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Theme Changer

 Topic: Dawkins upsets Muslims again (Scientific achievement)

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  • Dawkins upsets Muslims again (Scientific achievement)
     Reply #120 - August 15, 2013, 08:19 PM

    No, but I can start with my mum who always boast about scientific miracles in Qur'an before others here.

    "I'm standing here like an asshole holding my Charles Dickens"

    "No theory,No ready made system,no book that has ever been written to save the world. i cleave to no system.."-Bakunin
  • Dawkins upsets Muslims again (Scientific achievement)
     Reply #121 - August 15, 2013, 08:51 PM

    If you wrote down all the boasts, checked them to see how/if they stack up, if even a single one was found wanting, would you tell her?

    `But I don't want to go among mad people,' Alice remarked.
     `Oh, you can't help that,' said the Cat: `we're all mad here. I'm mad.  You're mad.'
     `How do you know I'm mad?' said Alice.
     `You must be,' said the Cat, `or you wouldn't have come here.'
  • Dawkins upsets Muslims again (Scientific achievement)
     Reply #122 - August 15, 2013, 09:09 PM

    I have decided not to challenge her long time ago because if I do,I will just bring trouble,waste our time and energy arguing and end up being angry at each other so I just remain mum anytime she does that.

    "I'm standing here like an asshole holding my Charles Dickens"

    "No theory,No ready made system,no book that has ever been written to save the world. i cleave to no system.."-Bakunin
  • Dawkins upsets Muslims again (Scientific achievement)
     Reply #123 - August 15, 2013, 09:21 PM

    That would be hell for me. I'd have some sort of reaction every time I heard it and kept quiet. Me and my mum (and other family and friends) have come to verbal clashes on a number of issues. Though sometimes it's actually quite fun, I'm told I don't come across as hostile which helps.

    `But I don't want to go among mad people,' Alice remarked.
     `Oh, you can't help that,' said the Cat: `we're all mad here. I'm mad.  You're mad.'
     `How do you know I'm mad?' said Alice.
     `You must be,' said the Cat, `or you wouldn't have come here.'
  • Dawkins upsets Muslims again (Scientific achievement)
     Reply #124 - August 15, 2013, 09:30 PM

    No, but I can start with my mum who always boast about scientific miracles in Qur'an before others here.


    Yeah well I don't have to deal with it on that level. Non-family or extended family who are Muslim I pretty much politely put on notice I'm not interested in hearing about Islam so the conversation on such topics never gets so far as the miraculous scientific evidence in the Quran or whatever, and all grandma cares about is me marrying a nice Muslim Egyptian girl, which I manage to deflect with as many excuses as possible and my lack of Arabic/her lack of English. Tongue

    Now my dad I shut down not so politely but he knows I don't respect him to begin with and is smart enough to know he's probably the only one who expects I should respect him so I'm not worried about being polite in that circumstance (on the rare occasions I actually see him).

    fuck you
  • Dawkins upsets Muslims again (Scientific achievement)
     Reply #125 - August 15, 2013, 09:36 PM

    My mum always says look at Zakir Naik on the telly, if you got any questions/doubts ring/email him. Cheesy

    I am my own worst enemy and best friend, itsa bit of a squeeze in a three-quarter bed, tho. Unhinged!? If I was a dog I would be having kittens, that is unhinged. Footloose n fancy free, forced to fit, fated to fly. One or 2 words, 3 and 3/thirds, looking comely but lonely, till I made them homely.D
  • Dawkins upsets Muslims again (Scientific achievement)
     Reply #126 - August 15, 2013, 09:50 PM

     Terror couch

    `But I don't want to go among mad people,' Alice remarked.
     `Oh, you can't help that,' said the Cat: `we're all mad here. I'm mad.  You're mad.'
     `How do you know I'm mad?' said Alice.
     `You must be,' said the Cat, `or you wouldn't have come here.'
  • Dawkins upsets Muslims again (Scientific achievement)
     Reply #127 - August 16, 2013, 09:39 PM

    My mum always says look at Zakir Naik on the telly, if you got any questions/doubts ring/email him. Cheesy

     That'd be like asking Mr.Bean for dating tips.

    There are some ignorant "stupid f**ks" walking this Earth, like Ken Ham or the Banana Guy, but that "Dr.Prof." Zakir Naik easily beats them all.
    If stupidity would make you grow, this man would be called "Mount Everest" by his followers.

    Just thinking of his voice and him "explaining" another "scientific" miracle and talking about all the "knowledge" apparently hidden in the Koran makes me laugh.
  • Dawkins upsets Muslims again (Scientific achievement)
     Reply #128 - August 16, 2013, 09:48 PM

    Btw, Dawkins is a lot of things; but he is not a racist. In fact, I remember him and Hitchens always feeling super-proud about Ayaan Hirsi-Ali and pointing out how intelligent she is. Basically pointing her out as to mean "look, we don't care where you are from or what you look like; here's a woman who went through A LOT, who comes from nothing more than patriarchy, Islamism and ignorance.........and even she was able to "get it"". I always thought Hitchens (whom Dawkins, really, really admired for his "bluntness") and Dawkins paid special attention to pointing out the ex-Muslim branch of the "New Atheists".

    And yes, I think Dawkins should be MORE sarcastic and cynical; he often comes off as "too dry" and academic. On the other hand, that's why his enemies want to associate themselves with him; "here I am, a dumb believer who thinks Mohammed flew to Heaven on a winged horse...........and there is this arrogant atheist professor with all his naturalism and not believing in Allah's obvious interventions into the Natural Order". lol

    If I were Dawkins, I'd much more often point out the simple idiocy radiating from many people he has to suffer interviews/debates thru with.
    Sometimes I wish he was more "straight forward" like Hitchens, who didn't shy away from calling all Black American reverends pimps for Jesus and liars, after just having debated Rev.Al Sharpton........and noone in their right mind would accuse Hitchens of racism.

  • Dawkins upsets Muslims again (Scientific achievement)
     Reply #129 - August 16, 2013, 10:59 PM

    I rather doubt Dawkins is a racist or even Snitchens, but just to play Devil's Advocate...

    Btw, Dawkins is a lot of things; but he is not a racist. In fact, I remember him and Hitchens always feeling super-proud about Ayaan Hirsi-Ali and pointing out how intelligent she is. Basically pointing her out as to mean "look, we don't care where you are from or what you look like; here's a woman who went through A LOT, who comes from nothing more than patriarchy, Islamism and ignorance.........and even she was able to "get it"". I always thought Hitchens (whom Dawkins, really, really admired for his "bluntness") and Dawkins paid special attention to pointing out the ex-Muslim branch of the "New Atheists".


    Ever considered this could just be tokenism? Wilders is also a supporter of AHA but there's little doubt that whether he himself is a bigot or racist that his rhetoric is clearly targeted towards the racist anti-immigrant voters in Holland. And here in the US we have plenty of total racists like Ann Coulter, Michael Savage, or take your pick quite willing to hold up Uncle Toms like Allen West and Herman Cain, themselves nasty bigots, as heroes.

    Simply supporting a prominent Black figure does not automatically mean someone's not racist. If you believe that then your definition of racism is rather shallow.

    Quote
    Sometimes I wish he was more "straight forward" like Hitchens, who didn't shy away from calling all Black American reverends pimps for Jesus and liars, after just having debated Rev.Al Sharpton


    ALL of them? MLK included? Jesse Jackson? People who have put their asses on the line for the struggle against oppression? That's bullshit. Yeah that's not MOST Black American preachers, but there are enough, even today, to where making a statement that they're ALL pimps and liars is total bullshit. I'm a pretty damn anti-clerical guy myself but I've seen enough preachers and priests out on union picket lines, willing to be arrested and beaten, for me to condemn all clergy. What did any of that matter to Hitchens though, born into money and privilege, who made a living being a drunken asshole on TV?

    Quote
    ........and noone in their right mind would accuse Hitchens of racism.


    Again this seems to indicate a very shallow understanding of racism. If we understand racism as more than mere personal prejudice, but rather a system that uses personal prejudice to oppress large groups of people, then considering the fact that Snitchens was a vocal cheerleader of neocolonialism and imperialist war (which many would consider inherently racist), then yes, one could make an argument Snitchens was racist even if all his closest friends were Black or brown or whatever.

    fuck you
  • Dawkins upsets Muslims again (Scientific achievement)
     Reply #130 - August 17, 2013, 01:37 PM

    I am not interested in the opinion of Americans regarding "anti-immigrant policies", because that's a topic clearly distinct from the buzz-word "Islamophobia". So if you play "Devil's Advocate", lets at least play the same game.
    Ayaan Hirsi-Ali wasn't promoted by Hitchens or Dawkins for involving herself politically into an anti-immigrant policy in Holland, but for exposing the influence of Islam on the female part of the population ANYWHERE Islam is in power or has a strong influence on the public.
    Quite different to Ann Coulter, an ugly personality of the "how do we make sure niggers understand we hate them, without using "the N-word" and while claiming we are the victims of reverse-racism"-crowd of Fox News and the likes.

    But again, we are talking about apples, but you insist we talk about cucumbers. No, we are talking about APPLES.

    Jeez, the point about Jesse Jackson (really? do you know anything about him? LOL)? Boy, you are one clueless cookie. Neither MLK nor Jesse Jackson are the saints one paints them as and our Freemason friend Jesse Jackson has been involved in profiting from his "Blackness" even longer than the complete fraud and intellectual case of diarrhea, "Reverend Al Sharpton". Just watch the Hitchens vs. Al Sharpton debate.

    MLK? As long as the union leaders organized the marches and backed up the protests, it was all good. The moment the thing worked, all the southern churches, who before didn't want to "rock the boat" and piss off "The Massahs", all of a sudden joined the marches, as if they were there from the beginning. No, only white humanists (some of them white preachers from the East Coast) were there from the beginning, who were beat up by the police, just as much as the Black protesters. Read some books or watch a documentary.

    That's what Hitchens (btw) specialized in: he let us see the whole scenario and not let fraudsters let a personal cult develop around them. The best example would be him exposing that wicked cunt of a sociopath, "Mother Theresa".

    It's completely obvious you don't have the slightest clue about politics, let alone about the people you criticize, otherwise you'd know, that Hitchens came from a middle-class environment and his parents hardly had money to send him to a good school. "Coming from money"...........yeah, for a Bangladeshi street beggar maybe. lol

    Quote from you:
    "Again this seems to indicate a very shallow understanding of racism. If we understand racism as more than mere personal prejudice, but rather a system that uses personal prejudice to oppress large groups of people, then considering the fact that Snitchens was a vocal cheerleader of neocolonialism and imperialist war (which many would consider inherently racist), then yes, one could make an argument Snitchens was racist even if all his closest friends were Black or brown or whatever."   Cheesy

    Ok, again, your post seems to indicate a very shallow understanding of logic, rational and intelligence. If we understand you looking at women lustfully not as something natural, but as a phase before you begin to turn violent and start to rape the women you look at, then it is clear to see, that you are indeed a rapist and you can't be trusted for a second, even in an elevator, because as we have demonstrated above (conclusively, of course), you are a rapist, murderer and your mom is a whore and you and your family should be executed.  mysmilie_977 (I'm trying to imitate your "reasoning" by simply setting up a logical chain of thought based on "facts", definitions and premises I just pulled right out of the ass of mine).

    Sorry, but this paragraph is too dumb for me to even respond to in a serious manner and you Sir, demonstrated an immense talent for idiotic conclusions based on even dumber premises. (Just as a tip and to help you get out of your ignorant, passive-aggressive line of "reasoning". Find some interviews of "lefty Hitchens" from the late 80s, where he argues that Saddam should be removed............then look up some of his interviews from around 2008-2010, where he claims that his only regret to the war in Iraq is, not having removed Saddam EARLIER (during the first Gulf War)) - that will be point number one, regarding "neo-colonialism" and Hitchens' positions of certain things". Read Hitchens' book about Henry Kissinger (the blanco check the Saudis gave to the US military in return for protection from Saddam should be of interest to you) and read some interesting things, like the involvement of France in building the biggest Uranium enrichment facility in the world, back in 80s Iraq and how Saddam promised Iran, that despite their problems and the war they finished a couple years earlier, the atomic bombs will be used to eradicate Israel only), etc...

    All in all, if you want to discuss such deep and complicated topics, please, know at least the very basic things about them, otherwise, you are just pissing in the wind, claiming it's raining.  cool2
  • Dawkins upsets Muslims again (Scientific achievement)
     Reply #131 - August 17, 2013, 06:49 PM

    I am not interested in the opinion of Americans regarding "anti-immigrant policies", because that's a topic clearly distinct from the buzz-word "Islamophobia".


    Not in Europe it's not.

    Quote
    Ayaan Hirsi-Ali wasn't promoted by Hitchens or Dawkins for involving herself politically into an anti-immigrant policy in Holland, but for exposing the influence of Islam on the female part of the population ANYWHERE Islam is in power or has a strong influence on the public.
    Quite different to Ann Coulter, an ugly personality of the "how do we make sure niggers understand we hate them, without using "the N-word" and while claiming we are the victims of reverse-racism"-crowd of Fox News and the likes.


    Again, I don't actually believe Dawkins or Snitchens are racists, was just making a point that publicly supporting a Black woman doesn't automatically clear one from the charge of racism-- a point you seemed to have missed.

    Quote
    Jeez, the point about Jesse Jackson (really? do you know anything about him? LOL)?


    Yes, I met him when he came to visit striking workers where I was at and deliver holiday food off the back of a truck. What an asshole.

    Quote
    Boy, you are one clueless cookie.


    And you are one piece of shit pastry.

    Quote
    Neither MLK nor Jesse Jackson are the saints one paints them as


    I never have. I'm quite familiar with the history of the Civil Rights struggle and the sanitized portraits of King that emerged from it. Also the differences between King and Jackson who was referred to by King once as "Uncle Tom Jesse"

    Quote
    and our Freemason friend Jesse Jackson has been involved in profiting from his "Blackness"


    You're bringing up Freemasonry? Oh gawd, you're one of those.

    Quote
    even longer than the complete fraud and intellectual case of diarrhea, "Reverend Al Sharpton".


    Sharpton is an even bigger snitch than Snitchens. I ain't defending him.

    Quote
    Just watch the Hitchens vs. Al Sharpton debate.


    Don't tell me what to do motherfucker.

    Quote
    MLK? As long as the union leaders organized the marches and backed up the protests, it was all good. The moment the thing worked, all the southern churches, who before didn't want to "rock the boat" and piss off "The Massahs", all of a sudden joined the marches, as if they were there from the beginning. No, only white humanists (some of them white preachers from the East Coast) were there from the beginning, who were beat up by the police, just as much as the Black protesters.


    This is total bullshit. King led the Montgomery Bus Boycott in 55 which was considered the start of the Civil Rights Movement, 2 years later he founded the Southern Christian Leadership Conference. And while some union leaders did participate (like Walter Reuther of the UAW), the labor movement at this time was in a fairly conservative period. Meany's AFL-CIO was hardly a solid friend to the Civil Rights Movement. I'm not saying King and the SCLC was the be-all and end-all of the movement, and I'll be the first to criticize some of their strategies, but they did play an early and central role.

    Quote
    Read some books or watch a documentary.


    Sounds like you're the one in need of education on these matters.

    Quote
    It's completely obvious you don't have the slightest clue about politics,


     Cheesy Okay den

    Quote
    let alone about the people you criticize, otherwise you'd know, that Hitchens came from a middle-class environment and his parents hardly had money to send him to a good school.


     Roll Eyes Middle-class indeed. Do you even know what that term means? His father was a naval officer, hardly a working-class role, especially at that time when officers in the Royal Navy tended to come almost exclusively from the middle and upper classes.

    Quote
    "Coming from money"...........yeah, for a Bangladeshi street beggar maybe. lol


    Or a Sheffield steel worker.

    Quote
    Sorry, but this paragraph is too dumb for me to even respond to in a serious manner and you Sir, demonstrated an immense talent for idiotic conclusions based on even dumber premises. (Just as a tip and to help you get out of your ignorant, passive-aggressive line of "reasoning".

     

    Kiss my hairy Egyptian-American ass, fuckface. That un-passive-aggressive enough for ya, ya little shit?

    Quote
    Find some interviews of "lefty Hitchens" from the late 80s, where he argues that Saddam should be removed............then look up some of his interviews from around 2008-2010, where he claims that his only regret to the war in Iraq is, not having removed Saddam EARLIER (during the first Gulf War)) - that will be point number one, regarding "neo-colonialism" and Hitchens' positions of certain things". Read Hitchens' book about Henry Kissinger (the blanco check the Saudis gave to the US military in return for protection from Saddam should be of interest to you) and read some interesting things, like the involvement of France in building the biggest Uranium enrichment facility in the world, back in 80s Iraq and how Saddam promised Iran, that despite their problems and the war they finished a couple years earlier, the atomic bombs will be used to eradicate Israel only), etc...


    Yes, I'm aware of ALL of this shit. My point was that one could construct an argument for Snitchens being objectively racist, not that the argument would be a good one, but it's certainly not beyond the realm of reason as you seemed to suggest. But once again you missed the fuckin point and decided instead to go off on some half-baked rant full of insults against me. Well fuck you too buddy.

    fuck you
  • Dawkins upsets Muslims again (Scientific achievement)
     Reply #132 - August 17, 2013, 09:19 PM

    Quote
    I rather doubt Dawkins is a racist or even Snitchens, but just to play Devil's Advocate...
    ...................

    I am not interested in the opinion .................. Boy, you are one clueless cookie.


    And you are one piece of shit pastry.




    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=20lYy5HsDLk

    Do not let silence become your legacy.. Question everything   
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim
     
  • Dawkins upsets Muslims again (Scientific achievement)
     Reply #133 - August 17, 2013, 10:32 PM

    Rather not watch the whole clip yeez, care to point me to the appropriate section?

    fuck you
  • Dawkins upsets Muslims again (Scientific achievement)
     Reply #134 - August 17, 2013, 11:09 PM

    You trying to discern the relevance of yeezevee's vid?  Ah! therein lies your problem. parrot

    "Many people would sooner die than think; In fact, they do so." -- Bertrand Russell

    Baloney Detection Kit
  • Dawkins upsets Muslims again (Scientific achievement)
     Reply #135 - August 18, 2013, 07:16 PM

    Rather not watch the whole clip yeez, care to point me to the appropriate section?


    Who gives a damn! It's Han Solo!!!

     dance

    No free mixing of the sexes is permitted on these forums or via PM or the various chat groups that are operating.

    Women must write modestly and all men must lower their case.

    http://www.ummah.com/forum/showthread.php?425649-Have-some-Hayaa-%28modesty-shame%29-people!
  • Dawkins upsets Muslims again (Scientific achievement)
     Reply #136 - August 18, 2013, 07:33 PM

    Just stumbled upon this so I thought I'd dump it here:

    Saudi Shura Council Member Ibrahim Al-Buleihi on Saudi TV:
    Progress for Arab and Islamic World Can Only Come from Western Civilization on memritv.org

    I guess he would back Dawkins up on this one.

    Danish Never-Moose adopted by the kind people on the CEMB-forum
    Ex-Muslim chat (Unaffliated with CEMB). Safari users: Use "#ex-muslims" as the channel name. CEMB chat thread.
  • Dawkins upsets Muslims again (Scientific achievement)
     Reply #137 - August 18, 2013, 07:57 PM

    Self criticism is always the way forward. Try and find something wrong, then come to an agreement on the best way to fix it, and repeat.

    `But I don't want to go among mad people,' Alice remarked.
     `Oh, you can't help that,' said the Cat: `we're all mad here. I'm mad.  You're mad.'
     `How do you know I'm mad?' said Alice.
     `You must be,' said the Cat, `or you wouldn't have come here.'
  • Dawkins upsets Muslims again (Scientific achievement)
     Reply #138 - August 18, 2013, 09:20 PM

    L
    Just stumbled upon this so I thought I'd dump it here:

    Saudi Shura Council Member Ibrahim Al-Buleihi on Saudi TV:
    Progress for Arab and Islamic World Can Only Come from Western Civilization on memritv.org

    I guess he would back Dawkins up on this one.


    LOL  Cheesy  Cheesy  dance  Cheesy  Cheesy

    He asks: what have we given the West?
    The host replies: Oil and deen (Islam)....

     Cheesy  Cheesy  Cheesy  Cheesy

    No free mixing of the sexes is permitted on these forums or via PM or the various chat groups that are operating.

    Women must write modestly and all men must lower their case.

    http://www.ummah.com/forum/showthread.php?425649-Have-some-Hayaa-%28modesty-shame%29-people!
  • Dawkins upsets Muslims again (Scientific achievement)
     Reply #139 - August 18, 2013, 09:33 PM

    Yes, they have given us those things. Well, maybe not "given"...

    `But I don't want to go among mad people,' Alice remarked.
     `Oh, you can't help that,' said the Cat: `we're all mad here. I'm mad.  You're mad.'
     `How do you know I'm mad?' said Alice.
     `You must be,' said the Cat, `or you wouldn't have come here.'
  • Dawkins upsets Muslims again (Scientific achievement)
     Reply #140 - August 18, 2013, 09:45 PM

    Well, the guest goes on to point out that the Arabs had oil right under their noses for centuries and did NOTHING with it. That is until the evil, pig eating, kafir Westerners came and developed instruments of detection, extraction, purification, filtrations, containments and transportations.

    He never said anything about the contribution of Islam to the West. Wise move.

    Though to be fair, Muslims have made enormous contributions in many of the major fields back in the day and to a smaller extent today. That's not quite 'Islam' though is it. I guess, Islam may ahve contributed in adding to the salvation history narrative and allowed us a much needed glimpse of a particular region in history. The ideas, philosophies, politics, social structure are interesting and Muhammad was a revolutionary figure who for his time (despite other short comings) was far advanced than his contemporaries. Must give credit where it is due. But Islam's contribution is insignificant. The contribution of people from regions under control by the Muslim empire can not be denied. Even if we are to limit to disseminating Greek thought.

    No free mixing of the sexes is permitted on these forums or via PM or the various chat groups that are operating.

    Women must write modestly and all men must lower their case.

    http://www.ummah.com/forum/showthread.php?425649-Have-some-Hayaa-%28modesty-shame%29-people!
  • Dawkins upsets Muslims again (Scientific achievement)
     Reply #141 - August 18, 2013, 09:53 PM

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iG0CeResVB4

    LOL  Cheesy  Cheesy  dance  Cheesy  Cheesy

    He asks: what have we given the West?
    The host replies: Oil and deen (Islam)....

     Cheesy  Cheesy  Cheesy  Cheesy



    That is a good one Jedi., Well progress is made., If every  Arab thinks that way there will be more progress in this century

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iBYXy14HGmA

    well let us look at that., The  life just 70 years ago.,    that was last century.,  Folks were very simple...  

    Do not let silence become your legacy.. Question everything   
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim
     
  • Dawkins upsets Muslims again (Scientific achievement)
     Reply #142 - August 18, 2013, 09:53 PM

    Why all the hate for the west and not the east? Japan, China, Thailand, North and South Korea and far more unislamic that us. I know at one point in the name of no violence China even tried to stop muslims going to mosque. West never did that.

    `But I don't want to go among mad people,' Alice remarked.
     `Oh, you can't help that,' said the Cat: `we're all mad here. I'm mad.  You're mad.'
     `How do you know I'm mad?' said Alice.
     `You must be,' said the Cat, `or you wouldn't have come here.'
  • Dawkins upsets Muslims again (Scientific achievement)
     Reply #143 - August 18, 2013, 09:58 PM

    Why all the hate for the west and not the east? Japan, China, Thailand, North and South Korea and far more unislamic that us. I know at one point in the name of no violence China even tried to stop muslims going to mosque. West never did that.

    because  West supports juice and juicy land., Allahdoll forbids that.

    "Oh Allah, accept our martyrs in the highest heavens…
    Oh Allah, show the Jews a black day…
    Oh Allah, annihilate the Jews and their supporters…
    Oh Allah, raise the flag of Jihad across the land…"

    Do not let silence become your legacy.. Question everything   
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim
     
  • Dawkins upsets Muslims again (Scientific achievement)
     Reply #144 - August 19, 2013, 05:51 AM

    Why all the hate for the west and not the east? Japan, China, Thailand, North and South Korea and far more unislamic that us. I know at one point in the name of no violence China even tried to stop muslims going to mosque. West never did that.


    None of those countries have shown any interest in imposing their will very far beyond their own borders, at least not in the last 65 years or so. China never sponsored a coup against a democratically-elected government in Iran. Japan never invaded the Suez with Israel. Thailand never carved up the entire Ottoman Empire into colonial puppets. South Korea never occupied Sudan and ruled over an Egyptian puppet regime for 57 years. North Korea did not participate in the recent invasions of Iraq and Afghanistan. Your country did all these things and more.

    fuck you
  • Dawkins upsets Muslims again (Scientific achievement)
     Reply #145 - August 19, 2013, 08:32 AM

    None of those countries have shown any interest in imposing their will very far beyond their own borders, at least not in the last 65 years or so. China never sponsored a coup against a democratically-elected government in Iran. Japan never invaded the Suez with Israel. Thailand never carved up the entire Ottoman Empire into colonial puppets. South Korea never occupied Sudan and ruled over an Egyptian puppet regime for 57 years. North Korea did not participate in the recent invasions of Iraq and Afghanistan. Your country did all these things and more.

     Colonel-Q ., World is same everywhere., greed is same in every human mind., Those countries also could do it and if they were  as powerful as AMRIKA, they will do it.  But the Islamic case of Muslim towel heads  hating west in-general  or hating Amrika in particular is different. It is Islamic mind set ., It is Islamic brain wash,   Freedom of Expression is a direct threat to Islam., In fact Freedom of Expression is a  threat to all governments that   rule people in the name some god.. the voodoo doll.

    Do not let silence become your legacy.. Question everything   
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim
     
  • Dawkins upsets Muslims again (Scientific achievement)
     Reply #146 - August 19, 2013, 11:14 AM

    Dawkins’ point is valid. It also explains why muslims keep harping on about all the freedoms and changes Islam made “1400 years ago”. It’s because since the so–called ‘golden age’ of Islam, the whole culture stagnated after the ‘Ulema managed to secure power for themselves.
  • Dawkins upsets Muslims again (Scientific achievement)
     Reply #147 - August 19, 2013, 06:20 PM

    Why all the hate for the west and not the east? Japan, China, Thailand, North and South Korea and far more unislamic that us. I know at one point in the name of no violence China even tried to stop muslims going to mosque. West never did that.


    Depend on what you mean by "The West". It took 120 years to expel and butcher the Muslims (and Jews) of the Iberian Peninsula from the reconquista was completed.

    Around the same time, Muslim tartars became a kind of warrior aristocracy in Poland. And now Poland just banned halal (and kosher) meat. So it is all over the place.

    British/France/US imperialism in the Middle East and Arab temperament - and the original ideas of Arab/Persian nationalism and democracy shot down by those empires in the fight against Communism and for profits - may have something to do with it - all the coups they orchestrated and of course the creation of Israel.

    Oh - and Hanbalis. Don't forget those. And the alliance between al-Saud og Muhammad ibn Abd al-Wahhab (thus Wahabism and off shots all over the world today).

    Danish Never-Moose adopted by the kind people on the CEMB-forum
    Ex-Muslim chat (Unaffliated with CEMB). Safari users: Use "#ex-muslims" as the channel name. CEMB chat thread.
  • Dawkins upsets Muslims again (Scientific achievement)
     Reply #148 - August 19, 2013, 06:59 PM

    A man who knows his history and can frame current events in that context-- excellent. Smiley

    fuck you
  • Dawkins upsets Muslims again (Scientific achievement)
     Reply #149 - August 19, 2013, 10:05 PM

    Around the same time, Muslim tartars became a kind of warrior aristocracy in Poland. And now Poland just banned halal (and kosher) meat. So it is all over the place.


    The Polish-Lithuanian kingdom was an exception throughout Europe's history, granting everyone basically religious freedom (and freedom FROM religion). And that without treating the people like sub-humans or forcing them to pay money. Not only did the Tatars had their legal rights and even became aristocrats (who later signed the world's second democratic, secular constitution, (not coincidentally after the USA)), but the Jews were also not bothered, because unlike in the West, the people didn't make them responsible for all evils.

    So it was no coincidence that the immigrants to Poland formed the famous Polish Brethren, who later became a big influence on many Dutch, British and even American secularists.

    And of course, lets not forget the role of the Polish-Lithuanian forces in defeating the Ottoman invasion near Vienna ("coincidentally" took place on September 11th, 1693).

    If you look at the further history of Europe and how the others "thanked" Poland for that (the three partitions and eradication for 123 years), followed by the Nazi occupation AND later post-WWII dictatorship via Communist Moscow, you have to understand that the secularist and humanist Poles don't feel the "White Guilt" the Germans, French or British feel, when dealing with (especially) Muslim immigrants.
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