Quran 3:93, Was Israel a man?

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Quran 3:93, Was Israel a man?
OP - January 27, 2010, 08:34 AM

Quote
003.093
YUSUFALI: All food was lawful to the Children of Israel, except what Israel Made unlawful for itself, before the Law (of Moses) was revealed. Say: "Bring ye the Law and study it, if ye be men of truth."

PICKTHAL: All food was lawful unto the Children of Israel, save that which Israel forbade himself, (in days) before the Torah was revealed. Say: Produce the Torah and read it (unto us) if ye are truthful.

SHAKIR: All food was lawful to the children of Israel except that which Israel had forbidden to himself, before the Taurat was revealed. Say: Bring then the Taurat and read it, if you are truthful.

Quote
كُلُّ ٱلطَّعَامِ كَانَ حِلًّۭا لِّبَنِىٓ إِسْرَٰٓءِيلَ إِلَّا مَا حَرَّمَ إِسْرَٰٓءِيلُ عَلَىٰ نَفْسِهِۦ مِن قَبْلِ أَن تُنَزَّلَ ٱلتَّوْرَىٰةُ ۗ قُلْ فَأْتُوا۟ بِٱلتَّوْرَىٰةِ فَٱتْلُوهَآ إِن كُنتُمْ صَٰدِقِينَ ﴿٣٩﴾

Arabic transliteration Ala Nafsihi which means On himself

Was this is a grammatical error? Or is Israel a prophet? I thought it was a country or region? And can someone explain the second part, bring the taurat and read it. Does that mean that they won't find that all food was lawful? Or that all food was lawful? This makes no sense, what is the Taurut? The Old Testament? Which book?

Also, notice how Yusuf Ali translates it as "for itself". Was this what Mo really meant? But that would be a direct mistake then.
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Re: Quran 3:93, Was Israel a man?
Reply #1 - January 27, 2010, 11:13 AM

Wow, Yusuf Ali always ready for the shameless fraud --> itself instead of himself.

"Ask the slave girl; she will tell you the truth.' So the Apostle called Burayra to ask her. Ali got up and gave her a violent beating first, saying, 'Tell the Apostle the truth.'"
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Re: Quran 3:93, Was Israel a man?
Reply #2 - January 27, 2010, 11:17 AM

Quote from: BlackDog on January 27, 2010, 08:34 AM
Arabic transliteration Ala Nafsihi which means On himself

Was this is a grammatical error? Or is Israel a prophet? I thought it was a country or region?

Israel was another name for the Prophet Yaqub (Jacob)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yaqub

Quote from: BlackDog on January 27, 2010, 08:34 AM
And can someone explain the second part, bring the taurat and read it. Does that mean that they won't find that all food was lawful? Or that all food was lawful? This makes no sense, what is the Taurut? The Old Testament? Which book?

Also, notice how Yusuf Ali translates it as "for itself". Was this what Mo really meant? But that would be a direct mistake then.

Ibn Kathir explains the verse in his tafsir
http://www.tafsir.com/default.asp?sid=3&tid=8761

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Re: Quran 3:93, Was Israel a man?
Reply #3 - January 27, 2010, 11:56 AM

In the Bible, Jacob had the name Israel too.

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Re: Quran 3:93, Was Israel a man?
Reply #4 - January 27, 2010, 12:05 PM

Ah ok thanks guys That makes more sense.

What the hell was Yusuf Ali doing :S
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Re: Quran 3:93, Was Israel a man?
Reply #5 - January 27, 2010, 12:22 PM

Actually, here's a very touching story on how Jacob's name was changed to Israel. He wrestled with God and defeated him too! Then God changed Jacob's name to Israel.

Genesis 32:24-32
http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Genesis%2032:24-32&version=NIV

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Re: Quran 3:93, Was Israel a man?
Reply #6 - January 27, 2010, 12:26 PM

I thought he wrestled an angel?
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Re: Quran 3:93, Was Israel a man?
Reply #7 - January 27, 2010, 12:29 PM

there are different accounts. One says the Angel of the Lord and one says a man, and as you can see the man turns out to be God ("I saw God face to face and I'm still alive").

A googolplex is *precisely* as far from infinity as is the number 1.--Carl Sagan
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Re: Quran 3:93, Was Israel a man?
Reply #8 - January 27, 2010, 12:35 PM

Debunker what is your take on this:

Shakir
(143) And when Musa came at Our appointed time and his Lord spoke to him, he said: My Lord! show me (Thyself), so that I may look upon Thee. He said: You cannot (bear to) see Me but look at the mountain, if it remains firm in its place, then will you see Me; but when his Lord manifested His glory to the mountain He made it crumble and Musa fell down in a swoon; then when he recovered, he said: Glory be to Thee, I turn to Thee, and I am the first of the believers.

Abdel Haleem
(143) When Moses came for the appointment, and his Lord spoke to him, he said, ?My Lord, show Yourself to me: let me see You!? He said, ?You will never see Me, but look at that mountain: if it remains standing firm, you will see Me,? and when his Lord revealed Himself to the mountain, He made it crumble: Moses fell down unconscious. When he recovered, he said, ?Glory be to You! To You I turn in repentance! I am the first to believe!?

Arthur John Arberry
(143) And when Moses came to Our appointed time and his Lord spoke with him, he said, 'Oh my Lord, show me, that I may behold Thee!' Said He, 'Thou shalt not see Me; but behold the mountain -- if it stays fast in its place, then thou shalt see Me.' And when his Lord revealed Him to the mountain He made it crumble to dust; and Moses fell down swooning. So when he awoke, he said, 'Glory be to Thee! I repent to Thee; I am the first of the believers.'
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Re: Quran 3:93, Was Israel a man?
Reply #9 - January 27, 2010, 01:05 PM

According to Quran God won't even so much as speak to a human face to face.

042.051
It is not fitting for a man that God should speak to him except by inspiration, or from behind a veil, or by the sending of a messenger to reveal, with God's permission, what God wills: for He is Most High, Most Wise.

But acccording to the Bible, Jacob even wrestled with God.
http://www.purposeoflife.org.uk/jacob.htm

A googolplex is *precisely* as far from infinity as is the number 1.--Carl Sagan
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Re: Quran 3:93, Was Israel a man?
Reply #10 - January 27, 2010, 01:09 PM

Debunker, there's no point in slagging the bible - we know its bunkem too, and it only serves to weaken your own position here as yet another Abrahmic theist.

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Re: Quran 3:93, Was Israel a man?
Reply #11 - January 27, 2010, 01:13 PM

Oh IsLame. I was just explaining in full, how the name of *Israel* supposedly came to be the name of Jacob. Read the story. It's an interesting one, albeit quite blasphemous.

A googolplex is *precisely* as far from infinity as is the number 1.--Carl Sagan
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