Does Negative Atheism Advance our Cause?

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- naseemzia
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Does Negative Atheism Advance our Cause?
OP - March 29, 2019, 10:00 PM

We have become followers of New Atheists. Does It Advance our Cause? What is or should be our cause? Is it simply to preach to the converted or as New Atheists do just trash and criticize religion. New Atheists who are mostly westerners do Ex-Muslims an injustice. Using Negative Atheism as their doctrine they are content to insult religion thus gain notoriety and fortune in the West. But that kind of atheism is not helpful to Ex-Muslims. We earn the ire of fundamentalist Muslims on the one hand and hatred of Islmophobes on the other. Better to advocate Positive Atheism which promotes humanism and science in many walks of life. Our goal should not be to anger ordinary Muslims but to show how atheism is liberating They are more likely to come to our camp or to tolerate us. Insulting Islam wholesale or Muslims is counter-productive and only increases peril in our lives We should take advantage of freedom of speech and action that is become available to us in the West.
- yeezevee
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Does Negative Atheism Advance our Cause?
Reply #1 - March 30, 2019, 08:59 AM

Quote from: naseemzia on March 29, 2019, 10:00 PM
~~We have become followers of~~ New Atheists. Does It Advance our Cause? What is or should be our cause? Is it simply to preach to the converted or as New Atheists do just trash and criticize religion. New Atheists who are mostly westerners do Ex-Muslims an injustice.

Hi Naseemzia .. glad to see you here., welcome to the dungeon... I certainly agree with some points of your post if not fully., And I crossed off the statement i do not agree with ., I guess you didn't had enough time to elaborate and define certain words you are using in the post plus it is your first post ...
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Using Negative Atheism as their doctrine they are content to insult religion thus gain notoriety and fortune in the West. But that kind of atheism is not helpful to Ex-Muslims. We earn the ire of fundamentalist Muslims on the one hand and hatred of Islmophobes on the other. Better to advocate Positive Atheism which promotes humanism and science in many walks of life. Our goal should not be to anger ordinary Muslims but to show how atheism is liberating They are more likely to come to our camp or to tolerate us.
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Insulting Islam wholesale or Muslims is counter-productive and only increases peril in our lives

We should take advantage of freedom of speech and action that is become available to us in the West.

So dear Naseem, let us try to define some words you said to make the underlying idea of your post bit stronger.

New Atheists., positive atheism, negative atheism, difference between " criticizing Islam vs Islamophobia"

there are so many questions that we can pose on those words, in essence I can use your post and replace these words " Muslims, Islam " with any faith follower , turn around and criticize all faith heads and pose same questions like these to every faith follower.. for eg.. with Ex-Christians, Ex-Jews, Ex-Hindus, Ex-Buddhists, Ex-Sikhs, Ex-Zoroastrians, Ex-Confucians., Ex-Bahái,, Ex-Shinto etc..etc.. including ex-Atheists- anyways again welcome to CEMB

with best wishes
yeezevee

Do not let silence become your legacy.. Question everything
I renounced my faith to become a kafir,
the beloved betrayed me and turned in to a Muslim
- naseemzia
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Does Negative Atheism Advance our Cause?
Reply #2 - March 30, 2019, 08:09 PM

Hi Yevezee (how do you pronounce this word/name?)/ Thank you for your comments and questions. Yes, you can substitute Islam and Muslim with faith and ti would have the dame effect excepting I am interested in Islam in particular. For me Negative atheism is mainly concerned with criticizing religion but if you have an exchange with fair minded people and they tentatively agree that Islam can be rejected the natural next question is What then? Or if not Islam what do you have left? Positive atheism is a response to that very valid question. It lays down a scenario where there is no religion and people build a new kind of society, or more likely, modify the current society to reflect atheistic and humanistic values. It can be done and has been done in small groups just like CEMB. Projecting positive atheism can attract ordinary Muslims who are dissatisfied with Islam and looking for a better life plan. Also, insulting or trashing the faithful cannot do the job. Let us not forget Ex-Msuls have an Islamic heritage whether we like it or not. In A part of heritage is that Islamic thinkers had elaborate debates about many doctrines not insults or put-downs which incidentally are not arguments. They don't convince anyone thought they may make people uncomfortable.
- yeezevee
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Does Negative Atheism Advance our Cause?
Reply #3 - March 30, 2019, 08:35 PM

Quote from: naseemzia on March 30, 2019, 08:09 PM
Hi Yevezee (how do you pronounce this word/name?)/ Thank you for your comments and questions.

i guess you are typing from some phone device not from a key board ... do not worry number of folks made that mistake...

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Yes, you can substitute Islam and Muslim with faith and ti would have the dame effect excepting I am interested in Islam in particular. For me Negative atheism is mainly concerned with criticizing religion but if you have an exchange with fair minded people and they tentatively agree that Islam can be rejected the natural next question is What then? Or if not Islam what do you have left? Positive atheism is a response to that very valid question. It lays down a scenario where there is no religion and people build a new kind of society, or more likely, modify the current society to reflect atheistic and humanistic values. It can be done and has been done in small groups just like CEMB. Projecting positive atheism can attract ordinary Muslims who are dissatisfied with Islam and looking for a better life plan. Also, insulting or trashing the faithful cannot do the job. Let us not forget Ex-Msuls have an Islamic heritage whether we like it or not. In A part of heritage is that Islamic thinkers had elaborate debates about many doctrines not insults or put-downs which incidentally are not arguments. They don't convince anyone thought they may make people uncomfortable.

I fully agree with you on that question and others

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WHAT NEXT?...
WHERE DO I GO FROM HERE?
WHAT IS THE ALTERNATIVE?
WHY ARE YOU CONFUSING ME?
WITHOUT FAITH I WHO WAS HARMLESS FAITHFUL BELIEVERHAS BECOME CONFUSED , DISTRACTED AND BAFFLED AND LOST THE MEANING OF LIFE AND MEANING FOR LIFE

along with other questions that is extremely important question for many folks .... 100s of millions of folks ..... we will discuss bit more on that ., but my point was slightly different dear Zia., I was under the impression that you didn't read/know about "negative and positive atheism ".. so you are using those words for different reasons

Those two words are well known to those who know/read Atheism .. Let me give you a simple link so you will get what I meant ..

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Negative_and_positive_atheism

Negative atheism, also called weak atheism and soft atheism, is any type of atheism where a person does not believe in the existence of any deities but does not explicitly assert that there are none.

Positive atheism, also called strong atheism and hard atheism, is the form of atheism that additionally asserts that no deities exists

Those with-in Atheism are entirely different subjects from what you intended to say on "Criticizing Islam" as faith or its books/scriptures from DEMO-GOUGING Muslim folks .

we will continue to discuss your point of view and I am glad to read your reply..

with best wishes
yeezevee

Do not let silence become your legacy.. Question everything
I renounced my faith to become a kafir,
the beloved betrayed me and turned in to a Muslim
- naseemzia
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Does Negative Atheism Advance our Cause?
Reply #4 - March 31, 2019, 06:12 PM

Yes I am aware of the difference between negative and positive atheism as generally defined. I really want Ex-Muslims to move away from the path of New Atheists such Richard Dawkins anSam Harris. In following their approach to Muslims of throwing dirt and ALL Muslims and Islam, we alienate those Muslims who have questions about Islam and likely to give it up with our help. My positive atheism is not only strong atheism as Wikipedia writer defines it also elaborates on a better life style of an atheist.

I even advocate that we can emulate religion. See me article @godlessmuslim. and

https://t.co/i3uxgOatLD
- yeezevee
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Does Negative Atheism Advance our Cause?
Reply #5 - March 31, 2019, 09:18 PM

Quote from: naseemzia on March 31, 2019, 06:12 PM
.................. My positive atheism is not only strong atheism as Wikipedia writer defines it also elaborates on a better life style of an atheist.

I even advocate that we can emulate religion. See me article @godlessmuslim. and

should i follow this??

https://twitter.com/godlessmuslim

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https://t.co/i3uxgOatLD

please open that to public so they can read without signing up or at least put the snippets and nuggets from it here.....

Do not let silence become your legacy.. Question everything
I renounced my faith to become a kafir,
the beloved betrayed me and turned in to a Muslim
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