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Theme Changer

 Topic: Mo attacking the defenceless

 (Read 3275 times)
  • 1« Previous thread | Next thread »
  • Mo attacking the defenceless
     OP - May 06, 2009, 04:01 PM
    Quote
    Narrated Ibn Aun: I wrote a letter to Nafi and Nafi wrote in reply to my letter that the Prophet had suddenly attacked Bani Mustaliq without warning while they were heedless and their cattle were being watered at the places of water. Their fighting men were killed and their women and children were taken as captives; the Prophet got Juwairiya on that day. Nafi said that Ibn 'Umar had told him the above narration and that Ibn 'Umar was in that army. [Sahih Bukhari: Book 46, Hadith 717]


    That's sick!
    ~My story~
    ~Collection of unethical hadiths/surahs~
  • Re: Mo attacking the defenceless
     Reply #1 - May 06, 2009, 09:44 PM
    I've come across that in Sahih Muslim before:

    Chapter 1: REGARDING PERMISSION TO MAKE A RAID, WITHOUT AN ULTIMATUM, UPON THE DISBELIEVERS WHO HAVE ALREADY BEEN INVITED TO ACCEPT ISLAM


    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Book 019, Number 4292:
    Ibn 'Aun reported: I wrote to Nafi' inquiring from him whether it was necessary to extend (to the disbelievers) an invitation to accept (Islam) before m". ing them in fight. He wrote (in reply) to me that it was necessary in the early days of Islam. The Messenger of Allah (may peace be upon him) made a raid upon Banu Mustaliq while they were unaware and their cattle were having a drink at the water. He killed those who fought and imprisoned others. On that very day, he captured Juwairiya bint al-Harith. Nafi' said that this tradition was related to him by Abdullah b. Umar who (himself) was among the raiding troops.


    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Book 019, Number 4293:
    This hadith has been narrated on the authority of Ibn 'Aun and the name of Juwairiya bint al-Harith was mentioned beyond any doubt.

    "At 8:47 I do a grenade jump off a ladder."
  • Re: Mo attacking the defenceless
     Reply #2 - May 06, 2009, 09:51 PM
    Quote from: PeruvianSkies on May 06, 2009, 04:01 PM
    Quote
    Narrated Ibn Aun: I wrote a letter to Nafi and Nafi wrote in reply to my letter that the Prophet had suddenly attacked Bani Mustaliq without warning while they were heedless and their cattle were being watered at the places of water. Their fighting men were killed and their women and children were taken as captives; the Prophet got Juwairiya on that day. Nafi said that Ibn 'Umar had told him the above narration and that Ibn 'Umar was in that army. [Sahih Bukhari: Book 46, Hadith 717]


    That's sick!



    you should know many hadiths are falls
    please read my blog, read how islam will win
    the clash of civilization.

    http://www.xanga.com/hfghj23458654fgha
  • Re: Mo attacking the defenceless
     Reply #3 - May 06, 2009, 10:41 PM
    Quote from: kope on May 06, 2009, 09:51 PM
    you should know many hadiths are falls

    Yep, many are. Particularly the one's that contradict your conscience or are too stupid for an educated mind.
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  • Re: Mo attacking the defenceless
     Reply #4 - May 07, 2009, 12:58 AM
    Quote from: kope on May 06, 2009, 09:51 PM
    Quote from: PeruvianSkies on May 06, 2009, 04:01 PM


    That's sick!



    you should know many hadiths are falls


    That one's Sahih Muslim... if that one's false, they're all false.
  • Re: Mo attacking the defenceless
     Reply #5 - May 07, 2009, 04:02 AM
    Hadith are a real mindfuck.
    Pakistan Zindabad? ya Pakistan sey Zinda bhaag?

    Long Live Pakistan? Or run with your lives from Pakistan?
  • Re: Mo attacking the defenceless
     Reply #6 - May 07, 2009, 08:42 AM
    Quote from: kope on May 06, 2009, 09:51 PM
    Quote from: PeruvianSkies on May 06, 2009, 04:01 PM
    Quote
    Narrated Ibn Aun: I wrote a letter to Nafi and Nafi wrote in reply to my letter that the Prophet had suddenly attacked Bani Mustaliq without warning while they were heedless and their cattle were being watered at the places of water. Their fighting men were killed and their women and children were taken as captives; the Prophet got Juwairiya on that day. Nafi said that Ibn 'Umar had told him the above narration and that Ibn 'Umar was in that army. [Sahih Bukhari: Book 46, Hadith 717]


    That's sick!



    you should know many hadiths are falls

    An unethical act does not constitute as a reason to declare a hadith unauthentic.
    ~My story~
    ~Collection of unethical hadiths/surahs~
  • Re: Mo attacking the defenceless
     Reply #7 - May 07, 2009, 09:34 AM
    Sure it does!

    I chose to get circumcised at 17, don't tell me I never believed.
  • Re: Mo attacking the defenceless
     Reply #8 - May 07, 2009, 09:46 AM
    Well, the Wikipedia entry puts this incident a bit differently:
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Banu_Mustaliq

    The Banu al Mustaliq, allied to the Quraish of Mecca, were the subject to a pre-emptive attack by Muhammad in the month of Sha'ban of the year 628 (6 AH). Muhammad had received news that the tribe was gathering together against the Muslims under the leadership of al-Harith ibn Abu Dirar. The Muslim force met the Banu Mustaliq in battle at a watering place called al-Muraysi and defeated them soundly, slaying the Mustaliq chief al-Harith.

    Among the captives taken by the Muslims was al-Harith's daughter Juwayriya. She initially fell among the booty of Muhammad's companion Thabit b. Qays b. Al-Shammas. Troubled by this, Juwayriya sought a deed of redemption from Muhammad. Muhammad proposed to marry her and as a result freed her from the bondage of Thabit and consequently ameliorated the condition of her captured tribe. [1]

    The campaign also involved a conflict between the Muhajirun and the Ansar when, on the march home, a Bedouin servant of Umar pushed an ally of the Khazraj, whose chief Ibn Ubayy reportedly tried to spread discontent. Muhammad forestalled any fighting by immediately continuing the march. Later on, Muhammad's wife Aisha was rumoured to have committed adultery, an accusation that was settled by Muhammad announcing that he had received a revelation confirming Aisha's innocence. [2]
  • Re: Mo attacking the defenceless
     Reply #9 - May 07, 2009, 10:53 AM
    Quote from: ned on May 07, 2009, 09:46 AM
    Well, the Wikipedia entry puts this incident a bit differently:
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Banu_Mustaliq

    The Banu al Mustaliq, allied to the Quraish of Mecca, were the subject to a pre-emptive attack by Muhammad in the month of Sha'ban of the year 628 (6 AH). Muhammad had received news that the tribe was gathering together against the Muslims under the leadership of al-Harith ibn Abu Dirar. The Muslim force met the Banu Mustaliq in battle at a watering place called al-Muraysi and defeated them soundly, slaying the Mustaliq chief al-Harith.

    Among the captives taken by the Muslims was al-Harith's daughter Juwayriya. She initially fell among the booty of Muhammad's companion Thabit b. Qays b. Al-Shammas. Troubled by this, Juwayriya sought a deed of redemption from Muhammad. Muhammad proposed to marry her and as a result freed her from the bondage of Thabit and consequently ameliorated the condition of her captured tribe. [1]

    The campaign also involved a conflict between the Muhajirun and the Ansar when, on the march home, a Bedouin servant of Umar pushed an ally of the Khazraj, whose chief Ibn Ubayy reportedly tried to spread discontent. Muhammad forestalled any fighting by immediately continuing the march. Later on, Muhammad's wife Aisha was rumoured to have committed adultery, an accusation that was settled by Muhammad announcing that he had received a revelation confirming Aisha's innocence. [2]

    They obviously didn't meet them in battle so that wiki article is a load of nonsense. I love the story about Aisha there Tongue
    ~My story~
    ~Collection of unethical hadiths/surahs~
  • Re: Mo attacking the defenceless
     Reply #10 - May 07, 2009, 11:05 AM
    Quote from: ned on May 07, 2009, 09:46 AM
    Well, the Wikipedia entry puts this incident a bit differently:
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Banu_Mustaliq

    Is that from the Sahih Wiki?
    Devious, treacherous, murderous, neanderthal, sub-human of the West. bunny
  • Re: Mo attacking the defenceless
     Reply #11 - May 08, 2009, 03:44 AM
    But how are you deconstructing the Muslim version of the events? They say that it was a pre-emptive strike against a tribe that was going to attack the Muslims. They cite Ibn Ishaq and Tabari.

    Of course, pre-emptive strike or not, raiding a tribe is wrong and taking women as slaves is wrong.

    I don't really care one way or another -- just wondering.
  • Re: Mo attacking the defenceless
     Reply #12 - May 08, 2009, 05:07 AM
    Quote from: ned on May 08, 2009, 03:44 AM
    But how are you deconstructing the Muslim version of the events? They say that it was a pre-emptive strike against a tribe that was going to attack the Muslims. They cite Ibn Ishaq and Tabari.

    Of course, pre-emptive strike or not, raiding a tribe is wrong and taking women as slaves is wrong.

    I don't really care one way or another -- just wondering.


    I'm suspicious whenever Tabari is brought up.  Talking about the descriptions of Prophet-inflicted torture in those sources, apologists will often say that Tabari and Ishaq are not reliable.  So I'd have to question that they're using the tainted source to counter another claim.

    It may come down to the isnad of a specific point, but chances are they don't know what that is.  And I don't even know if there's any substance to the wordy isnad based defenses that I've heard anyway.

    It's a point to keep in mind anyhoo.
  • Re: Mo attacking the defenceless
     Reply #13 - May 08, 2009, 07:11 AM
    Quote from: osmanthus on May 07, 2009, 11:05 AM
    Quote from: ned on May 07, 2009, 09:46 AM
    Well, the Wikipedia entry puts this incident a bit differently:
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Banu_Mustaliq

    Is that from the Sahih Wiki?

     Cheesy
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  • Re: Mo attacking the defenceless
     Reply #14 - May 08, 2009, 05:36 PM
    Quote from: IsLame on May 08, 2009, 07:11 AM
    Quote from: osmanthus on May 07, 2009, 11:05 AM
    Quote from: ned on May 07, 2009, 09:46 AM
    Well, the Wikipedia entry puts this incident a bit differently:
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Banu_Mustaliq

    Is that from the Sahih Wiki?

     Cheesy

    EXACTLY!
    Cheesy:D
    "At 8:47 I do a grenade jump off a ladder."
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