Something From Nothing - a conversation w/ Richard Dawkins & Lawrence Krauss

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Something From Nothing - a conversation w/ Richard Dawkins & Lawrence Krauss - A
OP - April 04, 2012, 01:34 PM

It's more scientific in content, so I put it in here. If you have 2 hours...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gH9UvnrARf8

"Between stimulus and response there is a space. In that space is our power to choose our response. In our response lies our growth and our freedom." - Viktor E. Frankl

'Life is just the extreme expression of complex chemistry' - Neil deGrasse Tyson
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Re: Something From Nothing - a conversation w/ Richard Dawkins & Lawrence Krauss - A
Reply #1 - April 04, 2012, 01:55 PM

Quote from: Stardust on April 04, 2012, 01:34 PM
It's more scientific in content, so I put it in here. If you have 2 hours...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gH9UvnrARf8

that is a great discussion Stardust.........

Hmm.. This is for Australians 8 more days.....
Quote
Venue : Sydney Grammar School New Hall
Enter via Yurong St, Darlinghurst.
Seating is by general admission
Thursday 12th April 2012, 6.30 pm

http://www.sydgram.nsw.edu.au/files/DAWKINS_2012.pdf

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the beloved betrayed me and turned in to a Muslim
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Re: Something From Nothing - a conversation w/ Richard Dawkins & Lawrence Krauss - A
Reply #2 - April 04, 2012, 04:00 PM

I just watched it -- fascinating! It was really interesting.

قل للمليحة في الخمار الأسود
مـاذا فـعــلت بــناسـك مـتـعـبد

قـد كـان شـمّر لــلـصلاة ثـيابه
حتى خـطرت له بباب المسجد

ردي عليـه صـلاتـه وصيـامــه
لا تـقــتـلــيه بـحـق ديــن محمد
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Re: Something From Nothing - a conversation w/ Richard Dawkins & Lawrence Krauss - A
Reply #3 - April 04, 2012, 04:02 PM

Great, gonna watch this later, thanks for posting!!

"Nobody who lived through the '50s thought the '60s could've existed. So there's always hope."-Tuli Kupferberg

What apple stores are like.....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S8QmZWv-eBI
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Re: Something From Nothing - a conversation w/ Richard Dawkins & Lawrence Krauss - A
Reply #4 - April 04, 2012, 04:08 PM

Quote from: Sprout on April 04, 2012, 04:02 PM
Great, gonna watch this later, thanks for posting!!

hmm.. we need to watch lot more Sprout lol

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FjAqcV_w3mc

Do not let silence become your legacy.. Question everything
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the beloved betrayed me and turned in to a Muslim
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Re: Something From Nothing - a conversation w/ Richard Dawkins & Lawrence Krauss - A
Reply #5 - April 04, 2012, 04:23 PM

Quote from: harakaat on April 04, 2012, 04:00 PM
I just watched it -- fascinating! It was really interesting.

Quote from: Sprout on April 04, 2012, 04:02 PM
Great, gonna watch this later, thanks for posting!!

Quote from: yeezevee on April 04, 2012, 01:55 PM
that is a great discussion Stardust.........

I was watching some yt videos last night and came across that one.

"Between stimulus and response there is a space. In that space is our power to choose our response. In our response lies our growth and our freedom." - Viktor E. Frankl

'Life is just the extreme expression of complex chemistry' - Neil deGrasse Tyson
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Re: Something From Nothing - a conversation w/ Richard Dawkins & Lawrence Krauss - A
Reply #6 - April 04, 2012, 04:25 PM

I wonder what the Weinberg quote he forgot was...

قل للمليحة في الخمار الأسود
مـاذا فـعــلت بــناسـك مـتـعـبد

قـد كـان شـمّر لــلـصلاة ثـيابه
حتى خـطرت له بباب المسجد

ردي عليـه صـلاتـه وصيـامــه
لا تـقــتـلــيه بـحـق ديــن محمد
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Re: Something From Nothing - a conversation w/ Richard Dawkins & Lawrence Krauss - A
Reply #7 - April 04, 2012, 04:38 PM

Stardust, I watched that on the day it was posted. Lawrence makes some mistakes on evolution, but that's not his field so not a big deal. Anyway, Lawrence explained it correctly the idea that something would not come out of nothing would actually be more of a miracle. You have to remember the total sum energy of the universe is zero. When you speak about nothingness, that is exactly what it is nothingness, you can't even think of it as "blackness" that is not nothingness. But quantum fluctuations always happen, in "nothingness" these are at subatomic levels this shit does actually happen particles pop in and out of existence all the time, because we can measure them and predict them so it does happen. So I think Lawrence does a good job of trying to explain that.

It would be a miracle if nothing happened! not the other way around.

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Re: Something From Nothing - a conversation w/ Richard Dawkins & Lawrence Krauss - A
Reply #8 - April 04, 2012, 04:55 PM

Basically "empty" space is not empty. I.e. the space between the quarks that's were most of the mass comes for the particles. So, 70 - 80% of your body is "empty space". The energy of the "empty space" is zero. Basically symmetry, the universe is flat, the energy is zero, and it most likely came out of nothingness.

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Re: Something From Nothing - a conversation w/ Richard Dawkins & Lawrence Krauss - A
Reply #9 - April 04, 2012, 05:15 PM

I thought it like there's a perturbation in the nothing-ness, like those virtual particle pairs, but small perturbations successively occurring and building a top of the other could result in where we are presently, at that time those perturbations would've had a more significant affect to the system than it would now. IDK.

"Between stimulus and response there is a space. In that space is our power to choose our response. In our response lies our growth and our freedom." - Viktor E. Frankl

'Life is just the extreme expression of complex chemistry' - Neil deGrasse Tyson
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Re: Something From Nothing - a conversation w/ Richard Dawkins & Lawrence Krauss - A
Reply #10 - April 04, 2012, 05:30 PM

Quote from: King Tut on April 04, 2012, 04:38 PM
Stardust, I watched that on the day it was posted. Lawrence makes some mistakes on evolution, but that's not his field so not a big deal. Anyway, Lawrence explained it correctly the idea that something would not come out of nothing would actually be more of a miracle. You have to remember the total sum energy of the universe is zero. When you speak about nothingness, that is exactly what it is nothingness, you can't even think of it as "blackness" that is not nothingness. But quantum fluctuations always happen, in "nothingness" these are at subatomic levels this shit does actually happen particles pop in and out of existence all the time, because we can measure them and predict them so it does happen. So I think Lawrence does a good job of trying to explain that.

It would be a miracle if nothing happened! not the other way around.

It's like having

+2 - 2 = 0

The individual components existing yet together in the system they make it zero, now if that system was some how 'torn' and separated then each other those compoents will exist without having it's counterpart there to cancel it. So creating a system which has is made of 'something'.

"Between stimulus and response there is a space. In that space is our power to choose our response. In our response lies our growth and our freedom." - Viktor E. Frankl

'Life is just the extreme expression of complex chemistry' - Neil deGrasse Tyson
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Re: Something From Nothing - a conversation w/ Richard Dawkins & Lawrence Krauss - A
Reply #11 - April 04, 2012, 05:33 PM

Quote from: Stardust on April 04, 2012, 05:15 PM
I thought it like there's a perturbation in the nothing-ness, like those virtual particle pairs, but small perturbations successively occurring and building a top of the other could result in where we are presently, at that time those perturbations would've had a more significant affect to the system than it would now. IDK.

Yes some argue it could be extra dimensional forces leaking into our universe. What we really know (from indirect experimentation) is that, quantum fluctuations, are happening all the time, in seemingly empty space. The energy has to be zero, if we tried to add a number to it, it would be infinitely larger then the observable matter which would not make any sense it would break the symmetry so zero energy fits and that gives us a perfect symmetry. I subscribe to the many universes model personally I think it makes the most sense, so I see this universe to be infinite but not boundless, existing inside a flat infinite cosmos with infinite universes that are bounded, and these bounded universe collide into each other universe creating more universes, like bubbles. So the empty space between the universes (bubbles) is part of the cosmos which has zero energy but things are always pop in and out of existence in it.

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Re: Something From Nothing - a conversation w/ Richard Dawkins & Lawrence Krauss - A
Reply #12 - April 04, 2012, 05:36 PM

Quote from: Stardust on April 04, 2012, 05:30 PM
It's like having

+2 - 2 = 0

The individual components existing yet together in the system they make it zero, now if that system was some how 'torn' and separated then each other those compoents will exist without having it's counterpart there to cancel it. So creating a system which has is made of 'something'.

Yes as a whole it does cancel it out.

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Re: Something From Nothing - a conversation w/ Richard Dawkins & Lawrence Krauss - A
Reply #13 - April 04, 2012, 05:38 PM

I have it in my head but its harder to explain, you know what I mean?

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Re: Something From Nothing - a conversation w/ Richard Dawkins & Lawrence Krauss - A
Reply #14 - April 04, 2012, 05:42 PM

Quote from: King Tut on April 04, 2012, 05:33 PM
Yes some argue it could be extra dimensional forces leaking into our universe. What we really know (from indirect experimentation) is that, quantum fluctuations, are happening all the time, in seemingly empty space. The energy has to be zero, if we tried to add a number to it, it would be infinitely larger then the observable matter which would not make any sense it would break the symmetry so zero energy fits and that gives us a perfect symmetry. I subscribe to the many universes model personally I think it makes the most sense, so I see this universe to be infinite but not boundless, existing inside a flat infinite cosmos with infinite universes that are bounded, and these bounded universe collide into each other universe creating more universes, like bubbles. So the empty space between the universes (bubbles) is part of the cosmos which has zero energy but things are always pop in and out of existence in it.

You're a string theorist?

Sounds like you're talking about colliding membranes. Mixed in with bubble universe theory.

"Between stimulus and response there is a space. In that space is our power to choose our response. In our response lies our growth and our freedom." - Viktor E. Frankl

'Life is just the extreme expression of complex chemistry' - Neil deGrasse Tyson
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Re: Something From Nothing - a conversation w/ Richard Dawkins & Lawrence Krauss - A
Reply #15 - April 04, 2012, 05:48 PM

Anyway, having dinner now

"Between stimulus and response there is a space. In that space is our power to choose our response. In our response lies our growth and our freedom." - Viktor E. Frankl

'Life is just the extreme expression of complex chemistry' - Neil deGrasse Tyson
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Re: Something From Nothing - a conversation w/ Richard Dawkins & Lawrence Krauss - A
Reply #16 - April 04, 2012, 06:02 PM

Quote from: Stardust on April 04, 2012, 05:42 PM
You're a string theorist?

Sounds like you're talking about colliding membranes. Mixed in with bubble universe theory.

I'm not an expert but I don't like to choose, I think I have my own idea of what it is (probably wrong, but it makes me feel good about death etc, its just a fantasy). I think I am maybe a string theorist, I know its has its problems but I think it will ultimately get us to the Grand Unified Theory, but I think it key is in the symmetry and super-symmetric string theory is going in the right direction in my opinion.

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