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 Topic: Life on Saturn's moon Titan?

 (Read 10357 times)
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  • Re: Life on Saturn's moon Titan?
     Reply #30 - June 08, 2010, 07:52 AM

    No, no.  You're absolutely not!  And I don't quite think you have the same position here that Ali has at FFI!  It was more a reference to the fact that it all started with Ali posting a video about UFOs or something and saying 'what's this?'.  Before you know it he was being laughed at by the skeptics and then he started banning people.  I think quite a few came here after that - although I suspect that was a bit of a mixed blessing.
  • Re: Life on Saturn's moon Titan?
     Reply #31 - June 08, 2010, 07:54 AM

    Why a mixed blessing? What's wrong with CEMB? Not to sound like a fanboy just curious.
  • Re: Life on Saturn's moon Titan?
     Reply #32 - June 08, 2010, 08:22 AM

    Ooft. That is one fast-moving block of ice, laddie. Or something else reflective? Judging by your other comments, there certainly are a lot of very bright shiny things moving around in space at high speeds  Wink


    Erm, yes, there ARE a lot of fast moving objects in space.  All you have to do is to watch some of those LunaCognita videos and sometimes he will show a video where one spec of dust moves in an unexpected way, but in the background you will see thousands.


    You seem to imply a lot that something's flying in a straight line precludes its being piloted by intelligent beings.


    No, I am categorically stating that if an object visually similar to ones we observe naturally is moving in according to the natural laws of science there is no reason to assume it is being flown by a unicorn.


    Of course, planes also  fly in straight lines.


    Actually they don't Smiley


    But, of course, changing direction is more indicative of something that's being piloted by intelligence, you're right in that.


    Let's put it this way, if I were an alien flying a space ship that looked exactly like the billions of bits of other space dust out there and I didn't want to be detected, I'd move in a straight line....just like the billions of other bits of space dust.

    As for the thing at 2:05, it moves very fast. Given the moon's comparitively weak gravitational force, I doubt it could be chalked up to gravity.


    Things in space DO move very fast.  You know when an astronaut is floating in space and a bit of rock flies past apparently at only a few miles per hour?  It's not only going a few miles per hour.  The Earth is already travelling at over 60,000 miles per hour around the Sun.  60,000 alone is most likely more than enough speed to fly close to the surface of a planet with no atmosphere and not be pulled into the body by gravity, and there are objects travelling much faster than that!

    When an object flies past an astronaut it might appear to be doing about 10 miles per hour.  However in relation to the Earth the Moon is travelling at over 2,200 miles per hour.  So move that 10mph object out towards the Moon and guess what you have?  A very fast travelling object!

    Speed is all relative!

    0:18 It's possible, although an alternative explanation is likewise.


    You think "It is being flown by aliens" is as credible as "It was hit by something non-reflective"?  Considering the number of observed objects floating around Vs the number of observed flying saucers I disagree.

    0:40 What could it possibly be?


    I have no idea, but that doesn't mean that we can assign an answer out of our own ignorance.  That's how God was invented.  Don't go replacing God with aliens.  PROOF!


    2:10 Could be something mundane, could not be


    Moving according to the laws of physics.  Why should I assume it is anything else?  If it started flying in a circle then there would be a reason to think otherwise.

    2:30 Also has some interesting things, something very fast-moving darting off in the direction of the earth, then something looking like it pops into existence out of nothing.


    Point 1: Remember how you mockingly said that I believed there are a lot of shiny objects floating around in space?  What do you think all those shiny objects are in that video? Are they all aliens? They are certainly not stars because they are moving.  So hopefully now you see there ARE lots of shiny objects floating in space, right?

    Point 2: All of the "popping into existence" objects are again moving with a uniformed motion. So no hint of external forces being applied to them.

    Point 3: Things pop in/out of your vision if they are flat and rotating.  Imagine a two sided mirror rotating very slowly in space.  One revolution could take hours, days, weeks, or even years.  At certain angles the light is being reflected elsewhere, but then at some point the angle has change significantly and shines the light in a direction detectable by the camera.  Just like a human on the ground using a mirror to reflect light at a low flying aircraft, the mirror was always there, you just couldn't see it until it was at the correct angle.


    3:10 Or, failing that, some other unexplained phenomenon. But I think it's interesting that some of them come from space, and do not seem to originate from the actual location of the storm itself.


    Scientists fondly name them "sprites" I believe.  They are perfectly natural phenomenon during an electrical storm.  Not only have they been observed many times, but I recently saw a documentary where a science plane flew into an electrical storm and photographed their formation using high speed camera equipment.

    If it's lights within an electrical storm, ignore it.


    5:30 The guy was an astronaut, and talks about how the existence of aliens and the like is acknowledged within circles of government scientists and intelligence people. Maybe it's not true, but it's worth considering.


    Sure, and astronauts are attributed with the following characteristics.
    1: They never lie.
    2: They never do anything solely for the purpose of making money.
    3: They are never mistaken.
    4: They are all cleared for top-secret level government intelligence.
    5: They never experience depression, hallucinations, misinterpretations, etc.

    CAMERA evidence, not human accounts!  Muhammad saw angel Gabriel, need I go on?


    8:40 So what? How does that explain what they are? One stationary and two moving at different speeds. Doesn't seem like random peices of ice from the space shuttle.


    Space debris. Lots of it up there, remember?


    2:18 Yep, it's a good 'n'.


    Yes.  It doesn't mean it's an alien, it means that you and I do not know what it was.  At least it's not like uniform-motion reflective space debris crap like the rest you showed me Smiley

    I'm not going to go on with the rest of your comments.  So far you seem to be convinced that space is "nice and clean" and that reflective objects moving in a straight line and rotating to reflect light periodically are so rare that all occurrences must be spaceships.

    If you want to post some videos/times where you see something credible I will be happy to see them.  But please, no more space debris or electrical storms.  Stuff moving in strange paths, or solid objects only.

    Your arguments are from ignorance.  "I don't know what it is, so it could be (insert unfounded belief of your choice here)".  LunaCognita depends on people having this kind of attitude to make money.  He puts together compilations of stuff which your average person will say "Wow, something apparently happened there", then instead of proving to you that they are alien spacecraft he leaves you to go through a list of things in your head of what you think it cannot be, and then eventually you end up with the one "simple" answer you cannot dismiss.....little green men.

    I don't come here any more due to unfair moderation.
    http://www.councilofexmuslims.com/index.php?topic=30785
  • Re: Life on Saturn's moon Titan?
     Reply #33 - June 08, 2010, 08:33 AM

    Quote
    5:30 The guy was an astronaut, and talks about how the existence of aliens and the like is acknowledged within circles of government scientists and intelligence people. Maybe it's not true, but it's worth considering.

    It is widely acknowledged that we are probably not the only intelligent, civilisation-creating species in the universe. It would be unlikely that we were. This may be what the astronaut guy is referring to. That doesn't mean that aliens are surreptitiously sneaking into your local McDonalds for a quarter pounder and fries.

    Devious, treacherous, murderous, neanderthal, sub-human of the West. bunny
  • Re: Life on Saturn's moon Titan?
     Reply #34 - June 08, 2010, 10:14 AM

    Why a mixed blessing? What's wrong with CEMB? Not to sound like a fanboy just curious.

    Mixed blessing for CEMB - i.e. perhaps not everyone who came across was who you might like to have around.
  • Re: Life on Saturn's moon Titan?
     Reply #35 - June 08, 2010, 10:15 AM

    Yes there was that aspect of it, but we managed to handle it. Cheesy

    I remember banning Tribalnation after only a few posts. Sometimes you just gotta thump morons.

    Devious, treacherous, murderous, neanderthal, sub-human of the West. bunny
  • Re: Life on Saturn's moon Titan?
     Reply #36 - June 08, 2010, 04:32 PM

    Erm, yes, there ARE a lot of fast moving objects in space.  All you have to do is to watch some of those LunaCognita videos and sometimes he will show a video where one spec of dust moves in an unexpected way, but in the background you will see thousands.


    No, I am categorically stating that if an object visually similar to ones we observe naturally is moving in according to the natural laws of science there is no reason to assume it is being flown by a unicorn.


    Actually they don't Smiley


    Let's put it this way, if I were an alien flying a space ship that looked exactly like the billions of bits of other space dust out there and I didn't want to be detected, I'd move in a straight line....just like the billions of other bits of space dust.

    Things in space DO move very fast.  You know when an astronaut is floating in space and a bit of rock flies past apparently at only a few miles per hour?  It's not only going a few miles per hour.  The Earth is already travelling at over 60,000 miles per hour around the Sun.  60,000 alone is most likely more than enough speed to fly close to the surface of a planet with no atmosphere and not be pulled into the body by gravity, and there are objects travelling much faster than that!

    When an object flies past an astronaut it might appear to be doing about 10 miles per hour.  However in relation to the Earth the Moon is travelling at over 2,200 miles per hour.  So move that 10mph object out towards the Moon and guess what you have?  A very fast travelling object!

    Speed is all relative!

    You think "It is being flown by aliens" is as credible as "It was hit by something non-reflective"?  Considering the number of observed objects floating around Vs the number of observed flying saucers I disagree.

    I have no idea, but that doesn't mean that we can assign an answer out of our own ignorance.  That's how God was invented.  Don't go replacing God with aliens.  PROOF!


    Moving according to the laws of physics.  Why should I assume it is anything else?  If it started flying in a circle then there would be a reason to think otherwise.

    Point 1: Remember how you mockingly said that I believed there are a lot of shiny objects floating around in space?  What do you think all those shiny objects are in that video? Are they all aliens? They are certainly not stars because they are moving.  So hopefully now you see there ARE lots of shiny objects floating in space, right?

    Point 2: All of the "popping into existence" objects are again moving with a uniformed motion. So no hint of external forces being applied to them.

    Point 3: Things pop in/out of your vision if they are flat and rotating.  Imagine a two sided mirror rotating very slowly in space.  One revolution could take hours, days, weeks, or even years.  At certain angles the light is being reflected elsewhere, but then at some point the angle has change significantly and shines the light in a direction detectable by the camera.  Just like a human on the ground using a mirror to reflect light at a low flying aircraft, the mirror was always there, you just couldn't see it until it was at the correct angle.


    Scientists fondly name them "sprites" I believe.  They are perfectly natural phenomenon during an electrical storm.  Not only have they been observed many times, but I recently saw a documentary where a science plane flew into an electrical storm and photographed their formation using high speed camera equipment.

    If it's lights within an electrical storm, ignore it.


    Sure, and astronauts are attributed with the following characteristics.
    1: They never lie.
    2: They never do anything solely for the purpose of making money.
    3: They are never mistaken.
    4: They are all cleared for top-secret level government intelligence.
    5: They never experience depression, hallucinations, misinterpretations, etc.

    CAMERA evidence, not human accounts!  Muhammad saw angel Gabriel, need I go on?


    Space debris. Lots of it up there, remember?


    Yes.  It doesn't mean it's an alien, it means that you and I do not know what it was.  At least it's not like uniform-motion reflective space debris crap like the rest you showed me Smiley

    I'm not going to go on with the rest of your comments.  So far you seem to be convinced that space is "nice and clean" and that reflective objects moving in a straight line and rotating to reflect light periodically are so rare that all occurrences must be spaceships.

    If you want to post some videos/times where you see something credible I will be happy to see them.  But please, no more space debris or electrical storms.  Stuff moving in strange paths, or solid objects only.

    Your arguments are from ignorance.  "I don't know what it is, so it could be (insert unfounded belief of your choice here)".  LunaCognita depends on people having this kind of attitude to make money.  He puts together compilations of stuff which your average person will say "Wow, something apparently happened there", then instead of proving to you that they are alien spacecraft he leaves you to go through a list of things in your head of what you think it cannot be, and then eventually you end up with the one "simple" answer you cannot dismiss.....little green men.


    Yeah, you're right. I take the caveats.

    I don't think we need to discuss this further. I've no doubt done wonders for my credibility as it is, coming out in favour of the existence of 'little green men.'

    Now, if you don't mind, I'd like to get back into my padded cell...
  • Re: Life on Saturn's moon Titan?
     Reply #37 - June 08, 2010, 04:39 PM

    I don't think we need to discuss this further. I've no doubt done wonders for my credibility as it is


    Actually your credibility is excellent, because you said this...


    Yeah, you're right.


    You saw the strength of the argument against you and conceded it.  That gives you a lot of credibility in my book.

    I believe the probability of off-Earth life is very high, more advanced civilisations too.  I don't think there's any evidence any are visiting Earth though, that's an entirely different matter.

    I think the most convincing UFO footage (which appear to be craft and not natural phenomenon) are likely to be military craft, probably using the atmosphere of Earth or Earth's magnetic field as part of its mechanism for propulsion.

    I don't come here any more due to unfair moderation.
    http://www.councilofexmuslims.com/index.php?topic=30785
  • Re: Life on Saturn's moon Titan?
     Reply #38 - June 08, 2010, 04:40 PM

    Not really. I think Zebedee is a moron.
  • Re: Life on Saturn's moon Titan?
     Reply #39 - June 08, 2010, 04:41 PM

    No, no.  You're absolutely not!  And I don't quite think you have the same position here that Ali has at FFI!  It was more a reference to the fact that it all started with Ali posting a video about UFOs or something and saying 'what's this?'.  Before you know it he was being laughed at by the skeptics and then he started banning people.  I think quite a few came here after that - although I suspect that was a bit of a mixed blessing.


    Yeah, those skeptics like to ruin everybody's fun  whistling2
  • Re: Life on Saturn's moon Titan?
     Reply #40 - June 08, 2010, 04:43 PM

    Actually your credibility is excellent, because you said this...


    You saw the strength of the argument against you and conceded it.  That gives you a lot of credibility in my book.

    I believe the probability of off-Earth life is very high, more advanced civilisations too.  I don't think there's any evidence any are visiting Earth though, that's an entirely different matter.

    I think the most convincing UFO footage (which appear to be craft and not natural phenomenon) are likely to be military craft, probably using the atmosphere of Earth or Earth's magnetic field as part of its mechanism for propulsion.


    It's not all bad then, eh?

    Not really. I think Zebedee is a moron.


    Gutted.
  • Re: Life on Saturn's moon Titan?
     Reply #41 - June 08, 2010, 04:46 PM

    It's not all bad then, eh?


    No, quite the opposite. In fact I find it very impressive Smiley

    Are you a muzzy or an ex-muzzy?

    PS: I saw this on YouTube only a day or two ago, you might like it...

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8EvXH-1N_VE

    I don't come here any more due to unfair moderation.
    http://www.councilofexmuslims.com/index.php?topic=30785
  • Re: Life on Saturn's moon Titan?
     Reply #42 - June 08, 2010, 04:51 PM

    Muzzy? lol Muslim?
  • Re: Life on Saturn's moon Titan?
     Reply #43 - June 08, 2010, 04:53 PM

    Muzzy? lol Muslim?


    Yeah, that's what I said...."Muzzy"!

    I often chuckle when I see the BBC advert for children to learn a foreign language with "Muzzy" :-)

    I don't come here any more due to unfair moderation.
    http://www.councilofexmuslims.com/index.php?topic=30785
  • Re: Life on Saturn's moon Titan?
     Reply #44 - June 08, 2010, 04:53 PM

    No, quite the opposite. In fact I find it very impressive Smiley

    Are you a muzzy or an ex-muzzy?

    PS: I saw this on YouTube only a day or two ago, you might like it...

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8EvXH-1N_VE


    Neither.

    The guy makes a good point. It's very true.
  • Re: Life on Saturn's moon Titan?
     Reply #45 - June 08, 2010, 04:57 PM

    Neither.


    In that case, are you a neverbeentempted or an ex-wannabemuzzy like myself?

    I don't come here any more due to unfair moderation.
    http://www.councilofexmuslims.com/index.php?topic=30785
  • Re: Life on Saturn's moon Titan?
     Reply #46 - June 08, 2010, 05:01 PM

    You're just full of questions, aren't you?

    I never wanted to be a Muslim. Islam's god is arguably the single most unpleasant character humanly conceivable.
  • Re: Life on Saturn's moon Titan?
     Reply #47 - June 08, 2010, 05:09 PM

    You're just full of questions, aren't you?

    I never wanted to be a Muslim. Islam's god is arguably the single most unpleasant character humanly conceivable.


    Strangers interest me Smiley

    So how did you become interested in Islam, and are you an atheist/deist/theist/other?

    I don't come here any more due to unfair moderation.
    http://www.councilofexmuslims.com/index.php?topic=30785
  • Re: Life on Saturn's moon Titan?
     Reply #48 - June 08, 2010, 05:14 PM

    I became interested in Islam for various reasons.

    1. Religion is kind of an interesting subject for me.

    2. Different people say different things about Islam, so I want to know what's actually true about it. So I study it. And not from JihadWatch or some Islamic apologetics website.

    3. I disagree with Islam and certain Muslims quite a bit. So I like to know what I'm talking about when I discuss Islam with them.

    4. Islam is obviously particularly interesting nowadays.

    And I'm an atheist.
  • Re: Life on Saturn's moon Titan?
     Reply #49 - June 08, 2010, 07:28 PM

    You are my mirror image, except not as funny or handsome Smiley

    I don't come here any more due to unfair moderation.
    http://www.councilofexmuslims.com/index.php?topic=30785
  • Re: Life on Saturn's moon Titan?
     Reply #50 - June 08, 2010, 07:33 PM

     Cheesy
  • Re: Life on Saturn's moon Titan?
     Reply #51 - June 08, 2010, 09:46 PM

    I became interested in Islam for various reasons.

    1. Religion is kind of an interesting subject for me.

    2. Different people say different things about Islam, so I want to know what's actually true about it. So I study it. And not from JihadWatch or some Islamic apologetics website.

    3. I disagree with Islam and certain Muslims quite a bit. So I like to know what I'm talking about when I discuss Islam with them.

    4. Islam is obviously particularly interesting nowadays.

    And I'm an atheist.

    The problem of Islam is the conversation of our time.  When I was a Muslim, I never enjoyed the conversation because, to me, Islam felt indefensible and I like to be honest.  It's only after apostasy that I feel I can speak my mind and point out the bits of Islam that I disagree with, and those I don't have a problem with. dance

    Zebedee, Did you say you teach too?  I thought you were only about 23 yrs old.

    "Many people would sooner die than think; In fact, they do so." -- Bertrand Russell

    Baloney Detection Kit
  • Re: Life on Saturn's moon Titan?
     Reply #52 - June 08, 2010, 09:49 PM

    I know hey me too ateapotist i could only defend islam against other religions but i would have no chance against a rational and educated atheist or skeptic
  • Re: Life on Saturn's moon Titan?
     Reply #53 - June 08, 2010, 09:59 PM

    The problem of Islam is the conversation of our time.  When I was a Muslim, I never enjoyed the conversation because, to me, Islam felt indefensible and I like to be honest.  It's only after apostasy that I feel I can speak my mind and point out the bits of Islam that I disagree with, and those I don't have a problem with. dance

    Zebedee, Did you say you teach too?  I thought you were only about 23 yrs old.


    Yes. I too don't like defending weak positions. But as Muhammad said, 'leave that which makes you doubt for that which does not.' It's ironic that it's for that very reason that so many Muslims leave Islam.

    And I don't teach, I'm still doing a degree. I'll probably end up being a teacher though.
  • Re: Life on Saturn's moon Titan?
     Reply #54 - June 09, 2010, 12:32 AM

    I think the most convincing UFO footage (which appear to be craft and not natural phenomenon) are likely to be military craft, probably using the atmosphere of Earth or Earth's magnetic field as part of its mechanism for propulsion.

    That's called a jet. Wink

    Earth's magnetic field is really pretty weak. I doubt you'd get a big enough gradient over a reasonable distance to generate any useful power, given that gradients is what it would come down to.

    Devious, treacherous, murderous, neanderthal, sub-human of the West. bunny
  • Re: Life on Saturn's moon Titan?
     Reply #55 - June 09, 2010, 01:58 AM

    if there are actually alien life forms , Islam is completely false then and every Muslim should then leave Islam.

    hopefully there are actual life forms so we could finally get a rest from these moronic theists.

    [13:36] <Fimbles> anything above 7 inches
    [13:37] <Fimbles> is wacko
    [13:37] <Fimbles> see
    [13:37] <Fimbles> you think i'd enjoy anything above 7 inches up my arse?
  • Re: Life on Saturn's moon Titan?
     Reply #56 - June 09, 2010, 04:28 AM

    How does the existence of aliens contradict Islam? Or any religion for that matter?
  • Re: Life on Saturn's moon Titan?
     Reply #57 - June 09, 2010, 04:33 AM

    let me find the ayah and i will post it.

    [13:36] <Fimbles> anything above 7 inches
    [13:37] <Fimbles> is wacko
    [13:37] <Fimbles> see
    [13:37] <Fimbles> you think i'd enjoy anything above 7 inches up my arse?
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