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 Topic: Blatant misogyny in Islam is what is making me question it.

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  • Blatant misogyny in Islam is what is making me question it.
     Reply #120 - August 19, 2015, 01:16 AM
    Quote from: AGirlWithDoubts on August 19, 2015, 12:56 AM
    Right now it seems to be appealing to the perversions of men. I'm finding it hard to figure out what's in it for us.

    Obviously there are good things about islam. It would be simply untrue to say it's all bad, but it's a religion not only created in but fixed to the social customs and norms of dark age arabia. People like Hassan are obviously reinterpreting it to fit with the 21st century and hopefully that will catch on.

    Quote from: AGirlWithDoubts on August 19, 2015, 12:56 AM
    Your step dad is an non-Muslim? Does that apply to most of you family, if you don't mind me asking?

    No one in my family is muslim. I suppose you could say I come from a Roman Catholic background, but out of the five children my grandparents had, four of them are atheists and the other is more cultural/deist. None of my siblings or cousins are religious in the slightest, though my brother thinks there's some kind of energy. At this point I'm basically from an atheist family.

    Having children and grandchildren with no belief in god had a profound effect on my grandmother. She couldn't rationalize a merciful and just god punishing who she knew were good, decent, kind, honest, loving people with unimaginable torment for all eternity, and before she died she told me she didn't believe in hell. I'm happy she didn't have that fear towards the end.

    It's a pity she couldn't throw the whole thing away. Catholicism is as fucked up as islam when it comes to hell, fear, guilt and shame. You said you're from England, you've probably come across the term "Catholic shame". It's an actual fucking phrase. Cheesy

    I think a large part of her remaining faith was a desire to be reunited with my granddad and uncle. Neither of them ever got over watching their son die of cancer.
    `But I don't want to go among mad people,' Alice remarked.
     `Oh, you can't help that,' said the Cat: `we're all mad here. I'm mad.  You're mad.'
     `How do you know I'm mad?' said Alice.
     `You must be,' said the Cat, `or you wouldn't have come here.'
  • Blatant misogyny in Islam is what is making me question it.
     Reply #121 - August 19, 2015, 01:27 AM
    Quote from: moe78 on August 19, 2015, 01:00 AM
    hi bro! this is someone's comment in the video you posted 8 years ago from the link you posted above.

     OrangeFuzz123 6 months ago
    It's kind of disappointing to find out Hassan has 'rediscovered faith' after all these video's etc. There's nothing more of a turn off than a so called truth seeker flip-flopping back and forth - purely, it seems, on the off chance Hell really does exist. Slightly pathetic.

    did you find your faith again? i am confused lol


    Best to let him speak for himself. You can read his blog until Hassan provides you with a direct answer.

    http://agnosticmuslimkhutbahs.blogspot.co.uk/
  • Blatant misogyny in Islam is what is making me question it.
     Reply #122 - August 19, 2015, 01:34 AM
    What is an Agnostic Muslim?

    http://www.councilofexmuslims.com/index.php?topic=28556.msg815474#msg815474

    Agnostic Muslim Rambling

    http://www.councilofexmuslims.com/index.php?topic=29120.msg829509#msg829509

    Yes I AM a Muslim!!

    http://www.councilofexmuslims.com/index.php?topic=28886.msg824315#msg824315

    Will the "True Islam" Please Stand Up

    http://www.councilofexmuslims.com/index.php?topic=28960.msg826042#msg826042
    `But I don't want to go among mad people,' Alice remarked.
     `Oh, you can't help that,' said the Cat: `we're all mad here. I'm mad.  You're mad.'
     `How do you know I'm mad?' said Alice.
     `You must be,' said the Cat, `or you wouldn't have come here.'
  • Blatant misogyny in Islam is what is making me question it.
     Reply #123 - August 19, 2015, 02:27 AM
    Quote from: moe78 on August 19, 2015, 01:00 AM
    hi bro! this is someone's comment in the video you posted 8 years ago from the link you posted above.

     OrangeFuzz123 6 months ago
    It's kind of disappointing to find out Hassan has 'rediscovered faith' after all these video's etc. There's nothing more of a turn off than a so called truth seeker flip-flopping back and forth - purely, it seems, on the off chance Hell really does exist. Slightly pathetic.

    did you find your faith again? i am confused lol


    Hi moe78,

    You can check out my posts here and my blogs where I have already talked about why I identify now as an Agnostic Muslim several times.

    I see Quod kindly posted some links above.

    BTW the comment you quote is from one of my brothers' comments. Otherwise known as Jack Torrance on this forum. His Youtube channel is the above OrangeFuzz123 channel. But I have a feeling you already know that Wink

    Best wishes.
  • Blatant misogyny in Islam is what is making me question it.
     Reply #124 - August 19, 2015, 08:15 AM
    Quote from: Quod Sum Eris on August 19, 2015, 01:16 AM
    Obviously there are good things about islam. It would be simply untrue to say it's all bad, but it's a religion not only created in but fixed to the social customs and norms of dark age arabia. People like Hassan are obviously reinterpreting it to fit with the 21st century and hopefully that will catch on.
    No one in my family is muslim. I suppose you could say I come from a Roman Catholic background, but out of the five children my grandparents had, four of them are atheists and the other is more cultural/deist. None of my siblings or cousins are religious in the slightest, though my brother thinks there's some kind of energy. At this point I'm basically from an atheist family.

    Having children and grandchildren with no belief in god had a profound effect on my grandmother. She couldn't rationalize a merciful and just god punishing who she knew were good, decent, kind, honest, loving people with unimaginable torment for all eternity, and before she died she told me she didn't believe in hell. I'm happy she didn't have that fear towards the end.

    It's a pity she couldn't throw the whole thing away. Catholicism is as fucked up as islam when it comes to hell, fear, guilt and shame. You said you're from England, you've probably come across the term "Catholic shame". It's an actual fucking phrase. Cheesy

    I think a large part of her remaining faith was a desire to be reunited with my granddad and uncle. Neither of them ever got over watching their son die of cancer.


    Yes, there certainly is. I am just trying to figure out if there is much that women get out of it considering that a lot of the rules are for the benefit of men.

    Oh, interesting, you weren't a Muslim then? I used to attend a Catholic school and would arrogantly tell myself how Christianity makes no sense and Islam was clearly the truth. They're starting to resemble each other more and more every day. I guess one thing that stood out which convinced me it wasn't true was the concept of the Holy Trinity.
  • Blatant misogyny in Islam is what is making me question it.
     Reply #125 - August 19, 2015, 11:09 AM
    If there is a God, AGirlWithDoubts, then he clearly intended the world to be full of questions and doubts and a struggle both physical and spiritual. Because that's the reality of this world when you take a look around. That's simply the way it is!

    There are no easy answers and if there is an ultimate truth out there we for sure can't see it from our human perspective. After all my years of searching I am inclined to think that there is no "Eureka!" moment where absolute truth is discovered and the world can now stop turning because all we have to do is imitate.

    I think we just have to make our own meanings and truths using our heart and mind - as best we can - being honest to ourselves and others and showing love and empathy and charity to our fellow man.

    If there is a God, he couldn't possibly ask much more than that.

    Sounds a little trite - but hey! lol


  • Blatant misogyny in Islam is what is making me question it.
     Reply #126 - August 19, 2015, 11:48 AM
    ^That post inspired me to make a longer on on my Facebook Timeline. I hope you don't mind if I share it here:

    https://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=100006745147497

    Shari'ah Law

    I not only reject the notion that Shari'ah is for all times & all places - I reject the very idea of a "Perfect Divine Law." All laws are human - and very fallible. They always have been and always will be.

    Had God truly wanted to send a detailed legal code on how to live our lives he could have done so quite easily without fuss or confusion. But he didn't. Because that is not the nature of the world he created. God clearly intended the world to be full of questions and doubts and a struggle both physical and spiritual. He intended it to be a world where we have to think for ourselves. Look around you! That's the reality of this world we live in. That's simply the way it is!

    There are no divine "A to Zs" - No handbook on: "How to do Everything Exactly Right!" - No easy answers! If there is an ultimate truth out there, we humans for sure can't see it from our perspective.

    After all my years of searching I am inclined to think that there is no "Eureka!" moment where absolute truth is discovered and the world can now stop turning because all we have to do is imitate.

    We just have to make our own meanings and truths using our heart and mind - as best we can - being honest to ourselves and others and showing love and empathy and charity to our fellow man.

    If there is a God, he couldn't possibly ask much more than that.

    ________________

    (Then I added in a comment)

    Just to add to what I said in my original post:

    I personally doubt the authenticity of ALL the traditional sources of information on Muhammad. I am inclined to think that we actually know very little about the historical Muhammad. However we are not dealing with history or science - we are dealing with people's beliefs and faith. In which case it doesn't really matter how historical any of it is (and as I say I doubt most of it anyway) - because the reality is this is what people use as the basis of their beliefs. I don't think the answer is to search for the "true historical accounts" because you will never find them. The answer is for us to realise that it is we ourselves who shape beliefs and we have the power to change traditional views.

    Smiley
  • Blatant misogyny in Islam is what is making me question it.
     Reply #127 - August 19, 2015, 11:54 AM
    I feel a little uneasy posting these views here as I suppose this is not really the forum for them - so as I mentioned before I will keep it to my Facebook page and just say if anyone is interested in my views to friend me on Facebook - Thanks Smiley

    https://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=100006745147497

    Smiley
  • Blatant misogyny in Islam is what is making me question it.
     Reply #128 - August 19, 2015, 12:02 PM
    Top notch as usual Hassan!  Afro
    Quote from: yeezevee on February 11, 2016, 02:05 PM
    how fuck works without shit??


    Let's Play Chess!

    harakaat, friend, RIP
  • Blatant misogyny in Islam is what is making me question it.
     Reply #129 - August 19, 2015, 12:07 PM
    Quote from: Hassan on August 19, 2015, 11:54 AM
    I feel a little uneasy posting these views here as I suppose this is not really the forum for them - so as I mentioned before I will keep it to my Facebook page and just say if anyone is interested in my views to friend me on Facebook - Thanks Smiley

    https://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=100006745147497

    Smiley


    Don't deny us your wisdom, shaikhna.  Smiley
  • Blatant misogyny in Islam is what is making me question it.
     Reply #130 - August 19, 2015, 12:18 PM
    Thanks HM - I just don't want to come across as being 'preachy' lol

    As Bob Dylan (Peace & Blessings Be Upon Him) said:

    In a soldier’s stance, I aimed my hand
    At the mongrel dogs who teach
    Fearing not that I’d become my enemy
    In the instant that I preach

  • Blatant misogyny in Islam is what is making me question it.
     Reply #131 - August 19, 2015, 12:20 PM
    Don’t worry, we’re all pretty good at cherry-picking the stuff we like and leaving the rest where it is. Grin
  • Blatant misogyny in Islam is what is making me question it.
     Reply #132 - August 19, 2015, 12:29 PM
     Afro
  • Blatant misogyny in Islam is what is making me question it.
     Reply #133 - August 19, 2015, 02:51 PM
    Quote from: Hassan on August 19, 2015, 02:27 AM
    Hi moe78,

    You can check out my posts here and my blogs where I have already talked about why I identify now as an Agnostic Muslim several times.

    I see Quod kindly posted some links above.

    BTW the comment you quote is from one of my brothers' comments. Otherwise known as Jack Torrance on this forum. His Youtube channel is the above OrangeFuzz123 channel. But I have a feeling you already know that Wink

    Best wishes.

    Thank you very much brother hassan Smiley
     I read  few of your posts here  and also  visited your blog before Wink
    I am on a spiritual  journey  and to be honest i feel less happy the more i use my brain lol
    it seems like my thoughts change with time. Sometimes i say to my self islam needs to be reformed by people
    like your self and sometimes i just like not to think about religion at all.
    I am thinking about writing my life story, but then i am a bit lazy due to the fact that english is not my first language which makes it hard for me to even string a sentence without mistakes.
    By the way i was born in 1978 and grew up in algeria during the civil unrest period in one of the most badly effect regions.
    I feel like writing my thoughts and belief for the public to read is like having a tattoo that one may regret further ahead in life because of the changing of thoughts  in once mind.
    I was surprised to find that i shared a lot of your thoughts when i first read your comments/blog Smiley
    Peace.
  • Blatant misogyny in Islam is what is making me question it.
     Reply #134 - August 19, 2015, 03:05 PM
    Quote from: happymurtad on August 19, 2015, 12:07 PM
    Don't deny us your wisdom, shaikhna.  Smiley

    This.
    `But I don't want to go among mad people,' Alice remarked.
     `Oh, you can't help that,' said the Cat: `we're all mad here. I'm mad.  You're mad.'
     `How do you know I'm mad?' said Alice.
     `You must be,' said the Cat, `or you wouldn't have come here.'
  • Blatant misogyny in Islam is what is making me question it.
     Reply #135 - August 19, 2015, 08:26 PM
    Quote from: AGirlWithDoubts on August 19, 2015, 08:15 AM
    Oh, interesting, you weren't a Muslim then? I used to attend a Catholic school and would arrogantly tell myself how Christianity makes no sense and Islam was clearly the truth. They're starting to resemble each other more and more every day. I guess one thing that stood out which convinced me it wasn't true was the concept of the Holy Trinity.

    Well I did take the shahada a few years ago, so I was a muslim for all of three seconds. I also made dua to allah once. Only once mind, and my dua was answered.

    How come the trinity convinced you it was less true?
    `But I don't want to go among mad people,' Alice remarked.
     `Oh, you can't help that,' said the Cat: `we're all mad here. I'm mad.  You're mad.'
     `How do you know I'm mad?' said Alice.
     `You must be,' said the Cat, `or you wouldn't have come here.'
  • Blatant misogyny in Islam is what is making me question it.
     Reply #136 - August 19, 2015, 09:16 PM
    Quote
    Well I did take the shahada a few years ago, so I was a muslim for all of three seconds. I also made dua to allah once. Only once mind, and my dua was answered.

    How come the trinity convinced you it was less true?


    Maybe it's because as a Muslim I was taught that Catholics believe that God is three but also that God is one. Maybe it wasn't explained to me clearly but that was what I understood at the time and it left me confused.
  • Blatant misogyny in Islam is what is making me question it.
     Reply #137 - August 19, 2015, 09:31 PM
    Quote from: Quod Sum Eris on August 19, 2015, 08:26 PM
    Well I did take the shahada a few years ago, so I was a muslim for all of three seconds. I also made dua to allah once. Only once mind, and my dua was answered.

    How come the trinity convinced you it was less true?


    i never knew you tool the shahada lol..  well 3 seconds or 3 decades you are still technically a muslim apostate lol
  • Blatant misogyny in Islam is what is making me question it.
     Reply #138 - August 19, 2015, 09:38 PM
    Quote from: AGirlWithDoubts on August 19, 2015, 09:16 PM
    Maybe it's because as a Muslim I was taught that Catholics believe that God is three but also that God is one. Maybe it wasn't explained to me clearly but that was what I understood at the time and it left me confused.


    It's quite simple:

  • Blatant misogyny in Islam is what is making me question it.
     Reply #139 - August 19, 2015, 09:49 PM
    Quote from: bogart on August 19, 2015, 01:27 AM
    Best to let him speak for himself. You can read his blog until Hassan provides you with a direct answer.

    http://agnosticmuslimkhutbahs.blogspot.co.uk/

    thank you thnkyu
  • Blatant misogyny in Islam is what is making me question it.
     Reply #140 - August 19, 2015, 09:50 PM
    Quote from: Hassan on August 19, 2015, 09:38 PM
    It's quite simple:

    (Clicky for piccy!)

     Cheesy
    `But I don't want to go among mad people,' Alice remarked.
     `Oh, you can't help that,' said the Cat: `we're all mad here. I'm mad.  You're mad.'
     `How do you know I'm mad?' said Alice.
     `You must be,' said the Cat, `or you wouldn't have come here.'
  • Blatant misogyny in Islam is what is making me question it.
     Reply #141 - August 19, 2015, 09:59 PM
    `But I don't want to go among mad people,' Alice remarked.
     `Oh, you can't help that,' said the Cat: `we're all mad here. I'm mad.  You're mad.'
     `How do you know I'm mad?' said Alice.
     `You must be,' said the Cat, `or you wouldn't have come here.'
  • Blatant misogyny in Islam is what is making me question it.
     Reply #142 - August 19, 2015, 10:05 PM
    Quote from: suki on August 19, 2015, 09:31 PM
    i never knew you tool the shahada lol..  well 3 seconds or 3 decades you are still technically a muslim apostate lol

    Does it count if it wasn't serious and everyone was fully aware of that?
    `But I don't want to go among mad people,' Alice remarked.
     `Oh, you can't help that,' said the Cat: `we're all mad here. I'm mad.  You're mad.'
     `How do you know I'm mad?' said Alice.
     `You must be,' said the Cat, `or you wouldn't have come here.'
  • Blatant misogyny in Islam is what is making me question it.
     Reply #143 - August 19, 2015, 10:09 PM
    From a christian point of view it's easy to see the appeal of the story. God himself loves us so much he comes to Earth as flesh and blood, lives with us, eats with us, drinks with us, laughs with us, cries with us, and eventually dies for us. It's incredibly romantic.
    `But I don't want to go among mad people,' Alice remarked.
     `Oh, you can't help that,' said the Cat: `we're all mad here. I'm mad.  You're mad.'
     `How do you know I'm mad?' said Alice.
     `You must be,' said the Cat, `or you wouldn't have come here.'
  • Blatant misogyny in Islam is what is making me question it.
     Reply #144 - August 19, 2015, 10:13 PM
    nope lol
  • Blatant misogyny in Islam is what is making me question it.
     Reply #145 - August 19, 2015, 10:16 PM
    Is the nope in response to this

    Quote from: Quod Sum Eris on August 19, 2015, 10:05 PM
    Does it count if it wasn't serious and everyone was fully aware of that?


    or this?

    Quote from: Quod Sum Eris on August 19, 2015, 10:09 PM
    From a christian point of view it's easy to see the appeal of the story. God himself loves us so much he comes to Earth as flesh and blood, lives with us, eats with us, drinks with us, laughs with us, cries with us, and eventually dies for us. It's incredibly romantic.

    `But I don't want to go among mad people,' Alice remarked.
     `Oh, you can't help that,' said the Cat: `we're all mad here. I'm mad.  You're mad.'
     `How do you know I'm mad?' said Alice.
     `You must be,' said the Cat, `or you wouldn't have come here.'
  • Blatant misogyny in Islam is what is making me question it.
     Reply #146 - August 19, 2015, 10:27 PM
    oh, sorry the first one   : )

    x
  • Blatant misogyny in Islam is what is making me question it.
     Reply #147 - August 19, 2015, 10:28 PM
    Quote from: Quod Sum Eris on August 19, 2015, 10:09 PM
    From a christian point of view it's easy to see the appeal of the story. God himself loves us so much he comes to Earth as flesh and blood, lives with us, eats with us, drinks with us, laughs with us, cries with us, and eventually dies for us. It's incredibly romantic.


    Can we really call that dying, though. Or even love? The guy spends thousands of years being an asshole, then 32 years of being a human and he's like, "Yeah fuck this shit, I'm going back to being a god."
  • Blatant misogyny in Islam is what is making me question it.
     Reply #148 - August 19, 2015, 10:31 PM
    I said from a christian point of view. You're looking at it logically and realising the actual implications.

    Quote from: suki on August 19, 2015, 10:27 PM
    oh, sorry the first one   : )

    x


    Eh, both of them are bullshit anyway. Wink
    `But I don't want to go among mad people,' Alice remarked.
     `Oh, you can't help that,' said the Cat: `we're all mad here. I'm mad.  You're mad.'
     `How do you know I'm mad?' said Alice.
     `You must be,' said the Cat, `or you wouldn't have come here.'
  • Blatant misogyny in Islam is what is making me question it.
     Reply #149 - August 19, 2015, 10:36 PM
    Transversely, "God hated being a human so much he killed himself."
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