What kind of Christian doesn't believe in Jesus?

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What kind of Christian doesn't believe in Jesus?
OP - March 03, 2010, 05:54 AM

OK, so I've brought this up before, but I don't think anyone's ever responded with a retort.

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YUSUFALI: Those who believe (in the Qur'an), those who follow the Jewish (scriptures), and the Sabians and the Christians,- any who believe in Allah and the Last Day, and work righteousness,- on them shall be no fear, nor shall they grieve.
PICKTHAL: Lo! those who believe, and those who are Jews, and Sabaeans, and Christians - Whosoever believeth in Allah and the Last Day and doeth right - there shall no fear come upon them neither shall they grieve.
SHAKIR: Surely those who believe and those who are Jews and the Sabians and the Christians whoever believes in Allah and the last day and does good-- they shall have no fear nor shall they grieve.

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YUSUFALI: They do blaspheme who say: "Allah is Christ the son of Mary." But said Christ: "O Children of Israel! worship Allah, my Lord and your Lord." Whoever joins other gods with Allah,- Allah will forbid him the garden, and the Fire will be his abode. There will for the wrong-doers be no one to help.
PICKTHAL: They surely disbelieve who say: Lo! Allah is the Messiah, son of Mary. The Messiah (himself) said: O Children of Israel, worship Allah, my Lord and your Lord. Lo! whoso ascribeth partners unto Allah, for him Allah hath forbidden paradise. His abode is the Fire. For evil-doers there will be no helpers.
SHAKIR: Certainly they disbelieve who say: Surely Allah, He is the Messiah, son of Marium; and the Messiah said: O Children of Israel! serve Allah, my Lord and your Lord. Surely whoever associates (others) with Allah, then Allah has forbidden to him the garden, and his abode is the fire; and there shall be no helpers for the unjust.

Most quranic contradictions that people present seem not to be clear-cut, but I think this one is. Verse 69 says the Christians will not grieve nor fear. 72 says those who join christ and others with allah will go to hell. Did most of the christians at the time of revelation not believe in jesus' divinity?

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Re: What kind of Christian doesn't believe in Jesus?
Reply #1 - March 03, 2010, 06:12 AM

Naaa, thats not a contradiction at all. The verse which says that they have no worries is talking about the Christians and jews before Muhammad came along. The later verse which condemns them to hellfire is the Christians and jews after Muhammad, when they heard his message. I personally think the Qur'an has no contradictions, but that isn't some miracle lol.

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Re: What kind of Christian doesn't believe in Jesus?
Reply #2 - March 03, 2010, 06:17 AM

Yusuf Ali's translation interprets ''those who believe'' as those who believe in the quran, so it would be after Mohammed. I dont know if thats who the phrase refers to, but if not, then whom ?

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Re: What kind of Christian doesn't believe in Jesus?
Reply #3 - March 03, 2010, 06:27 AM

Quote from: Angel54 on March 03, 2010, 06:17 AM
Yusuf Ali's translation interprets ''those who believe'' as those who believe in the quran, so it would be after Mohammed. I dont know if thats who the phrase refers to, but if not, then whom ?

Ohh. Hmm I am not too sure to be honest. Sweet Avatar by the way. Jax rules! But Reptile is the best

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Re: What kind of Christian doesn't believe in Jesus?
Reply #4 - March 03, 2010, 09:53 AM

At that time there were still lots of Christians around that didn't believe that Jesus was God: Arians and other groups.

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Re: What kind of Christian doesn't believe in Jesus?
Reply #5 - March 03, 2010, 10:51 AM

They were considered heretics. It was only after the Nicene council the dogma of Sweet Jebus was officiated
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Re: What kind of Christian doesn't believe in Jesus?
Reply #6 - March 04, 2010, 12:00 AM

Yeah that was 325, so 300ish years before Islam.

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Re: What kind of Christian doesn't believe in Jesus?
Reply #7 - March 04, 2010, 12:45 AM

Arians still existed some hundred years later, in areas where the church had no influence.

The Visigoths, for example, were Arians until ~600CE, when their king converted to Catholicism. At the time of Mohammed, there were still lots of Arians in Arabia and South Asia.

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Re: What kind of Christian doesn't believe in Jesus?
Reply #8 - March 04, 2010, 02:15 AM

Quote from: NineBerry on March 04, 2010, 12:45 AM
Arians still existed some hundred years later, in areas where the church had no influence.

The Visigoths, for example, were Arians until ~600CE, when their king converted to Catholicism. At the time of Mohammed, there were still lots of Arians in Arabia and South Asia.

This^

In fact, Arabia would be filled with gnostic and arian type christians. It was so beyond the realm of Sassanid or Byzantine religious authorities that lots and lots of religious heresies and cults would have been roaming about in Arabia. I bet some heretical christians even found refuge in a place like Mecca.

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