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 Topic: Love at first sight

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  • Love at first sight
     OP - February 07, 2014, 05:11 PM

    Love at first sight


    'Love at first sight' is an interesting phenomenon. Our oldest record of it was by the Ancient Greeks, who explained it as a sudden feeling of passionate love, a kind of mania, upon meeting a person for the first time.

    One thing that’s interesting about it is that some people believe it’s possible to experience it, to have it happen to them, while other people don’t. And for the people that do believe it, this is part of the causal chain that causes them to experience it. As for the people that don’t believe it, they can’t experience it. It just doesn’t happen to them.

    The 'unbelievers' either believed the tradition and then changed their mind, or they never bought into it in the first place because they already had reason to believe that it doesn’t make sense. But most of these people still have basically the same mistake. They still think in a way that is consistent with ‘love at first sight’ for other things, like ideas.

    So a person might have an intuition, or gut feeling, and immediately be excited by the idea, without checking it for error. And because he's excited, he doesn't put any effort in looking for problems. This is fundamentally the same as a person who gets a sensation upon the first sight of someone and then interpreting that sensation to mean that he loves that person, all without checking the idea (that he’s in love) for error.

    'Love at first sight,' for a person or for an idea, doesn’t make sense. No matter what sensation one has, that sensation doesn’t mean that the idea is true or best. Treating the sensation this way is a form of justificationism. It’s a way to give status to an idea in order to ignore the possibility that the idea might be wrong -- i.e. it's a way to justify the idea.


    Justification

    Justifying an idea by it’s sensation means having no means of finding out that you’re wrong. It means treating the sensation as an authority. It means treating the sensation as an infallible source of knowledge.  Justificationism doesn’t account for the fact that people are fallible, that all ideas people come up with are subject to error. 'Love at first sight' is just a special case of this.

    'Love at first sight' is fundamentally the same as getting angry after jumping to conclusions in response to somebody saying something to you. Whatever the intent of the person, you could be wrong about your interpretation of his intent. Your sensation of anger is not justification that your interpretation (of his intent) is correct. Maybe the person had no malicious intent. Maybe he wanted to help you as opposed to wanting to hurt you. No matter how strong your sensation is, that doesn’t make your interpretation true. Your sensation doesn’t give extra status to your interpretation. Your sensation is not an authority. You do not have any infallible sources of knowledge. All your ideas are subject to error, even the ones that you get strong sensations about.

    This is about first impressions. If your first impression comes with a strong emotional/intuitional sensation, that doesn’t mean that it’s correct. Your first impression could be wrong. And if you act on your first impression before checking it for error, then you are ignoring that you might be wrong. In the case of 'love at first sight' for an idea, it’s important to check for problems with the idea, as a means of accounting for the possibility of it being wrong.

    First impressions, like all other ideas, are fallible, so people shouldn’t act on them without first checking for criticism. One type of criticism of a first impression is another explanation that fits the evidence, an explanation that rivals the first impression. It’s a criticism because if both the first impression and the second explanation are compatible with all the existing evidence, then that means both explanations are wrong since neither of them is better than its rival, in the sense that both of them equally fit the evidence. In order to rule one of them out, you’d have to find another piece of evidence that contradicts one of them but not the other.

    This way of thinking affects all areas of a person's life. Lots of people make huge life decisions based on the sensations they get surrounding those decisions. They get married to people because of their feelings while ignoring the glaring problems surrounding the relationships. They choose not to abort pregnancies for feelings of love of unborn children while ignoring things like whether or not the family situation is opportune for the unborn children and for the parents. They switch jobs based on feelings of excitement of a new job, often trading to a worse situation than compared to the previous job, usually in a type of scenario where the person could have found out the danger before quitting the previous job. These are all very dangerous situations. Thinking in this way, of making decisions without trying to lookout for danger, can only be expected to lead to a long string of major disasters. What's needed is a way to think about things where dangerous results can be avoided instead of ignored.


    Conventional advice

    Another interesting thing about 'love at first sight,' or rather, the boiled down version of it, 'first impressions,' is the conventional advice about how to deal with the uncertainty of making decisions. The advise says that second-guessing yourself is something that should be avoided. It says that one shouldn't think critically about a decision after having made the decision, as a means of feeling better about the possibility of the decision being wrong. But this is a misguided way of dealing with uncertainty. It's like saying: Since I can't be certain about my idea, I need a way to act that accounts for the bad feeling I get when I'm uncertain about a decision I made. This is a bad approach because it's not giving any method for dealing with the uncertainty, and instead it's only giving advice on how to feel in spite of the uncertainty. The problem I see with this is that following this advice means ignoring criticism of one's ideas. It means blocking out of your mind that your decision could be wrong. It means blocking out of your mind that the case might be that you should change your mind. It means blocking out of your mind that you can learn things from your past mistakes, things that you can use to help you in future decisions.

    To clarify the issue, let's consider what it means to stop second-guessing in the context of a murder case. The first guess is the detective's first suspect. Second-guessing means looking for other possible suspects that could have committed the murder instead. It means looking for other types of theories like maybe it was a suicide, or maybe it was an accident caused by one or more mistakes made by the accused person and/or other people. If the detective doesn't second-guess his first guesses, then he can't possibly find the truth, unless he happened to get lucky on his first guess. Do you want to be a suspect in a case where the detective follows this conventional advice that second-guessing is something to be avoided? If you were wrongly convicted of a murder, would you want our judicial system to avoid second-guessing (aka appealing) the case?

    Consider the equivalent situation in the context of the medical profession. Recently a women died the night of being released from the hospital. The physician had decided that it was ok for her to be released from the hospital, and immediately after making the decision he second-guessed himself, but instead of acting on this, he looked to the nurse for confirmation of his decision, to which she confirmed that it was the right decision. But it was the wrong decision. Not only was it the wrong decision, the physician was also wrong to seek confirmation of his decision as a means of burying his thoughts of uncertainty. Instead, he should have sought criticism. He should have thought it normal to second-guess himself, instead of thinking that it was bad to do so.


    How to deal with uncertainty

    My description might not be giving the conventional advice a fair analysis. I think the conventional advise says that you should second-guess a little bit, and then at some point to stop second-guessing and decide on your best knowledge. But the problem with this conventional approach is that it's not clear about how to arrive at an idea that can be considered 'the best knowledge.' It doesn't explain that the best idea as a proposal solution for a particular problem is one that refutes all of it's existing rivals. It doesn't explain how to go about criticizing one's ideas. And it doesn't explain how to update one's ideas in the future as new ideas and criticisms are created.

    Consider the context of a murder case again. The court system is designed so that any conviction can be appealed. This is because we know that we could have been wrong about the conviction. Our best knowledge to date, at the time of the conviction, was good enough to convict, but we know that it's possible that a new piece of evidence, or a new analysis, could change the dynamics of the case such that the previous theory is now refuted, in favor for a new theory. This shows that our judicial system is designed to account for uncertainty. And this is a way of thinking, an attitude, that individuals can have to.

    So the conventional advice is telling us how to feel better about possibly being wrong (aka uncertain). But it doesn't address the underlying issue, that it's ok to be wrong since that's part of the human condition. Being wrong is normal. It's common. The important thing isn't that you're wrong, or that you could be wrong, but rather it's how you deal with the fact that you could be wrong, and how you deal with situations where you have criticism of your ideas. Do you seek confirmation for your ideas or do you seek criticism? Do you block out things from your mind or do you change your mind about your ideas when you do find out that you're wrong?

    More importantly, finding out that you're wrong shouldn't be seen as a bad thing because it's actually good -- you went from being wrong, to being right, about that one thing. If you get a bad feeling when second-guessing your ideas, that's an indication that you have the wrong attitude, the wrong philosophy towards mistakes. What's needed is an attitude that matches the human condition, an attitude of enjoying criticism, an attitude of enjoying finding out that you're wrong. Why? Because finding out that you're wrong is the first step towards correcting your mistake. It's an opportunity to improve. It's an opportunity to evolve.

    ----------------------

    Rami Rustom

    If you like my philosophy, signup to my blog: http://ramirustom.blogspot.com/
  • Love at first sight
     Reply #1 - February 07, 2014, 06:09 PM

    As for the people that don’t believe it, they can’t experience it. It just doesn’t happen to them.

    No Rustom, I used to be an unbeliever. But then I experienced a very very passionate love at first sight. I still cherish the experience Smiley.
  • Love at first sight
     Reply #2 - February 07, 2014, 06:55 PM

    Didn't read your article RamiRustom, but it all depends on what you define as "love". I have a hard time to define it, but I do not count passion and sexual attraction automatically as "love". So no, the kind of love that grows between two people the more time and experience they share, that kind of love cannot happen "at first sight". But a strong sexual attraction and passionate feelings can, because they are ruled by our biology. I have experienced that kind of "Infatuation" at first sight. It's really amazing Smiley

    "The healthiest people I know are those who are the first to label themselves fucked up." - three
  • Love at first sight
     Reply #3 - February 07, 2014, 08:29 PM

    Love at first sight.

    Anger at first sight.

    Hate at first sight.


    Do you understand how foolish all these sound when devoid of their social contexts?
    We are all the sum total of our circumstances and experiences thus far. There is no 'absolute' case of 'love at first sight', only past expereiences, indoctrinated value judgements and social taboos that define/redefine what 'love' is to a person and they then project these subjective narratives onto the other.

    So yeah, as you said:

    No matter what sensation one has, that sensation doesn’t mean that the idea is true or best.


    No free mixing of the sexes is permitted on these forums or via PM or the various chat groups that are operating.

    Women must write modestly and all men must lower their case.

    http://www.ummah.com/forum/showthread.php?425649-Have-some-Hayaa-%28modesty-shame%29-people!
  • Love at first sight
     Reply #4 - February 07, 2014, 09:33 PM

    No I am not saying that my passionate experience was the right one, I am just saying that unbelievers also change their mind about love at first sight. I used to think that it just happened in movies and novels. But I fell in love from the very first moment I saw this guy about whom I had no idea. And boy how I still love him now even though he is not worthy.
  • Love at first sight
     Reply #5 - February 08, 2014, 03:37 AM

    I believe in lust at first sight, but not love.

    `But I don't want to go among mad people,' Alice remarked.
     `Oh, you can't help that,' said the Cat: `we're all mad here. I'm mad.  You're mad.'
     `How do you know I'm mad?' said Alice.
     `You must be,' said the Cat, `or you wouldn't have come here.'
  • Love at first sight
     Reply #6 - February 08, 2014, 07:18 AM

    ^ Cheesy

    "I'm standing here like an asshole holding my Charles Dickens"

    "No theory,No ready made system,no book that has ever been written to save the world. i cleave to no system.."-Bakunin
  • Love at first sight
     Reply #7 - February 08, 2014, 08:21 AM

    Well, it's true wouldn't you say? You can have instant chemistry with someone, but love? Love grows over time.

    `But I don't want to go among mad people,' Alice remarked.
     `Oh, you can't help that,' said the Cat: `we're all mad here. I'm mad.  You're mad.'
     `How do you know I'm mad?' said Alice.
     `You must be,' said the Cat, `or you wouldn't have come here.'
  • Love at first sight
     Reply #8 - February 08, 2014, 09:03 AM

    If the chemistry involves getting a hard-on/getting wet then yes I do believe that is the case i.e. lust > love, but keep in mind that what one considers to be attractive or 'turn-on-ability' is socially constructed and then again when guys are horny some of them will just about fuck anything and say anything. That's what kafirs do.

    Stop throwing stones.

    Penis control.

    No free mixing of the sexes is permitted on these forums or via PM or the various chat groups that are operating.

    Women must write modestly and all men must lower their case.

    http://www.ummah.com/forum/showthread.php?425649-Have-some-Hayaa-%28modesty-shame%29-people!
  • Love at first sight
     Reply #9 - February 08, 2014, 09:19 AM

    Not only socially, but it is also governed by our biology. There are studies on this topic. No love at first sight, but attraction at first sight. And it is a different kind of attraction than when you see ANY  "a hot chick" or "hunk".

    "The healthiest people I know are those who are the first to label themselves fucked up." - three
  • Love at first sight
     Reply #10 - February 08, 2014, 10:03 AM

    Attracted by what pheremones?

    No free mixing of the sexes is permitted on these forums or via PM or the various chat groups that are operating.

    Women must write modestly and all men must lower their case.

    http://www.ummah.com/forum/showthread.php?425649-Have-some-Hayaa-%28modesty-shame%29-people!
  • Love at first sight
     Reply #11 - February 08, 2014, 10:12 AM

    Sorry in advance for poor grammar and spelling, but typing from your phone is the worst.

    Have you for example noticed that some people's natural odours are pleasent while other people's are the opposite? It's because we are biologically more suitable for each other. We emit odours just like other animals that sends off "messages", and I'm not talking about people stinking due to poor hygiene. Google it, it's quite interesting.

    "The healthiest people I know are those who are the first to label themselves fucked up." - three
  • Love at first sight
     Reply #12 - February 08, 2014, 11:14 AM

    When I first saw my partner, I knew with absolute certainty a number of facts that would absolutely transform me and my world. I knew that I had to know him, had to know who this beautiful creature was. I knew that he'd be interesting and surprising and exciting. And I knew that we'd be fucking later. These facts were confirmed within the first few moments of us being together. I was instantly hooked. I didn't just want to have sex, tear his clothes off, feel that excitement of exploring new flesh. It was more than base desire. I wanted to recalibrate my entire self to his rhythm, at whatever cost. And even if I did not willingly do that of my own accord, it would have been inevitable. Such was the hold he had over me. Such was the power of the attraction I felt. The entire momentum of my life changed. That ongoing moment and space between us would become the focus of my existence and my universe would revolve around that.

    That awoken capacity in me, that ability to be able to feel so close and in rhythm to a person, so totally connected, so intimately hooked into him, so irreversibly altered and dependant upon him in order to function as a human being, chemically, biologically, emotionally, intellectually, was so deeply rousing and exhilarating to the point that I felt I could not contain it. Whether or not that was love, I cannot say. I'll leave it to the poets to decide. All I can say is that when I hear people reduce this phenomenon to biology or the acted motions of learned behaviour, it's like hearing a blind person try to describe colour. You're either just not getting it, or you're not describing the same thing I'm talking about.

    It seems to me that people are missing the point when they try to reduce the arisen intellectual, emotional, interpretational and actionable higher capacities of the human down to biology or mimicry. The parameters of comprehension, the higher order processes and apprehension, the number of complex and often contradictory axis on which a human being exists and the dynamic and experienced interaction between them, the individual profundity of the human condition, and the purely indulgent and unnecessary appetites we can form, don't fit neatly and satisfactorily into people's crude and reduced biological assertions. That set of things is biologically seated, for sure. And if that's what you mean when you say they are biological, merely that they arise from our physical systems and the functioning of our advanced nervous system, then I agree. But what that is, the emergent thing that arises, didn't ought to still be framed as biology since it is too restrictive when trying to understand it. And it just seems so unsatisfactory and underwhelming too. It's oftentimes just a lazy 'biology of the gaps' argument, offering no insight at all. You don't need to explain these mysteries yet. There is no requirement that you fumble for an account of these things on so little data. If the scientific method can explain them, and I'm confident that it will, then so be it. But that's not quite yet.

    Too fucking busy, and vice versa.
  • Love at first sight
     Reply #13 - February 08, 2014, 11:32 AM

    Ishina, I get your point. But humans are, very simply put, made up of biology, our psychology and everything we learn when we go through our socialization into the respective society we happen to belong to. I don't think there is anything "unknown", "magic", or any "higher" meaning to human emotions and what we experience when we meet that special person. That doesn't make your, or other people's, experience and feelings any less "real" or special. I don't romanticize "love at first sight" just as I don't deny that something more than simple sexual attraction happens. I haven't experienced something like that which you describe, but I have felt the difference between being simply attracted to someones looks, and being drawn to someone more than just sexually. After years and years I still think about him even though we let go of each other a long time ago.

    "The healthiest people I know are those who are the first to label themselves fucked up." - three
  • Love at first sight
     Reply #14 - February 08, 2014, 11:44 AM

    That wasn't really my point. I'm not saying the higher-order capacities of human beings are spooky and supernatural. I'm saying that reducing that terrain down to biology is lazy and offers no insight at all. I'm saying that the emergent properties of mind and consciousness and the things such emergent dynamics compel humans to do ought to be understood as a different kind of natural phenomena to biological processes. I mean, there's a point in neuroscience and A.I. where a biologist is unqualified to talk about that body of knowledge. It's just not the same kind of thing. You see what I'm getting at? Some elements of 'love' do not fall within the ambit of biology or learned conditioning. Just because some elements do does not mean therefore all do.

    Too fucking busy, and vice versa.
  • Love at first sight
     Reply #15 - February 08, 2014, 12:11 PM

    No, I agree, it's interplay (correct word choice?) between a lot of different mechanism (biology, psychology etc etc etc). Perhaps the language barrier is making us not understanding that we perhaps agree on this  Smiley My response on high lighting the biology was a response to Jedi who only thought about sexual attraction as learned behavior (and the norms of the society).

    "The healthiest people I know are those who are the first to label themselves fucked up." - three
  • Love at first sight
     Reply #16 - February 08, 2014, 12:48 PM

    Yeah, sexual chemistry is just one facet of love. Not always a necessary one.

    Too fucking busy, and vice versa.
  • Love at first sight
     Reply #17 - February 08, 2014, 01:25 PM

    When I first saw my partner, I knew with absolute certainty a number of facts that would absolutely transform me and my world. I knew that I had to know him, had to know who this beautiful creature was. I knew that he'd be interesting and surprising and exciting. And I knew that we'd be fucking later. These facts were confirmed within the first few moments of us being together. I was instantly hooked. I didn't just want to have sex, tear his clothes off, feel that excitement of exploring new flesh. It was more than base desire. I wanted to recalibrate my entire self to his rhythm, at whatever cost. And even if I did not willingly do that of my own accord, it would have been inevitable. Such was the hold he had over me. Such was the power of the attraction I felt. The entire momentum of my life changed. That ongoing moment and space between us would become the focus of my existence and my universe would revolve around that.

    If we lived in the year 20,000 BC, that wouldn't have happened. You wouldn't have felt that way. Do you agree?

    I mean, had this happened in the year 20,000 BC, you wouldn't have these ideas related to falling in love with someone (i mean they wouldn't exist in your mind since they hadn't been invented yet), therefore you wouldn't have had these feelings you're describing.

    Quote
    That awoken capacity in me, that ability to be able to feel so close and in rhythm to a person, so totally connected, so intimately hooked into him, so irreversibly altered and dependant upon him in order to function as a human being, chemically, biologically, emotionally, intellectually, was so deeply rousing and exhilarating to the point that I felt I could not contain it. Whether or not that was love, I cannot say. I'll leave it to the poets to decide. All I can say is that when I hear people reduce this phenomenon to biology or the acted motions of learned behaviour, it's like hearing a blind person try to describe colour. You're either just not getting it, or you're not describing the same thing I'm talking about.

    I agree with you that explaining these higher order phenomenon in biology is wrong. Animals and humans have the same basic biology with respect to these things, yet animals do not fall in love (in the sense that humans do). So what is the different between animals and humans that causes this difference? Humans have intelligence while animals don't. And it's this intelligence that humans are using to do all this fancy stuff. For example, over thousands of years humans have been thinking about (and evolving) their ideas about romantic love, while animals have not. And now that these ideas exist in our culture, any humans can be learning them.

    Quote
    It seems to me that people are missing the point when they try to reduce the arisen intellectual, emotional, interpretational and actionable higher capacities of the human down to biology or mimicry. The parameters of comprehension, the higher order processes and apprehension, the number of complex and often contradictory axis on which a human being exists and the dynamic and experienced interaction between them, the individual profundity of the human condition, and the purely indulgent and unnecessary appetites we can form, don't fit neatly and satisfactorily into people's crude and reduced biological assertions. That set of things is biologically seated, for sure. And if that's what you mean when you say they are biological, merely that they arise from our physical systems and the functioning of our advanced nervous system, then I agree. But what that is, the emergent thing that arises, didn't ought to still be framed as biology since it is too restrictive when trying to understand it. And it just seems so unsatisfactory and underwhelming too. It's oftentimes just a lazy 'biology of the gaps' argument, offering no insight at all. You don't need to explain these mysteries yet. There is no requirement that you fumble for an account of these things on so little data. If the scientific method can explain them, and I'm confident that it will, then so be it. But that's not quite yet.

    I don't think the scientific method can explain them. Why? Because (1) the scientific method only applies to theories that can, in principle, be falsified by empirical evidence, and (2) there is no way, in principle, to get empirical evidence about the ideas that exist in a person's mind.

    To clarify #2, we can measure brain waves and stuff, but that can't be used to determine what ideas exist in a mind.

    Ishina, you said that it doesn't make sense to talk about human romantic love in terms of biology. I agree. But then you said that we will be able to explain it by the scientific method, which I think is a contradiction. IF we will be able to explain it with the scientific method, THEN it makes sense to talk about it in terms of biology.
  • Love at first sight
     Reply #18 - February 08, 2014, 01:41 PM

    What about psychology? People like me are dumb enough to believe their first impressions and cling to it.
  • Love at first sight
     Reply #19 - February 08, 2014, 03:07 PM

    Quote from: Rubaya
    What about psychology?

    What about it?
    Quote from: Rubaya
    People like me are dumb enough to believe their first impressions and cling to it.

    [this seems like a joke, but in case it's not...]

    Fortunately you can improve your thinking so that you don't do that.
  • Love at first sight
     Reply #20 - February 08, 2014, 03:33 PM

    I mean you should also see from the psychological viewpoint. Human beings' mind is complex, so the general rules in psychiatric books doesn't always apply. Love at first sight can happen to unbelievers, and it's not necessary that they have to be previously conditioned or something. It can suddenly hit you when you least expect it.
  • Love at first sight
     Reply #21 - February 08, 2014, 03:38 PM

    If we lived in the year 20,000 BC, that wouldn't have happened. You wouldn't have felt that way. Do you agree?

    No, I don't agree. Whatever love is, it has been around since recorded history. There's no reason for me to think it wouldn’t have existed before recorded history, as far back as humans have had the capacity to be infatuated with another individual and form these kinds of bonds. And there are things of a similar vein that appear in other species too. There is evidence that Neanderthal crafted musical instruments, that they expressed themselves to one another beyond mere practical information and crude biological needs, that they must have experienced some familiar kind of poignancy when someone died since they took great care to bury their dead and leave mementos, indicative of the capacity for compassion, profound respect and lasting feelings towards another individual. Ancient humans have started wars over love, or at least created grand mythical traditions where such tropes exist and where love is a prominent theme. They have even modelled their gods after the very concept of romance and love.

    I mean, had this happened in the year 20,000 BC, you wouldn't have these ideas related to falling in love with someone (i mean they wouldn't exist in your mind since they hadn't been invented yet), therefore you wouldn't have had these feelings you're describing.

    I think this highlights the difference in speaking from experience and speaking hypothetically. You describe it as an idea because that's all it is to you – an idea. I assume you only know the thing as an observer, not one with the fulsomeness of experiencing it. Your impression of it seems constructed wholecloth from intellect. It's difficult to describe the actual experience to the degree that is intellectually satisfying. Even the greatest wordsmiths don't quite capture it, not for want of trying. And that's a failing on the part of the describer, so I can't really blame you for what seems like a very clinical, detached and sceptical impression of it.

    Another approach we differ on is that, with regards to love, you see life imitating art. I see it the opposite way. I see art imitating life. I see these "ideas" about love as interpretations and expressions of it. You see references in culture about love as the cause of love. I see the experience and feeling of love as the cause of those references.  

    I agree with you that explaining these higher order phenomenon in biology is wrong. Animals and humans have the same basic biology with respect to these things, yet animals do not fall in love (in the sense that humans do). So what is the different between animals and humans that causes this difference? Humans have intelligence while animals don't. And it's this intelligence that humans are using to do all this fancy stuff. For example, over thousands of years humans have been thinking about (and evolving) their ideas about romantic love, while animals have not. And now that these ideas exist in our culture, any humans can be learning them.

    I disagree that animals don't have intelligence. First, humans are animals. Second, intelligence is a spectrum. A thing of degrees. The kind of functional intelligence an animal has depends on where it is on the scale, corresponding with the type of creature it is and what kind of aggregate of processing its brain must do in order to manage their exponentially more complex functions.

    I don't think the scientific method can explain them. Why? Because (1) the scientific method only applies to theories that can, in principle, be falsified by empirical evidence, and (2) there is no way, in principle, to get empirical evidence about the ideas that exist in a person's mind.

    To clarify #2, we can measure brain waves and stuff, but that can't be used to determine what ideas exist in a mind.

    Not yet at least. I'm fairly confident I'll live to see the day where we can, though. Where we map the functional state of a brain and record exactly what's happening. I mean, even if we have some kind of internal recorder that can be viewed real-time or played back later. We can already record the visuals and sounds. It doesn't seem so impossible to record a fuller experience eventually, with scents, touch, whatever sensory and chemical soup we are immersed in that comprises an experience.

    I hope so anyway. How can we ever hope to understand the grander mysteries of the workings of the universe if we can't understand a flash-in-the-pan ape species on a small backwater planet in one average galaxy?

    Ishina, you said that it doesn't make sense to talk about human romantic love in terms of biology. I agree. But then you said that we will be able to explain it by the scientific method, which I think is a contradiction. IF we will be able to explain it with the scientific method, THEN it makes sense to talk about it in terms of biology.

    Well, no, because biology is not the only scientific discipline. Geology and rock formation can be studied with the scientific method, but it doesn't make sense to talk about it in terms of biology. It doesn't make sense to talk about nuclear physics in terms of biology. Biology has its scope. I'm not saying that biology has nothing to do with love. I'm saying its a thing that, if it is to be studied and mapped with the scientific method, would span multiple disciplines, not just biology. Love is an aggregate of processes, not all biological. Applying just the narrow scope of biology would be to miss the bigger picture.

    Too fucking busy, and vice versa.
  • Love at first sight
     Reply #22 - February 09, 2014, 03:49 AM

    "Love at first sight" is an idea that I can only make sense of with reference to confirmation bias.

    Taken literally, to love someone the first time one sees them, it's generally an idea that one wouldn't admit to unless one is already in some sort of committed relationship with that person. To admit to such a feeling about another person, only on the basis of a temporary visual encounter, would indicate a level of capriciousness and whimsy to one's conception of love, thus cheapening the ultimate experience.

    In order to confirm such a hypothesis, one only has to look back at the various infatuations that one has had, and remember the exact moment that those infatuations were broken when actual evidence of experience of that person changed your conception of them. One never looks back at such circumstances and calls that first moment of infatuation "love at first sight", but if  we're truly being honest with ourselves, we tend to find that the other more successful connections start with the same feelings of infatuation.

    I believe in lust at first sight, but not love.


    Well, it's true wouldn't you say? You can have instant chemistry with someone, but love? Love grows over time.


    Basically, if you want to tl;dr my post, these ones would apply.  Tongue

    how fuck works without shit??


    Let's Play Chess!

    harakaat, friend, RIP
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