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 Topic: The Rise Of Islamic Creationism

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  • The Rise Of Islamic Creationism
     Reply #30 - February 24, 2014, 03:57 AM
    I did not know all pagan gods were considered demons. How very convenient for them. That is a great way to turn a population from the local religion, just demonize their gods and give them a different one, and that way they still get their beliefs validated. It's like an upgrade.
    I thought Christmas and Easter were the only fusions like that. How devious.
    Don't let Hitler have the street.
  • The Rise Of Islamic Creationism
     Reply #31 - February 24, 2014, 06:07 AM
    There is a lot more than just that. Judaism started as a Henotheist religion with a head or father god followed by a divine council of gods; son and mother, less deities. The current form of both the OT and Hebrew bible were based on a 5th BCE rewrite of the bible by the Yahwehist returning from Babylon. The whole polytheist conflicts, internal and external, is revisionist history created by these Yahwehist when they became the dominate faction. There is a lot of demonization of even fellow Hebrews which followed the old Canaanite ways which spawned Judaism itself. There are hints all over the Bible once you read without the monotheist slant.
  • The Rise Of Islamic Creationism
     Reply #32 - February 24, 2014, 06:30 AM
    I've come across snatches of that, and even mentioned it to someone recently. Do you have any sources on the history, beliefs and theological transformations? I'd love to learn more about it.
    `But I don't want to go among mad people,' Alice remarked.
     `Oh, you can't help that,' said the Cat: `we're all mad here. I'm mad.  You're mad.'
     `How do you know I'm mad?' said Alice.
     `You must be,' said the Cat, `or you wouldn't have come here.'
  • The Rise Of Islamic Creationism
     Reply #33 - February 24, 2014, 04:41 PM
    Dever, William (2001). What Did the Biblical Writers Know, and When Did They Know It?
    Dever, William (2003). Who Were the Early Israelites and Where Did They Come From?
    Dever, William (2005). Did God Have a Wife?: Archaeology and Folk Religion in Ancient Israel.
    Finkelstein, Israel; Mazar, Amihay; Schmidt, Brian B. (2007). The Quest for the Historical Israel
    Rendsburg, Gary (2008). "Israel without the Bible"
    Finkelstein, Neil Asher; Silberman (2001). The Bible Unearthed
    Gnuse, Robert Karl (1997). No Other Gods: Emergent Monotheism in Israel
    Golden, Jonathan Michael (2004a). Ancient Canaan and Israel: An Introduction
    Golden, Jonathan Michael (2004b). Ancient Canaan and Israel: New Perspectives
    Albertz, Rainer; Becking, Bob, eds. (2003b). Yahwism After the Exile: Perspectives on Israelite Religion in the Persian Era
    Becking, Bob, ed. (2001). Only One God? Monotheism in Ancient Israel and the Veneration of the Goddess Asherah
    Becking, Bob; Korpel, Marjo Christina Annette, eds. (1999). The Crisis of Israelite Religion: Transformation of Religious Tradition in Exilic and Post-Exilic Times
    Day, John (2002). Yahweh and the Gods and Goddesses of Canaan
    Goodison, Lucy; Morris, Christine (1998). Goddesses in Early Israelite Religion in Ancient Goddesses: The Myths and the Evidence
    Grabbe, Lester L., ed. (2008). Israel in Transition: From Late Bronze II to Iron IIa (c. 1250–850 B.C.E.)
    Killebrew, Ann E. (2005). Biblical Peoples and Ethnicity: An Archaeological Study of Egyptians, Canaanites, and Early Israel, 1300–1100 B.C.E
    Pitkänen, Pekka (2004). "Ethnicity, Assimilation and the Israelite Settlement


  • The Rise Of Islamic Creationism
     Reply #34 - February 25, 2014, 03:45 AM
     far away hug
    `But I don't want to go among mad people,' Alice remarked.
     `Oh, you can't help that,' said the Cat: `we're all mad here. I'm mad.  You're mad.'
     `How do you know I'm mad?' said Alice.
     `You must be,' said the Cat, `or you wouldn't have come here.'
  • The Rise Of Islamic Creationism
     Reply #35 - February 25, 2014, 05:21 PM
    This books represent views of anthropology and archaeology rather than standard theology. Toes are stepped on, feelings hurt, etc. What I find interesting is the comparison of religious history versus two fields which specialize in history. These books refute many of the early stories of both Judaism and Islam; Moses is the central figure which is undermined.
  • Re: The Rise Of Islamic Creationism
     Reply #36 - February 25, 2014, 11:18 PM
    Quote from: three on February 24, 2014, 03:57 AM
    I did not know all pagan gods were considered demons. How very convenient for them. That is a great way to turn a population from the local religion, just demonize their gods and give them a different one, and that way they still get their beliefs validated. It's like an upgrade.
    I thought Christmas and Easter were the only fusions like that. How devious.

    Pat Robertson, one of the prominent American Born Again preachers preaches that the the Hindu God Shiva is a demon. The Vatican has issued an encyclical that the practice of Yoga is akin to devil worship.
    वासुदैव कुटुम्बकम्
    Entire World is One Family
    سارا سنسار ايک پريوار ہے
  • The Rise Of Islamic Creationism
     Reply #37 - February 26, 2014, 02:14 AM
    Quote from: bogart on February 24, 2014, 06:07 AM
    There is a lot more than just that. Judaism started as a Henotheist religion with a head or father god followed by a divine council of gods; son and mother, less deities. The current form of both the OT and Hebrew bible were based on a 5th BCE rewrite of the bible by the Yahwehist returning from Babylon. The whole polytheist conflicts, internal and external, is revisionist history created by these Yahwehist when they became the dominate faction. There is a lot of demonization of even fellow Hebrews which followed the old Canaanite ways which spawned Judaism itself. There are hints all over the Bible once you read without the monotheist slant.


    But that sounds like the ancient hierarchy of Jewish priesthood. They modeled their priestly class on a hierarchy of gods?
    That gives even more background to the reformations of Christ. Nearly validates his mission, from a monotheistic point of view, though I never heard it voiced as such.
    Don't let Hitler have the street.
  • The Rise Of Islamic Creationism
     Reply #38 - February 26, 2014, 04:22 AM
    Quote from: Ram on February 25, 2014, 11:18 PM
    Pat Robertson, one of the prominent American Born Again preachers preaches that the the Hindu God Shiva is a demon.

    It wouldn't surprise me what those nutters preach. I remember the ones about Teletubbies being a gay conspiracy and Harry Potter books being evil. Cheesy

    Quote
    The Vatican has issued an encyclical that the practice of Yoga is akin to devil worship.

    ORLY? Got a link?
    Devious, treacherous, murderous, neanderthal, sub-human of the West. bunny
  • The Rise Of Islamic Creationism
     Reply #39 - February 26, 2014, 05:09 AM
    Quote
    It wouldn't surprise me what those nutters preach. I remember the ones about Teletubbies being a gay conspiracy and Harry Potter books being evil.

     


    Oh god that brought back a funny memory.  Back in highschool when I attended the Friday prayers held by the schools MSA it was mentioned during the khutbah(sermon) 

    The guy leading the prayer said " harry potter teaches magic so it's haraam to read or enjoy those books.  People often counter with "but books increase your vocabulary. " And I tell them " Do you want to go to hell with a "good vocabulary"

    The muslim science teacher who supervised the meetings said " that's a good point. I never thought of it that way"


    Oh gawd how difficult was it for me to not laugh out loud during that khutbah.  Cheesy
    In my opinion a life without curiosity is not a life worth living
  • The Rise Of Islamic Creationism
     Reply #40 - February 26, 2014, 05:19 AM
    Yeah Harry Potter teaches magic. It really works. I mean it's not just a fun story. Nooooooooooooooo. whistling2
    Devious, treacherous, murderous, neanderthal, sub-human of the West. bunny
  • The Rise Of Islamic Creationism
     Reply #41 - February 26, 2014, 08:55 PM
    Funnily enough, after mentioning the Great Harry Potter Conspiracy, it turned out that there was a doco on the tv last night about those three nutty US teenage girls who think they're exorcists. They seriously think the spells in Harry Potter are real spells. I assume they haven't tested this hypothesis to see if they can actually turn wombats into dragons by quoting bits of Harry Potter books. Roll Eyes

    Anyway, back to Islamic creationism. Al Jazeera has recently been getting into it on their Arabic pages (not on their English pages, funnily enough). Tranlslation here:

    Al Jazeera Arabic Calls The Theory Of Evolution A Myth and Praises Creationism and Allah

    Naturally, the arguments in the original article are really good evidence that some people haven't evolved that much.
    Devious, treacherous, murderous, neanderthal, sub-human of the West. bunny
  • The Rise Of Islamic Creationism
     Reply #42 - February 26, 2014, 10:39 PM
    Talking of Islamic pseudo-science, check this out: Egyptian government claimed that its military had achieved a "scientific breakthrough" in the detection and treatment of AIDS and hepatitis.

    I heard it on the radio yesterday. You could not make this up! Cheesy
    "Many people would sooner die than think; In fact, they do so." -- Bertrand Russell

    Baloney Detection Kit
  • The Rise Of Islamic Creationism
     Reply #43 - February 26, 2014, 10:48 PM
    Around this time last year, a story surfaced in Egypt of an exciting new tool in the fight against AIDS and hepatitis. The new "device" promised to revolutionise the detection of the diseases - instead of a blood test, patients would just need to be zapped with something that looked like the controller for a radio-controlled car and was said to be adapted from a device for detecting bombs. The device was supposed to work by detecting electromagnetic waves "emanating from" the virus.

    Apparently people are sceptical. I wonder why.
    `But I don't want to go among mad people,' Alice remarked.
     `Oh, you can't help that,' said the Cat: `we're all mad here. I'm mad.  You're mad.'
     `How do you know I'm mad?' said Alice.
     `You must be,' said the Cat, `or you wouldn't have come here.'
  • The Rise Of Islamic Creationism
     Reply #44 - February 26, 2014, 11:32 PM
    Back in the days of Mubarak, it could be taken for granted that the official narrative on just about anything was bullshit, so this sort of looks like a return to form.

    The context leaves me idly pondering another possibility: are the military lying this egregiously by way of demonstration, i.e. because it's for internal consumption, and they have the power to do the impossible in the Egyptian press?
    Before it gets too late, you will find escape.
  • The Rise Of Islamic Creationism
     Reply #45 - February 26, 2014, 11:52 PM
    Quote from: Ram on February 25, 2014, 11:18 PM
    Pat Robertson, one of the prominent American Born Again preachers preaches that the the Hindu God Shiva is a demon. The Vatican has issued an encyclical that the practice of Yoga is akin to devil worship.

       well  that is good Mr. Ram., he is educating hindus., Don't you think all those devil/god/goddess stories of hindu mythology are nothing but fables??

    Can't you guys   easily rip his Christianity to shreds?? go for it insult the fools and their silly beliefs... and let them insult you guys  Cheesy
    Do not let silence become your legacy.. Question everything   
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim     
  • The Rise Of Islamic Creationism
     Reply #46 - February 27, 2014, 01:16 AM
    Quote from: three on February 26, 2014, 02:14 AM
    But that sounds like the ancient hierarchy of Jewish priesthood. They modeled their priestly class on a hierarchy of gods?
    That gives even more background to the reformations of Christ. Nearly validates his mission, from a monotheistic point of view, though I never heard it voiced as such.


    Most religions had a person which functioned as head of an order or caste in the case of the Levites. The hierarchy goes back to Aaron, brother of Moses. The High Priest must be a descendant of Aaron, a general priest must be a Levite. By the time of Jesus the Priests had a firm control of the population which rivaled the Kings. While the destruction of a clear heir from the line of David the Messianic movement had be weak for centuries. The hopes for a delivery from foreign rule had shifted to the Priest away from any monarch figure. Figures such as John the Baptist revitalized the Messianic movement this was a direct threat to the Priesthoods power. Rabbis are a post diaspora adaption since both the Prophet and Priesthood had as institutions had fallen in the 70ad revolt. This role was later absorbed by Christians due to error in translations with the Greek language when the NT talks about the Priesthood.

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