The Quran in English

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- yeezevee
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The Quran in English
Reply #30 - September 11, 2014, 04:12 PM

Quote from: shaytanshoes on September 11, 2014, 03:53 PM
Thanks for the links. The usual PDF links already prove a lot for me to digest while most of these books are far beyond my abilities. Pardon me for saying this but I wish these scholars could write for the average reader instead of for fellow linguists and historians. Then the average wishy-washy Muslim might realize enough to tip him/her over to the side of reason.

The books on Islamic history and analysis of early Islam & Islamic history is NOT for average wishy-washy Muslim shaytanshoes., They are for Islamic Intellectuals who write books

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But then again, looking at the sheer number and political power of Christian and Jewish fundamentalists all over the world, I'm not so sure. Both faiths have had their texts researched from a secular angle for lots longer yet there are still people who believe their holy book came down inerrant from heaven.

well in comparison to Muslim Secularists., I think Christian and Jewish secular academics have done a stellar job. They freely criticize in their respective religious environment unlike in so-called Islamic nations. And they do it without getting threats and death threats... on the other hand if you are a Muslim and criticize anything in Islam in any country with greater than 80% Muslims, you are putting your head in front in front of Russian roulette

on that note that Somalian born Ayaan Hirsi Ali said this

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BnARvLa3Pd8

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-N3SXqfweYA

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YWw5x_MB3lI

Do not let silence become your legacy.. Question everything
I renounced my faith to become a kafir,
the beloved betrayed me and turned in to a Muslim
- shaytanshoes
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The Quran in English
Reply #31 - September 11, 2014, 04:38 PM

Yeah, you're right about criticizing Islam, it's fine doing it from London but suicidal if you're in Lahore. That said, Christian fundies hold a lot of wealth and political power in the US, and they still teach their kids the divine nature of the Bible despite more than century's worth of scholarship refuting that. And Creationist cretins disputing evolution, geology and pretty much all science... urgh.

Carl Sagan wrote about using knowledge to combat superstition, although he didn't quite target religion. Richard Dawkins did, although his focus on genetics and evolution was more to combat Christian creationists than Islam in general. Now we need someone crazy and brave enough to write a book refuting the divine origin or even assumed historicity of the Qur'an, aimed right at the Muslim masses trying to reconcile the 21st century with the 7th.
- yeezevee
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The Quran in English
Reply #32 - September 11, 2014, 05:35 PM

Quote from: shaytanshoes on September 11, 2014, 04:38 PM
..............Now we need someone crazy and brave enough to write a book refuting the divine origin or even assumed historicity of the Qur'an, aimed right at the Muslim masses trying to reconcile the 21st century with the 7th.............

Well we need more than a book., In fact there are plenty of them already.. What we need is "Protection" Protection for freedom of expression from All countries and all governments that are the members of UN ..

Any ways going to the subject The Quran in English and Zaotar's point
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"The Arabic of the Qur’ān is certainly not identical with Classical Arabic "

let me add the link of that book from pseudonym author Christoph Luxenberg..

The Syro-Aramaic Reading of the Koran: A Contribution to the Decoding of the Language of the Koran

that is 175 pages of free controversial book useful addition to this ... Arabics of Quran..

Do not let silence become your legacy.. Question everything
I renounced my faith to become a kafir,
the beloved betrayed me and turned in to a Muslim
- moi
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The Quran in English
Reply #33 - September 12, 2014, 11:22 AM

Is anyone attempting this for the koran?

http://www.scripture4all.org/OnlineInterlinear/NTpdf/mat1.pdf

But a far more complex version showing the possible variations of the text and the possible translations of that text.

My first impression is that we are nowhere near that!

We only have some texts whose meaning is amazingly variable dependent on the assumptions made about things that are not there.

When you are a Bear of Very Little Brain, and you Think of Things, you find sometimes that a Thing which seemed very Thingish inside you is quite different when it gets out into the open and has other people looking at it.

A.A. Milne,

"We cannot slaughter each other out of the human impasse"
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