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Theme Changer

 Topic: Going mainstream?

 (Read 22942 times)
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  • Re: Going mainstream?
     Reply #30 - August 24, 2010, 12:29 AM

    Hassan, I'll upload the video you made in a few minutes. Also, a dating site is a great idea for atheists/agnostics/ex-religionists in general. Does anyone know of any such site?

    "Blessed are they who can laugh at themselves, for they shall never cease to be amused."
  • Re: Going mainstream?
     Reply #31 - August 24, 2010, 12:41 AM

    Hassan, I'll upload the video you made in a few minutes. Also, a dating site is a great idea for atheists/agnostics/ex-religionists in general. Does anyone know of any such site?

    I think making it specific for ex-Muslims might be the best.

    Because other non-religious people might not have any trouble with revealing their real faces or very specific details about themselves to the world, so they would not understand why many ex-Muslims on that same site would be very cautious with declaring openly their lack of religiosity.
    On the other hand on a website made for ex-Muslims specifically such extreme caution would be the norm. So I guess other users would not get bothered if, for example, the personal pics are missing or do not really reveal one's face clearly, or if some specific information is missing.

    Ex-Muslim dating site should help ensure a degree of anonymity.

    Do not look directly at the operational end of the device.
  • Re: Going mainstream?
     Reply #32 - August 24, 2010, 01:31 AM

    Ok, it's up now... here it is:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ce1-kxGQNns

    Tlaloc, all good points. I just wonder about the numbers... are there enough of us to make it a worthwhile business venture yet. I hope so, but it's virtually impossible to get proper stats on it due to the very nature of Islam and the behaviours of Muslims - many are willing to ostracize and even harm those even in their own families who may be having doubts. While some others who may actually already be ex-muslims, seem to want to hold on to that label "muslim"...
     Thinking hard

    "Blessed are they who can laugh at themselves, for they shall never cease to be amused."
  • Re: Going mainstream?
     Reply #33 - August 24, 2010, 01:34 AM

    Oh and everyone, please feel free to spread/mirror this video and any of the others on the CEMB's youtube channel (linked to in my sig). We are all part of this movement, and we can all contribute in some way. Smiley

    "Blessed are they who can laugh at themselves, for they shall never cease to be amused."
  • Re: Going mainstream?
     Reply #34 - August 24, 2010, 02:00 AM

    i don't expect the youtube vid to get hits. just won't show up on the searches. the title needs to contain 'ex muslim(s)' or 'leave islam' or something that will be commonly entered into the search box.

    the content of the vid is definitive as an intro, but needs to be titled right.

    "you're not alone - message from ....." just won't show up imo.

    it might look ugly, but

    'Leaving islam? Ex muslim? Apostate? You're not alone' will be much more effective Wink
  • Re: Going mainstream?
     Reply #35 - August 24, 2010, 02:08 AM

    Good catch. Check out the new title...

    "Blessed are they who can laugh at themselves, for they shall never cease to be amused."
  • Re: Going mainstream?
     Reply #36 - August 24, 2010, 02:14 AM

    http://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=ex+muslim&suggested_categories=22%2C25%2C27&page=17

    shows up on page 17 right now Smiley i have no idea how to fix this Cheesy

    the only suggestion for the vid i have is to pepper the description with 'ex muslim, apostate, leaving islam' etc, increase the views, get it favourited by all youtube users within cemb.

    dirty tricks all of em, but a result on page 17 is no good at all.
  • Re: Going mainstream?
     Reply #37 - August 24, 2010, 02:24 AM

    LOL ok. The description is just Hassan's audio transcribed. Tags include many of the keywords that people could be searching by... I'll add the others you suggested too  Afro

    "Blessed are they who can laugh at themselves, for they shall never cease to be amused."
  • Re: Going mainstream?
     Reply #38 - August 24, 2010, 02:33 AM

    hehehe, we could hire a search engine optimization consultant Cheesy i have very little idea about how to go about it, just using some common sense. its on page 16 now  Afro

    i think the dirty solution of putting all the keywords into the title and description too will work. the formula should be title + descruption + tags + favourited + comments + likes. did i miss anything?  cool2

    you have a very cute avatar btw.
  • Re: Going mainstream?
     Reply #39 - August 24, 2010, 02:45 AM

    Thanks Smiley

    Ok... changed the title some more

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ce1-kxGQNns

    "Blessed are they who can laugh at themselves, for they shall never cease to be amused."
  • Re: Going mainstream?
     Reply #40 - August 24, 2010, 02:51 AM

    having a party in the comments section of the vid should be the logical next step Smiley
  • Re: Going mainstream?
     Reply #41 - August 24, 2010, 03:01 AM

     Cheesy

    Here you go everyone.... (comment from this vid)
    Quote
    I'm a christian and embraced Islam. This is council of pseudo-muslims gone no longer muslim by name. Congratulations. Fake ex-muslims for the lose. The commercial should be remade "Feeling bored and seeking attention? Looking to make easy money and be popularized in the media? Have a muslim name but know nothing about the religion you were born into or of your parents or forefathers? You too now can make easy money and remain the way you are by shouting being an ex-muslim". Lol. Pathetic.


    "Blessed are they who can laugh at themselves, for they shall never cease to be amused."
  • Re: Going mainstream?
     Reply #42 - August 24, 2010, 09:15 AM

    Thanks Smiley

    Ok... changed the title some more

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ce1-kxGQNns

    Good work H, particualrly in remembering the important bit at the end about anonymity - glad we got this video now.  Ive favourited it, and hope others do the same.

    My Book     news002       
    My Blog  pccoffee
  • Re: Going mainstream?
     Reply #43 - August 24, 2010, 10:40 AM

    I was reading some comments to the video and I had another idea:

    It might be useful to some people if these forums could be accessed from a seemingly innocent domain.
    Let me explain in details what I mean:

    - We could pick a completely non-religious subject that is not considered objectionable in Islam. For example... cars? Or, gardening? Or whatever.
    - Register a domain name for it like innocentlookingcars.com or ijustlovegardens.com
    - The site will have a user/login form
    - If the user logins using his councilofexmuslims.com credentials, he will be displayed the contents of these very forums but with an innocent-looking format (no "ex muslim" displayed in the title, different graphics, etcetera)
    - The credentials will NEVER be saved in cookies, so login is ALWAYS required
    - If the user is not logged, we just feed to the browser some news from a real news source about the fake-subject we picked
    - It would be better if the IP address of such fake domain is completely unrelated to councilofexmuslims.com (and this would require setup a secure encrypted connection between the new server and the database of councilofexmuslims.com)
    - The fake domain will have a registration form that will make you register on our forums BUT it will require using a specific "secret code" that we will provide. Without such code, you will end up being registered to the fake "mailing list" of our fake news site. So if anyone else stumbles upon it, it will seem less suspicious.

    So the lurkers who are currently too scared to join because they fear to get busted by their families/government/whatever.... will have a bit more incentive to actually register and use our forums.

    Do not look directly at the operational end of the device.
  • Re: Going mainstream?
     Reply #44 - August 24, 2010, 11:32 AM

    Meh. Tongue

    German ex-Muslim forumMy YouTubeList of Ex-Muslims
    Wikis: en de fr ar tr
    CEMB-Chat
    I'm on an indefinite break...
  • Re: Going mainstream?
     Reply #45 - August 24, 2010, 03:42 PM

    @ tlaloc : whoa Smiley

    some more ideas. wikipedia pages for the forum and more linking into our videos from wikipedia might be useful.

    thanks.
  • Re: Going mainstream?
     Reply #46 - August 24, 2010, 04:42 PM

    @ tlaloc : whoa Smiley

    some more ideas. wikipedia pages for the forum and more linking into our videos from wikipedia might be useful.

    thanks.


    There is a wikipedia page up for the Central Council of Ex-Muslims - which is the German branch which started it all.

    However I really think CEMB needs it's own page as we are actually more active than them - and we also have a busy online forum.

    I remember someone here tried putting up a page for us but it was removed by wikipedia for some reason - I don't understand why?

    Perhaps we can try doing that again - or maybe just an entry for the Forum - under the name "Council of Ex-Muslims"?

    Anyone able to do that?
  • Re: Going mainstream?
     Reply #47 - August 24, 2010, 08:54 PM

    I was reading some comments to the video and I had another idea:

    It might be useful to some people if these forums could be accessed from a seemingly innocent domain.
    Let me explain in details what I mean:

    - We could pick a completely non-religious subject that is not considered objectionable in Islam. For example... cars? Or, gardening? Or whatever.
    - Register a domain name for it like innocentlookingcars.com or ijustlovegardens.com
    - The site will have a user/login form
    - If the user logins using his councilofexmuslims.com credentials, he will be displayed the contents of these very forums but with an innocent-looking format (no "ex muslim" displayed in the title, different graphics, etcetera)
    - The credentials will NEVER be saved in cookies, so login is ALWAYS required
    - If the user is not logged, we just feed to the browser some news from a real news source about the fake-subject we picked
    - It would be better if the IP address of such fake domain is completely unrelated to councilofexmuslims.com (and this would require setup a secure encrypted connection between the new server and the database of councilofexmuslims.com)
    - The fake domain will have a registration form that will make you register on our forums BUT it will require using a specific "secret code" that we will provide. Without such code, you will end up being registered to the fake "mailing list" of our fake news site. So if anyone else stumbles upon it, it will seem less suspicious.

    So the lurkers who are currently too scared to join because they fear to get busted by their families/government/whatever.... will have a bit more incentive to actually register and use our forums.

    Yep, that'd be great for people whose pages visited are under surveillance.

    It reminds me of the elaborate setup the torrent tracker Waffles has.

    But in our case, we could just use a separate dummy page that'd link to here. 

    The forums could also be left directly accessible.


    Perhaps we can try doing that again - or maybe just an entry for the Forum - under the name "Council of Ex-Muslims"?

    Wikipedia usually doesn't allow pages about forums - with the exception of the infamous ones like Stormfront.

    You could put up a separate, detailed page about the organization though.

    "Life is not a matter of holding good cards, but of playing a poor hand well."
    - Robert Louis Stevenson
  • Re: Going mainstream?
     Reply #48 - August 24, 2010, 09:05 PM

    hmmm, yeah. which is why the internet is the only way to reach critical mass without a safety risk.


    Organizing an effective movement against an oppressive ideology/religion will ALWAYS involve safety risks.

    fuck you
  • Re: Going mainstream?
     Reply #49 - August 24, 2010, 09:08 PM

    Organizing an effective movement against an oppressive ideology/religion will ALWAYS involve safety risks.


    Correct.

    Internet is fine - but RL action is the only way to become mainstream.
  • Re: Going mainstream?
     Reply #50 - August 24, 2010, 09:49 PM

    i get the point of doing thing in real life. but as i said, you can use the internet to get a large enough pool of people.

    an active network of a few thousand people on the internet is going to be a good starting point for RL activities for reasons i explained earlier.
  • Re: Going mainstream?
     Reply #51 - August 24, 2010, 09:52 PM

    We should start something. Someday. It doesn't have to be impossible.  yes


    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BqkSmpKkfdI

    Do not let silence become your legacy.. Question everything   
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim
     
  • Re: Going mainstream?
     Reply #52 - August 24, 2010, 10:01 PM

    I discovered this site through IsLame's youtube channel:

    http://www.youtube.com/user/ExMuslimUK

    At the time I was inquisitive about other Muslims who'd left Islam and I accidentally stumbled upon one of his videos and found the link to the forum in his channel.

    I also think YouTube is a great portal for reaching closet apostates and doubting Muslims.  Before I joined this site, I realised that there was some activity worth checking out here when I saw Maryam Namazie on YouTube videos and on BBC programmes.  Also, the fact that the philosopher A.C. Grayling, the journalist Johann Hari, and reasonable YouTube atheists, endorsed the CEMB impressed me greatly.  Smiley

    "Many people would sooner die than think; In fact, they do so." -- Bertrand Russell

    Baloney Detection Kit
  • Re: Going mainstream?
     Reply #53 - August 24, 2010, 11:50 PM

    This is a good idea. It is important to make sure that not only ex-muslims have a place to go, normal muslims learn to accept and live with ex-muslims but that even non-muslims appreciate the courage needed to come out with such a decision.  Afro


    At evening, casual flocks of pigeons make
    Ambiguous undulations as they sink,
    Downward to darkness, on extended wings. - Stevens
  • Re: Going mainstream?
     Reply #54 - August 25, 2010, 12:27 AM

    ^ !!!!!

    So once again I'm left with the classic Irish man's dilemma, do I eat the potato or do I let it ferment so I can drink it later?
    My political philosophy below
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bwGat4i8pJI&feature=g-vrec
    Just kidding, here are some true heros
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dBTgvK6LQqA
  • Re: Going mainstream?
     Reply #55 - August 27, 2010, 02:07 PM


    The problem is not just the coercive pressures that ex Muslims face, which is massive, horrifying and inhibiting, but also the reluctance by some parts of the mainstream culture to acknowledge them, either out of deference to the sensitivities of Muslims, through a misplaces fear of being branded 'bigots' or 'Islamophobes', or because they only want to project shiney happy-clappy images of Islam. For example, the BBC regularly produces documentaries about converts to Islam, the 'greatness and beauty' of Islam, as part of a sort of soft multiculturalism remit, partly because it feels it has a role to play in 'de-demonising' Islam after all the issues to do with it have given it an image problem. The Guardian, The New Statesmen, they all allow themselves to be virtual vessels of dawah when the issue of Islam arises.

    So ex Muslims face a number of issues before even getting any sympathy or coverage in the first place.

    "we can smell traitors and country haters"


    God is Love.
    Love is Blind. Stevie Wonder is blind. Therefore, Stevie Wonder is God.

  • Re: Going mainstream?
     Reply #56 - September 01, 2010, 09:35 AM

    how about creating\marking some vids as responses to the main ad.
  • Re: Going mainstream?
     Reply #57 - September 01, 2010, 09:38 AM

    The problem is not just the coercive pressures that ex Muslims face, which is massive, horrifying and inhibiting, but also the reluctance by some parts of the mainstream culture to acknowledge them, either out of deference to the sensitivities of Muslims, through a misplaces fear of being branded 'bigots' or 'Islamophobes', or because they only want to project shiney happy-clappy images of Islam. For example, the BBC regularly produces documentaries about converts to Islam, the 'greatness and beauty' of Islam, as part of a sort of soft multiculturalism remit, partly because it feels it has a role to play in 'de-demonising' Islam after all the issues to do with it have given it an image problem. The Guardian, The New Statesmen, they all allow themselves to be virtual vessels of dawah when the issue of Islam arises.

    So ex Muslims face a number of issues before even getting any sympathy or coverage in the first place.


    Though I agree with all of the above, I would like to add that the guardian did carry a comment piece by an ex-muslim a few months ago as his form of coming out of the closet.

    At evening, casual flocks of pigeons make
    Ambiguous undulations as they sink,
    Downward to darkness, on extended wings. - Stevens
  • Re: Going mainstream?
     Reply #58 - October 29, 2010, 02:35 AM

    suppose we made a "movement" and voiced our opinion and tried to change stuff , our countries are going to forsake us and we will be without a country our families will be shamed of us,

    and many many of us will be homeless .... but after they kill some of us we will look really good since we didn't retaliate with violence and we will gain the people affection Ghandi style

    so the bottom line is : not worth it ...  grin12
  • Re: Going mainstream?
     Reply #59 - November 09, 2010, 03:11 PM

    Over the last couple years, I've been a dedicated follower of free-thinking and science media, watching documentaries, comedy, political commentary, videos, lectures, discussions and debates.  I somehow managed to stumble onto CEMB via YouTube.  Having only known about this site since yesterday, I think that great opportunities are in store for an awakening movement. 

    There is so much that this Council of ex-Muslims can offer in terms of ideas, media content and personalities.  I'm amazed at the quality of the videos I've seen produced by members on this site.  For example, the extraordinarily powerful poetry from Nessrinn is compelling.  After listening to some of the videos, I'm convinced that the medium of poetry can shape hearts and minds now, just as it always could in Arabic culture.  Beyond this emotive eloquence, I've also noticed rational discourse in the dissection of Islam coming out channels like that of ExMuslimUK.  I know that many other freethinking individuals and communities are hungry for these kinds of media.   

    There are several accessible outlets that will enable you to link media to masses.  Such outlets may not directly connect media to Muslims but you can reach thousands of like-minded pantheists, deists, agnostics, atheists, humanists and rational moderates of all backgrounds who will help propagate the message and the movement.  Some of the more popular sites that regularly post videos include:

    RichardDawkins.net (http://richarddawkins.net/)
    Atheist Media Blog (http://www.atheistmedia.com/)
    Common Sense Atheism (http://commonsenseatheism.com/)

    Probably the best way to propagate your memes is via Twitter.  There are a number of channels that have followings in the thousands.  For example:
    http://www.twitter.com/AtheistMission (over 2000 followers)
    http://www.twitter.com/NewHumanist (over 5000 followers)
    http://www.twitter.com/Hemant Mehta (over 4000 followers)
    http://www.twitter.com/pzmyers (over 40,000 followers)
    http://www.twitter.com/AtheistQOTD (over 6000 followers)

    It is paramount that all non-believers and secularists to stand together on common ground wherever possible so use these channels to share your stories and media.



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