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- Zimriel
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Reply #960 - August 27, 2016, 12:24 AM

Zeca: excellent find in Sijpesteijn. The explicit word "Mecca" is not in the papyrus, but since the text clearly alludes to sura 22 it's unlikely to be any other pilgrimage. (Nitpick, I object to her assumption p. 188 that Q. 9:3 is Muhammadan; the papyrus anyway doesn't allude to that but only to sura 22.)

Personally I think pilgrims went to Mecca before that. The "day of reckoning" (yawm al-hisâbi) is mentioned in a graffito inscribed on the Meccan route datable to 80 AH. The basis for the "day of reckoning" is Q. 14:44-51, which mentions the Day (...blah blah blah...) concluding "God be swift in reckoning"; sura 14 elsewhere refers to a Divine House far from civilisation. Sura 14 doesn't emphasise the pilgrimage - it just talks of taking refuge AFAIK - but clearly some Muslims had got it into their heads by 700 CE that pilgrimage was worth the trip.
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Reply #961 - August 27, 2016, 11:37 AM

Quote from: Zimriel on August 27, 2016, 12:24 AM
Zeca: excellent find in Sijpesteijn. The explicit word "Mecca" is not in the papyrus, but since the text clearly alludes to sura 22 it's unlikely to be any other pilgrimage. (Nitpick, I object to her assumption p. 188 that Q. 9:3 is Muhammadan; the papyrus anyway doesn't allude to that but only to sura 22.)

Personally I think pilgrims went to Mecca before that. The "day of reckoning" (yawm al-hisâbi) is mentioned in a graffito inscribed on the Meccan route datable to 80 AH. The basis for the "day of reckoning" is Q. 14:44-51, which mentions the Day (...blah blah blah...) concluding "God be swift in reckoning"; sura 14 elsewhere refers to a Divine House far from civilisation. Sura 14 doesn't emphasise the pilgrimage - it just talks of taking refuge AFAIK - but clearly some Muslims had got it into their heads by 700 CE that pilgrimage was worth the trip.

interesting post from Zimriel on Mecca and pilgrims but my problem is I didn't get the gist of his post on that Early History of Islam reference .. Zimriel I am curious here ., would you take that Islamic-awareness.org story as authentic early history of Islam? I think this so-called Mecca and pilgrims is nothing to do with Muhammad and Islam but it is pre-islamic pagan ritual ..

Anyway let me add pdf of this wonderful book Pilgrimage: From the Ganges to Graceland : an Encyclopedia it is great book on All FAITHS and their stupid rituals and the origin of these irrational repetitive ritual nonsense from faith heads in the name of some god/goddess/allah/voodoo dolls/ and on the stories such as Stoning of the Devil .... annual Islamic Hajj pilgrimage .....holy doll city Mecca ..

Please DOWNLOAD THE BOOK PDF file ASAP before the link disappears .,

Anyway on that stoning., news says Haj stoning period to be shortened

stupid people get killed in these stupid ritual across the globe and in modern days with a very large population, these governments and the cronies around these crooks are happy to make tons of money on these stupid rituals
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Some notable incidents of Hajj

July 2, 1990: A stampede inside a pedestrian tunnel (Al-Ma'aisim tunnel) leading out from Mecca towards Mina and the Plains of Arafat led to the deaths of 1,426 pilgrims, many of them of Malaysian, Indonesian and Pakistani origin.

May 23, 1994: A stampede killed at least 270 pilgrims at the stoning of the Devil ritual.

April 9, 1998: at least 118 pilgrims were trampled to death and 180 injured in an incident on Jamaraat Bridge.

March 5, 2001: 35 pilgrims were trampled to death in a stampede during the stoning of the Devil ritual.

February 11, 2003: The stoning of the Devil ritual claimed 14 pilgrims' lives.

February 1, 2004: 251 pilgrims were killed and another 244 injured in a stampede during the stoning ritual in Mina.

January 12, 2006: A stampede during the stoning of the Devil on the last day of the Hajj in Mina killed at least 346 pilgrims and injured at least 289 more. The incident occurred shortly after 13:00 local time, when a busload of travelers arrived together at the eastern access ramps to the Jamaraat Bridge. This caused pilgrims to trip, rapidly resulting in a lethal stampede. An estimated two million people were performing the ritual at the time.

September 24, 2015: At least 2,236 pilgrims were killed during a stampede. The Saudi government is yet to release an official report. A few weeks after the incident, the Saudi Vice Minister of Health officially announced 4,173 people dead in this incident in a press release, however, this page was removed from the website within three hours and requesting it would redirect the visitor to the home page. The Saudi Health Minister claimed that the published death toll was false in a Twitter post. Fars News, a semi-official news agency of Iran, provided a walkthrough video to accessing the page assuming it was out of reach due to high page requests. An AP report compiled from official reports and statements totaled the deaths at at least 1,470, over 700 more than the figures from Saudi authorities, and the worst toll so far in Mecca. The AP later updated its estimate to 2,411 pilgrims killed

stupid people silly rituals... anyways that is a great book., thanks to Linda Kay Davidson, ‎David Martin Gitlitz for collecting the info and printing that book., it is indeed an encyclopedia of so-called pilgrimage., WHICH I CALL IT AS "STUPID RITUALS" across the globe that born out of the brains of smart faith heads..

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Reply #962 - August 27, 2016, 02:55 PM

yeez:
Quote
Zimriel I am curious here ., would you take that Islamic-awareness.org story as authentic early history of Islam? I think this so-called Mecca and pilgrims is nothing to do with Muhammad and Islam but it is pre-islamic pagan ritual ..

As of 80/700 sura 14 (and sura 22) weren't attached to Muhammad. Those suras don't mention him; they just mention Abraham. In fact sura 14 makes no sense in the context of the Sira; in the Sira, Muhammad flees away from Mecca, not toward it. (I've said this a lot.)

To address another question you've asked, by 80/700 the Hajj is already being attached to Biblical figures, not pagan. The inscription here in alluding to sura 14 applies its (Abrahamic) teachings to another figure, the Jewish king David. So I don't know if Mecca was pagan originally; in Sijpesteijn's context it was already Abrahamic and had been for some years already.

I believe they were Divine messages delivered to the qurra'. The Prophet's role in (what would later become) Islam was to announce the era in which God would intervene more directly in history. This evolved from original Islam wherein the Prophet was announcing the end of all mortal eras (Paul Casanova, another guy I mention a lot here).

As for the Islamic-Awareness story's authenticity, the people over there have all the ethics of a weasel caught in a hen house. They deliberately slide over that the inscription is not the verse Q. 38:26 as seen in our Qur'an, although it's very similar - some words are different, like some words on the Dome of the Rock's parallels to suras 3 and 19 differ from them. The verse and their "translation" of the inscription say fa-ohkum (judge, David!); the carving says litahkuma (so that you, David, may judge). But since the rock carving itself *is* different and since they *did* have to lie about what it says, the carving itself is probably real.
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Reply #963 - August 28, 2016, 09:42 AM

Quote from: Zimriel on August 27, 2016, 02:55 PM
yeez:As of 80/700 sura 14 (and sura 22) weren't attached to Muhammad. Those suras don't mention him; they just mention Abraham. In fact sura 14 makes no sense in the context of the Sira; in the Sira, Muhammad flees away from Mecca, not toward it. (I've said this a lot.)

To address another question you've asked, by 80/700 the Hajj is already being attached to Biblical figures, not pagan. The inscription here in alluding to sura 14 applies its (Abrahamic) teachings to another figure, the Jewish king David. So I don't know if Mecca was pagan originally; in Sijpesteijn's context it was already Abrahamic and had been for some years already.

Quote
I believe they were Divine messages delivered to the qurra'. The Prophet's role in (what would later become) Islam was to announce the era in which God would intervene more directly in history. This evolved from original Islam wherein the Prophet was announcing the end of all mortal eras (Paul Casanova, another guy I mention a lot here).

As for the Islamic-Awareness story's authenticity, the people over there have all the ethics of a weasel caught in a hen house. They deliberately slide over that the inscription is not the verse Q. 38:26 as seen in our Qur'an, although it's very similar - some words are different, like some words on the Dome of the Rock's parallels to suras 3 and 19 differ from them. The verse and their "translation" of the inscription say fa-ohkum (judge, David!); the carving says litahkuma (so that you, David, may judge). But since the rock carving itself *is* different and since they *did* have to lie about what it says, the carving itself is probably real.

well most of what you said., I may argue with you a bit and I might agree with some of your points., but those highlighted words are questionable dear Zimriel and I agree to disagree with those words..

with best regards
yeezevee

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Reply #964 - August 28, 2016, 12:41 PM

The more fun question of the Petra M. Sijpesteijn paper is : "Why did the caliph need to announce that it was time to undertake the pilgrimage?"
Petra M. Sijpesteijn does not understand the caliph statement. Because she believes that " The ḥajj, after all, takes place every year on the same dates of the lunar calendar, namely during a five-day period from the eighth to the twelfth of the last lunar month of the Muslim calendar, Dhū ’l-ḥijja." which is what we are told by later historiographers who believes themselves that the story of Islam was what they were told, namely and in short : The Prophet Muhammad born in Mecca dead in Medina established the true religion with divine revelation consigned in the book, the Quran, and all the rituals ad hoc since 632 and all of this is very known by the believers.
Problem here is that the papyrus shows that Arab ruling élite does not know the basic framework of their religion because they need to be informed of it. Therefore, it does not fit with the traditional account. Of course, Petra M. Sijpesteijn begins to search anachronistic explanations 400 years later, because the traditional account soldier has to be saved as she believes in good faith in it, but that should convince only those already convinced of it...
Then what believe ? The papyrus and its consequences, or the traditional account ?
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Reply #965 - August 31, 2016, 09:22 AM

i find it hard to believe all this complex layers of hadith and historiography about mecca is a pure imagination of later Muslim generation, and now it seems we have an early documentary evidence that some Muslims in Egypt indeed has taken the hadji, i don't see what's the big deal with this.

i understand the reason my be theological ? if early Islam was simply another christian sect, we would expect to make pilgrim to Jerusalem not mecca,

but honestly who know what was early Islam ? unfortunately secular studies have not yet produce an alternative plausible explanation.
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Reply #966 - August 31, 2016, 11:31 AM

Quote from: hatoush on August 31, 2016, 09:22 AM
i find it hard to believe all this complex layers of hadith and historiography about mecca is a pure imagination of later Muslim generation, and now it seems we have an early documentary evidence that some Muslims in Egypt indeed has taken the hadji, i don't see what's the big deal with this.

i understand the reason my be theological ? if early Islam was simply another christian sect, we would expect to make pilgrim to Jerusalem not mecca,

but honestly who know what was early Islam ? unfortunately secular studies have not yet produce an alternative plausible explanation.

hatoush puts out an interesting statemen., "Muslims in Egypt indeed has taken the hadji" ..... and hadji in an interesting word .. and what is the big deal??

Islamisation of Egyptian population gives an important insight how little we know about early Islam and early Islamic history hatoush .. when we look in to the classical Islamic history what is taught and what we know

Quote
632: Death of the Holy Prophet.Election of Hadrat Abu Bakr as the Caliph. Usamah leads expedition to Syria. Battles of Zu Qissa and Abraq. Battles of Buzakha, Zafar and Naqra. Campaigns against Bani Tamim and Musailima, the Liar.
633: Campaigns in Bahrain, Oman, Mahrah Yemen, and Hadramaut. Raids in Iraq. Battles of Kazima, Mazar, Walaja, Ulleis, Hirah, Anbar, Ein at tamr, Daumatul Jandal and Firaz.
634: Battles of Basra, Damascus and Ajnadin. Death of Hadrat Abu Bakr. Hadrat Umar Farooq becomes the Caliph. Battles of Namaraq and Saqatia.
635: Battle of Bridge. Battle of Buwaib. Conquest of Damascus. Battle of Fahl.
636: Battle of Yermuk. Battle of Qadsiyia. Conquest of Madain.
637: Conquest of Syria. Fall of Jerusalem. Battle of Jalula.
638: Conquest of Jazirah.
639: Conquest of Khuizistan. Advance into Egypt.
640: Capture of the post of Caesaria in Syria. Conquest of Shustar and Jande Sabur in Persia. Battle of Babylon in Egypt.
641: Battle of Nihawand. Conquest Of Alexandria in Egypt.
642: Battle of Rayy in Persia. Conquest of Egypt. Foundation of Fustat.
643: Conquest of Azarbaijan and Tabaristan (Russia).
644: Conquest of Fars, Kerman, Sistan, Mekran and Kharan.[/u] Martyrdom of Hadrat Umar. Hadrat Othman becomes the Caliph.
645: Campaigns in Fats.
646: Campaigns in Khurasan, Armeain and Asia Minor.
647: Campaigns in North Africa. Conquest of the island of Cypress.
648: Campaigns against the Byzantines.
651: Naval battle of the Masts against the Byzantines.
652: Discontentment and disaffection against the rule of Hadrat Othman.
656: Martyrdom of Hadrat Othman. Hadrat Ali becomes the Caliph. Battle of the Camel.
657: Hadrat Ali shifts the capital from Madina to Kufa. Battle of Siffin. Arbitration proceedings at Daumaut ul Jandal.
658: Battle of Nahrawan.
659: Conquest of Egypt by Mu'awiyah.
660: Hadrat Ali recaptures Hijaz and Yemen from Mu'awiyah. Mu'awiyah declares himself as the Caliph at Damascus.
661: Martyrdom of Hadrat Ali. Accession of Hadrat Hasan and his abdication. Mu'awiyah becomes the sole Caliph.

with in 30 years of alleged Prophet's death Egypt, Syria, has already became centers of Islamic ..In other words The Islamic Map in the year alleged Prophet of Islam died looked like this

and with in 10 years of Prophet's death the map looked like this

The beauty and power of Islamic conquests unlike fore.g., Alexander the great whatever nations and cultures converted to Islam STAYED AS ISLAMIC NATIONS TILL TO THIS DAY.. the exception being Spain ..

so with that., I am watching The present Islamic hero who tells the story of early history of Islam ......Dr Yasir Qadhi ...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5hL-DjnxoDw

you can watch hrs and hours of his Islamic history presentations at this tube link
Quote
https://www.youtube.com/results?q=Islamic+Conquest+Dr+Yasir+Qadhi

Now a person like American Trump could ask American a Question .. If Islamic Caliph conquers US of A in west and Russia in East ... how much time does it take to make rest of the globe to become Islamic? and what actually do any one means When he/she says "The country Now is an Islamic nation"?

Dr Yasir Qadhi .. Abu Ammaar Yasir Qadhi is a great guy ..great amerikan.. great Islamic historian.. Off course we are not living in 7th century but Islamic idiots without knowing "what Islam was and what Islam supposed to be " can take few countries and half of the population of planet to middle ages

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Reply #967 - September 01, 2016, 10:25 AM

Travis Zadeh - Qur'anic Studies and the Literary Turn

https://www.academia.edu/27570852/_Qurʾānic_Studies_and_the_Literary_Turn_Journal_of_the_American_Oriental_Society_135.2_2014_329_42

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Reply #968 - September 02, 2016, 07:35 PM

I suspect the usual objections to the idea of Jewish Christianity as an influence on early Islam apply here.

Francisco del Río Sánchez - "Jewish-Christianity" and Islamic Origins. The transformation of a peripheral religious movement?

http://www.academia.edu/17849978/Paper_draft_Jewish-Christianity_and_Islamic_Origins._The_transformation_of_a_peripheral_religious_movement

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Reply #969 - September 02, 2016, 09:36 PM

Zeca: you and the other Z's on here make life so much more interesting. I'm so glad you're still around. I will catch up on your nuggets of insight in the coming days

Hi
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Reply #970 - September 02, 2016, 10:00 PM

Hi Musivore, welcome back.

-----

Sean Anthony - The letters of 'Urwah Ibn Al-Zubayr: the earliest corpus of traditions on the life of the prophet Muhammad

https://www.academia.edu/27960626/THE_LETTERS_OF_ʿURWAH_IBN_AL-ZUBAYR_d._ca._93-94_711-13_The_earliest_corpus_of_traditions_on_the_life_of_the_Prophet_Muḥammad

But see also

Stephen Shoemaker - In Search of ʿUrwa’s Sīra: Some Methodological Issues in the Quest for "Authenticity" in the Life of Muḥammad

http://www.academia.edu/1057322/In_Search_of_ʿUrwa_s_Sīra_Some_Methodological_Issues_in_the_Quest_for_Authenticity_in_the_Life_of_Muḥammad

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Reply #971 - September 03, 2016, 10:39 AM

Sean Anthony and Kecia Ali on Aisha's age:

https://mobile.twitter.com/shahanSean/status/771897112002981892

https://mobile.twitter.com/shahanSean/status/771901899196989441
Quote from: Kecia Ali
@shahanSean @iandavidmorris I ask for a citation to a premodern Arabic source every time someone offers me a revised age. Never once got it.

@shahanSean @iandavidmorris Having said that, I find myself increasingly interested in what work those ages do in their original texts.

Quote from: Sean Anthony
@kecia_ali @iandavidmorris Exactly ! Why do they think we'd care how old she was anyway? No one asks that far more interesting question.

Edited to avoid misunderstanding:

These are late additions to a twitter thread from Ian David Morris responding to a dubious claim by Asma Afsaruddin about what the tradition says about Aisha's age. The full thread is here: https://mobile.twitter.com/iandavidmorris/status/764455352289136640
The point isn't that what the sources say is true - in my opinion there's no real reason to believe in their historical accuracy. It's that you can't make them say something they don't actually say, or that you'd like them to say.

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Reply #972 - September 03, 2016, 11:10 AM

Quote from: zeca on September 03, 2016, 10:39 AM
Sean Anthony and Kecia Ali on Aisha's age:

https://mobile.twitter.com/shahanSean/status/771897112002981892

https://mobile.twitter.com/shahanSean/status/771901899196989441

Quote
Quote from: Sean Anthony
@kecia_ali @iandavidmorris Exactly Smiley ! Why do they think we'd care how old she was anyway? No one asks that far more interesting question.

Well Professor Sean Anthony is not using his brain when he says that but..but Professor Kecia Ali a convert to Islam and she never faced anything like 53 year old marrying 8/9 year old ., She at best know/heard pedophilia characters in her earlier faith.. ISLAM HAS NO PEDOPHILIA ... it is a marriage for life ..only thing is bride is 8 or 9 and bridegroom is 53... .. Age of bride is irrelevant in Islam..she just need to be matured and should have knowledge of a professor ..

So she being converted Islamic Scholar and other one being a expert/enquirer of history of Islam have problems with each other in understanding of Islam and Islamic history.

incidentally THERE IS NO AISHA IN QURAN.. hence I reject she is an important person in Islam.. in fact she was one among many manufactured characters of Islam by some stupid earlier Islamic story tellers

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Reply #973 - September 03, 2016, 11:24 AM

Yeez - have you actually bothered to read the twitter thread?

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Reply #974 - September 03, 2016, 11:38 AM

Quote from: zeca on September 03, 2016, 11:24 AM
Yeez - have you actually bothered to read the twitter thread?

Nope zeca I didn't i only read this from your link

Quote
Kecia Ali ‏@kecia_ali
@shahanSean @iandavidmorris Having said that, I find myself increasingly interested in what work those ages do in their original texts.
Sean W. Anthony

8h8 hours ago
Sean W. Anthony ‏@shahanSean
@kecia_ali @iandavidmorris Exactly ! Why do they think we'd care how old she was anyway? No one asks that far more interesting question.

and I am NOT interested in tit for tat tit-bits on important subjects., I am actually allergic to such twitter discussion on important subjects., I like books and articles and so called scriptures, early religious literature/religious stories on faiths from faith heads as well as from PROFESSORS

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Reply #975 - September 03, 2016, 12:00 PM

Seriously, do read the twitter thread - you're misinterpreting what Kecia Ali and Sean Anthony are saying.

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Reply #976 - September 03, 2016, 12:44 PM

Quote from: zeca on September 03, 2016, 12:00 PM
Seriously, do read the twitter thread - you're misinterpreting what Kecia Ali and Sean Anthony are saying.

what did they write on Islam? and what are they saying on twitter ? and what did I misrepresent what they are saying on Islam dear zeca .. but i will read that twitter because you are suggesting me to read before i write ..

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Reply #977 - September 03, 2016, 01:47 PM

Quote from: zeca on September 03, 2016, 10:39 AM
https://mobile.twitter.com/shahanSean/status/771901899196989441

I have long thought that Aisha's age was probably given as so young because it helped invoke her authority as a factional weapon during the late 7th century disputes and beyond. It was a way to claim a continuing direct first-person connection to the prophet's life, through Aisha's proclamations, at a relatively late juncture, connecting later figures with the prophet.
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Reply #978 - September 03, 2016, 05:01 PM

Quote from: yeezevee on September 03, 2016, 12:44 PM
what did they write on Islam? and what are they saying on twitter ? and what did I misrepresent what they are saying on Islam dear zeca .. but i will read that twitter because you are suggesting me to read before i write ..

Yeez - I've edited my original post so hopefully it's a bit clearer.

And what Zaotar says.

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Reply #979 - September 03, 2016, 05:18 PM

Quote from: zeca on September 03, 2016, 05:01 PM
Yeez - I've edited my original post so hopefully it's a bit clearer.

And what Zaotar says.

no..no.. I am sorry to disappoint you. I am not that smart to understand what academics in religious departments who are faculty members and trying to publish for the sake of their jobs on faiths., specially Islamic faith and its early history dear zeca. Off course there are exceptions to that rule., such as that wonderful Dr. Patricia Crone .. here I reject Zaotar's assumption/proposal

Quote from: Zaotar on September 03, 2016, 01:47 PM
I have long thought that Aisha's age was probably given as so young because it helped invoke her authority as a factional weapon during the late 7th century disputes and beyond. It was a way to claim a continuing direct first-person connection to the prophet's life, through Aisha's proclamations, at a relatively late juncture, connecting later figures with the prophet.

because I reject Aisha character in Islam. But on that Twitter I still have to read the works of converted professor Kecia Ali and dr. Sean Anthony on Islam/Islamic history..

any links on what they did ?? I read Kecia Ali book.....

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Reply #980 - September 03, 2016, 05:32 PM

I'm never quite sure if you are a genius or a complete idiot, Yeezy.
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Reply #981 - September 03, 2016, 05:34 PM

Quote from: Hassan on September 03, 2016, 05:32 PM
I'm never quite sure if you are a genius or a complete idiot, Yeezy.

well I am quite sure about that 2nd one Hassan

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Reply #982 - September 03, 2016, 05:38 PM

Quote from: yeezevee on September 03, 2016, 05:18 PM
I still have to read the works of converted professor Kecia Ali and dr. Sean Anthony on Islam/Islamic history..

any links on what they did ?? I read Kecia Ali book.....

Sean Anthony's articles on academia.edu: http://osu.academia.edu/SeanAnthony

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Reply #983 - September 03, 2016, 05:40 PM

Quote from: zeca on September 03, 2016, 05:38 PM
Sean Anthony's articles on academia.edu: http://osu.academia.edu/SeanAnthony

thanks ....

https://nelc.osu.edu/sites/nelc.osu.edu/files/cvSWAnthony.pdf

how about that converted professor Kecia Ali's work?

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Reply #984 - September 03, 2016, 05:49 PM

An old thread on Kecia Ali: http://www.councilofexmuslims.com/index.php?topic=27898.0

I haven't found much else that's freely available online.

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Reply #985 - September 03, 2016, 06:19 PM

Quote from: zeca on September 03, 2016, 05:49 PM
An old thread on Kecia Ali: http://www.councilofexmuslims.com/index.php?topic=27898.0

I haven't found much else that's freely available online.

zeca I posted more posts on her and her work than any one here in this forum as well as in other forums..

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Reply #986 - September 05, 2016, 01:46 PM

This link, posted by Yeez on the other thread, is interesting. I think there are parallels here between early Muslim and early Protestant opposition to monasticism and priestly celibacy

Kecia Ali - Virtue and Danger: Sexuality and Prophetic Norms in Muslim Life and Thought

http://irdialogue.org/wp-content/uploads/2009/10/Ali-JIRD-Oct-2009.pdf

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Reply #987 - September 05, 2016, 01:56 PM

Hello zeca I wonder about this book.. http://www.khi.fi.it/4853342/di_cesare_image_muhammad

I wonder whteher you have read it or read excerpts or some one's comment on it??

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Qur'anic studies today
Reply #988 - September 05, 2016, 02:07 PM

It's new to me but there's a review of it here: http://www.academia.edu/5110689/MICHELINA_DI_CESARE_The_Pseudo-Historical_Image_of_the_Prophet_Muhammad_in_Medieval_Latin_Literature._A_Repertory._Berlin_Boston_De_Gruyter_2012_XIII-541

Another review: http://www.academia.edu/1623746/Review_of_Michelina_DI_CESARE_The_Pseudo-Historical_Image_of_the_Prophet_Muhammad_2011_

Some author details: https://sites.google.com/site/archeologiaislamica/assegnisti/michelina-di-cesare

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- yeezevee
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Qur'anic studies today
Reply #989 - September 05, 2016, 02:16 PM

Quote from: zeca on September 05, 2016, 02:07 PM
It's new to me but there's a review of it here: http://www.academia.edu/5110689/MICHELINA_DI_CESARE_The_Pseudo-Historical_Image_of_the_Prophet_Muhammad_in_Medieval_Latin_Literature._A_Repertory._Berlin_Boston_De_Gruyter_2012_XIII-541

thanks..

Quote

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The Shari’a Project: A UK-Netherlands Network of scholars devoted to Islamic legal studies
Third Workshop, Friday 15th
-Saturday 16th November 2013
Leiden University, The Netherlands
Supported by the AHRC (of the UK), NWO (of the Netherlands) and The Leiden University Centre for Islam and Society]

http://media.leidenuniv.nl/legacy/sharia-project---3rd-workshop-programme-nieuw.pdf

Keynote speaker Ke_cia Ali

Do not let silence become your legacy.. Question everything
I renounced my faith to become a kafir,
the beloved betrayed me and turned in to a Muslim
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