Death

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- Chris W
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Death
OP - September 25, 2011, 02:09 AM

A man from Sri Lanka told me that his countrymen believe that we all have "danger days" in our lives when we can die or continue living. That sounds logical. But then he said the holy men, for a fee of course, divine which are the danger days. So a mother can keep a child indoors on those days and keep them out of danger. That's not logical, just money-making.
But it struck me that on these days God must decide whether we live or die. So I meditated this and came to the conclusion that if we die on an earlier danger day, it's because something worse would face us if we continued living.
Here's an example.
My mother-in-law and father-in-law didn't get on that well. M-in-law hated illness and disability. When f-in-law broke his leg, m-in-law nagged him to go back to work. So asap he returned to his shift work at the paper mills. He worked in the boiler room. One night, cycling home he had a heart attack and died. M-in-law now felt guilty about nagging him. She felt the early return brought on the heart attack.

But six months later, there was an explosion in the boiler room. On the same shift, my f-in-law would have worked. Nobody was injured because they were in the canteen. But f-in-law ate sandwiches in the boiler room. He'd have been in the blast. Either he'd have died a horrible death or been seriously injured, incurring years of nagging from his wife.

So I believe God took him earlier to save him the later agony and suffering.
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Re: Death
Reply #1 - September 25, 2011, 03:03 AM

Awesome. So why did god take all the Jews in Auschwitz?

Devious, treacherous, murderous, neanderthal, sub-human of the West.
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Re: Death
Reply #2 - September 25, 2011, 04:19 AM

if the final destination movies were to be believed, then cheating a normal death one day will only mean i'll die in some horribly gory and painful way from some complex rube-goldberg-like machinations of the environment around me.
- Saffire
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Re: Death
Reply #3 - September 25, 2011, 05:20 AM

This is the problem with teaching religion- you get a rule and it just doesn't work irl

Chris, I have done this a lot and believe me, there is no pattern. If you see one then it's only because you're looking for one. You miss a million things that disprove your theory and focus on the one that might possibly fit in with your idea. This is illogical. You assert that god makes these decisions? This assertion is offensive. Like Osmanthus said, what about the Jews etc. What about people in 3rd world countries born to die of starvation? What about someone who gets cancer and dies slow and painful? When you look at life with if's then you will come up with these illogical assertions:

If he hadn't broke is leg, if his wife hadn't nagged him back to work, if he hadn't had the heart attack, if he'd been at work that day then... too many if's!

If I had gone to America in September 2001 and decided to visit the twin towers on the 9th... people go crazy with if's. Imagine all the people who claim divine intervention for miraculously not being in that place on that date, or not being in london on July 7th, convinced god saved them... then what about the people who were there? God wanted them to die? It was better they died? We should be glad? This whole god's plan bollocks is plain bollocks.
- Saffire
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Re: Death
Reply #4 - September 25, 2011, 05:22 AM

Oops sorry for the excessive bold writing- was done by accident
- Prince Spinoza
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Re: Death
Reply #5 - September 25, 2011, 11:30 AM

"The general root of superstition is that men observe when things hit, and not when they miss, and commit to memory the one, and pass over the other." Sir Francis Bacon
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Re: Death
Reply #6 - September 25, 2011, 11:36 AM

Mmm... bacon.
- Chris W
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Re: Death
Reply #7 - September 26, 2011, 06:06 AM

If God doesn't intercede, what is the point of praying?
According to children's charities, there are 20,000 terminally ill children in Britain. Yet 200,000 adults pass through hospices each year. The ratio is less than the population ratio of healthy adults and children.
Odd that you should mention cancer. I had my chemo last year. Still got leukemia in my bones but only 5% now.
Do you believe in Karma? I think I've seen loads of examples in my life but maybe I've got that wrong as well.
The other point about the "danger days" theory is that God could stop you doing an evil act or even a kind act that could have terrible consequences. E.g Let's say a man saves a pregnant woman's life In Austria in the 19th century. The baby is born fit and well but grows up to be Adolph Hitler. God could intercede and let the man die before the heroic act. But without Hitler,the 1930s German chancellor might have been, say, Jewish instead. With access to a lot more war funding from rich friends worldwide. Hitler wasn't the only one to say "We are the master race". Israel's Begin said it as well. Check it online. It makes frightening reading.
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Re: Death
Reply #8 - September 26, 2011, 06:26 AM

You still didn't attempt to answer my question.

As for this:

Quote
If God doesn't intercede, what is the point of praying?

If you believe in an omniscient, omnipotent and benevolent deity there is no point in praying. I'm amazed by the number of religious people who can't see this. They like to claim to believe in such a deity, but they behave as if they didn't believe in it.

Devious, treacherous, murderous, neanderthal, sub-human of the West.
- Chris W
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Re: Death
Reply #9 - September 26, 2011, 08:17 PM

After contemplating this for years and experiencing amazing spiritual/psychic happenings I have developed my own beliefs about God. Very difficult to put into this cramped space all at once.
Basically the physical world is a vibration. That is how and why we perceive it. one thing is red, another green because they vibrate at different frequencies. God is the highest frequency, on a different plane to us. This level also incorporates the angels and maybe the spirit version of our ancestors.
So I believe that God usually only intercedes for us if we open a portal through prayer. But we must be careful for what we ask. The result may be what we request but not in the way we envisaged it.
To take a silly analogy, let's say we pray we pray for many beautiful children. God gives us ten. But then we find we don't earn enough and the children have miserable lives in poverty.
That is why Jesus said "...but only if it be Thy will."
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Re: Death
Reply #10 - September 27, 2011, 06:49 PM

Quote from: Chris W on September 26, 2011, 08:17 PM
So I believe that God usually only intercedes for us if we open a portal through prayer. But we must be careful for what we ask. The result may be what we request but not in the way we envisaged it.

A bit like casting a Wish spell in AD&D 2nd Edition, obviously.

Do not look directly at the operational end of the device.
- Jinn and Tonic
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Re: Death
Reply #11 - September 27, 2011, 07:37 PM

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gI3vwe7Hx_k

When one door of happiness closes, another opens; but often we look so long at the closed door that we do not see the one which has been opened for us.
Helen Keller
- Chris W
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Re: Death
Reply #12 - September 28, 2011, 08:13 AM

Jinn and Tonic, ask yourself why you are on this site? Most people are here because they are disillusioned by the current teachings of Islam. It didn't make them happy. The basic belief should be as in christianity, "Love God, love one another."
Christians only show their humanitarian side at Christmas. Even though they realise it's a heathen mid-winter festival, once a year they think about others. They sympathise with the homeless in their cardboard boxes, knowing they'll ignore them the rest of the year. In WW1, German and English soldiers played football in no-man's land.
We all have love for our fellow beings but we stifle it because of religious hierarchy and governments telling us that another religion or political belief is unacceptable.
To me, linking to God is very easy. It's like playing an online computer mystery game and when you're stumped, you hit the "hint" button. God is the ultimate spirit energy. "He" doesn't have human emotions but his messengers from the lower spiritual plane still do. They are the ones who link with us, they are part of God's spirit.
I've had so many times when God-spirit has come to my aid even without asking. But there's not enough space here to tell you even half.
- Jinn and Tonic
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Re: Death
Reply #13 - September 28, 2011, 02:02 PM

Chris.. what am i doing on this site?

I am both an ex xian AND an ex muslim.
and currently somewhere between agnostic and atheist.

why?

edit.. what are YOU doing here?

When one door of happiness closes, another opens; but often we look so long at the closed door that we do not see the one which has been opened for us.
Helen Keller
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Re: Death
Reply #14 - September 28, 2011, 03:11 PM

Quote from: Chris W on September 26, 2011, 08:17 PM
After contemplating this for years and experiencing amazing spiritual/psychic happenings I have developed my own beliefs about God. Very difficult to put into this cramped space all at once.
Basically the physical world is a vibration. That is how and why we perceive it. one thing is red, another green because they vibrate at different frequencies. God is the highest frequency, on a different plane to us.

God must cause a lot of cancer.

Quote
So I believe that God usually only intercedes for us if we open a portal through prayer. But we must be careful for what we ask. The result may be what we request but not in the way we envisaged it.

Yeah, every base is covered. Prayer is fulfilled - god did it. Isn't fulfilled - god did it. So any outcome - OMG MEERACLE.
[/quote]
- Saffire
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Re: Death
Reply #15 - September 28, 2011, 09:32 PM

Quote from: Chris W on September 28, 2011, 08:13 AM
The basic belief should be as in christianity, "Love God, love one another." ...
We all have love for our fellow beings but we stifle it because of religious hierarchy and governments telling us that another religion or political belief is unacceptable.

Have you even read the bible dude? It's not love all people- the bible displays the same in group ideas of all religions. In addition, it's grossly mysoginistic. So tell us, if Christianity is so lovely then why does 'God' hate women? Tell me how the bible regards women!
- Chris W
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Re: Death
Reply #16 - September 30, 2011, 12:48 PM

Please read my other postings. I don't advocate ANY particulae religion. I've drawn my own beliefs from the best tenets of other religions and rejected those which I believe are created by man. Mysogony, caste system, rituals.
I have a link with the higher vibrations where exist the spiritual messengers, angels whatever. I've received warnings, advice etc without even asking. The Life spirit is all around us. Everything in the physical world vibrates. Our senses receive these lower vibrations so we believe these things exist. But we can "tune" our brains to receive the higher vibrations. I have done this.
I'm trying to tell people on this site they can do the same. Initially through meditation.
But if you're happy going down the pub, watching tv, playing football then do that instead. Why waste valuable drinking time on this site.
- Chris W
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Re: Death
Reply #17 - September 30, 2011, 01:01 PM

Jinn and Tonic. I understand your previous "religious education". But what are you expecting to personally gain out of this site? Like yourself, the members here are disillusioned with the current Islamic teachings. Are you hoping to all get together and get some changes made? I'm noy RC but Mother Theresa once said "Don't wait for leaders. Do it alone - person to person". Whatever one's beliefs, this is good advice.
I'm trying to tell people there is another way of life. We can link with the Life-force and make our lives happier. I'm happy. Are you?
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Re: Death
Reply #18 - October 02, 2011, 08:18 PM

For me, to stop believing in God is not just a mere statement of saying there is no god but a completely new manner of perceiving. It is a disagreement with many assumptions.

- The assumption of reason. The idea that things require reason. There is no reason or if there is, it is not possible to understand what exactly it is.

- Nothing is true, nothing is absolute. Facts are not real and reality cannot be defined. You cannot prove anything at all to be true but you can recognise everything to be untrue.

- Meaning is not required, life has no meaning or the meaning of life is life itself, there is no "sub-text" for life is far more mysterious and complicated for it to be compressed into a single meaning.

- God does not mean anything or has nothing to do with human beings.

- I am also a post-structuralist, all words have no meaning, conceptual structures are an illusion produced by the egoic mind to perpetuate the sense of an individual self in a reality with many different individual selves

- Lastly, to bring it to your original post; Death is never experienced, for at the moment of death, your are not there to experience it for you are no longer.

"The words that oscillate between nonsense and supreme meaning are the oldest and truest." - C.G. Jung
- Saffire
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Re: Death
Reply #19 - October 03, 2011, 12:16 AM

Chris you're weird- I hate new age mumbo jumbo thinking. You take the good and remove the 'man made' aspects!? Who made you 'god' to know the truth. You suggest that parts of the religions are divine, and other parts are not, but only you can ascertain which is which.... hm, sounds like you're applying for the job of prophet!

You say you can tap in to this vibration watchama call it!? Prove it. People say these things but fail to provide actual evidence- it's as pointless as me saying I can astral project! If you really posses this 'power' then prove it. The feelings one gets are known as intuition, which are a part of a logical thought process. All humans get feelings, they are drawn from the same place as prejudism. It's not magic, just the mind working. If you do however possess some superior ability then I look forward to seeing actual evidence!
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