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 Topic: How can we comprehend the size of a star?

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  • Re: How can we comprehend the size of a star?
     Reply #30 - December 20, 2010, 06:03 PM
    I was mocking her lol. Obviously as you've pointed out it makes no sense.
  • Re: How can we comprehend the size of a star?
     Reply #31 - December 20, 2010, 06:35 PM
    I think she meant, "What is it about size that makes it important (a big deal)"

  • Re: How can we comprehend the size of a star?
     Reply #32 - December 20, 2010, 06:38 PM
    Quote from: Ishina on December 20, 2010, 05:51 PM
    So, why does it?

    What is it about size that makes it so big?


    We tend to percieve size from what is huge/big/large because;

    What is smaller requires more focus and can more easily escape us. Whereas what is huge/big/large is more inevitable and apparent.

    When we look at the scale of things. The natural tendency in the transformation of the scale of things wherein they last longer and have more of an impact is when they expand / increase in magnitude.

    The smaller a thing is the more easily it is reducible.

    Between two objects of different volumes yet of the same substance. The bigger one can by itself crush the smaller one moreso than the other way around.

    And in a state of equal withering, the bigger one will outlast the smaller one.
  • Re: How can we comprehend the size of a star?
     Reply #33 - December 20, 2010, 06:40 PM
    Quote from: zoomi on December 20, 2010, 06:35 PM
    I think she meant, "What is it about size that makes it important (a big deal)"


    My fault then sorry. Semantics problem.
  • Re: How can we comprehend the size of a star?
     Reply #34 - December 20, 2010, 06:43 PM
    Quote from: Logical_Mind44 on December 20, 2010, 06:38 PM


    Between two objects of different volumes yet of the same substance. The bigger one can by itself crush the smaller one moreso than the other way around.

    And in a state of equal withering, the bigger one will outlast the smaller one.


    I think you're forgetting that all big things are made up of very small things...
  • Re: How can we comprehend the size of a star?
     Reply #35 - December 20, 2010, 06:45 PM
    @z10 - don't worry about the importance of size. I'm sure zoomi loves you regardless.
  • Re: How can we comprehend the size of a star?
     Reply #36 - December 20, 2010, 06:49 PM
    Quote from: zoomi on December 20, 2010, 06:43 PM
    I think you're forgetting that all big things are made up of very small things...


    No I didn't. Smiley Thats why I said volume and substance(incl density etc). Regarding the composition of two objects being entirely equal and only their volume being the difference.
  • Re: How can we comprehend the size of a star?
     Reply #37 - December 20, 2010, 06:50 PM
    Quote from: Prince Spinoza on December 20, 2010, 06:45 PM
    @z10 - don't worry about the importance of size. I'm sure zoomi loves you regardless.


     Cheesy Cheesy
    At evening, casual flocks of pigeons make
    Ambiguous undulations as they sink,
    Downward to darkness, on extended wings. - Stevens
  • Re: How can we comprehend the size of a star?
     Reply #38 - December 20, 2010, 06:52 PM
    Quote from: Ishina on December 20, 2010, 05:58 PM
    How could we refute it?


    I'm not sure if it is possible. I do know however (and this is all my point was) that making such statements as "man is not the centre of the universe" or that "we are insignificantly small and so cannot be the purpose of all reality" doesnt really settle the matter either way.
    At evening, casual flocks of pigeons make
    Ambiguous undulations as they sink,
    Downward to darkness, on extended wings. - Stevens
  • Re: How can we comprehend the size of a star?
     Reply #39 - December 20, 2010, 06:53 PM
    Quote from: Prince Spinoza on December 20, 2010, 06:45 PM
    @z10 - don't worry about the importance of size. I'm sure zoomi loves you regardless.


     Cheesy Trust PS to make the obvious joke Tongue
  • Re: How can we comprehend the size of a star?
     Reply #40 - December 20, 2010, 06:55 PM
    Quote from: Logical_Mind44 on December 20, 2010, 06:49 PM
    No I didn't. Smiley Thats why I said volume and substance(incl density etc). Regarding the composition of two objects being entirely equal and only their volume being the difference.


    erm, OK. My point is more about a larger object crushing a smaller one. I think we are talking about different scales of relative size. How can the sun crush a quark? Your comment didn't make sense to me, maybe you can elaborate.
  • Re: How can we comprehend the size of a star?
     Reply #41 - December 20, 2010, 07:01 PM
    Quote from: z10 on December 20, 2010, 06:52 PM
    I'm not sure if it is possible. I do know however (and this is all my point was) that making such statements as "man is not the centre of the universe" or that "we are insignificantly small and so cannot be the purpose of all reality" doesnt really settle the matter either way.


    Well, I thinks its sheer wishful thinking almost to a comical level for someone to think this universe was made just for us. We can't even survive in most of it for a start. There are other forms of life on our own tiny ball of rock that are better suited to exist within this universe.
    Too fucking busy, and vice versa.
  • Re: How can we comprehend the size of a star?
     Reply #42 - December 20, 2010, 07:18 PM
    Don't mind him (us) on this point Ishina, we're perpetual agnostics Wink
  • Re: How can we comprehend the size of a star?
     Reply #43 - December 20, 2010, 07:33 PM
    Quote from: zoomi on December 20, 2010, 06:55 PM
    erm, OK. My point is more about a larger object crushing a smaller one. I think we are talking about different scales of relative size. How can the sun crush a quark? Your comment didn't make sense to me, maybe you can elaborate.


    Yes.

    The most infinitesimal and unreducible constituent of matter cannot be split/crushed by anything the same way visible object of relative volumes are crushed through abrasion because on that level all that really is, itself.

    By crush I mean a loss in the constituents of its composition wherein they are of a same type. I am not talking about other factors that play in this crushing.

    Is a quark able to split? No. Is two quarks able to be divided into two by abrasion of a compact of greater number of quarks? Possibly not. So in such an instance this does not apply.
  • Re: How can we comprehend the size of a star?
     Reply #44 - December 20, 2010, 09:15 PM
    Quote from: Ishina on December 20, 2010, 01:29 PM
    We often talk about imagining the unimaginable size of the universe, but can you even comprehend the size of a single star?

    Yeah. They're really big.  yes
    Devious, treacherous, murderous, neanderthal, sub-human of the West. bunny
  • Re: How can we comprehend the size of a star?
     Reply #45 - December 20, 2010, 09:49 PM
    Quote from: muddy on December 20, 2010, 02:53 PM
    Does anyone have any theories on how orbit around Saturn got evolved? And is it physical? If yes, what is the size of it?


    What do you exactly mean? Do you mean the orbit of Saturn itself?
  • Re: How can we comprehend the size of a star?
     Reply #46 - December 20, 2010, 09:59 PM
    I think he means Saturn's ring.
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  • Re: How can we comprehend the size of a star?
     Reply #47 - December 20, 2010, 10:52 PM
    Quote from: GodIsNotGreat on December 20, 2010, 09:59 PM
    I think he means Saturn's ring.


    I'll wait for him to reply. If he means the rings then there is a very intriguing answer.
  • Re: How can we comprehend the size of a star?
     Reply #48 - December 20, 2010, 11:54 PM
    yes.. give the answer already
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  • Re: How can we comprehend the size of a star?
     Reply #49 - December 21, 2010, 12:38 AM
    There have been quite a few theories about how saturn got its rings. Some astronomers thought that Saturn got its rings when a few astray asteroid or comet got too close to it and got ripped apart by the gravity of the planet. Others thought it that a large moon got stuck by an asteroid which smashed it into pieces. But none of that explains the composition of the rings, 90ish% of the rings are made of water ice and the rest is rocky materialm, and it doesn't explain the inner moons of saturn, which are made of ice.

    But recently an astronomer came up with a very good model which goes with the observations. She explained that a large moon strayed too close to Saturn and got destroyed by the tidal forces, there's an area close to the planet where the tidal forces get so intense that they literally tear the orbiting body apart, this area is called the Roche Limit. Astronomers had thought about this before, but what's different now is that the moon they think got ripped apart had a rocky core and an icy mantle. It explains everything what's seen around the rings. So it's very likely that it happened. This is the best theory right now, it's probably the right one.

    And yes, the rings are physical. It's not a solid body. It is made of millions and millions of tiny dust and ice particles ranging in size from a tiny dust particle to the size of a large pebble. The rings are vast, they span about about 270,000 kilometres across, but they are very thin, they're only a hundred metres thick. If the rings were the size of a football field, it would only be as thick as tissue paper.
  • Re: How can we comprehend the size of a star?
     Reply #50 - December 21, 2010, 03:01 AM
    so you are saying, there are multiple rings. And basically, it is not one solid ring but a combination of many tiny objects and all act like moons?
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  • Re: How can we comprehend the size of a star?
     Reply #51 - December 21, 2010, 04:19 AM
    Quote from: muddy on December 21, 2010, 03:01 AM
    so you are saying, there are multiple rings. And basically, it is not one solid ring but a combination of many tiny objects and all act like moons?


    Yes, that's how these rings are. In fact, some of the objects in the rings are called moonlets, not big enough to be a moon and too small to be a random pebble. They are natural satellites of Saturn. There are small gaps in the rings which are carved out by moonlets and the larger gaps are carved out by moons. The best things about these rings is...THEY ARE FREAKING BEAUTIFUL  grin12


    Click to see the full image...it's worth it!

    This ^^ is the F-ring is a small ring carved by two small moons of Saturn, Pandora and Prometheus. One orbits outside the ring and the other one orbits inside the ring. Often when Prometheus passes by the particles in the F-ring, it perturbs them as they're gravitationally attracted to the larger moon. That's what's seen above by the Cassini space probe. Here's an animation of the F-ring, you can see the moons passing by.



    The picture below is my personal favourite. It was taken by Cassini a few months ago. You can see the rings so clearly in this picture, and they look stunning. The F-ring in this picture is the outer most ring.


    Click to see in full-res.

    For more images from Cassini, go here: http://www.ciclops.org/index.php
  • Re: How can we comprehend the size of a star?
     Reply #52 - December 21, 2010, 01:05 PM
    Awesome work J. Thanks
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