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Theme Changer

 Topic: Palestinian Media Watch

 (Read 7796 times)
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  • Re: Palestinian Media Watch
     Reply #30 - February 20, 2009, 09:13 PM

    The left made of islam a victim of the evil right.
    The right found in islam a golden goose to justify its obsession for growth and expansion at all cost.


    I agree with you on this.
  • Re: Palestinian Media Watch
     Reply #31 - February 20, 2009, 09:16 PM

    Are you saying you support Israel because you see it as anti-muslim?


    To be fair to Baal, I don't think he has ever said that.

    I think Baal is more complicated than that.
  • Re: Palestinian Media Watch
     Reply #32 - February 20, 2009, 09:44 PM

    On balance, I would probably say it leans towards being pro-palestinian, but there is a broad range of opinion

    I think the consensus of opinion here is pro-palestine, we could do a poll on it?  I think the pro-Israel lobby is more vociferous so they get over represented..


    I would refuse to fit into either camp.  I would go as far as to say that its immoral for outsiders to be cheering on either side, as if it were a football match.  Its only encouraging extremism on both sides.  I don't blame Israelis or Palestinians who do it because they live in the thick of it, but people from the rest of the world shouldn't be joining in.

    The best camp for an outsider to be in would be the pro-two state solution camp.

    "Befriend them not, Oh murtads, and give them neither parrot nor bunny."  - happymurtad's advice on trolls.
  • Re: Palestinian Media Watch
     Reply #33 - February 20, 2009, 10:00 PM

    On balance, I would probably say it leans towards being pro-palestinian, but there is a broad range of opinion

    I think the consensus of opinion here is pro-palestine, we could do a poll on it?  I think the pro-Israel lobby is more vociferous so they get over represented..


    I would refuse to fit into either camp.  I would go as far as to say that its immoral for outsiders to be cheering on either side, as if it were a football match.  Its only encouraging extremism on both sides.  I don't blame Israelis or Palestinians who do it because they live in the thick of it, but people from the rest of the world shouldn't be joining in.

    The best camp for an outsider to be in would be the pro-two state solution camp.


    I agree with that Cheetah - though at the same time I recognise the enormous wrong that has been done to the Palestinians - and that is from a position of justice and humanism - not partisan.
  • Re: Palestinian Media Watch
     Reply #34 - February 21, 2009, 02:33 AM

    I support the two state solution and the Palestinians right to self determination but the reason why this is such a big problem and such a divisive issue is not because of injustice but because of "who" carried out the injustice.

    The real reason why Israel/Palestine is such a hornets nest of hate and injustice is right wing Messianic Israeli settlers with their Biblical claims and violently racist attitudes and the Arab/Muslim hate of Jews and the Muslim belief that their victories are divine so therefore any reverse of fortune must be reversed yet again etc

    If in the wake of the second world war Egypt had consumed Palestine and dispossessed the Palestinians apart from a few angry Palestinians the world would be as silent about Palestine as they were when the Ottomans ruled that region.

    In fact the raw energy and dedication that the Palestinians put into opposing Israel would be severely depleted if they were occupied by a Muslim nation.

    It's the idea of Muslims being ruled by Kafirs/Dhimmis/Jews in the heart of the Islamic world which makes the Palestinians and their coreligionists resist with such commitment.

    If Egypt ruled Palestine I think the Palestinian cause would be a lot more like that of the Quebec Separatists in Canada. A peaceful movement with pipe dreams about Independence. 

    Arab Street, the wider Muslim world and the Left wouldn't be inflamed by Egyptian oppression of Palestinians.

    It's because white skinned European Jewry backed by the hated America dispossessed Palestinians which causes the Muslim world and Western Leftists to be so enraged.

    Lets face it if Israels messianic religious nuts had been dealt with by the Israeli secularists and Israels Arab neighbours hadn't mobilised their armies to wipe Israel off the map and refused citizenship to Palestinian refugees the situation in that region would be a lot better for both the Israelis and the Palestinians.

    Also I have to say that the Messianic Jews are only a few thorns that need to be plucked but the hordes of Islamists and Leftists that hold animosity towards Israel are in exhaustible supply.

    It's religion and antisemitism that inflames the conflict and keeps the pot boiling not Palestinian grievance or the oppression of occupation.

    It's not the situation that matters, it's the identity of those involved in the situation.

         
  • Re: Palestinian Media Watch
     Reply #35 - February 21, 2009, 03:06 PM

    On balance, I would probably say it leans towards being pro-palestinian, but there is a broad range of opinion

    I think the consensus of opinion here is pro-palestine, we could do a poll on it?  I think the pro-Israel lobby is more vociferous so they get over represented..


    I would refuse to fit into either camp.  I would go as far as to say that its immoral for outsiders to be cheering on either side, as if it were a football match.  Its only encouraging extremism on both sides.  I don't blame Israelis or Palestinians who do it because they live in the thick of it, but people from the rest of the world shouldn't be joining in.

    The best camp for an outsider to be in would be the pro-two state solution camp.


    I agree with that Cheetah - though at the same time I recognise the enormous wrong that has been done to the Palestinians - and that is from a position of justice and humanism - not partisan.




    Many outsiders, especially many Muslims reflexively join in simply as the cause involves some Muslims. In the Mumbai Terror attacks, Muslim terrorists from Pakistan slaughtered, along with Indian Hindu kaffirs,Brits & Americans, 5 Jews (they let their co religionist Turks,who were also in the hotel they attacked, go free-simply due to fellow feeling with other Muslims). They attacked along with 5 Star Hotels, the Jewish Chabad House, the only Jewish centre in Mumbai.

    What do Pakistani Muslims have to do with Israel? They're themselves living in a nation which was formed as a separate Muslim state simply due to Muslim demands. Now they demand Kashmir as it is majority Muslim. They find nothing immoral or contradictory in living on stolen lands and planning to steal more lands from non Muslims, while sympathising with their co religionists who've lost some land in Israel, even feeling ready to butcher Jews in India due to their sympathy.

    Their grievances against the Israeli occupiers have little to do with either justice or humanism, its a purely theological grievance. From their point of view, its perfectly just to steal land from kaffirs, but a horrendous outrage if kaffirs steal so much as an inch of land from them. The whole Muslim Ummah, even Pakistanis, feel obliged to obliterate themselves killing Jews in Mumbai, far from the epicentre of trouble in Israel.

    Israel should stop any further illegal settlements, and try a two state solution, but if withdrawing from Gaza gets them 6000 rockets, why would they make further attempts?

    As the saying goes, "If Arabs laid down their arms  there'd be no war. If Israel laid down its arms, there'd be no Israel." If Israel has to beat the s*** out of them to make them behave, its unfortunate, but there's hardly an alternative. 040

    World renowned historian Will Durant"...the Islamic conquest of India is probably the bloodiest story in history. It is a discouraging tale, for its evident moral is that civilization is a precious good, whose delicate complex order and freedom can at any moment be overthrown..."
  • Re: Palestinian Media Watch
     Reply #36 - March 04, 2010, 04:36 PM


    As for Israel's right to exist, I'm about as critical of that as I am of Pakistan's right to exist. The difference is that Pakistan was created out of the Indian sub continent due to Muslim demands, Israel due to Jewish demands. Millions more people were dead or displaced due to the formation of Muslim Pakistan than Israel.

    The Muslims who want to wipe Israel off the map and get back all their land, need to give back land in Pakistan and Bangladesh as well. Obviously, they don't think along those lines.

    I dont think its fair to compare pakistan with israel because israel was created on  lands where the jews were small minority and most jews were imported to israel from europe and rest of the world.
    The areas which became pakistan were already muslim majority and the right to self determination led them to gaining a separate country.

    "When one bright intellect meets another bright intellect, the light increases and the Way becomes clear -- Rumi
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