Quran 24.31

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- TheRationalizer
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Quran 24.31
OP - April 20, 2015, 09:48 AM

The English translations of 24.31 say women can only expose themselves in front of "[relatives].....or their women attendants or captives, or male attendants who do not have any need (for women), or boys not yet aware of sex"

These people on Twitter are claiming it is not in the Arabic.
https://twitter.com/GodelFermat/status/590084588418035712

I can't see how they are correct. Can I have your thoughts please?

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http://www.councilofexmuslims.com/index.php?topic=30785
- Sachi
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Quran 24.31
Reply #1 - April 20, 2015, 02:10 PM

I have lack of Arabic knowledge but... Literally all of those translations specify the genders to whom women can expose themselves and what not. What is that girl talking about...

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- countjulian
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Reply #2 - April 20, 2015, 07:04 PM

Quote from: TheRationalizer on April 20, 2015, 09:48 AM
The English translations of 24.31 say women can only expose themselves in front of "[relatives].....or their women attendants or captives, or male attendants who do not have any need (for women), or boys not yet aware of sex"

These people on Twitter are claiming it is not in the Arabic.

"No,
according to the verse in front of her slave mature or immature,
there is no specification."

I can't see how they are correct. Can I have your thoughts please?

This does not seem to be correct. The Arabic has it

التابعين غير اولي الاربة من الرجال

I am not familiar with the phrase "ghayr uli alarba min ar -rijaal" but it sounds sexual lol. Quran.com translates it as "those male attendants having no physical desire." I will look up the word "arbala" in the dictionary when I get home tonight.

إطلب العلم ولو في الصين

Es sitzt keine Krone so fest und so hoch,
Der mutige Springer erreicht sie doch.

I don't give a fuck about your war, or your President.
- countjulian
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Reply #3 - April 20, 2015, 07:11 PM

Corpus Coranicum has it as "den männlichen Bediensteten (w. Gefolgsleuten) die keinen (Geschlechts) trieb (mehr) haben," which is in English "male Servants (literally following people) who have no (sex) drive (anymore)."

http://www.corpuscoranicum.de/kontexte/index?sure=24&vers=31&anzeigen=Anzeigen

إطلب العلم ولو في الصين

Es sitzt keine Krone so fest und so hoch,
Der mutige Springer erreicht sie doch.

I don't give a fuck about your war, or your President.
- countjulian
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Quran 24.31
Reply #4 - April 20, 2015, 07:35 PM

Honestly sounds to me like the Quran is talking about and implicitly allowing the practice of eunuchs. So it's OK to be naked in front of a slave as long as he is a very young boy or a eunuch lol. That girl is trying to use the Arabic to block the Quran from criticism in English.

إطلب العلم ولو في الصين

Es sitzt keine Krone so fest und so hoch,
Der mutige Springer erreicht sie doch.

I don't give a fuck about your war, or your President.
- zeca
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Reply #5 - April 20, 2015, 07:47 PM

My immediate assumption was that it was referring to eunuchs. Presumably their existence would just have been an accepted part of life at the time.

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- cosmicdancer
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Reply #6 - May 24, 2015, 09:44 AM

Just saw this. According to what I know from tafseers it means a simpleton. La irba means no wits. It can also mean no desire. So could I guess refer to eunuchs but eunuchs I don't ever rember such a tafseer.

I don't have access to a computer for a week. Just my mobile so will check when I get back.
- zeca
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Reply #7 - May 24, 2015, 09:50 AM

^Could this be a case of later interpretation contradicting what the Qur'an actually says? In the context of late antiquity I'd have thought eunuch would be a more likely meaning. Maybe it's more useful to think about the Qur'an as a pre-Islamic text - something written in the world of the late Roman Near East before Islam as we know it really existed.

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- cosmicdancer
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Reply #8 - May 24, 2015, 10:31 AM

Yes it could quite easily be that. It is something worth looking into.
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