RamiRustom: I don't even know what "measure morality" means.
yeezevee: Good so we don't know how to measure morality
RamiRustom: And you think that’s relevant to whether or not morality is objective because [no argument]. So what is your argument? In other words, why is that relevant to the problem you’re trying to solve?
yeezevee: Well I am not trying to solve any problem but trying to understand your point of view on Morality.
That is a (human) problem. A human problem is a want that somebody has.
Well I was under the impression that you have some sort of scientific way of measuring morality
Science applies only to scientific theories. A scientific theory is one that makes testable predictions. To be more specific. A theory is scientific if and only if it can, in principle, by ruled out by empirical evidence. So any theory that doesn’t, is not scientific. Also, any theory that claims to be scientific, but doesn’t pass this Line of Demarcation, is psuedo-science.
A moral theory does not pass the line of demarcation test. So a moral theory is not scientific. But that doesn’t mean moral theories are not objective.
An objective moral theory is one that is intended to solve a problem. Now, because we are fallible, there is no way of telling beforehand which of our theories are going to be found wrong in the future. We can’t predict future criticism. We can’t predict future knowledge creation.
and then differentiating "THE MORAL COMPASS OF A PERSON" under a given situation, whether it is a "Subjective morality" or objective Morality ? That is all what I was writing about Rami..
I don’t know what you mean by this question. I don’t know what you mean by ‘subjective morality.’ So at this point I don’t know what problem you’re trying to solve.
yeezevee: Can we define "Morality" the way we understand?
RamiRustom: In my essay I wrote this:
...........So ideas that are intended to solve problems are objective. Those that don’t are subjective. And morality is about solving problems. A moral philosophy should be able to provide a method to answer questions like 'should I learn to read,' 'should I learn epistemology,' 'what and when should I eat,' 'how should I raise my children?' These are all ideas that are intended to solve specific problems. And for this reason, it's possible to find out if they fail to solve the problems they intend to solve….
So according to you "definition of Morality" is,
a). morality is about solving problems,
b). A moral philosophy should be able to provide a method to answer questions.. like
1). 'should I learn to read,'
2). 'Should I learn to eat'
3). ' 'how should I raise my children?
etc..etc. questions and giving answers to questions ., Is that the definition of Morality RamiRustom??
But people like Ayn Rand says
What is morality, or ethics?
It is a code of values to guide man’s choices and actions—the choices and actions that determine the purpose and the course of his life. Ethics, as a science, deals with discovering and defining such a code.
Morality is about how to live a good life. That requires solving problems. While a person is solving these problems, he creates his moral principles, his code of ethics.
Note: Here Rand is using the word “science” metaphorically to mean ‘reason’. Reason is a process of coming to conclusions by guesses and criticism (which is analogous to science which is by hypothesis and experiment).
The first question that has to be answered, as a precondition of any attempt to define, to judge or to accept any specific system of ethics, is: Why does man need a code of values?
Man needs a code of ethics in order to live a good life.
Let me stress this. The first question is not: What particular code of values should man accept?
Right. The particular set of moral ideas (values) that somebody has right now is not as important as the method by which he judges moral ideas.
The first question is: Does man need values at all—and why?
There is benefit and harm to be found in the universe. To avoid the harm and take advantage of the benefit, one needs to be selective with what things he chooses to do, which people he chooses to interact with, what jobs he chooses to take, etc. And in order to be selective, one must apply a standard of selection. Those standards are your values.
Does what she wrote make any sense Rami Rustom??
Yes.
Topic: Is morality subjective or objective?