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Theme Changer

 Topic: Muhammad & Germs!

 (Read 12487 times)
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  • Re: Muhammad & Germs!
     Reply #60 - July 25, 2009, 03:24 PM
    If god is all powerful why would he let us word get corrupted? Every time he sends a messenger this happens.The current Quran hasn't been changed since Uthman put it together, we humans have managed to keep it intact and unchanged. Why can god not do this with his original message?  Kind of sheds doubt on his power tbh.
    ~My story~
    ~Collection of unethical hadiths/surahs~
  • Re: Muhammad & Germs!
     Reply #61 - July 25, 2009, 06:14 PM
    Quote from: PeruvianSkies on July 25, 2009, 01:47 PM
    "but the distortion of the message in the Quran."

    Why would god allow his message to be distorted?


    Yet another difference between Marleya's beliefs and Islamic beliefs. The Qur'an clearly states that its content is infallible and is protected from change.
    The unlived life is not worth examining.
  • Re: Muhammad & Germs!
     Reply #62 - July 25, 2009, 07:01 PM
    Quote from: J4m3z on July 25, 2009, 06:14 PM
    Yet another difference between Marleya's beliefs and Islamic beliefs. The Qur'an clearly states that its content is infallible and is protected from change.


    Protected from change maybe,but not protected from distortion.The jews did it with their Torah,the jews also have their hadith called mishna and gemara,that makes the Talmud.Man made laws and oral tradition.
    The gospel made Jesus son of God,and the muslims have their hadiths.

    It is all distorted.
  • Re: Muhammad & Germs!
     Reply #63 - July 25, 2009, 07:38 PM
    Marleya, the fact of the matter is that the narrator of this hadeeth at the beginning of this thread is Sunan Dawood.

    If you are going to reject the hadeeth for your personal religious reasons, I don't care. What matters is to view this hadeeth as a historical report and to assess how truthful the historical report is. This is what Islamic jurists do anyway, but you didn't seem to get that.

    Can you please refute the hadeeth on historical grounds, rather than appealing to your religious conviction that you must do away with this hadeeth exactly because it makes the prophet look like something which you would personally rather he did not.
    The unlived life is not worth examining.
  • Re: Muhammad & Germs!
     Reply #64 - July 25, 2009, 08:02 PM
    Quote from: J4m3z on July 25, 2009, 07:38 PM
    Marleya, the fact of the matter is that the narrator of this hadeeth at the beginning of this thread is Sunan Dawood.

    If you are going to reject the hadeeth for your personal religious reasons, I don't care. What matters is to view this hadeeth as a historical report and to assess how truthful the historical report is. This is what Islamic jurists do anyway, but you didn't seem to get that.

    Can you please refute the hadeeth on historical grounds, rather than appealing to your religious conviction that you must do away with this hadeeth exactly because it makes the prophet look like something which you would personally rather he did not.


    You talk like my imam Smiley

    Refute the hadith on a historical ground?What do you want?This hadith is not recongnized as a strong hadith by the establisshemnt of muslim scoolars today.Not all of Abu Dawood hadith is considered sahih.

    So then it is very easy to refute it.
  • Re: Muhammad & Germs!
     Reply #65 - July 25, 2009, 09:09 PM
    Quote from: marleya on July 25, 2009, 08:02 PM
    You talk like my imam Smiley

    Refute the hadith on a historical ground?What do you want?This hadith is not recongnized as a strong hadith by the establisshemnt of muslim scoolars today.Not all of Abu Dawood hadith is considered sahih.

    So then it is very easy to refute it.


    Go on then... I'm waiting...
    The unlived life is not worth examining.
  • Re: Muhammad & Germs!
     Reply #66 - July 25, 2009, 09:21 PM
    Marleya, according to Rashna, the hadeeth at the beginning of this thread has been agreed by the scholars to be Sunan. What could you possibly say against this?
    The unlived life is not worth examining.
  • Re: Muhammad & Germs!
     Reply #67 - July 25, 2009, 10:25 PM
    Quote from: J4m3z on July 25, 2009, 09:21 PM
    Marleya, according to Rashna, the hadeeth at the beginning of this thread has been agreed by the scholars to be Sunan. What could you possibly say against this?


    I can say that Dawood himself,said that all his hadiths is not sahih(autentic).It is much easier to refute sunan dawood than sahih bukhari.

    And this special hadith,has been under scrutiny before from establishment of schoolars.
  • Re: Muhammad & Germs!
     Reply #68 - July 25, 2009, 10:39 PM
    Marleya, why are you a Muslim? Smiley
  • Re: Muhammad & Germs!
     Reply #69 - July 25, 2009, 10:42 PM
    Quote from: marleya on July 25, 2009, 10:25 PM
    I can say that Dawood himself,said that all his hadiths is not sahih(autentic).It is much easier to refute sunan dawood than sahih bukhari.

    And this special hadith,has been under scrutiny before from establishment of schoolars.



    No, Abu Dawood said some of his hadeeth are inauthentic but most of them are.

    It is easier to refute sunan dawood than sahih bukhari? Is that supposed to be saying something?! Let's just say you would have a flippin hard time trying to refute sahih bukhari!
    The unlived life is not worth examining.
  • Re: Muhammad & Germs!
     Reply #70 - July 25, 2009, 10:43 PM
    best question to date popcorn
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  • Re: Muhammad & Germs!
     Reply #71 - September 09, 2009, 03:17 PM
    Quote from: J4m3z on July 25, 2009, 12:19 AM
    Tolu-e-Islam followers do not reject all hadiths; however, they only accept hadiths which "are in accordance with the Quran.."

    I am hearing about this more and more lately. 

    What will they say if you show them this:

    Quote
    Book 004, Number 2127: Aisha (his wife) said, ?When it was my turn for Allah's Messenger to spend the night with me, he turned his side, put on his mantle and took off his shoes and placed them near his feet, and spread the corner of his shawl on his bed and then lay down till he thought that I had gone to sleep. He took hold of his mantle slowly and put on the shoes slowly, and opened the door and went out and then closed it lightly. I covered my head, put on my veil and tightened my waist wrapper, and then went out following his steps till he reached Baqi'. He stood there and he stood for a long time. He then lifted his hands three times, and then returned and I also returned. He hastened his steps and I also hastened my steps. He ran and I too ran. He came (to the house) and I also came (to the house). I, however, preceded him and I entered (the house), and as I lay down in the bed, he (the Holy Prophet) entered the (house), and said: Why is it, O 'Aisha, that you are out of breath? I said: There is nothing. He said: Tell me or the Subtle and the Aware would inform me. I said: Messenger of Allah, may my father and mother be ransom for you, and then I told him (the whole story). He said: Was it the darkness (of your shadow) that I saw in front of me? I said: Yes. He struck me on the chest which caused me pain?


    and then do the reverse, i.e. back it up with verse 4:34  Cheesy
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  • Re: Muhammad & Germs!
     Reply #72 - September 09, 2009, 03:55 PM
    Clearly Aisha wanted some loving...but Muhammad suddenly leaving pissed her off...and she still got beaten!  mysmilie_977
    Pakistan Zindabad? ya Pakistan sey Zinda bhaag?

    Long Live Pakistan? Or run with your lives from Pakistan?
  • Re: Muhammad & Germs!
     Reply #73 - September 09, 2009, 04:16 PM
    After reading passages like that and the rest of the biography of Muhammed including paedophilia, murder and abuse, its difficult to summon up an ounce of respect as an ex-muslim for that man. 

    As a quarter of the world love and cherish him, should we still show respect to him?  If a Nazi asked you to respect to their beloved Hitler, would you?
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  • Re: Muhammad & Germs!
     Reply #74 - September 15, 2009, 03:17 PM
    Does anyone understand this verse below?  Why was Aisha struck by Mo, and why did she follow him?

    Quote
    Book 004, Number 2127: Aisha (his wife) said, ?When it was my turn for Allah's Messenger to spend the night with me, he turned his side, put on his mantle and took off his shoes and placed them near his feet, and spread the corner of his shawl on his bed and then lay down till he thought that I had gone to sleep. He took hold of his mantle slowly and put on the shoes slowly, and opened the door and went out and then closed it lightly. I covered my head, put on my veil and tightened my waist wrapper, and then went out following his steps till he reached Baqi'. He stood there and he stood for a long time. He then lifted his hands three times, and then returned and I also returned. He hastened his steps and I also hastened my steps. He ran and I too ran. He came (to the house) and I also came (to the house). I, however, preceded him and I entered (the house), and as I lay down in the bed, he (the Holy Prophet) entered the (house), and said: Why is it, O 'Aisha, that you are out of breath? I said: There is nothing. He said: Tell me or the Subtle and the Aware would inform me. I said: Messenger of Allah, may my father and mother be ransom for you, and then I told him (the whole story). He said: Was it the darkness (of your shadow) that I saw in front of me? I said: Yes. He struck me on the chest which caused me pain?

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  • Re: Muhammad & Germs!
     Reply #75 - September 15, 2009, 03:22 PM
    I'm not quite sure myself but Islam apologists say the correct arabic translation was she was shoved not struck as in hit on the chest but hey I'm just the messenger.
    "The ideal tyranny is that which is ignorantly self-administered by its victims. The most perfect slaves are, therefore, those which blissfully and unawaredly enslave themselves."
  • Re: Muhammad & Germs!
     Reply #76 - September 15, 2009, 03:32 PM
    Whether she was shoved or struck makes no difference, the intent was to cause pain.
    ~My story~
    ~Collection of unethical hadiths/surahs~
  • Re: Muhammad & Germs!
     Reply #77 - September 15, 2009, 05:38 PM
    Quote from: Heyjustlooking on September 15, 2009, 03:22 PM
    I'm not quite sure myself but Islam apologists say the correct arabic translation was she was shoved not struck as in hit on the chest but hey I'm just the messenger.

    Either way, not very gentlemenly behaviour of a prophet (dont you think  Huh?)
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  • Re: Muhammad & Germs!
     Reply #78 - January 25, 2011, 06:41 PM
    Question,

    I didn't want to open a new thread for sunnah so i will revive this one... As a Islamic ignorant, I know that what the prophet did and how he behaved is a perfect example for everyone, and therefore we should copy it..

    People copy everything from cutting nails, the way they go in and out of a bathroom, eating habits, hygiene habits etc etc... My question is: "is it sunah if we stay or at least keep our children illiterate for the purpose of following the example of the prophet? "
    Quote from: FreeSoul007 on January 14, 2011, 05:00 AM
    Just look at the sun and the moon, rotating around the earth perfectly! Out of all the never ending space in the universe, the sun and moon ended up close to earth rotating around it perfectly.!!

  • Re: Muhammad & Germs!
     Reply #79 - January 25, 2011, 07:04 PM
    Quote from: Bardhi_i_zi on January 25, 2011, 06:41 PM
    My question is: "is it sunah if we stay or at least keep our children illiterate for the purpose of following the example of the prophet? "

    Yes, provided you can show Mo kept his children illiterate (but I'm not sure if he did)
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  • Re: Muhammad & Germs!
     Reply #80 - January 25, 2011, 10:09 PM
    Quote from: Bardhi_i_zi on January 25, 2011, 06:41 PM
    "is it sunah if we stay or at least keep our children illiterate for the purpose of following the example of the prophet? "

    Hmm..  I've never thought about this one.  I would say the answer is: No, Muslims generally try to teach their kids literacy, so they can read the Quran, first and foremost, and learn Islamic teachings; and secular subjects (secondarily, of course).
    "Many people would sooner die than think; In fact, they do so." -- Bertrand Russell

    Baloney Detection Kit
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