Jinn & Quran

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- Moondancer
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OP - January 05, 2016, 02:10 PM

Hi everyone

Been having a good look around the forum and found some interesting reading here.

I was wondering on your opinions and experiences with the Quran and Jinn. I have on two occasions experienced some friends who have been affected by something spiritual, for example changing voices, facial expressions, seeming to be "possessed" swearing, hitting, not knowing who I am, speaking in tongues etc. You get my meaning, the thing is on these occasions the recitation of Quran greatly affected my friends.
The voice would shout " stop it's burning me" ok I'll leave her body of you stop reading"
She also would run and hide away from me if I read Quran under tables and bed anything to get away from Quran.
This is a shortened version of events to give you an idea, at the time it was like a " proof" the Quran is real and a 'medicine'

Obviously now with my questioning of Islam and everything I know I'm just wondering if anyone else has experienced this or has another explanation for it.

Thanks in advance
- AGirlWithDoubts
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Reply #1 - January 05, 2016, 02:30 PM

Sadly in many cases these people are either having seizures or have a genuine mental illness. Instead of immediately taking them to the hospital, some will assume that they are possessed. Christianity has a similar exorcism procedure and these people appear to be affected by the Bible the same way but this does not make Christianity true.
- Moondancer
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Reply #2 - January 05, 2016, 03:10 PM

Actually in this case I was visiting my friend in a hospital and she was hospitalised but thy could find nothing medically wrong with her, only Quran had an effect
- AGirlWithDoubts
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Reply #3 - January 05, 2016, 04:00 PM

Hmmm....

You would know the situation better than anyone here so I wouldn't know why that's the case. There are a number of reasons why the Quran could have had that effect on her and it could depend on her past. I know of a girl who was quite mentally unstable (her family believed she was "possessed" at first) and she would freak out at the thought of going to the mosque or listening to Quran. Turns out that this was because she had some very disturbing memories of things happening to her in the mosque, which I probably shouldn't go into.

But I'm sure that these reactions have nothing to do with the Quran being medicine, otherwise the corrupted Bible could not be used for the same purpose while having the same effect
- Navtheshocker
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Reply #4 - January 05, 2016, 04:20 PM

you say that

but i was told by a raqi that the jinns have a way to trick christians to stay christian ie by having a successful exoricism using the bible
so they dont become muslim
its a confusing topic for me

Life is like a box of chocolates, shut the fuck up and eat them!
- AGirlWithDoubts
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Reply #5 - January 05, 2016, 05:18 PM

I have heard that argument as well but Christians can claim the same thing; that spirits respond to the Quran to trick people.

Much of it is also psychological; when someone is disturbed and believes that they are possessed by a demon due to strong religious beliefs, they may also believe that the ruqya/exorcism is working on them. In this situation it is an illusion.

There is also the minority of cases in which people do it for attention which should be considered.
- Moondancer
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Reply #6 - January 05, 2016, 05:30 PM

From what I've witnesses especially from my best friends of 17 years it was not her and "seemed" most definately from another world with the things it said and the way the Quran affected her. As for another lady who used to work for me I would play Quran in the house and find her hiding under things and in cupboards, she was also unable to recite any quranic words or seek refuge from "shaytan " without passing out. Anyways I'm not here to prove or disprove whether it's due to psychological effects or not.
Islamically we believe that the bible being monotheistic would have the same affect as the quraan.
With my doubts in Islam (Not God) i have to question some things I've seen with my own eyes that gave me the belief in the first place. I'd like to hear from anyone who has an explain as to why the Quran may effect someone aside from psychological.

Thanks
- Free mind
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Reply #7 - January 05, 2016, 09:52 PM

" Islamically we believe that the bible being monotheistic would have the same affect as the quraan. "

All Muslims believe that the bible now is not the rel version and was distorted by the Jews.
Consequently it will have no effect.
- Moondancer
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Reply #8 - January 05, 2016, 10:02 PM

I appreciate what you're saying however this "was" my belief and of those I came into contact with.
I've heard of exorcism being carried out with the bible and the Quran, however I'm not sure if there is a link.
I guess I'm trying to understand why the Quran or the bible for that matter would have an effect on the unseen. I realise not all people believe in Jinns or spirits but I do and did previous to Islam also.
Before I make any decision I like to look and think about all factors, I guess that's why I don't get along with a lot of Muslim because I ask to many questions and seek to understand.
- Quod Sum Eris
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Reply #9 - January 05, 2016, 11:13 PM

At 44:20 someone asks about protections and charms from the quran which begins a discussion on jinns and exorcisms with an ex-muslim who used to be an exorcist in Saudi Arabia.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9lpzoXmoE60

The question to ask really is why do they only effect those who believe in them? When was the last time an atheist was possessed? Never happens. So why? Because the atheist doesn't believe in it. So it only effects those who believe? Ah, interesting.

These are things that have been researched and tested dozens if not hundreds of times. The information is out there and I invite you to look into it. If you actually believe in jinns and possession then this can very easily be exploited while you're in a vulnerable state.

I saw this video a while ago. It was unbelievable.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=8ts9bMMpCbY

I skipped to a few random parts that were describing the supernatural to see if there was another explanation. Unsurprisingly there were. First was post natal depression. Next was bipolar disorder. Then they went onto talismans and magic rings and I decided not to waste my time.

Comment from a member who faked jinn possession:

Quote from: Mia on August 17, 2013, 05:39 PM
To answer your question, I had many for entire year and a few months. It was daily and I actually missed an entire school semester in 2009 because I wasn’t allowed to leave my home. I do have mental health issues but during 2009, I completely broke. I'm diagnosed with paranoia schizophrenia, anxiety and post-traumatic stress disorder. I was forced to take absolutely no medications because Islam was somehow my ‘true’ medicine so I’ve experienced the consequences. My father is a Sheik and he believed that I was possessed by shaytaans and djinns due to my rebellious acts that were against Islam. He doesn’t realize that they’re mental illnesses which were due to genetics and trauma. My father’s brother is diagnosed with paranoia schizophrenia but he does actually take medications. My father shunned him because he refused to trust Allah for his mental health. Well anyway, during the year of the ruqyah, I was locked in a house where I constantly faced these violent exorcisms by members of the community and my father. Everyone holds you down and the Sheik (my father) would scream Quran verses in my ear. Everyone would read Quran ayas and spit on me. Some people did beat me to get the djinns/shaytaans out and I once had a male member who would touch me inappropriately. Because we didn’t have much zam-zam water, I lived off of holy water (a mixture of tap water and saliva from random men). Daily, I had to consume 2 glasses of holy water. I was forced to constantly sniff some type of perfume, I had oil and different types of shit on my head and I had to bath in holy water (water and spit). I faked during the exorcisms so I screamed and act psychotic but a few times, I did black out so I can’t imagine what I have done. This sped up the process so after 6 months, I was no longer trapped in a house. Since then, I secretly visit psychiatrists and take medications for my mental health. I hide these issues from anyone because I fear of the ruqyah. Most of the time, people do fake for similar reasons. Most are actually diagnosed with mental illness but due to their family, they’re forced to experience ruqyahs. By the way, not all ruqyahs are violent; some are just ‘normal’ depending on your problems but don’t try. Sheiks actually accuse random people of being possessed by djinns/shaytaans because they get a lot of money from this. Some Sheiks actually sexually abuse their clients. There is a girl in Toronto who was raped by some Sheik during a ruqyah. A Sheik requested a one-on-one session with the girl and during the ruqyah, she was screaming for help but her parents though it was the djinns talking instead. You can’t trust these people.

Exorcisms are the product of a bygone age where we didn't have any answers, an attempt to explain that which couldn't be explained. We had no clue about mental health issues. We had no clue about bacteria. Exorcism was one of our very first attempts at medicine, and we had no clue what we were doing because we didn't understand. What I find truly deplorable are that they're still in business.

Here's a few links you may find interesting.

The History and Psychology
of Spirit Possession and Exorcism

http://www.markbancroft.com/info/spirit-possession#spirit2

I have no idea how to copy and paste a Pdf file but here's the link. It's a case study on ten people reporting demonic possession.

http://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=possession%20syndrome&source=web&cd=9&ved=0CGgQFjAI&url=http%3A%2F%2Fulag.net%2Famusing%2Fpossession%2Fexorcism.pdf&ei=PDAeUvmWAonG7AaGi4H4Dw&usg=AFQjCNEDUFfHElCb9OXvBmQdnVEv8pnFEw&bvm=bv.51156542,d.bGE

The Possession Syndrome: A Comparison of Hong Kong and French Findings

http://bjp.rcpsych.org/content/106/442/114.abstract

A forensic psychologist on anger, madness and destructive behavior.

by Dr. Stephen Diamond

Quote
The idea of demonic possession is nothing less than a metaphysical, theological or spiritual explanation for human evil. The Exorcist (1973), a film based on William Peter Blattey's book about an allegedly true case, provides a highly dramatized depiction of evil, possession and exorcism, and stimulated renewed public fascination with the possession syndrome.

http://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/evil-deeds/201008/giving-the-devil-his-due-exorcism-psychotherapy-and-the-possession-syndrome

Is demonic possession real?

http://www.christianitydisproved.com/brain/is-demonic-possession-real.html#reference1

This is an abstract from a full article, but it has the option for the full text on the right.

http://isp.sagepub.com/cgi/pdf_extract/17/2/150

THE POSSESSION SYNDROME ON TRIAL

http://www.holysmoke.org/cos/postrial.htm

The Devil Inside: Psychotherapy, Exorcism and Demonic Possession

http://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/evil-deeds/201201/the-devil-inside-psychotherapy-exorcism-and-demonic-possession

How Exorcism Works

http://science.howstuffworks.com/science-vs-myth/afterlife/exorcism5.htm

Elements of Culture and Mental Health: Critical Questions for Clinicians

http://ajp.psychiatryonline.org/article.aspx?articleid=1722086

POSSESSION SYNDROME: AN EPIDEMIOLOGICAL STUDY IN WEST KARNATAKA1

Full text just under the abstract.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3012945/

Epileptic seizures and spirit possession in Haitian culture

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/20724222

Mental disease related to belief in being possessed by the "Zar" spirit

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/7926995

The 'Zar' possession syndrome among Ethiopian immigrants to Israel: cultural and clinical aspects

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/8883974

`But I don't want to go among mad people,' Alice remarked.
`Oh, you can't help that,' said the Cat: `we're all mad here. I'm mad. You're mad.'
`How do you know I'm mad?' said Alice.
`You must be,' said the Cat, `or you wouldn't have come here.'
- Moondancer
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Reply #10 - January 05, 2016, 11:19 PM

Thank you Quod Sum Idris

This is exactly the kind of information I'm looking for and you raised some excellent points!

It's going to take me awhile to get through this lot though!
I need to take my belief one at a time and dispel them if you know what I mean, so thanks again muchly.
- Quod Sum Eris
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Reply #11 - January 05, 2016, 11:30 PM

You're welcome.

`But I don't want to go among mad people,' Alice remarked.
`Oh, you can't help that,' said the Cat: `we're all mad here. I'm mad. You're mad.'
`How do you know I'm mad?' said Alice.
`You must be,' said the Cat, `or you wouldn't have come here.'
- Moondancer
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Reply #12 - January 05, 2016, 11:43 PM

Sorry I spelt your name wrong
- Quod Sum Eris
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Reply #13 - January 05, 2016, 11:53 PM

`But I don't want to go among mad people,' Alice remarked.
`Oh, you can't help that,' said the Cat: `we're all mad here. I'm mad. You're mad.'
`How do you know I'm mad?' said Alice.
`You must be,' said the Cat, `or you wouldn't have come here.'
- moi
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Reply #14 - January 06, 2016, 05:20 PM

Wiki has a good but basic intro to the many varieties of this!

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spirit_possession

And of course this is a core part of anthropology, but one should never study that if you want to retain a religious belief :-)

http://www.drps.ed.ac.uk/13-14/dpt/cxscan10053.htm

Quote
The anthropological engagement with shamanism and spirit possession reflects a particular history of the discipline, pushing us to the limits of both the theoretical and empirical. In this course students will examine these phenomena and the social relations involved through lectures addressing theoretical approaches and case studies across regional contexts. We will ask to what extent a universal shamanism can be extracted from the specificities of locality, and explore the range of theoretical ideas used to understand and explain these phenomena. In particular we shall ask, what has been the relationship between these practitioners and modernity, particularly the state?; are shamans and mediums best understood as healers, or religious practitioners, and does this distinction matter? Core lectures will be delivered by the course convenor, with several guest slots delivered by staff across social anthropology drawing on their diverse regional engagement with these practitioners.

Weekly topics to include: Introduction; From Eliade and Lewis, through Taussig to phenomenology and its -ism(s) - History of an anthropological obsession; shamanism and spirit possession as healing; shamanism as religious practice; spirit possession and the state; at the borders of anthropology - psychological approaches to shamanism and spirit possession; several lectures on regional variations: Eastern and Southern Africa, the Himalayas, Indonesia, and the Amazon; globalization and neo-shamanic practice.

When you are a Bear of Very Little Brain, and you Think of Things, you find sometimes that a Thing which seemed very Thingish inside you is quite different when it gets out into the open and has other people looking at it.

A.A. Milne,

"We cannot slaughter each other out of the human impasse"
- Quod Sum Eris
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Reply #15 - January 06, 2016, 06:11 PM

`But I don't want to go among mad people,' Alice remarked.
`Oh, you can't help that,' said the Cat: `we're all mad here. I'm mad. You're mad.'
`How do you know I'm mad?' said Alice.
`You must be,' said the Cat, `or you wouldn't have come here.'
- Moondancer
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Reply #16 - January 06, 2016, 06:42 PM

In looking for the truth, doesn't matter where it is.

Thanks for the info
- R1233
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Reply #17 - January 09, 2016, 02:34 PM

Hey there.. Interesting topic raised here.

I have a personal experience of this I would like to share. Basically several years ago I start suffering from fatigue and sleep problems which put my life on halt, literally ruined it and have not been able to recover to this day. I had to leave my job and couldnt hold one after that for more then a few months, because I was always tired with no energy even after a misreable drug induced sleep, about to fall and collapse at any given moment, it is a struggle getting through each day trying to do normal things and having family and kids to support, it is like this every single day and the symptoms just get worse and worse and now I have unexplained shaking and pains moving throughout my body particularly in the right side and knees. Its come to the point that I really dont want to live no more and end my life, it is so difficult and distressful, I would not hestitate in a second but I got kids that need me around, the doctors have been made aware of this several times but they dont seem to really care or be bothered or understand what they are dealing with. The symptoms can be described as Insomina, chronic fatigue, fribromyalgia and depression with phsychotic symptoms. The only diagnosis I got from medical practioners over the years is that of depression, all blood tests have come clear which have been done several times. The solution put forward was trying different anti depressents and a sedatives to force me to sleep. They dont solve anything really the symptoms are still there, sedative just helps me get a good 8 hours which allows me to not be in bed the rest of the day and maybe do a chore or two.

Anyhows during all of this, being a Muslim i was advised to get a spritual screening/therapy/excorcism done. I didnt believe in none of this and that it was all fairy stories, but when the guy start recited verses over me my shaking just went haywire, falling on the floor and my arms and legs and body start violently shaking and banging against the ground with very intense, sharp pains in particular areas of my body when pressed, growling coming out of my chest and throat. I was not doing any of this, it was just happening, I could not believe what was happening but it was. It was clear to me then all these stories off jinn, evil spririts and possession were damn real no doubt about it.

I have been trying to battle this triublation from medical, rational and spiritual perspective coming close to a decade, but it is a losing battle and I dont know how long I will survive it, these evil entities are not coming out because they indicated they are tied by some sort of spell in my stomach. I do not know how to take it from here, just seeing how many years I can last out before it takes me, which I am not too fussed about but I have a child who is ten suffering simalar problems to me, I had a normal easy childhood but he is not, he is suffering with all this shakiness and weakness very unstable and shaky in his legs, standing walking and hand movements. he needs me to be there to help him get through this so we can both end this suffering of ours together, but I am struggling to exist by myself, I dont know what to do, this is going to end badly for both of us.. Just a question of how and when.
- LadyDanger
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Reply #18 - January 09, 2016, 03:01 PM

Quote from: Moondancer on January 05, 2016, 02:10 PM
Hi everyone

Been having a good look around the forum and found some interesting reading here.

I was wondering on your opinions and experiences with the Quran and Jinn. I have on two occasions experienced some friends who have been affected by something spiritual, for example changing voices, facial expressions, seeming to be "possessed" swearing, hitting, not knowing who I am, speaking in tongues etc. You get my meaning, the thing is on these occasions the recitation of Quran greatly affected my friends.
The voice would shout " stop it's burning me" ok I'll leave her body of you stop reading"
She also would run and hide away from me if I read Quran under tables and bed anything to get away from Quran.
This is a shortened version of events to give you an idea, at the time it was like a " proof" the Quran is real and a 'medicine'

Obviously now with my questioning of Islam and everything I know I'm just wondering if anyone else has experienced this or has another explanation for it.

Thanks in advance

A very close relative of mine has a mental illness and when she was first diagnosed and didn't take meds, she would be very different during episodes of mania. She would also "see" things. When we she was first diagnosed and her meds were still being calibrated for best treatment, I could totally see how people back in the day could ascribe behavior that arose from mental illness as being possessed. We always joke with he now that it is extremely unfair she is born in the age of modern medicine because had she been born 500 years ago she could have been an influential religious figure who could have ruled the world. But yes, mental illness can take many forms. My relative used to have "visions" too as well as go through phases where she was extremely paranoid and would accuse those around her of all kinds of things.
- R1233
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Reply #19 - January 09, 2016, 03:02 PM

Anyhows during all this in the last year I had to re-examine my association and belief in the Islamic faith because being a rational, logical and civlised human being with respect to the rights and freedoms of the rest of humanity there is no way you can be part of this madness when knowing what the ideology is about, from its founder and primary sources and what it demands. If there is a God, this is not the way of that almighty being, it stands against everything good and humane, although it does have a monotheistic belief and ritual system which seems to agitate negative spiritual entities. But you see the issue is agitating these things through reciting Gods name, and that can be done through other ways also, so I gave it a shot and thats how I resolved this dilemna for myself.

I have tried some spiritual deliverence/therapy done by people in the name of Jesus Christ and it had the simalar same effects on me in terms of causing severe involuntary shaking, banging, movements of the limbs and vomiting etc and trying to get the negative energies to leave me, which of course they dont. But the point is I can adopt this spiritual way and try and fight it from this angle which I have just started and have alot of hours and work to put into and see what happens, it is something I have to pursue.
- LadyDanger
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Reply #20 - January 09, 2016, 03:14 PM

Quote from: R1233 on January 09, 2016, 02:34 PM
Hey there.. Interesting topic raised here.

Anyhows during all of this, being a Muslim i was advised to get a spritual screening/therapy/excorcism done. I didnt believe in none of this and that it was all fairy stories, but when the guy start recited verses over me my shaking just went haywire, falling on the floor and my arms and legs and body start violently shaking and banging against the ground with very intense, sharp pains in particular areas of my body when pressed, growling coming out of my chest and throat. I was not doing any of this, it was just happening, I could not believe what was happening but it was. It was clear to me then all these stories off jinn, evil spririts and possession were damn real no doubt about it.

I know this is a bit different but the relative i spoke of used to go to a support group for people with mental illness. One of the people there had reported something very similar. He also had an exorcism done where his body shook and she spoke all garbled during when the priest recited verses from the bible (i think it was the bible, not sure how exorcisms go). Later he was diagnosed with very mild bipolar disorder. I'm not saying that you have this but that the brain is very complex.

I don't believe in possession, ghosts, inns or any of those but I do get freaked out at certain creepy things even though i don't believe in them at all. Similarly my ex-sister in law swore she was possessed in her sleep once. She was having an episode of sleep paralysis where the hallucinated. I don't discount the brain making coping mechanisms or associations to things and then when we try to [iece together what happened we ascribe it to an unknown or ghostly entity only because we don't understand the brain as well.
- yeezevee
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Reply #21 - January 09, 2016, 04:53 PM

Quote from: R1233 on January 09, 2016, 02:34 PM
.................... but it is a losing battle and I dont know how long I will survive it, these evil entities are not coming out because they indicated they are tied by some sort of spell in my stomach. I do not know how to take it from here, just seeing how many years I can last out before it takes me, which I am not too fussed about but I have a child who is ten suffering simalar problems to me, I had a normal easy childhood but he is not, he is suffering with all this shakiness and weakness very unstable and shaky in his legs, standing walking and hand movements. he needs me to be there to help him get through this so we can both end this suffering of ours together, but I am struggling to exist by myself, I dont know what to do, this is going to end badly for both of us.. Just a question of how and when.

Quote from: R1233 on January 09, 2016, 03:02 PM
.............................
I have tried some spiritual deliverence/therapy done by people in the name of Jesus Christ and it had the simalar same effects on me in terms of causing severe involuntary shaking, banging, movements of the limbs and vomiting etc and trying to get the negative energies to leave me, which of course they dont. But the point is I can adopt this spiritual way and try and fight it from this angle which I have just started and have alot of hours and work to put into and see what happens, it is something I have to pursue.

helloo R1233 interesting two posts from you........ well write more.... educate the folks on that subject., indeed it is interesting topic..

so you went from Islamic Jinn Therapy to Christian Jinn Therapy?? well that is a progress .. Did you try Hypnotherapy?? .........well whatever works.....

anyway welcome to the forum. And I am very sorry to know your kid's Physical/psychological/medical problems . Please continue to read and write..

with best wishes
yeezevee

Do not let silence become your legacy.. Question everything
I renounced my faith to become a kafir,
the beloved betrayed me and turned in to a Muslim
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Reply #22 - January 09, 2016, 09:31 PM

Hey there Ladydanger & Yezeevee

No one is denying that there are mental illnesses, paranoid delusion, manic depression, Schizophrenia, depression, anxiety etc you name it, that happen due to whatever reason and can be explained medically and rationally in many cases. But I am telling you from not just my experience but from the experience of hundreds of others that all these can be symptoms of being effected (by intentionally being induced or non intentional) negative spiritual entities that are directly causing this. The example of the person you reported of having an excorcism confirms this, his bi-polar disorder was probably a symptom of being effected by a spirit. You cannot explain a person starting to have involountary siezure and fits the moment an excorcism in the name of Jesus or whatever is recited in any other way. I did not believe, nor do I want to believe this, but the unfortunate fact is there is something else causing severe reaction, fits, pains, wild and wierd movements and motions within my body that is not just me.. It even growls and speaks when it is (tortured with the name of god) You have to suffer from it directly or witness it first hand to believe it, its not one isiolated case, it is many cases. It is just a tragic and evil fact of life that we have to deal with just like we deal with other tragic and evil facts of life.

You can put this to the test yourself, find people with severe mental and physical health issues which they cannot deal with or answer medically, play one of the prayers for deliverance, or prayer to route out demons and witness the reactions for yourself and then you will believe, better still if you start having reactions yourself, they could be very slight or very excessive.

As for me, i tried my utmost first and foremost to deal with my symptoms and illnesses from a medical perspective but it is a lost cause. The health officials and system here is so incompetent and useless it is beyond explanation. If they know that your symptoms are so severe that you want to take your own life because you cannot handle them, complaining of them for years, being sent around in silly circles, refer you to some councelling and a specialist mental health department, a Psychiatrist who at the end of it tells you that you are severley depressed and apart from some anti depressents that he cannot help any further and tells you to see your GP to deal with phsyical symptoms who sends you back to the mental health team, then they just forget about you completley and not follow up on you when know you are suicidal what hope is there left? Then again they cannot solve or explain something that is not within reach or explanation, that is where a spiritual expert comes in, in which my case has been good for a diagnosis but not solvable as far as I can see, a lot of false hopes but not solvable except through death unfortunatley.
- zeca
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Reply #23 - January 09, 2016, 09:57 PM

Hi R1233, as far as medical perspectives go I wonder if the approach of the Hearing Voices network would be of any help:

http://www.hearing-voices.org

Which side are you on?
- Helaine
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Reply #24 - January 10, 2016, 03:37 AM

I had those fears once.... Had unexplained pains, aches, etc.... Had gone to many specialist, (obgyn, optometrist, ENT, etc etc)...

They stopped after I stopped paying attention to them =/

Honestly I was just really paranoid, and doctors pretty much... No, you're healthy. Your body is not perfect, but you're not sick. It's always like that.

I don't know about your problems are, but exorcism seems to be present in every single spiritual groups/cults/religions. At the very least, not a single religion can lay claim to it.

I still think it's all in our heads. I was once really convinced of so much pain as well, but then it turns out to be my own mind making things up.

I'm curious could you please explain more about your symptoms? If your son has it, it could be hereditary. Genetic problems?
- R1233
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Reply #25 - January 12, 2016, 01:08 PM

Dear Helaine, I think some of your queries have been addressed in my previous posts.

My situation now is as follows, I wake up to and go to sleep to Sharp pains around knees back and front, have to scratch heavily to provide relief. My Head and legs in severe throbbing pain, have to massage fiercely to provide relief, around calves, thighs and knee caps. Many times this pain is all concentrated on the right side of my body from head to feet which and also find very worrying and disturbing is twitching feet and shaking body, sometimes the right side arm leg etc, sometimes the left sometimes both. I wake up from poor drug induced sleep to being exhausted and having little or no energy and feeling very ill, with sore ears, cold like symptoms and the pains mentioned above. I have no choice but to rest out in bed and try and get some more sleep so I can scrape a few half decent hours later and spend time with kids and get something to eat. Symptoms just get worse and worse and no effort is being made to diagnose or understand any of this. I am trying to drag and stretch this continuous suffering out as long as I can but I do not know how long I can hold out. My Childs symptoms are quite different, he has weak, shaky, unstable legs and hand movements. It is kind of hereditary but spirtual heriditary, not medical hereditary. I had a normal healthy childhood, but as soon as things start turning bad for me things start turning bad for him.

It is not in our heads, this problem is very real unfortunatley and a universal one not spefic to any religion as you mentioned.
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