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 Topic: Women are Deficient in Mind and Religion

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  • Re: Women are Deficient in Mind and Religion
     Reply #30 - April 10, 2010, 11:11 PM
    Quote from: Hassan on April 10, 2010, 10:55 PM
    "No people will ever prosper who put a woman in charge of their affairs!"

    Allah never met Hatshepsut, nor Cleopatra. Cleopatra was an excellent stateswoman, but being human, but she was killed by Emporer Octavian because he wanted full control of Egypt and didn't want anything to stand in his way. Then claimed she commited suicide.

    And Allah never heard of anything about the Scythians, who were a powerful tribe, whose military was made up of women, and were very successful, and some say are the ancestors of Ukrainians but I question that. But still, they remained in control of that land until the Huns slowly took control.

    Allah never heard of Queen Kubaba, she was deified by the mesopotamians because when she was full ruler, she made sumeria so prosperous. And on top of that, she got her independance from fighting against a male run city state. And in those times, the king actually went to war.

    So Allah must not leave Arabia all too often, maybe he should get out more? Like out of the Quran and Hadith. So he can see what women are really like. Because they're fierce, way more so than he can ever be. He's just an insecure single mythological being. Inanna would crush Allah too quickly though, she doesn't take too kindly to gods who are disobediant to her.
    It is not the way you live your life that is important, it is how well you enjoy it that matters.
  • Re: Women are Deficient in Mind and Religion
     Reply #31 - April 10, 2010, 11:14 PM
    Actually all you stupid Kuffar, Atheists and Communists are ignoring the scientific evidence as my esteemed Sheikh Al-Zindani (he of the red beard) explains:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7x_I7tic_84

  • Re: Women are Deficient in Mind and Religion
     Reply #32 - April 10, 2010, 11:15 PM
    Umm, the Scythians apparently had female warriors but it is an exaggeration to say their military was composed of women.
    Devious, treacherous, murderous, neanderthal, sub-human of the West. bunny
  • Re: Women are Deficient in Mind and Religion
     Reply #33 - April 10, 2010, 11:16 PM
    And this explains things even more for all you Communists! (And please look carefully at the diagrams as they explain it very well.)

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v5KmIXZM-V8
  • Re: Women are Deficient in Mind and Religion
     Reply #34 - April 10, 2010, 11:23 PM
    I have to say Thatcher did a great job as PM (and don't tell anyone but I voted for her in the 80s when she was up for second office Wink  - I told u I'm a 'people person' - not a 'politics person'  grin12 )
  • Re: Women are Deficient in Mind and Religion
     Reply #35 - April 10, 2010, 11:27 PM
    Quote from: Hassan on April 10, 2010, 11:16 PM
    And this explains things even more for all you Communists! (And please look carefully at the diagrams as they explain it very well.)

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v5KmIXZM-V8


    From personal experience I believe the VVAAASSSTT majority of men speak first than think, and women tend to think first then speak.  At least me and just about every guy I know has been guilty of the foot in mouth problem while usually women are better at not doing that. At least in relationships. 

    So once again I'm left with the classic Irish man's dilemma, do I eat the potato or do I let it ferment so I can drink it later?
    My political philosophy below
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bwGat4i8pJI&feature=g-vrec
    Just kidding, here are some true heros
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dBTgvK6LQqA
  • Re: Women are Deficient in Mind and Religion
     Reply #36 - April 10, 2010, 11:28 PM
    Quote from: deusvult on April 10, 2010, 11:27 PM
    From personal experience I believe the VVAAASSSTT majority of men speak first than think, and women tend to think first then speak.  At least me and just about every guy I know has been guilty of the foot in mouth problem while usually women are better at not doing that. 


    Commie!
  • Re: Women are Deficient in Mind and Religion
     Reply #37 - April 10, 2010, 11:28 PM
    That sheikh put his foot in it with this line: "A man's brain works for a long time.......even over simple issues."  Cheesy

    I can certainly see how that might be true of said sheikh.  Wink
    Devious, treacherous, murderous, neanderthal, sub-human of the West. bunny
  • Re: Women are Deficient in Mind and Religion
     Reply #38 - April 10, 2010, 11:30 PM
    There's only one hard and fast rule about the differences between men and women - and that is there are no hard and fast rules!

     grin12

  • Re: Women are Deficient in Mind and Religion
     Reply #39 - April 10, 2010, 11:31 PM
    Quote from: Hassan on April 10, 2010, 11:16 PM
    And this explains things even more for all you Communists! (And please look carefully at the diagrams as they explain it very well.)

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v5KmIXZM-V8


    sdgih rsgiinse slksdk dpf...

    Oh, sorry. Forgot to think before I typed.
  • Re: Women are Deficient in Mind and Religion
     Reply #40 - April 10, 2010, 11:56 PM
    Quote from: Hassan on April 10, 2010, 11:30 PM
    There's only one hard and fast rule about the differences between men and women - and that is there are no hard and fast rules!

     grin12




    this Smiley
    So once again I'm left with the classic Irish man's dilemma, do I eat the potato or do I let it ferment so I can drink it later?
    My political philosophy below
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bwGat4i8pJI&feature=g-vrec
    Just kidding, here are some true heros
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dBTgvK6LQqA
  • Re: Women are Deficient in Mind and Religion
     Reply #41 - April 10, 2010, 11:59 PM
    Quote from: Hassan on April 10, 2010, 10:55 PM
    And as another hadith goes:

    "No people will ever prosper who put a woman in charge of their affairs!"


     grin12


    When Hillary was running for office, most of the Muslims I knew really hoped she would win, because they figured that would guarantee the downfall of the evil United States.
    The only thing we have to fear is fear itself
    - 32nd United States President Franklin D. Roosevelt
  • Re: Women are Deficient in Mind and Religion
     Reply #42 - April 11, 2010, 12:05 AM
    Quote from: Luthiel on April 10, 2010, 11:59 PM
    When Hillary was running for office, most of the Muslims I knew really hoped she would win, because they figured that would guarantee the downfall of the evil United States.


    Ha, yeah. Little did they know Barack Obama would do the job just as well.
  • Re: Women are Deficient in Mind and Religion
     Reply #43 - April 11, 2010, 02:43 AM
    How can these pious, god-fearing sheikhs who never mingle with any women apart from their inner family know so much about women??
    At evening, casual flocks of pigeons make
    Ambiguous undulations as they sink,
    Downward to darkness, on extended wings. - Stevens
  • Re: Women are Deficient in Mind and Religion
     Reply #44 - April 11, 2010, 02:53 AM
    You see, its all there already in the quran
    My Book     news002       
    My Blog  pccoffee
  • Re: Women are Deficient in Mind and Religion
     Reply #45 - April 11, 2010, 04:44 AM
    May Allah (swt) bless Hassan with good health and good iman, for sending us those clips dance
    "The more I study religions the more I am convinced that man never worshiped anything but himself."
    ~Sir Richard Francis Burton

    "I think religion is just like smoking: Both invented by people, addictive, harmful, and kills!"
    ~RIBS
  • Re: Women are Deficient in Mind and Religion
     Reply #46 - April 11, 2010, 06:20 AM
    From what I understand Shia view Abu Said Al-Khudri's contributions with caution but Sunni seem to accept them without question - so how do 'devout Sunni' accept something that appears to contradict what so many Muslims claim is the underlying view of the Qur'an - that men and women are equal before Allah?
    "It's just a job. Grass grows, birds fly, waves pound the sand. I beat people up." - Muhammad Ali
  • Re: Women are Deficient in Mind and Religion
     Reply #47 - April 11, 2010, 06:36 AM
    The Shia's believe in this crap aplenty.

    From Ali (Mohammed's cousin/son in law)'s book of sayings: The Nahjul Balagha:
    Quote
    After the Battle of Jamal,[1] Concerning Women and Their Short comings.
    O' ye peoples! Women are deficient in Faith, deficient in shares and deficient in intelligence. As regards the deficiency in their Faith, it is their abstention from prayers and fasting during their menstrual period. As regards deficiency in their intelligence it is because the evidence of two women is equal to that of one man. As for the deficiency of their shares that is because of their share in inheritance being half of men. So beware of the evils of women. Be on your guard even from those of them who are (reportedly) good. Do not obey them even in good things so that they may not attract you to evils.

    Footnotes by translator:

    [1].Amir al-mu'minin delivered this sermon after the devastation created by the Battle of Jamal. Since the devastation resulting from this battle was the outcome of blindly following a woman's command, in this sermon he has described women's physical defects and their causes and effects. Thus their first weakness is that for a few days in every month they have to abstain from prayer and fasting, and this abstention from worship is a proof of their deficiency in Faith. Although the real meaning of `iman (belief) is heart-felt testimony and inner conviction yet metaphorically it also applies to action and character. Since actions are the reflection of Belief they are also regarded as part of Belief. Thus, it is related from Imam `Ali ibn Musa ar-Rida (p.b.u.t.) that:

    `iman (belief) is testimony at heart, admission by the tongue and action by the limbs.

    The second weakness is that their natural propensities do not admit of full performance of their intelligence. Therefore, nature has given them the power of intelligence only in accordance with the scope of their activities which can guide them in pregnancy, delivery, child nursing, child care and house-hold affairs. On the basis of this weakness of mind and intelligence their evidence has not been accorded the status of man's evidence, as Allah says:

    . . . then call to witness two witnesses from among your men and if there not be two men then (take) a man and two women, of those ye approve of the witnesses, so that should one of the two (women) forget the (second) one of the two may remind the other... (Qur'an, 2:282)

    The third weakness is that their share in inheritance is half of man's share in inheritance as the Qur'an says:

    Allah enjoineth you about your children. The male shall have the equal of the shares of two females...(4:11)

    This shows woman's weakness because the reason for her share in inheritance being half is that the liability of her maintenance rests on man. When man's position is that of a maintainer and care taker the status of the weaker sex who is in need of maintenance and care-taking is evident.

    After describing their natural weakness, Amir al-mu'minin points out the mischief of blindly following them and wrongly obeying them. He says that not to say of bad things but even if they say in regard to some good things it should not be done in a way that these should feel as if it is being done in pursuance of their wish, but rather in a way that they should realise that the good act has been performed because of its being good and that their pleasure or wish has nothing to do with it. If they have even the doubt that their pleasures has been kept in view in it they would slowly increase in their demands and would wish that they should be obeyed in all matters however evil, the inevitable consequence whereof will be destruction and ruin.


    Again, Islam dehumanizes women, and destroys men's views about women.
    "Blessed are they who can laugh at themselves, for they shall never cease to be amused."
  • Re: Women are Deficient in Mind and Religion
     Reply #48 - April 11, 2010, 09:43 AM
    Quote from: Hassan on April 10, 2010, 10:55 PM
    Ruqayyah Maqsood is a joke herself - I read her book on marriage in Islam (published by Quilliam press - started by our friend Abdul Hakeem)

    Which were the main points that bothered you? I haven't read it, just curious.

    Quote from: Hassan on April 10, 2010, 10:55 PM
    And as another hadith goes:

    "No people will ever prosper who put a woman in charge of their affairs!"

    I see. That's why Benazir Bhutto was killed.

    Quote from: osmanthus on April 10, 2010, 11:15 PM
    Umm, the Scythians apparently had female warriors but it is an exaggeration to say their military was composed of women.

    Gaddafi’s praetorian guard consists entirely of women:



    In Israel national military service is mandatory for women too:


    Interestingly in a certain grimdark futuristic fictional universe there is a whole elite all-female army in a Joan of Arc via the Fish Speakers (from Frank Herbert’s Dune) style known as Sisters of Battle. And they are tough; really, really tough.
  • Re: Women are Deficient in Mind and Religion
     Reply #49 - April 11, 2010, 11:07 AM
    Quote from: kaiwai on April 11, 2010, 06:20 AM
    From what I understand Shia view Abu Said Al-Khudri's contributions with caution but Sunni seem to accept them without question - so how do 'devout Sunni' accept something that appears to contradict what so many Muslims claim is the underlying view of the Qur'an - that men and women are equal before Allah?


    Shias & Sunnis have pretty much the same misogynist attitude towards women - even though their hadith collections may differ. (I think you'll find the reason their collections differ is more to do with antipathy towards individuals connected to the Shia/Sunni split, than sound scholarly reasons).

    And in what way does saying women are: deficient in mind and religion - contradict the Qur'an?

    There are a great many misogynist verses in the Qur'an - and I posted one that pretty much mirrors this hadith.

    Qur'an:


    الرِّجَالُ قَوَّامُونَ عَلَى النِّسَاءِ بِمَا فَضَّلَ اللَّهُ بَعْضَهُمْ عَلَى بَعْضٍ

    "Men are in charge of women because God has bestowed more on one over the other"

    From the Tafseer of Jalalayn:

    "الرجال قوامون" مسلطون "على النساء" يؤدبونهن ويأخذون على أيديهن "بما فضل الله بعضهم على بعض" أي بتفضيله لهم عليهن بالعلم والعقل والولاية وغير ذلك

    "Men are in charge of women means they rule over women, correcting them and taking charge of them because of their advantage over them in knowledge and intelligence and guardianship and other things like that..."
  • Re: Women are Deficient in Mind and Religion
     Reply #50 - April 11, 2010, 11:14 AM
    Quote from: Kenan on April 11, 2010, 09:43 AM
    Gaddafi’s praetorian guard consists entirely of women:

    Never said it didn't. I was just commenting on the Scythians. In any case the Libyan military as a whole is not all female either.


    Quote
    In Israel national military service is mandatory for women too:

    And?
    Devious, treacherous, murderous, neanderthal, sub-human of the West. bunny
  • Re: Women are Deficient in Mind and Religion
     Reply #51 - April 11, 2010, 11:19 AM
    Quote from: Kenan on April 11, 2010, 09:43 AM
    Which were the main points that bothered you? I haven't read it, just curious.


    It didn't bother me - in fact I quite liked it as she was very liberal and modern in her thinking in many ways. It's just that I would put her in the category of the modern sort of liberal Muslim scholars who I can't take seriously. Who make up their own Islam by stretching interpretations and scraping the barrel for anything that will allow them to give the view they want - while turing a blind eye to the mountain of evidence that contradicts them.

    Her saying Muhammad was "just joking" confirms that view I had of her.
  • Re: Women are Deficient in Mind and Religion
     Reply #52 - April 11, 2010, 11:27 AM
    Quote from: osmanthus on April 11, 2010, 11:14 AM
    Never said it didn't. I was just commenting on the Scythians. In any case the Libyan military as a whole is not all female either.

    And?

    And nothing. Just a fun fact.

    I'm just sayin.
  • Re: Women are Deficient in Mind and Religion
     Reply #53 - April 11, 2010, 11:31 AM
    K. Chicks with guns = fun.  cool2
    Devious, treacherous, murderous, neanderthal, sub-human of the West. bunny
  • Re: Women are Deficient in Mind and Religion
     Reply #54 - April 11, 2010, 11:53 AM
    Quote from: Hassan on April 11, 2010, 11:07 AM
    Shias & Sunnis have pretty much the same misogynist attitude towards women - even though their hadith collections may differ. (I think you'll find the reason their collections differ is more to do with antipathy towards individuals connected to the Shia/Sunni split, than sound scholarly reasons).

    And in what way does saying women are: deficient in mind and religion - contradict the Qur'an?

    There are a great many misogynist verses in the Qur'an - and I posted one that pretty much mirrors this hadith.

    Qur'an:


    الرِّجَالُ قَوَّامُونَ عَلَى النِّسَاءِ بِمَا فَضَّلَ اللَّهُ بَعْضَهُمْ عَلَى بَعْضٍ

    "Men are in charge of women because God has bestowed more one one over the other"

    From the Tafseer of Jalalayn:

    "الرجال قوامون" مسلطون "على النساء" يؤدبونهن ويأخذون على أيديهن "بما فضل الله بعضهم على بعض" أي بتفضيله لهم عليهن بالعلم والعقل والولاية وغير ذلك

    "Men are in charge of women means they rule over women, correcting them and taking charge of them because of their advantage over them in knowledge and intelligence and guardianship and other things like that..."


    True, but if you look at the Muhammad Asad translation, which I find alot of female converts like reading, the footnote points to males and females having unique strengths. The question one has to ask is why do you believe that the classical  exegetical work have more legitimacy than a later interpretation? if the person is happy with the modern interpretation - are they wrong? deluded? should understanding of the Qur'an be evolving or static?
    "It's just a job. Grass grows, birds fly, waves pound the sand. I beat people up." - Muhammad Ali
  • Re: Women are Deficient in Mind and Religion
     Reply #55 - April 11, 2010, 12:17 PM
    Quote from: kaiwai on April 11, 2010, 11:53 AM
    True, but if you look at the Muhammad Asad translation, which I find alot of female converts like reading, the footnote points to males and females having unique strengths. The question one has to ask is why do you believe that the classical  exegetical work have more legitimacy than a later interpretation? if the person is happy with the modern interpretation - are they wrong? deluded? should understanding of the Qur'an be evolving or static?


    I trust the classical scholars much more than the modernist liberal ones as they gave it to you straight. They knew the Arabic of the Qur'an very well, they were closer to the time of Muhammad and far more in tune with the mentality of that time. They didn't try to twist and change things to suit modern sensibilities.

    Besides I can see for myself the utter nonesense many modern liberal scholars talk when they give ridiculous interpretations that contradict Arabic.

    For example those who say Qur'an doesn't say "Hit" your wives but really says <insert absurd explanation of choice>. Muhammad Asad for example obviously didn't like the story in the Qur'an where the Jews were asked to solve a murder by killing a cow and slapping the dead body with a bit of it to bring it alive. So he came up with some unbelievably weak linguistic acrobatics to make it sound less silly.

    Now I'm quite happy to see the Qur'an evolving and move away from the harsh and ridiculous doctrines of the past - and I wish them good luck - but to me it's just bullshit.

    I mean they are taking the Qur'an - which is supposed to be Gods eternal word - and making it into something they want it to be - and still selling it as God's eternal word.

    It's a bit emptying a Coke bottle and filling it up with Fanta - the label is still the same but that's about it!

    And I can't help thinking why bother?

    If one is going to follow one's inner instincts and own sense of what is right - why keep up the pretence that one is following the Divine and Eternal dictate of of the Qur'an?
  • Re: Women are Deficient in Mind and Religion
     Reply #56 - April 11, 2010, 12:20 PM
    women are deficient in tameability, nuff said. some of them women are hot, wouldn't want to mess with them though, they've got guns Wink
    It is not the way you live your life that is important, it is how well you enjoy it that matters.
  • Re: Women are Deficient in Mind and Religion
     Reply #57 - April 11, 2010, 01:07 PM
    Quote from: osmanthus on April 10, 2010, 01:53 PM
    Narrated Abu Said Al-Raghiaf:

    Once Allah's Apostle went out to the Musalla (to offer the prayer) on 'Id-al-Adha or Al-Fitr prayer. Then he passed by the women and said, "O women! Give alms, as I am a fuckwit and could do with some help." They asked, "Why is it so, O Allah's Apostle?" He replied, "I am deficient in mind and religion. I couldn't invent a decent belief system if my life depended on it. A cautious sensible man could be led astray by my bullshit." The women asked, "O Allah's Apostle! What is deficient in your intelligence and religion?" He said, "Is not the evidence of my stupidity obvious?" They replied in the affirmative. He said, "This is the deficiency in my intelligence. Isn't it true that Islam contains all sort of dumb crap?" The women replied in the affirmative. He said, "This is the deficiency in my religion."
    (Sahih al-Bukhari, Volume 1, Book 69, Number 111)


     Cheesy   Lmao   hahaha   

    Good one, Os!   Afro
    Atheism is a non-prophet organization.

    The sleeper has awakened -  Dune

    Give a man a fish, and you'll feed him for a day Give him a religion, and he'll starve to death while praying for a fish!
  • Re: Women are Deficient in Mind and Religion
     Reply #58 - April 11, 2010, 01:09 PM
    Quote from: Hassan on April 10, 2010, 12:18 PM
    Once Allah's Apostle went out to the Musalla (to offer the prayer) on 'Id-al-Adha or Al-Fitr prayer. Then he passed by the women and said, "O women! Give alms, as I have seen that the majority of the dwellers of Hell-fire were you (women)." They asked, "Why is it so, O Allah's Apostle?" He replied, "You curse frequently and are ungrateful to your husbands. I have not seen anyone more deficient in mind and religion than you. A cautious sensible man could be led astray by some of you." The women asked, "O Allah's Apostle! What is deficient in our intelligence and religion?" He said, "Is not the evidence of two women equal to the witness of one man?" They replied in the affirmative. He said, "This is the deficiency in her intelligence. Isn't it true that a woman can neither pray nor fast during her menses?" The women replied in the affirmative. He said, "This is the deficiency in her religion."
    (Sahih al-Bukhari, Volume 1, Book 6, Number 301)


    Truly the most GLARING example of circular (il)logic if ever I saw one.

    There should be a hadith about the stupidity of men when they have the man-flu to even things out!   Roll Eyes
    Atheism is a non-prophet organization.

    The sleeper has awakened -  Dune

    Give a man a fish, and you'll feed him for a day Give him a religion, and he'll starve to death while praying for a fish!
  • Re: Women are Deficient in Mind and Religion
     Reply #59 - April 11, 2010, 01:11 PM
    Quote from: Tlaloc on April 10, 2010, 02:00 PM
    We have them, just underdeveloped in most cases.
    So technically we could still grow some nice biological ones, give science some time Grin


    Moobs?  No thanks!
    Atheism is a non-prophet organization.

    The sleeper has awakened -  Dune

    Give a man a fish, and you'll feed him for a day Give him a religion, and he'll starve to death while praying for a fish!
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