in the chapter devoted to the issue in his book as well. Perhaps these arguments won't work on your folks but they're more mental ammo.


    Thanks I'll have a look at those links.
    'The greatest glory of living lies not in never falling but in rising everytime you fall'
  • Re: Hijab
     Reply #99 - May 25, 2010, 09:34 PM
    Quote from: Pariah on May 25, 2010, 09:09 PM
    I do think there is a controlling issue here, however it's not just that, I want to limit the pain and distress I will put them through.  Therefore, again, professing my apostacy won't be fruitful.

    I agree with you.  Sometimes it is best not to tell them -- particularly your mum -- because she will just grieve and get depressed about it.  Muslims have been indoctrinated about hell from an early age and the thought of one's own son/daughter burning in hell for eternity is quite terrifying.  My situation was different. I felt I was stuck between a rock and a hard place, and coming out to them seemed like the easiest way out.
    Anyway, good luck, however you decide to handle it.
    "Many people would sooner die than think; In fact, they do so." -- Bertrand Russell

    Baloney Detection Kit
  • Re: Hijab
     Reply #100 - June 25, 2010, 04:33 AM
    I'll just state my beliefs here. (Not looking for a debate, I'm just say'n)

    For me, hijab is part of modesty. So of course I am not going to deny that it is important in Islam, though I don't always wear it  hiding anyway...

    But I don't really judge people based on what they wear (it's just me). If a Muslimah wears her hijab and she is humble to her Creator in doing so, I support her for having good intentions. However in my opinion, if a Muslimah wears her hijab, but she acts boastful, looks down on other people, judges and backbites - I don't see the point of her wearing hijab when her heart is nowhere close to purity.

    I am not a full time hijabi, and I don't make that much fuss over clothes, but I do support, admire my sisters who wear hijab/niqab if they do that for the sake of better character development, humbleness and dedication to the Lord.

     victory I'm just a Muslim practising her 'freedom of speech' here.
  • Re: Hijab
     Reply #101 - June 25, 2010, 04:35 AM
    Quote from: canex on May 19, 2010, 10:34 PM
    well the best thing to do would be to do your own research. show your family members how its not mentioned in the quran and how its derived from cultural practices.

    is there any indication that muhammad's wifes wore the hijab?


    There are hadeeths that state the prophet(pbuh)'s wives wore niqab. Just to clarify that.
  • Re: Hijab
     Reply #102 - June 25, 2010, 05:04 AM
    Quote from: Pariah on May 18, 2010, 09:00 PM
    Hey everyone

    What's the best way to explain to a practising muslim that hijab isn't mandatory for women (without sounding like a ex-muslim)?

    I know some moderate muslims have alternative views on hijab out there, but I'm looking for some evidence to back it up.

    Thanks
     
    Pariah




    Just skimmed through the thread and saw that people seemed to be agreeing that hijab isn't mandatory. Are you guys serious?
    I'm an asshat.
  • Re: Hijab
     Reply #103 - June 25, 2010, 06:29 AM
    yea it aint. weird huh ?  ummah still doesnt get it.  Roll Eyes
    Nothing can be more contrary to religion and the clergy than reason and common sense. - Voltaire
  • Re: Hijab
     Reply #104 - June 25, 2010, 06:35 AM
    Quote from: canex on June 25, 2010, 06:29 AM
    yea it aint. weird huh ?  ummah still doesnt get it.  Roll Eyes


    like im an ex muslim and all... but that shit is mandatory. are you talking about hijab or niqab?
    I'm an asshat.
  • Re: Hijab
     Reply #105 - June 25, 2010, 07:13 AM
    Is it really mandatory?

    I know there is verse about covering bosom in Quran. And then the hadith about Umar spying on Muhammad's wife taking a shit. And him asking the Prophets wives to cover up. Not sure if this then extends automatcially to all women.
  • Re: Hijab
     Reply #106 - June 25, 2010, 07:17 AM
    Wait.... he perves on her making poo poo and then proclaims the ladies to cover up?!
  • Re: Hijab
     Reply #107 - June 25, 2010, 07:18 AM
    Quote from: wizzie on June 25, 2010, 04:33 AM
    I'll just state my beliefs here. (Not looking for a debate, I'm just say'n)

    For me, hijab is part of modesty. So of course I am not going to deny that it is important in Islam, though I don't always wear it  hiding anyway...

    But I don't really judge people based on what they wear (it's just me). If a Muslimah wears her hijab and she is humble to her Creator in doing so, I support her for having good intentions. However in my opinion, if a Muslimah wears her hijab, but she acts boastful, looks down on other people, judges and backbites - I don't see the point of her wearing hijab when her heart is nowhere close to purity.

    I am not a full time hijabi, and I don't make that much fuss over clothes, but I do support, admire my sisters who wear hijab/niqab if they do that for the sake of better character development, humbleness and dedication to the Lord.

     victory I'm just a Muslim practising her 'freedom of speech' here.



    Right so you just want to say something but not debate about it. That's cool.

    I think anybody who says hijab is beautiful and shows modesty (as if putting a table cloth on your head makes you more modest in the sight of Allah, like he’s some grump old man with shrivelled balls and dried oatmeal crust around his lips and doesn’t want to see women frolicking in the sun.) and doesn't wear is it condescending and patronizing. If it’s so good why doesn’t that person do it? I think anybody that makes that comment needs to think if it's them making the comment or if it's something they've picked up and not really thought through.

    Oh and you don’t need to respond to my post.

    Just an atheist practising his """freedom of speech""".
  • Re: Hijab
     Reply #108 - June 25, 2010, 07:18 AM
    Quote from: BlackDog on June 25, 2010, 07:13 AM
    Is it really mandatory?

    I know there is verse about covering bosom in Quran. And then the hadith about Umar spying on Muhammad's wife taking a shit. And him asking the Prophets wives to cover up. Not sure if this then extends automatcially to all women.


    lol at umar. when the verses of hijab were revealed all the women ripped their clothes and put it on their head. the prophet's wives covered completely including their face.

    Some people say that the niqab is mandatory on all women but there is a difference of opinion. Nobody can say hijab isn't mandatory though. it's pretty clear cut.
    I'm an asshat.
  • Re: Hijab
     Reply #109 - June 25, 2010, 07:18 AM
    Quote from: BlackDog on June 25, 2010, 07:13 AM
    Is it really mandatory?

    I know there is verse about covering bosom in Quran. And then the hadith about Umar spying on Muhammad's wife taking a shit. And him asking the Prophets wives to cover up. Not sure if this then extends automatcially to all women.


    It's the same way anything that Mohammed did (aside from marriage) extends automatically to all men as things they should do if they want to be as good as mohammed.

    Who better for a role model for women in Islam, than the prophets wives?  (again, not the marriage part, only Mo gets those props)

    When I wore niqab it was because the prophets wives wore it.

    If there exists a rule that during hajj at mecca a woman should not wear her face veil, it stood to reason, to me, that it was meant to be worn at all other times, otherwise why would there exist a rule telling you when it wasn't supposed to be worn?

    The only way to ditch it, is to stick with the quran.
    Inhale the good shit, exhale the bullshit.
  • Re: Hijab
     Reply #110 - June 25, 2010, 07:18 AM
    Quote from: CocoPop on June 25, 2010, 07:17 AM
    Wait.... he perves on her making poo poo and then proclaims the ladies to cover up?!


    Yeah? Why? He's a man and friend of the Prophet. He can do anything GOT THAT
  • Re: Hijab
     Reply #111 - June 25, 2010, 07:19 AM
    ISLAM CAN SUCK MY BALLS!!!!

    You ignore this post.

    Just an atheist practising his """"""""""""""""freedom of speech""""""""""""""""
  • Re: Hijab
     Reply #112 - June 25, 2010, 07:21 AM
    Quote from: BlackDog on June 25, 2010, 07:18 AM
    Right so you just want to say something but not debate about it. That's cool.

    I think anybody who says hijab is beautiful and shows modesty (as if putting a table cloth on your head makes you more modest in the sight of Allah, like he’s some grump old man with shrivelled balls and dried oatmeal crust around his lips and doesn’t want to see women frolicking in the sun.) and doesn't wear is it condescending and patronizing. If it’s so good why doesn’t that person do it? I think anybody that makes that comment needs to think if it's them making the comment or if it's something they've picked up and not really thought through.

    Oh and you don’t need to respond to my post.

    Just an atheist practising his freedom of speech.



    look bro...I don't want to play devils advocate but when I see a woman without hijab on I have a very hard time not raping her.
    I'm an asshat.
  • Re: Hijab
     Reply #113 - June 25, 2010, 07:21 AM
    Quote from: DigDug on June 25, 2010, 07:21 AM
    look bro...I don't want to play devils advocate but when I see a woman without hijab on I have a very hard time not raping her.


    You too?
  • Re: Hijab
     Reply #114 - June 25, 2010, 07:22 AM
    *strums guitar*
  • Re: Hijab
     Reply #115 - June 25, 2010, 07:23 AM
    Lord, so many potential wapists lurking at CEMB.  Positively sad.   Cry
    Inhale the good shit, exhale the bullshit.
  • Re: Hijab
     Reply #116 - June 25, 2010, 07:24 AM
    Quote from: BlackDog on June 25, 2010, 07:21 AM
    You too?


    yea...its like the hijab is some kinda rape protection cloak
    I'm an asshat.
  • Re: Hijab
     Reply #117 - June 25, 2010, 07:25 AM
    I bet if a woman had a rape fantasy, this would be a great place to be.......


    *flashes knees*
  • Re: Hijab
     Reply #118 - June 25, 2010, 07:26 AM
     Cheesy
    Inhale the good shit, exhale the bullshit.
  • Re: Hijab
     Reply #119 - June 25, 2010, 07:26 AM
    Quote from: CocoPop on June 25, 2010, 07:25 AM
    I bet if a woman had a rape fantasy, this would be a great place to be.......


    *flashes knees*


    hello heavenly blessed beauty whose inner and outer beauty are simply divine and everlasting...
    I'm an asshat.
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