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Theme Changer

 Poll

  • Question: Should men have the right to have a baby aborted when they're not ready for it?
  • Yes - 10 (19.6%)
  • No - 41 (80.4%)
  • Total Voters: 51

 Topic: Men's right to abortions

 (Read 55747 times)
  • Previous page 1 ... 11 12 1314 15 ... 19 Next page « Previous thread | Next thread »
  • Re: Men's right to abortions
     Reply #360 - December 30, 2009, 11:34 PM
    Quote
    I know abortion is not a procedure

    About time you admitted this!

    Quote
    but neither is forced fatherhood just a procedure or just a label. All of the man's rights and concerns shouldn't get thrown out of the window like that.

    You can walk away from fatherhood, those are your rights. And guilt for this is NOT a valid reason for forcing a procedure on another human being. I'd love to know how you'd live with the guilt of invading another persons body against their will and leaving them permanently scarred. Is this guilt more preferable for you then letting a child live without you needing to even look after it if you don't want to?
    ~My story~
    ~Collection of unethical hadiths/surahs~
  • Re: Men's right to abortions
     Reply #361 - December 30, 2009, 11:45 PM
    Quote
    You can walk away from fatherhood, those are your rights. And guilt for this is NOT a valid reason for forcing a procedure on another human being. I'd love to know how you'd live with the guilt of invading another persons body against their will and leaving them permanently scarred. Is this guilt more preferable for you then letting a child live without you needing to even look after it if you don't want to?


    As you know I've been talking about early stage abortions. Those are relatively painless. Considering that:

    - The woman will need to go through a surgery/invasion regardless even if she gives birth
    - And a short procedure while not being ideal, is better than a living, breathing human being you're supposed to look after

    Those 2 factors make the abortion seem a lot less guilt inducing and stressful than becoming a father. I would make it up to the girl after the abortion, really...

    I think that just the way you think I'm not understanding that abortion is not just a procedure, you're also not understanding that becoming a father and having a living being with your DNA and which looks like you and might have your last name and nationality is a lot for a man to cope with, esp. when he doesn't want a kid, and he can't just walk away from it without major emotional breakdown. I'm sure some men can do that but I can't and I know many others can't.
  • Re: Men's right to abortions
     Reply #362 - December 30, 2009, 11:55 PM
    Quote
    I would make it up to the girl after the abortion, really...

    How nice of you! You've invaded her body by force and now you wanna make it up to her! I'm sure she'll be sooo understanding!

    You are so screwed up in the head it's unbelievable!

    Quote
    he can't just walk away from it without major emotional breakdown.

    And a forced abortion wont do that at all will it? Jesus fucking christ!

    Bah just forget it!
    ~My story~
    ~Collection of unethical hadiths/surahs~
  • Re: Men's right to abortions
     Reply #363 - December 31, 2009, 12:00 AM
    Her body will get invaded either way, whether through childbirth or an abortion.

    Plus if the woman understood the man's right to reject fatherhood, just like men these days accept the right of the woman to choose what to do with her body, most women will understand and respect the man's decision. It will not need to be forced
  • Re: Men's right to abortions
     Reply #364 - December 31, 2009, 12:03 AM
    A lot of passion in this thread i see. I would generally like to think after all precautions have been taken, that it is a mutual decision if a pregnancy results, but no way should a man have the right to terminate just because he is not ready. I wouldn't want a child to be born to a useless father either. Two parents are usually better than one not always the case though. A bit of a tough call.
    "The ideal tyranny is that which is ignorantly self-administered by its victims. The most perfect slaves are, therefore, those which blissfully and unawaredly enslave themselves."
  • Re: Men's right to abortions
     Reply #365 - December 31, 2009, 12:08 AM
    I think there's a misconception here about what I'm proposing.

    I'm not saying lets make a law that forces abortion on women so men can fuck as much as they want and women can't do anything about it.

    I'm saying men's right to not accept fatherhood should be legally acknowledged, and with this knowledge available to all women, and with it formally accepted by law, most women will understand this right and accept it, and learn to respect the man's decision if he wants to abort the baby, just like most reasonable men these days respect the woman's decision if she wants to abort it.

    This will naturally lead to more 'mutual' abortions compared to the forced fatherhoods. The most this law will usually do is give more weight to the man's opinion in the woman's eyes.
  • Re: Men's right to abortions
     Reply #366 - December 31, 2009, 12:11 AM
    Quote from: PeruvianSkies on December 30, 2009, 11:55 PM
    Bah just forget it!


    Pretty much.
    Quote from: thinkfree on September 28, 2010, 07:58 PM
    Iblis has mad debaterin' skillz. Best not step up unless you're prepared to recieve da pain.

  • Re: Men's right to abortions
     Reply #367 - December 31, 2009, 12:12 AM
    Quote from: liberated on December 31, 2009, 12:08 AM
    I think there's a misconception here about what I'm proposing.

    I'm not saying lets make a law that forces abortion     on women so men can fuck as much as they want and women can't do anything about it.

    I'm saying men's right to not accept fatherhood should be legally acknowledged, and with this knowledge available to all women, and with it formally accepted by law, most women will understand this right and accept it, and learn to respect the man's decision if he wants to abort the baby, just like most reasonable men these days respect the woman's decision if she wants to abort it.


    Srsly, just stop.. just stop...
    Quote from: thinkfree on September 28, 2010, 07:58 PM
    Iblis has mad debaterin' skillz. Best not step up unless you're prepared to recieve da pain.

  • Re: Men's right to abortions
     Reply #368 - December 31, 2009, 12:46 AM
    Quote from: liberated on December 30, 2009, 11:45 PM
    As you know I've been talking about early stage abortions. Those are relatively painless. Considering that:

    - The woman will need to go through a surgery/invasion regardless even if she gives birth
    - And a short procedure while not being ideal, is better than a living, breathing human being you're supposed to look after

    Those 2 factors make the abortion seem a lot less guilt inducing and stressful than becoming a father. I would make it up to the girl after the abortion, really...

    I think that just the way you think I'm not understanding that abortion is not just a procedure, you're also not understanding that becoming a father and having a living being with your DNA and which looks like you and might have your last name and nationality is a lot for a man to cope with, esp. when he doesn't want a kid, and he can't just walk away from it without major emotional breakdown. I'm sure some men can do that but I can't and I know many others can't.


    So how would you make it up to her Lib, flowers or candy? Especially to girl whos still devastated three years on? Id be interseted to know. Seeing as how her feeling this way is worth it and meant to spare your guilt.


    Quote
    After it was over, i went home and stayed in bed for 3 days. I told my dad and he cried. He would let me touch him for four months after that. he brought me a book to write in. I tried commiting suicide twice. Even now i am crying and its been 3 years.


    What would you say to her after making her abort her baby?
    "We were married by a Reform rabbi in Long Island. A very Reform rabbi. A Nazi."-- Woody Allen
  • Re: Men's right to abortions
     Reply #369 - December 31, 2009, 12:50 AM
    Quote
    . He would let me touch him for four months after that.

    What the hell is that about? Huh? (not being an ass or anything but that just sounds dodgy unless I'm reading it all wrong)

    EDIT: Did she mean wouldn't rather then would?
    ~My story~
    ~Collection of unethical hadiths/surahs~
  • Re: Men's right to abortions
     Reply #370 - December 31, 2009, 12:54 AM
    Quote from: liberated on December 31, 2009, 12:00 AM
    Her body will get invaded either way, whether through childbirth or an abortion.

    Plus if the woman understood the man's right to reject fatherhood, just like men these days accept the right of the woman to choose what to do with her body, most women will understand and respect the man's decision. It will not need to be forced


    Do a little experiment. Take a poll with a bunch of random chicks. Obv not us forum girls cuz there must be sth wrong with us if we dont wanna give up rights to our bodies Roll Eyes. Come back and tell us how many chicks would be OK with a man having the right to an abortion.

    Youd best realize that most people think like us. Only I have the right to my body. Under no circumstances can any one else. Go see how many people you can get to disagree with this.

    You see childbirth as an invasion. How nice.

    Honestly, disgusting.
    "We were married by a Reform rabbi in Long Island. A very Reform rabbi. A Nazi."-- Woody Allen
  • Re: Men's right to abortions
     Reply #371 - December 31, 2009, 12:58 AM
    Quote from: PeruvianSkies on December 31, 2009, 12:50 AM
    What the hell is that about? Huh? (not being an ass or anything but that just sounds dodgy unless I'm reading it all wrong)

    EDIT: Did she mean wouldn't rather then would?


    seriously, I dont know. I tried reading it diff ways. I think she means what you said or she means contact. Its prob a typo...anyways...not the point...shes suicidal...read that part.
    "We were married by a Reform rabbi in Long Island. A very Reform rabbi. A Nazi."-- Woody Allen
  • Re: Men's right to abortions
     Reply #372 - December 31, 2009, 01:00 AM
    I Can't Forget

    Quote
    It will almost 3yrs(Jan 5,2007) since I had the abortion. I know the date so clearly is because I had it done on my boyfriend now husband's birthday. I didn't want to go through it; but he didn't want it the baby. The first words out of his mouth was he don't want it. That I needed to take care of it.So at 8weeks I made the appointment at the clinic on his birthday. I wanted him to remember it always like me. I'm 32yrs old now and i remember every minute I was in the clinic. I hate myself every day for what i done...For you see I didn't believe in abortion when I did it. I have to buetiful kids from my first marraige. I'm truely sorry for what I did. And I think about it all the time.


    http://www.experienceproject.com/stories/Had-An-Abortion/808493
    "We were married by a Reform rabbi in Long Island. A very Reform rabbi. A Nazi."-- Woody Allen
  • Re: Men's right to abortions
     Reply #373 - December 31, 2009, 01:04 AM
    Quote from: Angel54 on December 31, 2009, 12:54 AM
    Do a little experiment. Take a poll with a bunch of random chicks. Obv not us forum girls cuz there must be sth wrong with us if we dont wanna give up rights to our bodies Roll Eyes. Come back and tell us how many chicks would be OK with a man having the right to an abortion.

    Youd best realize that most people think like us. Only I have the right to my body. Under no circumstances can any one else. Go see how many people you can get to disagree with this.

    You see childbirth as an invasion. How nice.

    Honestly, disgusting.

    Or better yet, aim the poll at males instead and see how many agree with you.
    ~My story~
    ~Collection of unethical hadiths/surahs~
  • Re: Men's right to abortions
     Reply #374 - December 31, 2009, 01:06 AM
    Quote from: Angel54 on December 31, 2009, 12:58 AM
    seriously, I dont know. I tried reading it diff ways. I think she means what you said or she means contact. Its prob a typo...anyways...not the point...shes suicidal...read that part.

    I know it's horrible. It'll go straight past liberated's head though as it doesn't involve men suffering. We're just being selfish really Roll Eyes
    ~My story~
    ~Collection of unethical hadiths/surahs~
  • Re: Men's right to abortions
     Reply #375 - December 31, 2009, 01:11 AM
    Quote
    Do a little experiment. Take a poll with a bunch of random chicks. Obv not us forum girls cuz there must be sth wrong with us if we dont wanna give up rights to our bodies . Come back and tell us how many chicks would be OK with a man having the right to an abortion.


    Obviously girls will not be ok giving up their power. But this is not about appeasing to the girls or making the girls happy. This is about equality and rights. How is it fair to talk only about the girls' trauma and not about the guys' trauma in case of a forced fatherhood?

    Girls already have the power to abort a child even without the man's consent. But they should not be allowed to force fatherhood on a man. Men should have that right of refusing to become a father. It simply makes their rights equal.

    Growing the baby in your fetus does not give you the right to force fatherhood on a man without his consent. Nothing you say will change this.

    Guys are physically stronger than women. Would you like it if they beat up every woman they saw? They're biologically at an advantage, after all. My body, my decision what I do with it, huh? But they don't because its a civilized society and we respect each other's rights. Similarly, women are biologically at an advantage when it comes to babies but it does not mean they should abuse this right to force fatherhood on men who are not ready to become fathers.

    Quote
    Go see how many people you can get to disagree with this.


    Go try see how many people you can get to agree with abortion at all in some backward countries. Or to get them to agree that islam is a false religion. Or get people to agree with black people not being slaves in the 1800s. A majority agreeing with something does not make it right.

    Quote
    You see childbirth as an invasion. How nice.


    It is a physical invasion. Do you dispute that?
  • Re: Men's right to abortions
     Reply #376 - December 31, 2009, 01:13 AM
    Quote
    Or better yet, aim the poll at males instead and see how many agree with you.


    Many men in some places will also agree that gay men should be killed or sent to jail. Again, the majority of people agreeing with something does not mean the minority's rights should be violated. Forcing fatherhood on a man who doesn't want to be a father remains a violation of his rights.
  • Re: Men's right to abortions
     Reply #377 - December 31, 2009, 01:19 AM
    Quote from: Angel54 on December 31, 2009, 12:46 AM
    What would you say to her after making her abort her baby?


    What would you say to a man after making him a father without his consent?
  • Re: Men's right to abortions
     Reply #378 - December 31, 2009, 01:23 AM
    Quote from: liberated on December 31, 2009, 01:13 AM
    Many men in some places will also agree that gay men should be killed or sent to jail. Again, the majority of people agreeing with something does not mean the minority's rights should be violated. Forcing fatherhood on a man who doesn't want to be a father remains a violation of his rights.

    And forcing a traumatic procedure isn't a violation of anything right?

    Homosexuality harms no one, abortion does. MAJOR difference there.
    ~My story~
    ~Collection of unethical hadiths/surahs~
  • Re: Men's right to abortions
     Reply #379 - December 31, 2009, 01:27 AM
    Quote from: liberated on December 31, 2009, 01:19 AM
    What would you say to a man after making him a father without his consent?


    Answer my question. answer my friggin question before you get one. Simple
    "We were married by a Reform rabbi in Long Island. A very Reform rabbi. A Nazi."-- Woody Allen
  • Re: Men's right to abortions
     Reply #380 - December 31, 2009, 01:28 AM
    Quote
    And forcing a traumatic procedure isn't a violation of anything right?


    How does abortion being traumatizing means it is OK to force fatherhood on a man without his consent which is also traumatizing?

    1) Women have the right to abort a child even without a man's consent even if it traumatizes the man to see his baby killed.

    2) Men should have the right to have a baby aborted without the woman's consent even if it traumatizes the woman to have the baby killed.

    3) Abortion is a less risky, less invasive, and relatively pain-free procedure compared to pregnancy and childbirth, hence the woman is not being put at any risk through this procedure.

    4) Men are also traumatized if their baby is killed without their consent, but they suck it up and live with it because they respect the woman's right to not become a mother if she's not ready. Similarly women should also accept the right of a man to not become a father if he's not ready and suck it up.

    Quote
    Homosexuality harms no one, abortion does. MAJOR difference there.


    Abortion is already allowed to the woman. It should also be allowed to the man. Equal rights.
  • Re: Men's right to abortions
     Reply #381 - December 31, 2009, 01:29 AM
    I think women should be legally compelled to blow me. Or else it will cause me irreparable mental harm. After all they are forcing dry-cock on me. Astagfirullah, dry-cock is a violation of my basic rights!
    Quote from: thinkfree on September 28, 2010, 07:58 PM
    Iblis has mad debaterin' skillz. Best not step up unless you're prepared to recieve da pain.

  • Re: Men's right to abortions
     Reply #382 - December 31, 2009, 01:29 AM
    Quote from: Angel54 on December 31, 2009, 01:27 AM
    Answer my question. answer my friggin question before you get one. Simple


    Why should I? My question is as important & relavant as yours.
  • Re: Men's right to abortions
     Reply #383 - December 31, 2009, 01:30 AM
    Quote from: Kafirist on December 31, 2009, 01:29 AM
    I think women should be forced to blow me. Or else it will cause me irreparable mental harm. After all they are forcing dry-cock on me. Astagfirullah, dry-cock is a violation of my basic rights!


    Shut up please.
  • Re: Men's right to abortions
     Reply #384 - December 31, 2009, 01:30 AM
     Cheesy

    Quote from: thinkfree on September 28, 2010, 07:58 PM
    Iblis has mad debaterin' skillz. Best not step up unless you're prepared to recieve da pain.

  • Re: Men's right to abortions
     Reply #385 - December 31, 2009, 01:35 AM
    Quote
    How does abortion being traumatizing means it is OK to force fatherhood on a man without his consent which is also traumatizing?

    No one is forcing fatherhood on you, just walk the fuck away! I dont give a shit about your guilt, it does not justify invading someone elses goddamn body! You are wanting to force an invasive procedure on a woman without her consent!

    Quote
    Abortion is already allowed to the woman. It should also be allowed to the man. Equal rights.

    You have NO rights to another persons body, ever! That is NOT equal rights!

    Quote
    2) Men should have the right to have a baby aborted without the woman's consent even if it traumatizes the woman to have the baby killed.

    Cheesy I love the hypocrisy of that statement. I also love how you keep changing your opinions when it suits you.

    Thank fuck we live in a democratic country.

    ~My story~
    ~Collection of unethical hadiths/surahs~
  • Re: Men's right to abortions
     Reply #386 - December 31, 2009, 01:37 AM
    Quote from: liberated on December 31, 2009, 01:11 AM
    Obviously girls will not be ok giving up their power. But this is not about appeasing to the girls or making the girls happy. This is about equality and rights. How is it fair to talk only about the girls' trauma and not about the guys' trauma in case of a forced fatherhood?

    Girls already have the power to abort a child even without the man's consent. But they should not be allowed to force fatherhood on a man. Men should have that right of refusing to become a father. It simply makes their rights equal.

    Growing the baby in your fetus does not give you the right to force fatherhood on a man without his consent. Nothing you say will change this.

    Guys are physically stronger than women. Would you like it if they beat up every woman they saw? They're biologically at an advantage, after all. My body, my decision what I do with it, huh? But they don't because its a civilized society and we respect each other's rights. Similarly, women are biologically at an advantage when it comes to babies but it does not mean they should abuse this right to force fatherhood on men who are not ready to become fathers.

    Go try see how many people you can get to agree with abortion at all in some backward countries. Or to get them to agree that islam is a false religion. Or get people to agree with black people not being slaves in the 1800s. A majority agreeing with something does not make it right.

    It is a physical invasion. Do you dispute that?


    What do you think invasion means?

    a backward country--like Afghanistan. Not many I guess. why the fuck would we use the opinion of the majority of people in country we find morally backward in its practices to guide our own. Your cultural relativist bullshit wont fly. We are more morally advanced than people in backward country. We've evolved to believe in certain things. We oppose certain things that we find morally reprehensible that wouldn't have been thought of before. Marital rape wasnt that big a deal at one time, now it is. Are you saying it is OK to argue marital rape isnt so bad because ppl in Iraq dont even recognize it as a crime?

    How are you so blind? What you want id for the woman's trauma to be neglected in favor of the man's. You come acrros extrememly hateful of women.
    "We were married by a Reform rabbi in Long Island. A very Reform rabbi. A Nazi."-- Woody Allen
  • Re: Men's right to abortions
     Reply #387 - December 31, 2009, 01:37 AM
    Quote from: Kafirist on December 31, 2009, 01:29 AM
    I think women should be legally compelled to blow me. Or else it will cause me irreparable mental harm. After all they are forcing dry-cock on me. Astagfirullah, dry-cock is a violation of my basic rights!

    Oh noes we dont want traumatised men with dry cocks! Cheesy
    ~My story~
    ~Collection of unethical hadiths/surahs~
  • Re: Men's right to abortions
     Reply #388 - December 31, 2009, 01:38 AM
    Quote from: liberated on December 31, 2009, 01:29 AM
    Why should I? My question is as important & relavant as yours.


    I belive i asked first. dont answer me with a question.
    "We were married by a Reform rabbi in Long Island. A very Reform rabbi. A Nazi."-- Woody Allen
  • Re: Men's right to abortions
     Reply #389 - December 31, 2009, 01:39 AM
    I cant tell why Im still bothering with this. Honestly
    "We were married by a Reform rabbi in Long Island. A very Reform rabbi. A Nazi."-- Woody Allen
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