Skip navigation
Sidebar -

Advanced search options →
↑ ↓
CEMB → Forum → Welcome to the forum → Introductions → Peace, All

Welcome

Welcome to CEMB forum.
Please login or register. Did you miss your activation email?

Donations

Help keep the Forum going!
Click on Kitty to donate:

Kitty is lost

Recent Posts

Do humans have needed kno...
September 28, 2025, 02:31 PM
New Britain
September 26, 2025, 12:16 PM
Lights on the way
by akay
September 26, 2025, 06:22 AM
الحبيب من يشبه اكثر؟؟؟
by akay
September 24, 2025, 11:55 AM
What's happened to the fo...
September 23, 2025, 12:54 AM
Muslim grooming gangs sti...
September 20, 2025, 07:39 PM
Jesus mythicism
by zeca
September 13, 2025, 10:59 PM
Qur'anic studies today
by zeca
September 12, 2025, 10:09 PM
Orientalism - Edward Said
by zeca
August 22, 2025, 07:41 AM
News From Syria
by zeca
August 09, 2025, 10:33 PM
Gaza assault
July 25, 2025, 05:18 PM
The origins of Judaism
by zeca
July 01, 2025, 08:10 PM

Theme Changer

 Topic: Peace, All

 (Read 193065 times)
  • Previous page 1 ... 15 16 1718 19 ... 61 Next page « Previous thread | Next thread »
  • Re: Peace, All
     Reply #480 - June 21, 2010, 09:48 PM
    Quote from: hupla on June 21, 2010, 09:40 PM
    Yeah - spotted that too. I am also not sure if it is intentional or something else.  He does not follow logical arguments.


    The circular reasoning is indeed strong with this one. He's clearly the most powerful mind we've ever dealt with.

    I mean, he seems like a civil and nice guy but, by Jove, in terms of intellectual dishonesty he could run rings round the brain-washed ideologues in Nineteen Eighty-Four
  • Re: Peace, All
     Reply #481 - June 21, 2010, 09:50 PM
    In this thread: people wasting time.

    His point of view: "Things are like this because I believe they are like this because the Quran said so"
    Everyone else: "How can you know the Quran is right / What if you are wrong / What if things are not like that?"
    His replies: "Not possible, because I believe things are like this, because God/Quran/Mohammed said so and God cannot be wrong"
    Everyone else: "But what if..."

    Etcetera, etcetera...
    Do not look directly at the operational end of the device.
  • Re: Peace, All
     Reply #482 - June 21, 2010, 09:51 PM
    Hey, don't ruin our pointless fun.
    fuck you
  • Re: Peace, All
     Reply #483 - June 21, 2010, 09:53 PM
    Quote from: Zebedee on June 21, 2010, 09:48 PM
    The circular reasoning is indeed strong with this one. He's clearly the most powerful mind we've ever dealt with.

    I mean, he seems like a civil and nice guy but, by Jove, in terms of intellectual dishonesty he could run rings round the brain-washed ideologues in Nineteen Eighty-Four

    It's not even capable of running in circles - only in particular circles. He is *deliberately* believing in 2 contradictory things at once in a number of the points he has made - and refuses to work out that those 2 contradictory concepts/positions need to interact at their edges - where their contradiction becomes apparent.

    EDIT: it's more like a skipping record that refuses to read a certain section (the bit where the 2 contradictions bounce off each other).
    It's interesting to observe.
  • Re: Peace, All
     Reply #484 - June 21, 2010, 09:53 PM
    Quote from: MRasheed on June 21, 2010, 04:12 PM
    No, I'm good.  Thanks though.

    I'm having a ball, don't mind me.  Keep 'em comin'.  Smiley

    You don't consider your argument "preaching" just because you don't believe in God?  "Slavery is evil!! How dare you!  You're stupid because you don't think slavery is evil!!"  lol

    I don't think I'm right about everything.  Somethings I try and interpret through the Word of God and form my opinion accordingly.  I trust on your counterarguments to help me work out the kinks in my own argument about those types of things.  God is the one who is right about everything, so if He says something then I form my opinion around that.  He is the omniscient one after all.  I give Him the benfit of the doubt that He knows what He is talking about.



    You don't appear to be interpreting anything. All you are doing is quoting and that is preaching. You do see why we might be forgiven for thinking so.
    Religion is ignorance giftwrapped in lyricism.
  • Re: Peace, All
     Reply #485 - June 21, 2010, 09:54 PM
    Quote from: hupla on June 21, 2010, 09:35 PM
    Yeah-you've demonstrated that there are a number of things you do not.


    ME?Huh?  LOL!!!
     
    Quote from: hupla on June 21, 2010, 09:35 PM
    Read what you wrote here again.  You say "it would not be fair". Suggesting that fair is defined objectively or by you - not by your god.


    I apologize and did not mean to give that impression.  I thought I had already made it clear that Allah is the one who decides the rules thus makes things fair/ or not.  I only speak from my understanding of how the Lord operates.

    Quote from: hupla on June 21, 2010, 09:35 PM
    If you follow your earlier logic fully then "fair" is also defined by your god.


    This is exactly true.

    Quote from: hupla on June 21, 2010, 09:35 PM
    In which case it is not for you to worry if your god in fact sends you to hell for following your god's rules after he promises you that you get to heaven - after all he is the one who defines fair and if that includes changing the rules because he feels like it, who are you to dispute that it is not fair.


    Only you would arbitrarily change the rules as you went along, hupla.  Not the One who created mathematics from scratch.  Please be reasonable.  lol

    Quote from: hupla on June 21, 2010, 09:35 PM
    (Unless of course your logic in the second part is what you now believe is true: in which case you are saying that morality exists outside your god and your god is subject to it).


    I haven't even remotely changed my argument.  It is you who seem confused and having trouble keeping up.  But I'll wait. Wink
  • Re: Peace, All
     Reply #486 - June 21, 2010, 09:55 PM
    Tlaloc - please change your avatar, I cant concentrate on your posts anymore, all I do is stare at "Garfield" Yum Yum
    My Book     news002       
    My Blog  pccoffee
  • Re: Peace, All
     Reply #487 - June 21, 2010, 09:55 PM
    Quote from: DigDug on June 21, 2010, 09:36 PM
    haha is it like salvia?

    www.youtube.com/watch?v=lPuGJM_0DwI

    who's that guy?
    Quote from: MRasheed on June 21, 2010, 09:32 PM
    'Fair' is Him doing what He said He would while giving us a lifetime to choose the right way.  Unfair is Him not doing what He said after spelling out all the rules and conditions.  I've known for quite sometime now that the consequence of my rejection of faith is the Lake of Fire no matter what I may personally feel about the concept.  If I find myself in the thing, it will not be unfair on His part, but stupid on my own.

    honestly i think that it is way in which you acctualy think which is stupid, i hope 4 you that god isn't the one of the bible, cause if not your going to hell.please reaspond to my other question about the native-americans, and try to respond by yourself without using god's thoughts.
    "Believe nothing, no matter where you read it, or who said it, no matter if I have said it, unless it agrees with your own reason and your own common sense. "
    "We are what we think. All that we are arises with our thoughts. With our thoughts, we make the world. "
    --Buddha
  • Re: Peace, All
     Reply #488 - June 21, 2010, 09:56 PM
    Quote from: IsLame on June 21, 2010, 09:55 PM
    Tlaloc - please change your avatar, I cant concentrate on your posts anymore, all I do is stare at "Garfield" Yum Yum


    Yeah, where the hell is that from anyways?
    fuck you
  • Re: Peace, All
     Reply #489 - June 21, 2010, 09:57 PM
    Quote from: MRasheed on June 21, 2010, 09:54 PM
    Only you would arbitrarily change the rules as you went along, hupla.  Not the One who created mathematics from scratch.  Please be reasonable.  lol

    So now you say your god is subject to reason.
    You do know that Islamic scholars have looked at this in the past, do you not?
    Conclusions of Al Ghazali:
    There is no free will - only predestination.
    Allah is beyond logic and morality is defined by Allah.

    Who are you to say what Allah does or does not is reasonable or should be reasonable? Again you contradict yourself.  
    EDIT: you've merely substituted the word "reasonable" for "fair".  It doesn't escape the illogic of your position.
  • Re: Peace, All
     Reply #490 - June 21, 2010, 09:59 PM
    Quote from: MRasheed on June 21, 2010, 06:13 PM
    uhhh... menustration is 'unclean.'  Isn't it her body purging itself of goo it no longer needs?  You don't think feces is unclean either eh?  Do you have sex when people are purging themselves of feces and urine?  What's your deal?

    It is okay to touch women and be alright by them but not to have intercourse with them while they are on their menses.  The Talmud says not to touch them at all; if they walk over a waterhose the water is now poluted forever or something crazy like that.  That's not what the Qur'an is saying.

    Isn't that a tad confused. All of the processes you mention are cleansing functions. Far from being unclean, I would say; unless you want to go rolling about in the products. And then of course it's not the person producing it but the person doing the rolling who might be considered 'unclean'.
    Religion is ignorance giftwrapped in lyricism.
  • Re: Peace, All
     Reply #491 - June 21, 2010, 09:59 PM
    Quote from: hupla on June 21, 2010, 09:53 PM
    It's not even capable of running in circles - only in particular circles. He is *deliberately* believing in 2 contradictory things at once in a number of the points he has made - and refuses to work out that those 2 contradictory concepts/positions need to interact at their edges - where their contradiction becomes apparent.

    EDIT: it's more like a skipping record that refuses to read a certain section (the bit where the 2 contradictions bounce off each other).
    It's interesting to observe.

    Some absolutely brilliant posts today, but gotta say this one beats them all  Afro
    My Book     news002       
    My Blog  pccoffee
  • Re: Peace, All
     Reply #492 - June 21, 2010, 09:59 PM
    Quote from: hupla on June 21, 2010, 09:40 PM
    Yeah - spotted that too. I am also not sure if it is intentional or something else.  He does not follow logical arguments.


    Should I?  Am I not a practitioner of a belief system that you claimed to reject because it was an illogical fairy tale?  So why would you expect me to use a logical argument while believing and arguing in, as you see it, an illogical concept?

    It sounds suspiciously like you all are trying to get me to play by a different set of rules in which you will have some odd form of advantage based on your way of thinking.  CONFESS!  lol
  • Re: Peace, All
     Reply #493 - June 21, 2010, 10:01 PM
    Quote from: Q-Man on June 21, 2010, 09:56 PM
    Yeah, where the hell is that from anyways?

    Garfield or the image?
    My Book     news002       
    My Blog  pccoffee
  • Re: Peace, All
     Reply #494 - June 21, 2010, 10:01 PM
    Quote from: sojournerlumus on June 21, 2010, 09:59 PM
    Isn't that a tad confused. All of the processes you mention are cleansing functions. Far from being unclean, I would say; unless you want to go rolling about in the products. And then of course it's not the person producing it but the person doing the rolling who might be considered 'unclean'.


    You're being silly.  The 'goo' that is being processed out during the cleansing is clearly unclean.
  • Re: Peace, All
     Reply #495 - June 21, 2010, 10:03 PM
    Quote from: IsLame on June 21, 2010, 09:55 PM
    Tlaloc - please change your avatar, I cant concentrate on your posts anymore, all I do is stare at "Garfield" Yum Yum

    Would you prefer Invader Zim?

    Do not look directly at the operational end of the device.
  • Re: Peace, All
     Reply #496 - June 21, 2010, 10:04 PM
    Quote from: MRasheed on June 21, 2010, 09:59 PM
    Should I?  Am I not a practitioner of a belief system that you claimed to reject because it was an illogical fairy tale?  So why would you expect me to use a logical argument while believing and arguing in, as you see it, an illogical concept?

    It sounds suspiciously like you all are trying to get me to play by a different set of rules in which you will have some odd form of advantage based on your way of thinking.  CONFESS!  lol

    OK, we confess, we are trying to get you to use logic Embarrassed
    My Book     news002       
    My Blog  pccoffee
  • Re: Peace, All
     Reply #497 - June 21, 2010, 10:04 PM
    Quote from: MRasheed on June 21, 2010, 08:14 PM
    We are ALL brainwashed with SOMETHING.  I myself choose to be brainwashed with the Word of God where I can never go wrong.  Feel free to continue to be brainwashed with whatever the world regurgitates.

    In the end we will see which of us wins.   dance

    I think you'll find that people on this forum have freed themselves from brainwashing. That's why we're here.
     Why are you here exactly - developing doubts?  That would explain your need to push your dogma down our throats perhaps?
    Religion is ignorance giftwrapped in lyricism.
  • Re: Peace, All
     Reply #498 - June 21, 2010, 10:04 PM
    Quote from: MRasheed on June 21, 2010, 09:59 PM
    Should I?  Am I not a practitioner of a belief system that you claimed to reject because it was an illogical fairy tale?  So why would you expect me to use a logical argument while believing and arguing in, as you see it, an illogical concept?

    It sounds suspiciously like you all are trying to get me to play by a different set of rules in which you will have some odd form of advantage based on your way of thinking.  CONFESS!  lol

    No - I am merely asking you to follow your own logic to its conclusion.
    I respect that Al Ghazali was able to do this - one may disagree on his premise (that the Qur'an is the word of allah) but at least one must respect the fact that he examines the logical implications of this, tests his beliefs for inconsistencies and ensures that there is a single coherent belief system. Yours is simply a set of shards - and you refuse to look at the edges of those shards.
  • Re: Peace, All
     Reply #499 - June 21, 2010, 10:05 PM
    Quote from: Zebedee on June 21, 2010, 09:48 PM
    The circular reasoning is indeed strong with this one. He's clearly the most powerful mind we've ever dealt with.


    lol

    Quote from: Zebedee on June 21, 2010, 09:48 PM
    I mean, he seems like a civil and nice guy but, by Jove, in terms of intellectual dishonesty he could run rings round the brain-washed ideologues in Nineteen Eighty-Four


    Where am I being dishonest?  'Cause I don't believe the slave institution is evil separate from the acts of evil men?
  • Re: Peace, All
     Reply #500 - June 21, 2010, 10:05 PM
    Quote from: MRasheed on June 21, 2010, 09:59 PM
    It sounds suspiciously like you all are trying to get me to play by a different set of rules in which you will have some odd form of advantage based on your way of thinking.  CONFESS!  lol


    No, it's that you say things like 'You need to keep acting like a Muslim till you believe because otherwise you will burn in Hell!'

    While we are saying 'We don't believe in Hell" - So we need a better reason.

    You don't seem to have a better reason other than "I believe it's true".

    I can see you believe it's true - but since you are asking us to repent and believe you need to give us a reason we would find compelling.

    Can you see that, Rasheed?
  • Re: Peace, All
     Reply #501 - June 21, 2010, 10:08 PM
    Quote from: MRasheed on June 21, 2010, 08:34 PM
    There are no circumstances that would "demand" I hit my wife.  I prefer to take the best meaning from the Qur'an and strive towards the best behavior as a Muslim.

    It was common practice in those days in most cultures for a woman to be ready for marriage the very second she reached pubertyand for the man to be ready when he achieved the money/wealth to enable him to take care of a family.  Consequently it was normal for men in their thirties to have wives in their teens... meaning there was a household full of kids which included the wife.  Kids are kids and sometimes they need a wack or two.  In our age and culture, it is normal for the husband and wife to be of the same age and thus the "wack or two" is no longer appropriate.  

    It's not ' in order' to whack kids either.
    Religion is ignorance giftwrapped in lyricism.
  • Re: Peace, All
     Reply #502 - June 21, 2010, 10:09 PM
    Quote from: sojournerlumus on June 21, 2010, 10:04 PM
    I think you'll find that people on this forum have freed themselves from brainwashing. That's why we're here.


    Nonsense.  You've merely replaced it with another.

    Quote from: sojournerlumus on June 21, 2010, 10:04 PM
    Why are you here exactly?


    To test my argument for my faith against those I felt should have the strongest arguments against faith: The Transgressor.

    Quote from: sojournerlumus on June 21, 2010, 10:04 PM
    That would explain your need to push your dogma down our throats perhaps?


    Wow.  Is that what I'm doing?  Or am I merely answering you all's questions to the best of my ability?  Notice that I've barely stepped out of the intro thread...
  • Re: Peace, All
     Reply #503 - June 21, 2010, 10:13 PM
    Quote from: Hassan on June 21, 2010, 10:05 PM
    No, it's that you say things like 'You need to keep acting like a Muslim till you believe because otherwise you will burn in Hell!'

    While we are saying 'We don't believe in Hell" - So we need a better reason.

    You don't seem to have a better reason other than "I believe it's true".

    I can see you believe it's true - but since you are asking us to repent and believe you need to give us a reason we would find compelling.

    Can you see that, Rasheed?



    I do.

    But it is a matter of faith.  He could've just opened up a rift in space/time and showed without a shadow of a doubt the truth of the matter and did away with the pesky little thing called 'belief.'

    But He didn't. 

    Raw belief is an important requirement of His for His own reasons.  Simply believing is part and parcel of the whole Game.  It's important that you accept the rules of the Game on His terms.  He is the One afterall who holds all the cards.
  • Re: Peace, All
     Reply #504 - June 21, 2010, 10:14 PM
    Quote
    It was common practice in those days in most cultures for a woman to be ready for marriage the very second she reached pubertyand for the man to be ready when he achieved the money/wealth to enable him to take care of a family.  Consequently it was normal for men in their thirties to have wives in their teens... meaning there was a household full of kids which included the wife.  Kids are kids and sometimes they need a wack or two.  In our age and culture, it is normal for the husband and wife to be of the same age and thus the "wack or two" is no longer appropriate.

    if it is god's will so what is it no longer appropriate? do you think that it should be restored?
    "Believe nothing, no matter where you read it, or who said it, no matter if I have said it, unless it agrees with your own reason and your own common sense. "
    "We are what we think. All that we are arises with our thoughts. With our thoughts, we make the world. "
    --Buddha
  • Re: Peace, All
     Reply #505 - June 21, 2010, 10:15 PM
    Quote from: MRasheed on June 21, 2010, 10:13 PM
    I do.

    But it is a matter of faith.  He could've just opened up a rift in space/time and showed without a shadow of a doubt the truth of the matter and did away with the pesky little thing called 'belief.'

    But He didn't. 

    Raw belief is an important requirement of His for His own reasons.  Simply believing is part and parcel of the whole Game.  It's important that you accept the rules of the Game on His terms.  He is the One afterall who holds all the cards.

    and why beliving is so important??
    "Believe nothing, no matter where you read it, or who said it, no matter if I have said it, unless it agrees with your own reason and your own common sense. "
    "We are what we think. All that we are arises with our thoughts. With our thoughts, we make the world. "
    --Buddha
  • Re: Peace, All
     Reply #506 - June 21, 2010, 10:15 PM
    Rasheed my friend, I don't want you to feel we are all having a go at you. I have Muslim family and have huge empathy for Muslims. Like others here we just like to debate Islam as it is something we have been through. But I am certainly not on a mission to try and turn anyone away from islam.

    I suggest you stay and join in other discussions here and get to know us a bit.

    We are generally a nice bunch. (Except for IsLame - he's evil and his butt smells)
  • Re: Peace, All
     Reply #507 - June 21, 2010, 10:17 PM
    Quote from: IsLame on June 21, 2010, 09:38 PM
    But Gandhi worshipped idols?  Like us kaffirs, according to the Quran he IS destined to hell.  Dont you know that?


    No, I don't know what Gandhi believed.  I HEARD he was a good man.  For his sake, whatever he believed, I hope Allah accepts it.
  • Re: Peace, All
     Reply #508 - June 21, 2010, 10:19 PM
    Quote from: MRasheed on June 21, 2010, 10:13 PM
    Raw belief is an important requirement of His for His own reasons.  Simply believing is part and parcel of the whole Game.  It's important that you accept the rules of the Game on His terms.  He is the One afterall who holds all the cards.


    He also made us an inquisitive race and with a mind - how could he expect us not to use it?
  • Re: Peace, All
     Reply #509 - June 21, 2010, 10:20 PM
    Quote from: MRasheed on June 21, 2010, 10:17 PM
    No, I don't know what Gandhi believed.  I HEARD he was a good man.  For his sake, whatever he believed, I hope Allah accepts it.

    i think that allah will strangely accept more from Bin Laden that from Gandhi  grin12
    "Believe nothing, no matter where you read it, or who said it, no matter if I have said it, unless it agrees with your own reason and your own common sense. "
    "We are what we think. All that we are arises with our thoughts. With our thoughts, we make the world. "
    --Buddha
  • Previous page 1 ... 15 16 1718 19 ... 61 Next page « Previous thread | Next thread »