A greeting from a scandinavian atheist!

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A greeting from a scandinavian atheist!
OP - November 16, 2010, 12:59 AM

Hi!
I'm kinda feeling that dont quite belong here since i have never been a muslim, but at the same time i find this forum to be truly, truly fascinating and exciting!
As an atheist i have been discussing matters of religion with both christians and muslims alike (and some fringe-groups) and i do admit that my knowledge of islam is far inferior of christianity, therefore i do have apprehension when discussing religion with muslims as i dont fully understand they method of thought as opposed to christianity which i can easily relate to and subsequently make valid arguments.
So if i may, my first question to you guys is: I keep noticing from various debates that islam isnt a religon, its an ideology, or a culture.. So i'm wondering, to which extent is(or not) islam a culture or ideology? Is the people claiming islam to be an ideology just hate and fear-mongers? (as i currently suspect)

Anyway, i'm glad to be here and hope you will accept my presence so to speak
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Re: A greeting from a scandinavian atheist!
Reply #1 - November 16, 2010, 01:28 AM

Hi, and welcome .

Islam is cultural in the sense that it imposes a lot of restrictions in terms of dress code, segregation of men and women, azaan (calling out for prayer from the loudspeaker of a mosque), etc.

Its also political in the sense that muslims are often encouraged to try to convert other non muslims, prosletyze, etc.

There also seem to be at least some sects of islam which have an ideaology that they should wage war in non muslim areas and try to bring them under muslim control. But as far as I know its a sect based thing, not all muslims subscribe to this particular aspect of Islam, I think.

I think every religion has an effect on the culture of the place where its practised, so the cultural aspect isn't necessarily limited to Islam.

And welcome . I'm new here as well..

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Re: A greeting from a scandinavian atheist!
Reply #2 - November 16, 2010, 01:31 AM

You are very much welcome.
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Re: A greeting from a scandinavian atheist!
Reply #3 - November 16, 2010, 05:21 AM

Hey, welcome! Feel free to join in! You're not the only never-was-a-Muslim around here, so no biggie.

Islam is a an all-encompassing way of life, so it is both a culture and a religion, I guess you'd say. Now, to muddy the waters, Muslims often say, "Well that's just culture, and not Islam," when they are referring to certain practices common in Muslim societies. This is, and in some cases, isn't true. What they mean to say is that there is no particular text (either from the Quran or the hadith, which are the reported sayings and doings of Muhammad) which specifically condones or requires such acts. However, there are a number of practices and internal approaches to the understanding of the world that lead Muslims to behave in some predictable ways. Thus the "culture of Islam" has developed out of its religious imperatives.

"Religion is an insult to human dignity. With or without it, you'd have good people doing good things and evil people doing bad things, but for good people to do bad things, it takes religion."~Steven Weinberg
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Re: A greeting from a scandinavian atheist!
Reply #4 - November 16, 2010, 10:42 AM

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Re: A greeting from a scandinavian atheist!
Reply #5 - November 16, 2010, 12:58 PM

Welcome aboard. There are quite a few never-been-muslims here, so don't worry!

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Re: A greeting from a scandinavian atheist!
Reply #6 - November 16, 2010, 01:50 PM

Welcome Alpha.

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Re: A greeting from a scandinavian atheist!
Reply #7 - November 16, 2010, 02:42 PM

Welcome! I'm a life-long infidel, myself.
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Re: A greeting from a scandinavian atheist!
Reply #8 - November 17, 2010, 01:00 AM

Welcome.

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Re: A greeting from a scandinavian atheist!
Reply #9 - November 17, 2010, 01:36 AM

Welcome Alpha!

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Re: A greeting from a scandinavian atheist!
Reply #10 - November 23, 2010, 04:30 PM

Thank you all for the warm welcome and yes, i will use the furries wisely!
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Re: A greeting from a scandinavian atheist!
Reply #11 - November 23, 2010, 04:36 PM

Welcome

Short answer:

Yes of course Islam is a religion. It may well be a lot of other things also - but it is definitely a religion.
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Re: A greeting from a scandinavian atheist!
Reply #12 - November 23, 2010, 04:43 PM

Quote from: Alpha on November 16, 2010, 12:59 AM
Hi!

Welcome.

Quote
So if i may, my first question to you guys is: I keep noticing from various debates that islam isnt a religon, its an ideology, or a culture.. So i'm wondering, to which extent is(or not) islam a culture or ideology? Is the people claiming islam to be an ideology just hate and fear-mongers? (as i currently suspect)

Consider your suspicions confirmed. And I think you mean "cult" rather than "culture". First off, all religions are ideological, and while Islam may be inherently more political than other religions, that does not, in and of itself, mean that it's not a religion. As far as the cult thing goes, I've never accepted that there is any meaningful difference between a cult and a religion besides size and age.

People who say Islam is not really a religion (but instead a "cult" or "political ideology") are just bigots coming up with a clever excuse for discriminating against the adherents of one particular religion over another. Of course it's a religion-- they have their sky-daddy, prayer, holy texts, prophets, theologians, religious leaders and institutions-- now if one wants to argue it's a religion that's more problematic than the others because of X, Y, and/or Z, that's a reasonable discussion/debate to have.

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Re: A greeting from a scandinavian atheist!
Reply #13 - November 23, 2010, 05:14 PM

Quote from: Alpha on November 16, 2010, 12:59 AM
Hi!
I'm kinda feeling that dont quite belong here since i have never been a muslim, but at the same time i find this forum to be truly, truly fascinating and exciting!
As an atheist i have been discussing matters of religion with both christians and muslims alike (and some fringe-groups) and i do admit that my knowledge of islam is far inferior of christianity, therefore i do have apprehension when discussing religion with muslims as i dont fully understand they method of thought as opposed to christianity which i can easily relate to and subsequently make valid arguments.
So if i may, my first question to you guys is: I keep noticing from various debates that islam isnt a religon, its an ideology, or a culture.. So i'm wondering, to which extent is(or not) islam a culture or ideology? Is the people claiming islam to be an ideology just hate and fear-mongers? (as i currently suspect)

Anyway, i'm glad to be here and hope you will accept my presence so to speak

Welcome to the forum!

There are many who were never Muslim on the forum so I'm sure you'll fit in fine.

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Re: A greeting from a scandinavian atheist!
Reply #14 - November 23, 2010, 05:24 PM

Welcome

So once again I'm left with the classic Irish man's dilemma, do I eat the potato or do I let it ferment so I can drink it later?
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Re: A greeting from a scandinavian atheist!
Reply #15 - November 23, 2010, 06:08 PM

Welcome, I'm quite new here as well (at least on the posting front )

As to your question, I've always been told that Islam is, and I quote, "a complete way of life". So it is not just spiritual, but seeps into all matters of life, be they political, economical or social. For example the strict rules regarding inheritance, charity, spoils of war etc. So I guess it is sort of an ideology with it's own laws, and the culture is just influenced by that (among other things).
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Re: A greeting from a scandinavian atheist!
Reply #16 - November 24, 2010, 03:25 PM

Welcome to the board. My SO is scandinavian as well and he posts here. Where do you live?

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Re: A greeting from a scandinavian atheist!
Reply #17 - November 24, 2010, 03:26 PM

Quote from: IsLame on November 16, 2010, 10:42 AM

What, that's it? Son I am disappoint.

He's no friend to the friendless
And he's the mother of grief
There's only sorrow for tomorrow
Surely life is too brief
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