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Theme Changer

 Topic: What I saw today

 (Read 9277 times)
  • 1« Previous thread | Next thread »
  • What I saw today
     OP - July 19, 2009, 01:38 PM

    I can't believe what I saw in Asda. There was a girl, and from her height I could tell that she was no more than 8 years old. She wasn't wearing a hijab, but was dressed exactly like her mum in full niqab/veil! I don't normally feel sorry for young girls in hijab but seeing this girl, I did feel really sorry for her. Surely she can't be having a normal childhood and must be totally isolated from other kids her age.

    I am still in shock as that is something that I have never seen before. I see young girls in hijab all the time but this seemed a little bit too far. The girl has been sexualised at a very young age and surely she can't have a normal childhood.

    Is this becoming more common and will we see more of this in the future? I am saying this because when I was in junior school (age 7 - 11), there was not a single girl in my majority Muslim school who wore a hijab, but now it is very common for girls in that age group to wear hijab. There has been an obvious change there, but will it go even further and will we see young, prepubescent girls in niqab?

    Religion - The hot potato that looked delicious but ended up burning your mouth!

    Knock your head on the ground, don't be miserly in your prayers, listen to your Sidi Sheikh, Allahu Akbar! - Lounes Matoub
  • Re: What I saw today
     Reply #1 - July 19, 2009, 01:57 PM

    20yrs ago in egypt u never saw hijabs on the street and egyptians wore bikinis on the beaches. Now it is rare to see a non-hijabi on the street, even though 10% of the country are Christians. Thank you Carter for not protecting the shah. Thank you Khomeini for taking over. thank you France and Air France for offering Khomeini a free trip to Iran so he can take over while Carter bent over. The 1979 Iranian revolution gave a lot of impetus to the established islamists everywhere. And when Iran looked poised to take over the islamic reigns, Saudis decided they have to compete as well.

    I would estimate post-1979 is when the islamist influence surpassed their governments influence.

    "Ask the slave girl; she will tell you the truth.' So the Apostle called Burayra to ask her. Ali got up and gave her a violent beating first, saying, 'Tell the Apostle the truth.'"
  • Re: What I saw today
     Reply #2 - July 19, 2009, 02:08 PM

    1979 was when I became religious - it was definitely a significant year and as you say the Iranian revolution had a lot to do with it.

    re-niqab - I saw a girl at Islamia start wearing niqab in year 6 (aged 10 or 11) though everyone else at the school considered her a bit of a freak. (It was aslo not her mum or dad who wanted her to do it, but they were Salafis - though mum didn't wear niqab.)
  • Re: What I saw today
     Reply #3 - July 19, 2009, 02:26 PM

    I think its a lot more recent thing and maybe even post 9/11. I was at junior school in the Early - Mid 90s, the school was probably 95% Muslim and there was not a single girl who wore the hijab. When we went to secondary school, some girls obviously started wearing hijab because of puberty and boys etc. but not a single girl wore hijab in primary school. There was even this girl who's father was an imam and she didn't wear a hijab. Now, in the same school, I would say about 30 - 40% of the girls wear hijab.

    And today I saw an 8 year old in niqab! Poor kid! I bet she watches Hannah Montana like most 8 year olds, but watches it with envy!


    Religion - The hot potato that looked delicious but ended up burning your mouth!

    Knock your head on the ground, don't be miserly in your prayers, listen to your Sidi Sheikh, Allahu Akbar! - Lounes Matoub
  • Re: What I saw today
     Reply #4 - July 19, 2009, 03:17 PM

    ....20yrs ago in egypt u never saw hijabs on the street and egyptians wore bikinis on the beaches...


    Yes you are right Baal, I remember seeing some old Egyptian movies (from the late 60s and early 70s) and the atmosphere in Ciro was just like in Rome or Paris today!! Bikinis on beaches and miniskirts on the streets!! It was quite liberal.

    ...I would estimate post-1979 is when the islamist influence surpassed their governments influence....


    I wonder if the political frustration of the Arab world and the powerful advancing of Israel is to blame as well. I mean they are turning to religion as a resort of something!! Just a thought!

    ...
  • Re: What I saw today
     Reply #5 - July 19, 2009, 03:28 PM

    I think its a lot more recent thing and maybe even post 9/11.


    It may have been much later that some places started to become more "Islamic" - but it started with the Iranian revolution 78/79

    I remember Sadat describing the Egyptian women students who began wearing the full niqab as "Walking Tents".  When Sadat was killed in 1982 it was a new and active Islamist Jihadi group with a young doctor at it's head - Ayaman al-Zawahiri.

    I remember the early 80s as Salafism (and Hizbis) spread rapidly in the UK.

    60s and 70s most Muslim women wore mini-skirts and hardly knew what a hijab was - post 1979 these same women were now suddenly wearing islamic dress.

    It started long before 911.

    Ironically 911 - the supposed greatest victory of the Islamists - was the high point and the beginning of the decline - imho.
  • Re: What I saw today
     Reply #6 - July 19, 2009, 05:25 PM

    An 8 yr old girl in full niqab is truly disgusting!  I wonder they were Somali as I have noticed that the Somalis seem to be the youngest to start wearing hijab.  At first I was thinking that maybe they were Saudis then I remember you said that this was at Asda and I immediately went, 'Nah!  Definitely not Saudi as no self-respecting Saudi would be caught dead in Asda!'

    Interestingly enough I was just having a conversation with a friend at the pub earlier today about this very subject and he theorised that what probably causes so many of these girls to put on hijab is due to a romanticised vision of the 'true Islamic society' which has been built up amongst the Muslim communities in the U. K. and their need to latch onto Islam as a sign of identification due to the fact that they don't quite fit into mainstream British society due to their ethnicity.

    Atheism is a non-prophet organization.

    The sleeper has awakened -  Dune

    Give a man a fish, and you'll feed him for a day Give him a religion, and he'll starve to death while praying for a fish!
  • Re: What I saw today
     Reply #7 - July 19, 2009, 05:31 PM

    I can't believe what I saw in Asda. There was a girl, and from her height I could tell that she was no more than 8 years old.




    what would you say to 8 years old girl who wear bikini?

    please read my blog, read how islam will win
    the clash of civilization.

    http://www.xanga.com/hfghj23458654fgha
  • Re: What I saw today
     Reply #8 - July 19, 2009, 05:40 PM

    The difference is, Kope that you NEVER see 8 year old girls in bikinis in Asda.  I had a bikini when I was young but I would never wear it in public, only at home when I was swimming in the family pool (I was living in California at that point in my life).

    Next time the sun is out and it's a hot day, go outside and tally up how many prepubescent girls you see walking down the street with their parents in a bikini.  I bet the answer is none.

    Atheism is a non-prophet organization.

    The sleeper has awakened -  Dune

    Give a man a fish, and you'll feed him for a day Give him a religion, and he'll starve to death while praying for a fish!
  • Re: What I saw today
     Reply #9 - July 19, 2009, 05:41 PM

    An 8 yr old girl in full niqab is truly disgusting!  I wonder they were Somali as I have noticed that the Somalis seem to be the youngest to start wearing hijab.  At first I was thinking that maybe they were Saudis then I remember you said that this was at Asda and I immediately went, 'Nah!  Definitely not Saudi as no self-respecting Saudi would be caught dead in Asda!'


    They definitely weren't Somali. I think the mum was white British as indicated by her accent.

    Quote
    Interestingly enough I was just having a conversation with a friend at the pub earlier today about this very subject and he theorised that what probably causes so many of these girls to put on hijab is due to a romanticised vision of the 'true Islamic society' which has been built up amongst the Muslim communities in the U. K. and their need to latch onto Islam as a sign of identification due to the fact that they don't quite fit into mainstream British society due to their ethnicity.


    I was thinking exactly the same thing the other day, as to why Muslims are more religious now in the UK than they were 10 - 15 years ago.


    what would you say to 8 years old girl who wear bikini?



    I'd say "Kope! Put it away!"

    Religion - The hot potato that looked delicious but ended up burning your mouth!

    Knock your head on the ground, don't be miserly in your prayers, listen to your Sidi Sheikh, Allahu Akbar! - Lounes Matoub
  • Re: What I saw today
     Reply #10 - July 19, 2009, 05:42 PM


    what would you say to 8 years old girl who wear bikini?


    A bikini is normal swim wear, only a weirdo would sexualise the image of an 8 year old wearing one.

    "Befriend them not, Oh murtads, and give them neither parrot nor bunny."  - happymurtad's advice on trolls.
  • Re: What I saw today
     Reply #11 - July 19, 2009, 06:10 PM



    A bikini is normal swim wear, only a weirdo would sexualise the image of an 8 year old wearing one.



    mans pay money to woman to see her body

    please read my blog, read how islam will win
    the clash of civilization.

    http://www.xanga.com/hfghj23458654fgha
  • Re: What I saw today
     Reply #12 - July 19, 2009, 06:13 PM

    The difference is, Kope that you NEVER see 8 year old girls in bikinis in Asda.  I had a bikini when I was young but I would never wear it in public, only at home when I was swimming in the family pool (I was living in California at that point in my life).

    Next time the sun is out and it's a hot day, go outside and tally up how many prepubescent girls you see walking down the street with their parents in a bikini.  I bet the answer is none.

    8 years old girl dont wear bikini?

    please read my blog, read how islam will win
    the clash of civilization.

    http://www.xanga.com/hfghj23458654fgha
  • Re: What I saw today
     Reply #13 - July 19, 2009, 06:15 PM




    I'd say "Kope! Put it away!"




    what do you mean?

    please read my blog, read how islam will win
    the clash of civilization.

    http://www.xanga.com/hfghj23458654fgha
  • Re: What I saw today
     Reply #14 - July 19, 2009, 06:27 PM



    mans pay money to woman to see her body


    8 year old girls are not women, and they are not paid to wear bikinis.  They wear them to the swimming pool because they are normal swimwear, not some kind of sexual fetish costume as you seem to think.

    "Befriend them not, Oh murtads, and give them neither parrot nor bunny."  - happymurtad's advice on trolls.
  • Re: What I saw today
     Reply #15 - July 19, 2009, 06:49 PM

    Thank you Carter for not protecting the shah.


     Roll Eyes Where to start-- okay, how about "Thank you U.S. and U.K. for overthrowing Mossadegh and installing the unpopular shah in the first place, which led to the blowback which became the Iranian Revolution"?

    And why did the US/UK support the overthrow of a democratically-elected government in the first place?

    1. Iran nationalized its oil
    2. The West was afraid of Soviet influence

    Which, in turn, begs the question, why did the US turn about and withdraw support of the autocratic but secular shah? Same reason actually-- Cold War politics. The shah was unpopular and Khomeni hated the godless Soviets. The radical Muslims would be an effective counterweight to Soviet influence in the Middle East and elsewhere in the Muslim world. Same reason the Carter administration got us involved in supporting the shitbag mujahadeen and provoking the Soviet invasion of Afghanistan. The Soviet Union was the king we needed to capture and the Muslim world expendable pawns in the struggle.

    And yet, you seem to think the problem was that we didn't intervene enough. Yeah, okay, there buddy-- because we all know the awesome results that have come from post-WWII US foreign intervention  Roll Eyes

    Quote
    I would estimate post-1979 is when the islamist influence surpassed their governments influence.


    Um, yeah.

    fuck you
  • Re: What I saw today
     Reply #16 - July 19, 2009, 07:52 PM

    From what I've noticed in North America, Hijabs really became popular after 911 as a display of solidarity to counter the persecussion of Muslims that never materialized.

    My style is impetuous, my defense is impregnable and I'm just ferocious. I want your heart. I want to eat your children. Praise be to Allah." -- Mike Tyson
  • Re: What I saw today
     Reply #17 - July 19, 2009, 08:11 PM

    From what I've noticed in North America, Hijabs really became popular after 911 as a display of solidarity to counter the persecussion of Muslims that never materialized.


            That's very much what happened in London as well .
  • Re: What I saw today
     Reply #18 - July 19, 2009, 08:19 PM

    8 year old girls are not women, and they are not paid to wear bikinis.  They wear them to the swimming pool because they are normal swimwear, not some kind of sexual fetish costume as you seem to think.




     Lmao

    ...
  • Re: What I saw today
     Reply #19 - July 19, 2009, 08:22 PM

    8 year old girls are not women, and they are not paid to wear bikinis.  They wear them to the swimming pool because they are normal swimwear, not some kind of sexual fetish costume as you seem to think.

    why do 8 year old girls dresses like adult whore?

    please read my blog, read how islam will win
    the clash of civilization.

    http://www.xanga.com/hfghj23458654fgha
  • Re: What I saw today
     Reply #20 - July 19, 2009, 08:25 PM

    Whores don't wear bikinis.  In fact, in some parts of the world they are far more likely to be wearing niqabs.

    "Befriend them not, Oh murtads, and give them neither parrot nor bunny."  - happymurtad's advice on trolls.
  • Re: What I saw today
     Reply #21 - July 19, 2009, 09:40 PM

    why do 8 year old girls dresses like adult whore?


    You are such a fake, kope.
  • Re: What I saw today
     Reply #22 - July 19, 2009, 10:15 PM

    From what I've noticed in North America, Hijabs really became popular after 911 as a display of solidarity to counter the persecussion of Muslims that never materialized.


    The persecution that never materialized? You mean like the 532 Muslims, Sikhs and Arabs targeted in hate crimes according to the FBI in the three years after 9/11?

    http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_kmafp/is_200405/ai_kepm471659/

    Or perhaps you're referring to the over 1000 legal immigrants from Muslim and Arab countries who were rounded up in Ashcroft's immigration sweeps immediately after 9/11, secretly detained for months then had their visas revoked and were deported without being charged with anything?

    http://www.aclu.org/safefree/general/18776prs20041208.html

    http://abcnews.go.com/WNT/story?id=130365&page=1

    Or the dozens of secular Palestinian political activists detained and deported without charge since 9/11 because they were, well, Palestinian political activists? (Sorry don't have time to look for links for all of them).

    Or when, right after 9/11 an Arab Secret Service Agent was not permitted to board an American Airlines flight because he was (you guessed it) Arab?

    http://archives.cnn.com/2001/US/12/27/rec.agent.airline/

    Or the "Kill All Arabs" graffiti and other such stuff I saw around Boston not long after the 9/11 attacks. Or the people I'd meet in bars who'd go off on "killing all the towelheads", which would inevitably lead to a fight and me being banned from the bar? Or that job I'm pretty sure I didn't get because of my Muslim name only weeks after the attack? And no, I'm not just using that as an excuse-- I was clearly the most qualified candidate of the 4 applicants for the 2 positions and even the other 2 candidates who got the jobs were shocked I didn't get it and figured it was discrimination.

    Well, it's a damn good thing none of those imaginary instances of persecution ever materialized.

    fuck you
  • Re: What I saw today
     Reply #23 - July 21, 2009, 05:48 PM

    Quote
    The persecution that never materialized? You mean like the 532 Muslims, Sikhs and Arabs targeted in hate crimes according to the FBI in the three years after 9/11?


    OK let's look at this figure. 532 hate crimes in 3 years against over 6 million people by a population of 300 million. That is 177 crimes per year, ranging from everything from verbal insults to the one case of that Sikh guy who got shot after 911.
    Would you say the Jews of Britain are persecuted? Because in just 1 year (2004) There were 532 reported hate crimes against British Jews.

    http://books.google.com/books?id=HjjV4DpDNh0C&pg=PA49&lpg=PA49&dq=532+hate+crimes+france&source=bl&ots=_00BjEkmzy&sig=JXSKUa_Ecb6yqdjuzulxTiCV7x4&hl=en&ei=uuFlSozvKZ78tgeY9I31Dw&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=2

    The population of Birtain is a fifth the size of the US. From this we can conclude that Jews in Britain suffered from reported hate crimes at a rate approximately 15 times higher than Muslims in America.

    Quote
    Or perhaps you're referring to the over 1000 legal immigrants from Muslim and Arab countries who were rounded up in Ashcroft's immigration sweeps immediately after 9/11, secretly detained for months then had their visas revoked and were deported without being charged with anything


    This is misleading. Yes over a 1000 Muslims were detained for questioning. You cannot be detained in America for no good reason. If you are then you have a civil liberties case on your hand. I'm sure many think they were treated unfairly, but the fact of the matter is that Homeland Security are not magicians and in order to uncover the real threats, the good need to be sorted from the bad at the good?s inconvenience. BTW 1000 out of 6 million is one in six thousand. Of the Muslims apprehended, about 500 were discovered to be illegal aliens and deported. This is the ACLU's main gripe. They don't think it is fair for someone questioned for terrorism should be deported for illegal status because it is not a related offence.

    If it is the government's intention to get rid of people simply because they are Muslims then why did they allow 96.000 legal Muslim immigrants in 2005?


    "In 2005, more people from Muslim countries became legal permanent United States residents ( nearly 96,000 ) than in any year in the previous two decades. More than 40,000 of them were admitted last year, the highest annual number since the terrorist attacks, according to data on 22 countries provided by the Department of Homeland Security."
    http://fairuse.100webcustomers.com/fairenough/nyt446.html

    HMS in all their incompetence have managed to thwart many planned terror attacks.
    http://www.heritage.org/research/HomelandDefense/images/b2085_chart1-lg.gif

    Quote
    Or the "Kill All Arabs" graffiti and other such stuff I saw around Boston not long after the 9/11 attacks.


    I didn?t see any of that in New York. However graffiti writers represent the lowest elements of a society and their writings do not represent the community at large.

    Quote
    Or the people I'd meet in bars who'd go off on "killing all the towelheads", which would inevitably lead to a fight and me being banned from the bar?


    How many bar room brawls have you been in? What percentage of them were Islamophobia related? I need the statistics before I can make an assessment.

    Quote
    Or that job I'm pretty sure I didn't get because of my Muslim name only weeks after the attack?


    I think most people will attest to losing a job opportunity to a less qualified candidate. Assuming you are right and it wasn't another reason then that is not fair. But you did find a job didn't you? American Muslims (and ones with Muslim names) generally do well in America.

    "Six years after the terrorist attacks on New York and Washington, American Muslims are now self-confident and more influential than ever before. They earn as much money as the average
    American, they go on talk shows to tell their success stories and they are beginning to run for political office.

    American senators offer Muslims internships, members of Congress hire Muslim press secretaries and chiefs of staff and the US State Department recently appointed a female Muslim ambassador who also happens to be its chief advisor on issues of equality.

    Muslims are everywhere in US politics: in government agencies and in the White House, in Congress and on city councils, in city halls and on planning commissions. They are the new imperative of political correctness in the United States. A year ago President George W. Bush announced: "America is stronger because of the countless contributions of Muslim citizens." Less than six months later, in February 2007, he nominated Zalmay Khalilzad, a native of Afghanistan, to the position of US ambassador to the United Nations. Khalilzad is now the most important Muslim in the US cabinet."

    http://www.spiegel.de/international/world/0,1518,505573-2,00.html

    Here are some key findings of a recent Pew Research Poll. American Muslims love it here!

    "Overall, Muslim Americans have a generally positive view of the larger society. Most say their communities are excellent or good places to live.

    A large majority of Muslim Americans believe that hard work pays off in this society. Fully 71% agree that most people who want to get ahead in the United States can make it if they are willing to work hard."

    http://pewresearch.org/pubs/483/muslim-americans

    I am not saying that no Muslim was treated unfairly in America since 911. I am saying that on the whole, Americans have not lashed out at their Muslim neighbours like would have happened in other countries if they had experienced a 911 perpetrated by members of a religious minority.

    My style is impetuous, my defense is impregnable and I'm just ferocious. I want your heart. I want to eat your children. Praise be to Allah." -- Mike Tyson
  • Re: What I saw today
     Reply #24 - July 21, 2009, 07:08 PM

    1979 was when I became religious - it was definitely a significant year and as you say the Iranian revolution had a lot to do with it.

    re-niqab - I saw a girl at Islamia start wearing niqab in year 6 (aged 10 or 11) though everyone else at the school considered her a bit of a freak. (It was aslo not her mum or dad who wanted her to do it, but they were Salafis - though mum didn't wear niqab.)


    So she wanted to wear it?! Do you know why?

    The unlived life is not worth examining.
  • Re: What I saw today
     Reply #25 - July 21, 2009, 07:15 PM

    why do 8 year old girls dresses like adult whore?


    If I saw an 8 year old girl wearing a bikini in Asda I would think it was just as wrong as a walking 8 year old tent.

    The unlived life is not worth examining.
  • Re: What I saw today
     Reply #26 - July 21, 2009, 07:36 PM

    My sister bought my 8 year old a bikini. She is only allowed to wear it at grandma and granpas pool. She has to wear a one piece at the beach.  No bathing suits at Stop and Shop.

    My style is impetuous, my defense is impregnable and I'm just ferocious. I want your heart. I want to eat your children. Praise be to Allah." -- Mike Tyson
  • Re: What I saw today
     Reply #27 - July 21, 2009, 08:54 PM

    Buncha stuff


    You make good points, and yes, it's true that the level of repression many feared did not materialize thankfully-- but to say there was no persecution at all (which is what I took your previous post to mean) is incorrect.

    I mostly agree with what you wrote, except for this part:

    Quote
    You cannot be detained in America for no good reason.


    You don't really believe this, do you? Even citizens get detained all the time for no good reason, and most of these cases rarely make the news-- just some asshole cops being asshole cops.

    Quote
    If you are then you have a civil liberties case on your hand.


    Yeah, good luck with that if you're a dirt-poor immigrant who's just been deported to his dirt-poor country. Even people who've been deported just North of us, haven't had such an easy time getting satisfaction from the US government. Don't have time to look it up at the moment, but I remember there was a case of a Palestinian-Canadian who was in the US legally, was detained for several months by the Feds immediately after 9/11 and beaten by his captors, then deported to Canada without charge, the Canadians then detained him (despite him holding citizenship) because the US convinced them he was some kind of terrorist supporter. Finally the Canadians realized he'd done no wrong, paid him compensation and gave a public apology. The US wouldn't even apologize. Now how much luck you think this guy's gonna have winning a court judgment against the US government? And even if he wins, how long you think it will take? And for some dirt poor sonofabitch being shipped back to Pakistan, what do you think his chances are of finding a lawyer to take his case?

    Quote
    Of the Muslims apprehended, about 500 were discovered to be illegal aliens and deported. This is the ACLU's main gripe. They don't think it is fair for someone questioned for terrorism should be deported for illegal status because it is not a related offence.


    Many were deported for minor paperwork irregularities or for having visas that expired while they were being detained. It's not like all 500 of them were smuggled aboard container ships. Many were on student or tourist visas and had the misfortune of being a Muslim immigrant in the greater NYC area on 9/11, got detained for several months, during which time their visas expired, then got deported far away so the INS and FBI wouldn't have to deal with the consequences of their unfair detention.

    My sister bought my 8 year old a bikini. She is only allowed to wear it at grandma and granpas pool. She has to wear a one piece at the beach.  No bathing suits at Stop and Shop.


    You live in New England? I miss Stop-and-Shop. Pathmark, Acme and Shop-Rite are too inconsistent in their quality.


    fuck you
  • Re: What I saw today
     Reply #28 - July 22, 2009, 06:33 PM

    OK, you got good points too.

    Let me rephrase my original statement. The police are required to provide justification for anyone's detainment. For the most part they are trying to get the guilty ones without wasting time on the innocent, but sometimes they fuck up and when they do they lie to cover their asses. I was once driving in a group of two cars after a few drinks. I was driving the second car following my idiot associates, one of whom was hanging out the window and hollaring back at us. I was driving like a saint. Next thing I new the cops pulled us over and they ask me why someone was hanging out of my car. I felt and was acting completely sober and they gave me the balance test which I passd with flying colours because I can and did hold my foot above the ground indefinately. He told me to put it down after a minute.  I got busted anyway and blew a tiny percentage above the legal limit back at the station. The point is the police report was bullshit. They said I was driving all over the road and was staggering when I walked and had slurred speach. Of course no mention that they pulled over the wrong car! So yes you can be detained for no good reason, but you are given one (legitimate or not) and it is counter-productive of them to randomly arrest people so for the most part I think they try not to do it.

    I din't know Stop and Shop was a New England only chain. Yes I'm in Danbury CT.

    My style is impetuous, my defense is impregnable and I'm just ferocious. I want your heart. I want to eat your children. Praise be to Allah." -- Mike Tyson
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