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 Topic: Hello! Frustrated concern for family member.

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  • Hello! Frustrated concern for family member.
     OP - July 10, 2017, 03:39 PM
    Thank you for inviting me to your forum. A friend has joined a Salafi sect. It has completely taken over his personality. They have turned the sweetest young man into a very angry and mean person. He has PTSD and I believe people are taking advantage of it. I have been Googling and researching and I have become more and more frustrated with the "Ummah" at large because it seems there is an unwritten rule that you don't say anything about the poor behavior of another Muslim. I literally had someone say to me in a face-to-face conversation, "Well he isn't threatening violence so we shouldn't persecute him for his beliefs". So it takes a threat of violence before anyone does anything? From my short estimation, instead of having all of these interfaith events, why won't they address the cancer growing in their midst? If you are so worried about your image to the world why won't they renounce this evil and have services set up to stop it before it starts. I am not saying all Salafis are terrorists. I wouldn't say that. But you can only spend so much time dehumanizing the "other" before someone with a screw loose goes off and does something evil. And besides it's soul-killing to be that angry all of the time at everyone. They are taking advantage of people with  psychological issues. And yet there doesn't seem to be any place to turn for help. I thought you guys might know of some resources. I wouldn't care if my friend became an atheist. I just want him healthy. And this is not healthy. Is there anything being set up to deal with this pure unadulterated evil? It's scary that we have a cult this large in our midst and everyone is walking around like everything is fine. I came here for guidance and resources, because of all of the forums, you folks are the only ones who seem to have any sense.
    "The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men (and women) to do nothing" -Edmund Burke
  • Hello! Frustrated concern for family member.
     Reply #1 - July 11, 2017, 12:21 AM
     parrot Welcome. I am not sure you can do anything about this. I am sorry you lost your friend, but you can't arrest people or hold them if they have not done anything wrong. He will have to see the light himself.
    I can also tell you that PTSD can make a person unpleasant all by itself. It might not be his new beliefs.
    I don't know what you can do to counter radicalization. I hope someone else chimes in.
    Don't let Hitler have the street.
  • Hello! Frustrated concern for family member.
     Reply #2 - July 11, 2017, 12:31 AM
    Hi sorry to hear what your having to go through. I don't know of any resources to be honest so sorry can't help you there.

    Have you ever considered going with your friend or letting their close ones know I.e. family know of your concerns?

    You can only do the best you can to protect those around you so don't kick yourself researching and googling for answers as you'll only worry yourself more....

    Become an advocate and educate your friend you can only be there for them and protect them...
  • Hello! Frustrated concern for family member.
     Reply #3 - July 12, 2017, 02:35 AM
    Thank you for the response. His family while concerned is doing nothing. And while I know we can't arrest people for doing nothing wrong, it would be nice if there were exceptions for things like this. LOL! The danger signs are everywhere. Down right scary. The irrational thinking. And you have to be careful what you say because anything against what this cult (yes, I said cult)  says will set him off.
    "The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men (and women) to do nothing" -Edmund Burke
  • Hello! Frustrated concern for family member.
     Reply #4 - July 12, 2017, 02:38 AM
    Thank you three!

    I think it is a combination of new beliefs & the PTSD. You said he will have to see the light on his own. For those of you who are ex-Muslim, can you tell me what happened to get you to see the light? Was there an event or moment that caused you to change? Or did it happen gradually?
    "The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men (and women) to do nothing" -Edmund Burke
  • Hello! Frustrated concern for family member.
     Reply #5 - July 12, 2017, 08:57 AM
    PTSD can certainly make you irrational and overwhelm you with inappropriate reactions to things. Many people try to avoid difficult situations or ideas in order to keep themselves from feeling this. The problem is that this very strong avoidance, if indulged in, can actually reinforce the PTSD and increase symptoms, and so can the required exposure therapy, as contrary as that sounds. It must be treated by a professional competent in trauma. I know you can't force a person to have treatment, but perhaps you can convince him to tie his camel first in this regard, it's worth a shot.

    For myself I did come to see the light when I realized that the rules I was following were hurting me, that Islamic practices and laws were great on paper and yet harmful in real life to myself and my children. I have an awful lot of regret for how I lived my life for a God and not in my own best interest.
    I repeatedly butted up against life situations that were not resolved by an Islamic lifestyle and were instead exaggerated by it.
    Being exposed to alternative ideas and other ways of living caused me to shift my views gradually. I was always bothered by the things I couldn't square with human rights in Islamic law, and that did chip away at my faith even though I was unaware of the effect. I remember reading an awful lot of liberal news in the beginning of my transition and also watching music videos, which was mostly contradictory to Islamic thought in regards to how one should live. I know that is probably not entirely helpful with your situation (converts are expert at self denial and in following the rules), but maybe at least it will give you some hope, as those things (news and music) are readily available and indeed difficult to avoid in modern society.
    Don't let Hitler have the street.
  • Hello! Frustrated concern for family member.
     Reply #6 - July 12, 2017, 05:43 PM
    Yes, news and music are difficult to avoid, but this cult seems to do it's best to isolate him from both. And that's the issue, they are trying to remove him from modern society. There is this huge push for him to go live in Saudi Arabia. They are taught that Saudi Arabia is their home, not any place in the west. It's "haram" according them to live in a land of "non-believers", even if you were born in said land. This attack on music, art, movies, television is terrifying because those are often the vehicles of social change. He is being isolated from it. Movies and television shows are considered "lying". Music is "haram". The news is distorted. In his family, 3 family members converted to Islam to just keep contact with him. They are creating a world where he is only being exposed to their world view. And if you present a view that is different in any way, he and his few friends become very angry. I know about his PTSD, but there seems to be something endemic to this particular group that has a group response. They all seem to behave this way. There is this concrete, "We are right, everyone else is wrong, and because we are right, we can say and do whatever we want to people, because only members of our group are to be respected". I agree his PTSD is an issue. No doubt. But there is something far deeper, sick and sinister going on with this group.
    "The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men (and women) to do nothing" -Edmund Burke
  • Hello! Frustrated concern for family member.
     Reply #7 - July 12, 2017, 06:43 PM
    Yes, I am familiar with that particular brand of extremism. It does sound pretty bad. I wish I could advise you further, I just don't know how to extract a person from a cult without it involving illegal kidnapping. We have a group in the US that does it for exorbitant amounts of money, but it is still illegal.
    Don't let Hitler have the street.
  • Hello! Frustrated concern for family member.
     Reply #8 - July 12, 2017, 08:03 PM
    Yeah well, I am not into doing illegal stuff! But not to sound whiney, I feel so damn helpless and I am so angry.
    "The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men (and women) to do nothing" -Edmund Burke
  • Hello! Frustrated concern for family member.
     Reply #9 - July 13, 2017, 12:42 AM
    You have every right to feel that way.
    Don't let Hitler have the street.
  • Hello! Frustrated concern for family member.
     Reply #10 - July 14, 2017, 12:07 AM
    Sorry I couldn't assist further Gnostic...have you looked around and researched organisations that can maybe assist? With a community like you've explained the only thing I can suggest is being there and protecting your friend to the best of your abilaties...what they are doing is injsut...don't feel helpless as your still there with your friend plus your raising awareness through here...I see and hear a lot of injust things in this world and although I have no faith left in religion I still have my faith in God only because of the injustice in this world...no good will come to those who do wrong....I'd like to still believe God is watching over the Good and Bad....
  • Hello! Frustrated concern for family member.
     Reply #11 - July 16, 2017, 05:33 AM
    Thank you Ragu! While I am a Muslim, I consider myself to be more spiritual. I believe in God. Always have. I hope that God is looking out for him and those like him. But this has brought me to the brink of hating Islam.
    "The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men (and women) to do nothing" -Edmund Burke
  • Hello! Frustrated concern for family member.
     Reply #12 - July 16, 2017, 09:16 AM
    Quote from: Gnostic on July 10, 2017, 03:39 PM
    Thank you for inviting me to your forum. A friend has joined a Salafi sect. It has completely taken over his personality. They have turned the sweetest young man into a very angry and mean person. He has PTSD and I believe people are taking advantage of it. I have been Googling and researching and I have become more and more frustrated with the "Ummah" at large because it seems there is an unwritten rule that you don't say anything about the poor behavior of another Muslim. I literally had someone say to me in a face-to-face conversation, "Well he isn't threatening violence so we shouldn't persecute him for his beliefs". So it takes a threat of violence before anyone does anything? From my short estimation, instead of having all of these interfaith events, why won't they address the cancer growing in their midst? If you are so worried about your image to the world why won't they renounce this evil and have services set up to stop it before it starts. I am not saying all Salafis are terrorists. I wouldn't say that. But you can only spend so much time dehumanizing the "other" before someone with a screw loose goes off and does something evil. And besides it's soul-killing to be that angry all of the time at everyone. They are taking advantage of people with  psychological issues. And yet there doesn't seem to be any place to turn for help. I thought you guys might know of some resources. I wouldn't care if my friend became an atheist. I just want him healthy. And this is not healthy. Is there anything being set up to deal with this pure unadulterated evil? It's scary that we have a cult this large in our midst and everyone is walking around like everything is fine. I came here for guidance and resources, because of all of the forums, you folks are the only ones who seem to have any sense.


    You did nothing wrong. Your detractors are collectivists so the individual does not matter until he/she harms the group image. The lack of action to curb radicalism when it is starring you in the face is why there is so much backlash against the Muslim community as many prefer to ignore issues until said issue boil over.

    Just talk to him, not his friends, not his group, one on one. Perhaps without the social reinforcement a group provides he may look at things differently.
  • Hello! Frustrated concern for family member.
     Reply #13 - July 25, 2017, 10:05 PM
    I am afraid you can do nothing about it! since he/she chose that direction whatever you do or say will mean nothing to them! its like they totally start loosing their minds!  finmad only wish they will find the right direction themselves before its too late
  • Hello! Frustrated concern for family member.
     Reply #14 - July 26, 2017, 02:43 AM
    Welcome to the forum Gnostic, and have a rabbit!  bunny

    I'm afraid I'm not too sure what to do to prevent people from going down the path of absurdity. I mostly just try to steer clear of the sort for my own well being.

    I guess the only thing you could do is to keep tabs on him one on one as a friend, as bogart mentioned.
    Quote from: yeezevee on February 11, 2016, 02:05 PM
    how fuck works without shit??


    Let's Play Chess!

    harakaat, friend, RIP
  • Hello! Frustrated concern for family member.
     Reply #15 - August 02, 2017, 11:05 PM
    Quote from: Gnostic on July 16, 2017, 05:33 AM
    Thank you Ragu! While I am a Muslim, I consider myself to be more spiritual. I believe in God. Always have. I hope that God is looking out for him and those like him. But this has brought me to the brink of hating Islam.


    Me too...I still believe God is all watching...Will keep your friend in my prayers...God bless...you still have your voice so use it....
  • Hello! Frustrated concern for family member.
     Reply #16 - August 03, 2017, 01:21 PM
    Quote from: Gnostic on July 12, 2017, 08:03 PM
    Yeah well, I am not into doing illegal stuff! But not to sound whiney, I feel so damn helpless and I am so angry.

    There are some things you just cannot change, no matter the injustice. I'm sorry for your friend, it hurts to lose people to their own stupidity. I hope one day he'll see the light, but when it comes to religion I always feel so helpless too.

    Make sure you take care of yourself far away hug
    ~My story~
    ~Collection of unethical hadiths/surahs~
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