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 Topic: Dear Ex-Muslim

 (Read 2249 times)
  • 1« Previous thread | Next thread »
  • Dear Ex-Muslim
     OP - September 19, 2009, 11:14 AM

    Just wanted to share a message I got from a Muslim on Youtube. The message is in response to my Video "Prayer".

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MeaEBaoTQn8

    Dear ex-Muslim.

    Peace be with you. I greet you with a pure and sincere greeting.

    I must congratulate you on the feedback you have received. you have indeed touched on a very important and alluring subject.

    Does God answer prayers? Yes and no. God hears all prayers, if you believe he exists or not. God hears insults towards him, and he hears praises of his devotees.

    Allah swt said: And were All?h to hasten for mankind the evil they invoke for themselves and for their children, etc. while in a state of anger) as He hastens for them the good (they invoke) then they would have been ruined. So We leave those who expect not their meeting with Us, in their trespasses, wandering blindly in distraction.

    If God responded to every reckless insult towards him, what would be left of this world?

    INSAN the Arabic word for Man means, "Forgetful one"

    there is another verse: 15. As for man, when his Lord tries him by giving him honour and gifts, then he says (puffed up): "My Lord has honoured me."

    16. But when He tries him, by straitening his means of life, he says: "My Lord has humiliated me!"

    another verse says:
    12. And when harm touches man, he invokes Us, lying down on his side, or sitting or standing. But when We have removed his harm from him, he passes on his way as if he had never invoked Us for a harm that touched him! Thus it seems fair to the Musrif?n[] that which they used to do.

    Mankind is forgetful of the blessings he recieved, whenever hardships and trials are brought to him. you forgot the blessing of a daughter, when God took her away.

    He gives and he takes away. Did God have a purpose of giving her to you, and so soon taking her from you? I cannot answer that.

    God does whatever he wills. Salah is not prayer, rather it is worship. Dua is prayer. Most of the pictures you showed were of Muslims praying Salah. that is a duty God made compulsary on Mankind, and it benefits mankind.

    with Duas in the Salah or outside it, one should ask of Allah. you may refer to the many times or the 50/50 accounts you claim, if one asks he may or may not recieve. its chance you say.

    But then you cannot explain those who have prayed and received a miraculous healing, which cannot be explained by modern science.

    Indeed if you are a agnostic, you should not make sure claims. surely if you do not know. God knows best I believe.

    Peace be with you and May God guide you to what is best...
  • Re: Dear Ex-Muslim
     Reply #1 - September 19, 2009, 11:26 AM

    Peace be with you.

    I'll await your reponse and then we can continue our conversation.
  • Re: Dear Ex-Muslim
     Reply #2 - September 19, 2009, 11:37 AM

    I also made the following reply for your video: Life is a Test.

    "I COULD NOT POST THE LINK TO YOUR VIDEO"

    the last verse you mention was, He who created death and life to test which of you is best in action

    you showed a picture of a child starving in Africa. perhaps that verse would point to the need for people to take ''action'' and do what is right, like helping supply food.

    in cases you showed pictures of dead children, which was perhaps due to a bomb, shootings and what not.

    this stands as a example, that indeed we need to stop conflict, and bloodshed. we need to take action.

    life is a test, for people who are ready to act and who are not ready to act. the people who are in the wrong, are those who do nothing. and say. Why does the Scriptures say, life is a test. WHY DOES GOD SAY LIFE IS A TEST.

    as one great mind once said:

    For evil to prevail good men do nothing

    the point of tests, is to BETTER.

    the Angels asked to the limit of their knowledge: WHY WOULD YOU CREATE SOMETHING THAT WOULD CREATE CORRUPTION AND BLOODSHED ON EARTH?

    God replied: I know that which you know not.

    God knew man is capable of great evil, yet capable of great good.

    Why create something that is bound to fail. that is a naive understanding of mankind. One of mankind's virtues is never giving up, if he fails, he still tries again and again until he succeeds.

    and God fills in the rest,  the shortcomings and loose ends.
  • Re: Dear Ex-Muslim
     Reply #3 - September 19, 2009, 12:19 PM

    Quote
    But then you cannot explain those who have prayed and received a miraculous healing, which cannot be explained by modern science.

    There are no miraculous miracles to explain?  They are all hearsay,mistakes or random chance events.

    My Book     news002       
    My Blog  pccoffee
  • Re: Dear Ex-Muslim
     Reply #4 - September 19, 2009, 12:33 PM

    Quote
    Does God answer prayers? Yes and no. God hears all prayers, if you believe he exists or not. God hears insults towards him, and he hears praises of his devotees.


    Aslamo-Alaikum Emasraw22 - Can you tell me why God doesn't answer the prayers of amputees? The site below might be useful.

    http://whywontgodhealamputees.com/

  • Re: Dear Ex-Muslim
     Reply #5 - September 19, 2009, 12:36 PM

    Quote
    ...If God responded to every reckless insult towards him, what would be left of this world?...

     That depends how He responds, if he destroy, then, He is not The All-Compassionate and rather behaving like a dictator but if he respond by showing the way then, Its, God. Because eventually, it is Us that had to choose.

    Quote
    ...God does whatever he wills...

    So can The Most Holly sent his own creations astray (as in quran 2:7, 2:10, 6:25, 6:125) and thereby sending them hell? Devils sent people astray, not God for he is the Most Holly and sending His creations astray is unHolly  

    Quote
    ... Salah is not prayer, rather it is worship. Dua is prayer....

    Correction, Salah is prayer is worship. Dua, on the other hand is asking Allah for something


    ...God replied: I know that which you know not.....


     Why the secrecy God? the angles had the point, you know.
  • Re: Dear Ex-Muslim
     Reply #6 - September 19, 2009, 12:57 PM


    the Angels asked to the limit of their knowledge: WHY WOULD YOU CREATE SOMETHING THAT WOULD CREATE CORRUPTION AND BLOODSHED ON EARTH?
    God replied: I know that which you know not.


    It's funny that mentioned that verse, I do have a question for you though. If the Angels had limited knowledge, how WOULD THEY KNOW that humans would create corruption and bloodshed, if there wasn't even a single human to being with?.

    "Hanifs (Muslims) are stumbling, Christians all astray
    Jews wildered, Magians far on error's way.
    We mortals are composed of two great schools:
    Enlightened knaves or else religious fools....."

    Muslim freethinkers society:  http://www.facebook.com/editapps.php?ref=mb#/group.php?gid=2251053
  • Re: Dear Ex-Muslim
     Reply #7 - September 19, 2009, 01:35 PM

    Quote from: Emasraw22
    the Angels asked to the limit of their knowledge: WHY WOULD YOU CREATE SOMETHING THAT WOULD CREATE CORRUPTION AND BLOODSHED ON EARTH?God replied: I know that which you know not.
    Quote from: arabie
    It's funny that mentioned that verse, I do have a question for you though. If the Angels had limited knowledge, how WOULD THEY KNOW that humans would create corruption and bloodshed, if there wasn't even a single human to being with?.

     

     I think that he meant to the limit to their knowledge as compared to God.

  • Re: Dear Ex-Muslim
     Reply #8 - September 19, 2009, 01:55 PM

    Yeah, but still. does that mean that the angels also know the futur, because that's how it seems.

    "Hanifs (Muslims) are stumbling, Christians all astray
    Jews wildered, Magians far on error's way.
    We mortals are composed of two great schools:
    Enlightened knaves or else religious fools....."

    Muslim freethinkers society:  http://www.facebook.com/editapps.php?ref=mb#/group.php?gid=2251053
  • Re: Dear Ex-Muslim
     Reply #9 - September 19, 2009, 02:52 PM

    Peace be with you all.

    There have been a number of questions directed towards me, and being busy because of Eid al fitr being tommorrow, I can only answer a few, and God willing, will have more time after Sunday.

    As for the Question of how did the Angels know, Man would cause such corruption and bloodshed on earth. There is a authentic narration which says, the Jinn created mischief on earth and corrupted it before the Creation of mankind, who also happened to be given Free Will.

    The Quran speaks about in in Surah Hijr. when Allah says: and we created Jinn before from smokeless fire.

    Most correctly translate Salah as worship rather then Prayer. and designate Dua as prayer. since the Salah may include duas, it at times is also designated as Prayer. the reason I wanted to make a distinction is because, when you pray Salah, you are not doing it in expectation of a thing, like when one would go on his knees and supplicate. Rather it is to fulfill the command "I have not created mankind and Jinn except that they may worship me"

    and Allah swt knows best. I will try to answer all your questions, to the best of my ability, and if I cannot answer, I will be honest and say, I do not have the knowledge, and I do not know.

    I hope that sounds good for all of you. Peace be with you all.
  • Re: Dear Ex-Muslim
     Reply #10 - September 19, 2009, 02:54 PM

    Quote
    INSAN the Arabic word for Man means, "Forgetful one"


    Welcome to the forum Emasraw22.


    Insan does not mean Forgetful one. This is false. Insan means the "obvious" as oposed to "Jin" the unseen creature. I am sorry I have no time now to translate it from Arabic, but here you go I copied and pasted it from a website that explained it thouroughly:


    إن أصل كلمة "إنسان"، وكذا "إنس"، و "أنس": في كلام العرب من الإيناس؛ ومعناه: الإبصار.
    يقال: أنَسْته، وأنِسْته؛ أي أبصرته. وقيل للإنس: إنس. لأنهم يؤنسون؛ أي يبصرون. كما قيل للجن: جن. لأنهم لا يؤنسون؛ أي لا يرون. كذا ذكر الأزهري.

    وكذا جاء المعنى في القرآن الكريم، قال تعالى: {فإن آنستم منهم رشدا}؛ رأيتم.
    وفي قوله تعالى: {آنس من جانب الطور نارا}؛ أي أبصر. فالاستئناس في كلام العرب بمعنى النظر.
    وإنسان العين هو ما ينظر به، وهو السواد الذي في العين، قال ابن سيده:
    أشارت لإنسان بإنسان عينها
    لتقتل إنسانا بإنسان كفها

    فتحصّل من هذا أن كلمة "إنسان" في كلام العرب يرجع إلى معنى الظهور، عكس الجن.
    ثم إنهم ذكروا للإنسان معنى آخر هو: النسيان. فقد أورد ابن منظور عن ابن عباس قوله: "إنما سمي الإنسان إنسانا؛ لأنه عهد إليه فنسي"، كما في قوله تعالى: {ولقد عهدنا إلى آدم من قبل فنسي ولم نجد له عزما}. وبهذا قال الكوفيون: إنه مشتق من النسيان.

    وبهذا فإن معنى الإنسان، الذي محور حديثنا، يرجع في معناه، في كلام العرب، إلى: الظهور، والنسيان.

    ومعرفة هذه النتيجة لها دور مهم، في تحديد ما يجب أن يكون الإنسان عليه، فما دام أن الظهور أصل معناه، فيفترض به أن يكون الظهور سمته البارزة، فيحقق هذا المعنى في: نفسه، وطريقته، وحياته. فيكون ظاهرا في:
    - مبادئه، وقيمه، وأخلاقه، ودينه الذي يؤمن به، فلا يستخفي، ولا يتوارى، كما يتوارى الجن.
    - في أقواله، وأفعاله، يوافق ظاهره باطنه، مجتنبا لحن القول، ومخالفة الظاهر للباطن، كما حال المنافقين.

    ومبنى هذا الافتراض، ووجوب التحقق: ما عرف وثبت، من أن الأسماء لها أثر في مسمياتها، وكما قيل: "كل له من اسمه نصيب"، فهذا في الأسماء المسماة باجتهاد واختيار الوالدين، فكيف بالاسم الذي تعلق بهذا الكائن، حين عدمه، وحين وجوده، والذي علقه به وأطلقه عليه، الذي خلقه، وهو أعلم به.

    وأما النسيان، فيستفاد منه: أن الإنسان فيه هذا العقل. فهو الذي يتذكر، وهو الذي ينسى، فالنسيان علامة وجود العقل، وإذا عرف الإنسان أن معناه مرتبط بهذه الآلة: العقل. كان مما يجب عليه أن يرعى هذه النعمة حق الرعاية:بالحفظ، والنماء. فالعقل جرم عجيب، من حيث إنه صغير الحجم، لكنه كبير السعة، حفظا وفهما، فمن الرعاية استثماره وتنميته، وإهماله يعني فقد جزء أساس من الإنسانية.

    هذا ما يتعلق بالإنسان، في تعريفه: لغة ً. بقي أن نقول:
    - إن الإنسان اسم جنس يطلق على الذكر والأنثى.
    إذن فكل ما قيل سابقا، يعم الذكر، والأنثى: الرجل، والمرأة. الشاب، والفتاة. بحد سواء.

    ------------

    إنسان من ناحية لفظية هي كلمة ثنائية الوزن و ذلك يتضح من وجود الآلف و النون في نهاية الكلمة آي على وزن فعلان , و بالتالي تكون كلمة إنسان مثنى من مفردة هي انس و مفردة أخري هي انس أيضا , الآمر الذي يعني لنا آن هناك مركب من نفس و جسد و هما مركبان ماديان مرتبطان و في جدال و حوار بينهما دائم .
    و لكل منهما خصائصه و يحتكمان إلى العقل , و إذا انفصم الارتباط بينهما يحدث انفصام الشخصية و يعطي بالتالي شخصيتان , متباينتان في التصرفات .

    ------------

    إنسان هي مثنى لكلمة إنس ,فأنت إنس في ذاتك إنس لغيرك
    إنس + إنس يساوي إنسان
    فأنت نصف إنسان ولا أستطيع
    أن أطلق عليك إنساناً كاملاً
    إلا إذا أتيت بنصفك الآخر ..


    ref: http://xfriend.blogspot.com/2006/09/blog-post_10.html

    ...
  • Re: Dear Ex-Muslim
     Reply #11 - September 19, 2009, 03:12 PM

    Peace be with you all.

    There have been a number of questions directed towards me, and being busy because of Eid al fitr being tommorrow, I can only answer a few, and God willing, will have more time after Sunday.

    As for the Question of how did the Angels know, Man would cause such corruption and bloodshed on earth. There is a authentic narration which says, the Jinn created mischief on earth and corrupted it before the Creation of mankind, who also happened to be given Free Will.
    The Quran speaks about in in Surah Hijr. when Allah says: and we created Jinn before from smokeless fire.



    i would like to see the autehntic narration, if you can provide one, that would be great.

    "Hanifs (Muslims) are stumbling, Christians all astray
    Jews wildered, Magians far on error's way.
    We mortals are composed of two great schools:
    Enlightened knaves or else religious fools....."

    Muslim freethinkers society:  http://www.facebook.com/editapps.php?ref=mb#/group.php?gid=2251053
  • Re: Dear Ex-Muslim
     Reply #12 - September 19, 2009, 03:45 PM

    Peace be with you.

    I'll await your reponse and then we can continue our conversation.


    Hi Emasrawi - I am out of the house right now - just checking mail at an internet cafe and then I gotta go - so I hope u will forgive me if I respond tomorrow.

    Thanks for popping in  Afro  and welcome  Smiley
  • Re: Dear Ex-Muslim
     Reply #13 - September 19, 2009, 04:38 PM

    Salam, and welcome to the forum!

    I just have a comment about something you said:

    God knew man is capable of great evil, yet capable of great good.

    Why create something that is bound to fail. that is a naive understanding of mankind. One of mankind's virtues is never giving up, if he fails, he still tries again and again until he succeeds.

    and God fills in the rest,  the shortcomings and loose ends.


    I completely agree with the bolded part. Why indeed? It makes absolutely no sense. But you say that man never gives up and keeps trying to be better until he succeeds. That is certainly true for some people and in some situations, but I ask you this: what about after he dies? Does God give man a chance to better himself after death? As far as I know, the answer is NO. And we know from what the Qur'an tells us that there WILL be many humans who FAIL God's "test" during life and end up in hell. Hell is not a place where man can try again until he succeeds. It is doom and torture for ETERNITY. So I'd like to ask you the same question you posed dear Emasraw22, "Why create something that is bound to fail?"

    Hope you're having a good Eid  Smiley

    "when you've got thousands of hadith/sunnah and a book like the Qur'an where abrogation is propagated by some; anyone with a grudge and some time on their hands can find something to confirm what ever they wish"- Kaiwai
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