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Theme Changer

 Topic: Is there a natural selection phenomena in different religions

 (Read 2428 times)
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  • Is there a natural selection phenomena in different religions
     OP - February 10, 2013, 04:23 PM

    (Not sure if this belongs here I've never posted in her before, just reflecting on some thoughts)


    So I was thinking when it comes to the whole debate over which religion is growing faster Islam or Christianity, is there something of the survival of the fittest going in religion?
    Christianity has been able to thrive and continue to hold strong numbers, because of it's flexibility with it's lifestyle and able to adapt to modern world. Same thing with Judaism, and Hinduism.

    However there is this strong fight between keeping Islam strong, and there has been a Islamic rebirth. More girls are wearing hijab, and more dawahist are going out there trying to spread their messages. You can't deny in many regions in the world the sense of being 'Muslim' has strengthened. But when you look around at the countries in turmoil in the Middle East, though families have many children, a good bit are killed in either, war or extreme religious law. And even though the West does not have many children families there are able to send them to the highest education and they have a higher chance of living to adulthood and spreading their beliefs or lack thereof.
    (graphic image)
    http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_tKgKQlC_SgY/S-vs0vq_-jI/AAAAAAAAANs/-4j26T91ykc/s1600/honor_killings_murdered_muslim_women_hlok5_3868.jpg

    When you look at Islamic countries, men outnumber women 2:1 Whereas in Western countries women are even, or in the USA more.
    A strong society needs an even number of women or slightly more. Why? If you think back to tribal times. Why were the women always captured or protected first? The tribe with he most women was able to populate faster and become stronger and hence spread their culture/ beliefs. Women can only have 1 baby each year.

    The strict religious laws in more extreme parts has been causing many women to lose their lives, for breaking religious laws, where the men usually are allowed to continue living.   If this continues or gets worst, is Islam killing itself by putting putting death penalties on the very beings that help keep the Muslim population strong. The West may have less births, but more women. This is a bit of a stretch but I'm mentioning this to those who believe that Islam will take over purely by family size. And this ties back to the idea of natural selection.



    In other parts of the world that are not going through mass warfare at the moment, their population is able to procreate and stay alive, versus the war torn Middle East where much of the population is either dying in combat such as innocent civilians (Syria) or those who chose to join extreme groups leaving themselves sitting ducks for the stronger West, or in most cases the hands of dictators their own brother. Then those who survive Western countries immigrating and will eventually assimilate into Western countries that are either Atheist of Christian majority. The Muslim population is growing yes, in Western countries, but we are beginning to see a clash of cultures, and questioning (Why can't we listen to music, why are boys allowed late and girls aren't, why can't we eat certain foods, why can't I wear certain fashions that are too western) and the tensions with a clash of cultures are showing with an increase in laws and efforts to keep Muslims, as Muslim as possible (though we know most break the rules away). We have a sizeable community of people in CEMB that have chosen to leave the life of Islam behind and begin a new way of life, inspired in part by their host country ( be it education, secular views, science etc.) Even if people no not leave Islam persay, the Islam practiced by Muslims in Britain is in some form being softened to be acceptable in the host country to eventually gather more converts.



    Before where one would take a harsh stance on apostasy and gays, more and more people are migrating towards views that are more comfortable to them. Is  this  the case? Islamic value has had little to no influence on Christian/ Aetheist culture. But New Muslims are borrowing ideas grown from these people and are trying to incorporate it in their own religion. Example women challenging gender roles in Islam, fighting hard to prove to their Western counterparts they are not oppressed but instead can do anything they please to bring Islam in a positive light. Or evolution, which has overwhelming evidence versus the story of Adam and Eve is a hard pill to swallow. Point is, the Western world has little to prove to the Islamic world, but the Islamic world has much to prove to the Western world and also to it's followers to make them stay, so they don't get enticed by other cultures, religions or non-religions altogether.Islam often attacks the West on the bases of morality, but you see there is no mass influence of (this chastity, morality culture) since virginity a woman's vagina is of no interest to the masses.  And no kufir is giving up alcohol and bacon in a hurry. Keep in mind when I say Islamic culture, I mean strictly religious practices, Arabic culture has made an influence on the Western world, in regards to food, music, architecture etc. and these are things everyone can enjoy and appreciate. That's different.

    To close my thought and bring it back to my original point. Will the religion that is the most adaptable survive? Will the the overwhelming displaced population of the Middle East and Islamic countries being killed or immigrating do an impact on Islam and how it's practiced? And despite claims that it is the fastest growing in the world, will we see that number take a sharp decline due to a variety of factors I just mentioned. And if not Islam deviant sects of Islam that will either grow (example Quranist) Thoughts?

    ***~Church is where bad people go to hide~***
  • Is there a natural selection phenomena in different religions
     Reply #1 - February 10, 2013, 11:57 PM

    The only reason Islam continues to grow is NOT because of Dawah as most apologists would like to tell you.

    Islam's survival and growth strategy is composed of three parts.

    1) Get married and have alot of babies and declare them to be muslims on birth

    2) Kill any person that tries to leave the faith

    3) Kill or persecute anyone that tries to criticize the faith.



    In my opinion a life without curiosity is not a life worth living
  • Is there a natural selection phenomena in different religions
     Reply #2 - February 11, 2013, 04:32 PM

    I think people underestimate Islam.

    Islam has one key thing going for it today.
    A clear set of rules on how to live your life.

    Freedom is a wonderful thing, but it does leave many people lost, unable to make sense of what to make of their life.
    Montesquieu talked about inquietude as it relates to liberal democracies in this respect. People unsure of their lives, unsure what to think, unsure what to believe, unsure what is right, how to act...

    This is even more so now that culture is weakening. That is to say for example... British culture is not taught in British schools.. so British kids grow up without anything 'British' to hang on to. Basically raised without culture.

    In this regard, Islam offers a very strong alternate narrative. Something for people to hang onto; to live their life by.
    Islam is not the only alternative of course. Evangelical Christianity does this as well.  So do extreme political movements.

    This 'trait' of Islam might become a key for its survival and its flourishing in the modern context.



  • Is there a natural selection phenomena in different religions
     Reply #3 - February 11, 2013, 05:21 PM

    To answer the OP, of course there is to a certain extent. There have been thousands and thousands of religions throughout the ages and only the "strongest" have survived. Also when new guys come up with new religions they take the strengths of older religions and discard the weaknesses. So religions get stronger and stronger.

    Islam for example took the strengths of Christianity (i.e. the idea of a heaven and hell, the idea of a single god watching over and protecting everything) and then discarded some of the weaknesses (i.e. the replacement of easily disprovable stuff about Genesis with more vague, grandiose statements about creation and in answer to why only Jews were the chosen people, Islam adds the idea that every people received prophets once upon a time) Then you look at even newer religions like Bahaism, they have built on the strengths of the Abrahamic faiths but discarded all the outdated women hating stuff.

    Traditionally if a religion preached too much peaceful stuff then it was likely to get conquered and destroyed by a more aggressive and militant religion. But in the modern world where freedom of speech is protected, religions need to re-adapt again to be less aggressive and violent. Of course if freedom of expression is not protected then this adaptation is unnecessary, critics can continue to be silenced through violence.

    But I do not think that Islam is dying out yet, to get through the natural selection process you simply need to live, you do not need to live well. The OP showed how Islam is making people's lives a misery in many places, but as long as they keep having babies and keep teaching them Islam then Islam will survive.
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