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 Topic: An opinion piece: Cameron is right on the failures of multiculturalism.

 (Read 5797 times)
  • 1« Previous thread | Next thread »
  • An opinion piece: Cameron is right on the failures of multiculturalism.
     OP - February 07, 2011, 10:23 AM

    I enjoyed this article so I will share it. Smiley

    http://www.abc.net.au/unleashed/43660.html

    Pallavi Jain was a correspondent, producer and anchor with the Hindi section of the BBC World Service for many years and currently freelances for the BBC from Canberra.

    Quote
    British prime minister David Cameron has said that state multiculturalism has "failed" in the UK.

    Finally British citizens can breathe a sigh of relief and may feel more comfortable expressing their opinion without the fear of being labelled as bigots (Former PM Gordon Brown called an elderly woman a bigot simply because she expressed some anxiety over immigrants from eastern European countries).

    Of course this does not mean that all immigrants in the UK have failed to become part of the wider British identity nor does it mean that the majority of Britons dislike all immigrants but it does mean that there is a problem that needs to be sorted.

    Cameron also said “under the doctrine of state multiculturalism, different cultures have been encouraged to live separate lives. We have even tolerated these segregated communities behaving in ways that run counter to our values.”

    Champions of equality, generally, are quick to label any such statement as part of underlying racism, lack of respect for other cultures etc. Surprisingly this kind of analysis is only restricted to western countries. I don’t hear much rhetoric from these quarters about the abhorrent treatment of immigrants in countries like Saudi Arabia (where forget human rights you can’t even practice your religion freely) or UAE or Qatar (where you can’t write anything controversial about the ruling family like the despicable practise of polygamy). Such double standards are disturbing.

    I am not going to define multiculturalism here and engage in an academic discussion with incomprehensible words and lofty theories. Everyone knows what multiculturalism means and I am glad that Cameron had the guts to say what he said. It’s high time someone spoke in favour of defending ‘liberal western values’.

    There is good and bad in every culture of the world but to treat all cultures as equal without accountability is a warped notion because culture is neither static, nor a monolith. Rather the pursuit should be to imbibe the good and reject the bad in all cultures.

    As a woman I cannot accept that cultural practises relating to gender in Saudi Arabia, India, Russia or South Africa are equal to those in Sweden, Norway or Australia. Thank God for liberal western values, even if they are not totally gender neutral at least they present me with some sort of choice.

    Unfortunately there seems to be a lack of acknowledgement by a large portion of the global population (barring a few liberals here and there) that certain traditions are worth discarding (polygamy, patriarchy, religious fanaticism etc). It’s not as if the UK or for that matter Australia, Canada or Sweden have become perfect societies with infallible cultural values, far from it, but at least they have the ability to be self critical, and therein lies their capacity to move forward.

    The idea is not to have a sense of superiority or inferiority about any culture including one’s own but to keep an open mind and have the ability to be introspective. It's one thing to be proud of one’s cultural heritage, indeed one should be, but it’s entirely different to be blinded by it. It is this rigidity of thought that sometimes compels immigrants in western countries to make a choice between assimilation and holding on to their own cultural values when in practice they could enjoy the best of both.

    Some commentators have politicised words like ‘assimilation’, ‘integration’ or ‘multiculturalism’ so we can replace these words with others like ‘unity in diversity’, ‘globalist', ‘cosmopolitanism’ etc. But my point remains this: that being an immigrant in a western country gives me an opportunity to expand my intellectual horizons without making any compromises related to my culture or identity.

    Moreover, I see no reason not to respect the 'liberal western values’ that prevail in my adopted country (essentially liberty, equality, fraternity, the rule of law, freedom of speech etc) which makes developed western democracies an attractive destination for immigrants to begin with. Doing so does not infringe upon my rights, identity or dignity in any way.

    This fusion of cultures in the global village is not just desirable but possible if people are confident about their cultural backgrounds without being chauvinistic about it. I am no psychologist but I do feel that people who are most diffident or insecure about their culture or have a deep sense of inferiority are in fact the ones who will shout out the loudest (or do far worse) about preserving their cultural (religious or ethnic) identity as if one’s culture is so fragile that it will change with a whiff of air or be threatened with a piece of clothing.

    For example Albert Einstein would not have the need to shout from rooftops that he is brilliant even if there were other brilliant people in the vicinity but a Sarah Palin may feel the need to do so. The point being that any self confident individual will not be afraid of losing his/her identity (cultural or otherwise) if they take pride in their roots and are happy with who they are. Rather they will use the diversity of the world to grow as individuals.

    Multiculturalism can be a great thing but it certainly should not mean accepting any culture of the world unconditionally with barbaric, sexist, racist or communal ideologies which are in conflict with liberal values. And one can not emphasise enough the importance of these liberal values that have played a critical role in improving human life - from ground-breaking medicines to establishing democracy.

    Any person who thinks otherwise is free not to live in a western country.


    Your opinions?

    One thing I might add, it is great that David Cameron is talking about the elephant in the room. The deafening silence from the mainstream politicians is what leads to the rising popularity of fringe-parties like the BNP. Perhaps now we can have a more honest discussion about this sort of thing. Smiley
  • Re: An opinion piece: Cameron is right on the failures of multiculturalism.
     Reply #1 - February 07, 2011, 10:51 AM

    Great article Smiley Thanks for sharing.

    "If intelligence is feminine... I would want that mine would, in a resolute movement, come to resemble an impious woman."
  • Re: An opinion piece: Cameron is right on the failures of multiculturalism.
     Reply #2 - February 07, 2011, 11:08 AM


    The deafening silence from the mainstream politicians is what leads to the rising popularity of fringe-parties like the BNP. Perhaps now we can have a more honest discussion about this sort of thing. Smiley


     Afro

    Quote
    I don’t hear much rhetoric from these quarters about the abhorrent treatment of immigrants in countries like Saudi Arabia (where forget human rights you can’t even practice your religion freely) or UAE or Qatar (where you can’t write anything controversial about the ruling family like the despicable practise of polygamy). Such double standards are disturbing.


    Ever wonder why?
  • Re: An opinion piece: Cameron is right on the failures of multiculturalism.
     Reply #3 - February 07, 2011, 11:18 AM

    It's sort of considered unacceptable amongst the most die-hard liberal equalists and humanitarians to criticise the disgusting abuse of human rights in other countries. It's all about sounding nice and tolerant but in fact blindly excusing intolerance because of one's own naivety.

    I remember one gay guy calling someone "Islamophobic" for saying that the death penalty for gays in Iran is "barbaric". This same guy then went on to talk about how intolerant Scandinavian Paganism was. The irony is laughable.

    I accused him of Paganophobia. He didn't log back in.
  • Re: An opinion piece: Cameron is right on the failures of multiculturalism.
     Reply #4 - February 07, 2011, 11:22 AM

    Good article in general.

    The problem isn't our cosmopolitan reality. Britain is a multi-ethnic, cosmopolitan society - but this doesn't need state sponsorship, its simply a grassroots reality.

    The problem is, identity politics, particularly religious identity politics, which are catastrophically divisive in the British context.

    Identity politics and 'state multiculturalism' not only creates a lack of social cohesion and causes all the problems that have been pointed out so many times - it also actually betrays minorities and betrays the cosmopolitan reality that is modern British society.


    "we can smell traitors and country haters"


    God is Love.
    Love is Blind. Stevie Wonder is blind. Therefore, Stevie Wonder is God.

  • Re: An opinion piece: Cameron is right on the failures of multiculturalism.
     Reply #5 - February 07, 2011, 11:41 AM

    Ever wonder why?


    That was probably  one of the weakest links in her articles to be honest. Legitimately criticising policies or attitudes towards immigrants or minorities in the UK shouldn't be contingent on doing the same in Gulf Arab nations. There may be hypocrisy amongst some, but landmark articles like the one that Johan Haari wrote on the subject for the Independent a couple of years ago, the recent BBC expose of worker conditions there, shows that there is increasing scrutiny of those issues.

    I kind of see where she is coming from in a general sense, but still, its a very scattergun piece of rhetoric that in particular.

    "we can smell traitors and country haters"


    God is Love.
    Love is Blind. Stevie Wonder is blind. Therefore, Stevie Wonder is God.

  • Re: An opinion piece: Cameron is right on the failures of multiculturalism.
     Reply #6 - February 07, 2011, 12:09 PM

    Quote
    landmark articles like the one that Johan Haari wrote on the subject for the Independent a couple of years ago

    His tweets are pretty funny.

    Against the ruin of the world, there
    is only one defense: the creative act.

    -- Kenneth Rexroth
  • Re: An opinion piece: Cameron is right on the failures of multiculturalism.
     Reply #7 - February 07, 2011, 01:07 PM

    Ever wonder why?

    It's no secret.
    The basic tenet of such 'multiculturalism' is that there should be no universal norms because universal norms lead to tyranny and racism.
    On top of that such 'multiculturalists' argue that human beings have a basic, almost biological, need for cultural attachments. This need has to be protected by publicly validating and protecting different cultures - different cultures should be treated with equal respect.

    That is why such 'multiculturalists' criticize domestic violence when it comes to those who 'belong' to the 'Western' culture but keep stum when it comes to FGM which is an 'alternative' cultural practice. It's not automatically bad or anything like that (it only seems bad through our racist 'western' eyes) it' simply different.

    http://www.guardian.co.uk/society/2010/jul/25/female-circumcision-children-british-law
    Female circumcision will be inflicted on up to 2,000 British schoolgirls during the summer holidays – leaving brutal physical and emotional scars. Yet there have been no prosecutions against the practice.

  • Re: An opinion piece: Cameron is right on the failures of multiculturalism.
     Reply #8 - February 07, 2011, 03:18 PM

    "Multiculturalism" isn't the problem. Islam is.

    The mosque: the most epic display of collective douchbaggery, arrogance and delusion
  • Re: An opinion piece: Cameron is right on the failures of multiculturalism.
     Reply #9 - February 07, 2011, 04:23 PM


    "Multiculturalism" isn't the problem. Islam is.


    As Thilo Sarrazin says quote all immigrants are not alike. So far immigrants from Eastern Europe, India, China and Vietnam pose no integrational problems at all in their second generation and all important economic and cultural problems of integration in Europe are concentrated around immigrants from Muslim countries. It is the Islamic culture which is responsible for these problems, not ethnic background.unquote

    Bolding is mine.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=hRCvVo9MyYE


    Former Singaporean Prime Minister Lii Kuan Yew, according to this article, shares Sarazin´s view :

    Quote
    Singapore's Lee: 'we can integrate all religions and races except Islam'

    Lee Kuan Yew ranks as one of the most successful statesmen of the 20th century, having led Singapore to independence, and built a thriving prosperous mini-state with a world class economy, out of an ethnically diverse population. He retired as the world's longest serving prime minister, and at 87 years of age, has little to lose in speaking his mind.


    Thus, his candor in discussing the assimilation of Muslims is perhaps understandable, but still startling in a world of political correctness and compulsory sensitivity to Muslims, who are never expected to reciprocate. Singapore has a substantial Muslim minority, mostly Malays but also some Indian Muslims. Throughout its history, Singapore has striven to keep ethnic tensions minimized among its diverse population (ethnic Chinese being the largest group [74%], followed by Malays[13%], Indians, and others -- including many westerners). At one point in the 1960s, Lee spearheaded a merger with majority-Muslim Malaysia, but it quickly fell apart.


    Now, Lee has published a book on Singapore's future, and he is speaking his mind:


    In the book, Mr Lee, when asked to assess the progress of multiracialism in Singapore, said: "I have to speak candidly to be of value, but I do not wish to offend the Muslim community.


    "I think we were progressing very nicely until the surge of Islam came, and if you asked me for my observations, the other communities have easier integration - friends, intermarriages and so on, Indians with Chinese, Chinese with Indians - than Muslims. That's the result of the surge from the Arab states."


    He added: "I would say today, we can integrate all religions and races except Islam."


    He also said: "I think the Muslims socially do not cause any trouble, but they are distinct and separate."


    Mr lee then went on to speak of how his own generation of politicians who worked with him had integrated well, including sitting down and eating together. He said: "But now, you go to schools with Malay and Chinese, there's a halal and non-halal segment and so too, the universities. And they tend to sit separately so as not to be contaminated. All that becomes a social divide."


    He added that the result was a "veil" across peoples. Asked what Muslims in Singapore needed to do to integrate, he replied: "Be less strict on Islamic observances and say ‘Okay, I'll eat with you.'"


    http://www.americanthinker.com/blog/2011/02/singapores_lee_we_can_integrat.html

    Quote
    "I think we were progressing very nicely until the surge of Islam came, and if you asked me for my observations, the other communities have easier integration - friends, intermarriages and so on, Indians with Chinese, Chinese with Indians - than Muslims. That's the result of the surge from the Arab states."


    I think he is right about this surge of religiosity, Muslim seem to be more fervent in their beliefs now than they were say 20 - 30 years ago. They need to start interacting and intermarrying more with the host population, become part of the tribe, so to speak.

    Like a compass needle that points north, a man?s accusing finger always finds a woman. Always.

    Khaled Hosseini - A thousand splendid suns.
  • Re: An opinion piece: Cameron is right on the failures of multiculturalism.
     Reply #10 - February 07, 2011, 04:33 PM

    Quote from: Paloma
    [Muslims] need to start interacting and intermarrying more with the host population


    NOT if involves demands on prospective non-Muslim spouses that they convert to Islam and/or any offspring be brought up as Muslims. Seriously, how many Muslim men would accept their daughters and sisters marrying a Kafir?

    The mosque: the most epic display of collective douchbaggery, arrogance and delusion
  • Re: An opinion piece: Cameron is right on the failures of multiculturalism.
     Reply #11 - February 07, 2011, 04:47 PM


    That is why such 'multiculturalists' criticize domestic violence when it comes to those who 'belong' to the 'Western' culture but keep stum when it comes to FGM which is an 'alternative' cultural practice. It's not automatically bad or anything like that (it only seems bad through our racist 'western' eyes) it' simply different.

    http://www.guardian.co.uk/society/2010/jul/25/female-circumcision-children-british-law
    Female circumcision will be inflicted on up to 2,000 British schoolgirls during the summer holidays – leaving brutal physical and emotional scars. Yet there have been no prosecutions against the practice.




    Some things are automatically bad, FGM being an example. The problem is many of those who criticise other people's culture happen to be bigots, right wingers and orientalists. And then that gives multiculturalists and (some) muslims an 'excuse' to play the 'racist' or 'islamaphobia' card.
  • Re: An opinion piece: Cameron is right on the failures of multiculturalism.
     Reply #12 - February 07, 2011, 04:48 PM

    NOT if involves demands on prospective non-Muslim spouses that they convert to Islam and/or any offspring be brought up as Muslims. Seriously, how many Muslim men would accept their daughters and sisters marrying a Kafir?


    Its not allowed in Islam.  whistling2
  • Re: An opinion piece: Cameron is right on the failures of multiculturalism.
     Reply #13 - February 07, 2011, 04:52 PM

    I know it's not allowed in Islam. THEREFORE?

    The mosque: the most epic display of collective douchbaggery, arrogance and delusion
  • Re: An opinion piece: Cameron is right on the failures of multiculturalism.
     Reply #14 - February 07, 2011, 04:57 PM

    Why ask a question you know the answer to?

    Actually nowadays there seems to be some muslims who say it is allowed, even a Syrian imam:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m9CHEhZL0OA
  • Re: An opinion piece: Cameron is right on the failures of multiculturalism.
     Reply #15 - February 07, 2011, 05:00 PM

    Quote from: Aphrodite
    Why ask a question you know the answer to?


    In order to lead the questionee into a position where they will be induced to draw the proper logical conclusions from the answer.

    The mosque: the most epic display of collective douchbaggery, arrogance and delusion
  • Re: An opinion piece: Cameron is right on the failures of multiculturalism.
     Reply #16 - February 07, 2011, 05:56 PM

    Billy says this
    Good article in general.

    The problem isn't our cosmopolitan reality. Britain is a multi-ethnic, cosmopolitan society - but this doesn't need state sponsorship, its simply a grassroots reality.

    The problem is, identity politics, particularly religious identity politics, which are catastrophically divisive in the British context.

    Identity politics and 'state multiculturalism' not only creates a lack of social cohesion and causes all the problems that have been pointed out so many times - it also actually betrays minorities and betrays the cosmopolitan reality that is modern British society.

    And the man  Tooting MP Sadiq Khan says
    Quote
    Tooting's MP has reacted furiously to David Cameron's claim yesterday that multiculturalism in Britain has "failed"....Britain's most prominent muslim MP who represents thousands who follow Islam in Tooting, claimed Mr Cameron was "writing propaganda for the English Defence League".  Yesterday, Mr Cameron told the Munich Security Conference: "Let's properly judge these organisations... do they believe in universal human rights - including for women and people of other faiths? Do they believe in equality of all before the law?"

    In reponse to Mr Khan's comments, Tory co-chairman Baroness Warsi called for an apology.

    She said:
    Quote
    "For Sadiq Khan to smear the prime minister as a rightwing extremist is outrageous and irresponsible.
    "David Cameron has made it clear that he wants to unite Britain around our common values and he has done so in measured language.


    "Extremism and Islam are not the same thing."

     read it all at http://www.yourlocalguardian.co.uk/news/local/topstories/8836089.MP_Sadiq_Khan_accuses_David_Cameron_of_far_right__propaganda_/

    hmm hu!  you go girl..  

    A fool like  Sadiq Khan doesn't understand if elected Politicians don't say anything what is going on in some Muslim communities of west., then town  people will go to EDL..BDL..IDL..UDLS.. GDL

    here is new news from GDL

    New German anti-Muslim party calls Islam 'totalitarian'   http://www.thenational.ae/news/worldwide/europe/new-german-anti-muslim-party-calls-islam-totalitarian
    Quote
    BERLIN // The leader of a newly created anti-Islamic party in Germany said he wants to stop the immigration of Muslims and described Islam as a "totalitarian system" bent on supplanting western liberal values.

    In an interview with The National, Rene Stadtkewitz, 46, said Muslims were not integrating into German society as well as other immigrants and that authorities should become stricter, by banning headscarves in school, stopping public funding for teaching young children the Quran and curbing the influence of Islamic organisations.

    "Islam is far more than a religion. It's an entire model of society that is incredibly binding for many people," he said. "It's basically a political system with its own legal system that seeks to regulate all aspects of life. We criticise the socio-political component of Islam, which I see as an ideological one similar to other totalitarian systems, and which I think is dangerous."

    He called Islam "the opposite of a free society" and said the faith posed a threat because it sought to instil different values in Germany, and because it encouraged immigrants to segregate themselves...


    Do not let silence become your legacy.. Question everything   
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim
     
  • Re: An opinion piece: Cameron is right on the failures of multiculturalism.
     Reply #17 - February 07, 2011, 06:06 PM


    Sadiq Khan only has slander to answer the points that Cameron made. Its sad that the Labour party is so witless on this issue, really sad. They should be addressing it, taking ownership of the issue, instead it seems that Sadiq Khan is setting the atmospherics for that party.


    "we can smell traitors and country haters"


    God is Love.
    Love is Blind. Stevie Wonder is blind. Therefore, Stevie Wonder is God.

  • Re: An opinion piece: Cameron is right on the failures of multiculturalism.
     Reply #18 - February 07, 2011, 06:51 PM

    Pretty much, every article I have ran across responding to Cameron' s remarks aren't thought out analysis, but reflexive mud flinging.  Cameron's a racist, islamophobic, he is working for the EDL, etc.  At some point it should be highlighted at all said is that we should make sure the people who the government gives money too for es should be inline with liberal ideals.  When that becomes "racist", you've running on intellectual fumes. Like you said it seems so funny that no one responding realizes that people believe ( rightly) that this is a serious issue. It either gets defected by poo throwing of the " that's racist" variety, or painted over with " Islam just needs a PR campaign".  That head scratching schism wouldn't be so large if Islam were absolutely truly comparable with universal human rights, but mainstream Muslim scholars say over and over that it isn't. The the OIC goes out and makes its own piss poor imitation of the UDOHR without the universal or rights parts, that should alert the Labour party that this is an issue they should take seriously.

    So once again I'm left with the classic Irish man's dilemma, do I eat the potato or do I let it ferment so I can drink it later?
    My political philosophy below
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bwGat4i8pJI&feature=g-vrec
    Just kidding, here are some true heros
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dBTgvK6LQqA
  • Re: An opinion piece: Cameron is right on the failures of multiculturalism.
     Reply #19 - February 07, 2011, 11:51 PM

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=47HiuKQqpgY&feature=player_embedded#

    So once again I'm left with the classic Irish man's dilemma, do I eat the potato or do I let it ferment so I can drink it later?
    My political philosophy below
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bwGat4i8pJI&feature=g-vrec
    Just kidding, here are some true heros
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dBTgvK6LQqA
  • Re: An opinion piece: Cameron is right on the failures of multiculturalism.
     Reply #20 - February 08, 2011, 09:50 AM

    Baroness Afshar was so annoying on The Big Questions!  She was giggling and interrupting throughout.

    .
  • Re: An opinion piece: Cameron is right on the failures of multiculturalism.
     Reply #21 - February 08, 2011, 11:57 AM

    Baroness Afshar was so annoying on The Big Questions!  She was giggling and interrupting throughout.

    That is what some women and men do when they have no answers and no words to counter. if I was there I would  have politely told her stop giggling and if she has that uncontrollable laughing habit, I request her to put a soc in her mouth..

    That guy was right she NEVER EVER WORKED or had a job .. She comes out silver spoons of Iran and lived in France. 

    Do not let silence become your legacy.. Question everything   
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim
     
  • Re: An opinion piece: Cameron is right on the failures of multiculturalism.
     Reply #22 - February 09, 2011, 10:20 AM


    Quote
    Cameron's Multicultural Wake-Up Call

    The growth of Islamist extremism in the West is something even the politically correct can no longer ignore. .

    By DOUGLAS MURRAY
    London

    'Multiculturalism has failed," said British Prime Minister David Cameron last weekend in Munich. If anybody thought they had read those words before, it is because they have. Many times. Last October German Chancellor Angela Merkel (sitting onstage with Mr. Cameron when he gave his speech on Saturday) said the same. Finally, Europe's mainstream party leaders seem to be realizing what others have long noticed: Multiculturalism has been the most pernicious and divisive policy pursued by Western governments since World War II.

    Multiculturalism is a deeply misunderstood idea. That was one of the reasons for its political success. People were led to believe that "multiculturalism" meant multiracialism, or pluralism. It did not. Nevertheless, for years anybody who criticized multiculturalism was immediately decried as a "racist."

    But the true character and effects of the policy could not be permanently hidden. State-sponsored multiculturalism treated European countries like hostelries. It judged that the state should not "impose" rules and values on newcomers. Rather, it should bend over backwards to accommodate the demands of immigrants. The resultant policy was that states treated and judged people by the criteria of whatever "community" they found themselves born into.

    In Britain, for instance, this meant that if you were a white English girl born into a white English family and your family decided to marry you against your will to a randy old pervert, the state would intervene. But if you had the misfortune to be born into an "Asian-background" family and the same happened, then the state would look the other way.

    In 1984, a British school principal named Ray Honeyford politely suggested in an article in the Salisbury Review that it might be a good idea if students at his state-funded school were able to speak English and did not disappear to Pakistan for months at a time. The result was a siren of accusations of "racism," which willfully ignored his arguments and precipitated the end of his career

    The multicultural model may have continued a lot longer if it hadn't been for radical Islam. The terrorist assaults and plots across Britain and Europe—often from home-grown extremists—provided a breaking point that few sentient people could ignore. The question now is what can be done.

    In his speech in Munich, Mr. Cameron rightly focused on the problem of home-grown Islamic extremism. He stressed several preliminary steps—among them that groups whose values are opposed to those of the state will no longer be bestowed with taxpayer money. It is a symptom of how low we have sunk that ceasing to fund our societies' opponents would constitute an improvement.

    But this is a first, not a final, policy. The fact is that Britain, Germany, Holland and many other European countries have nurtured more than one generation of citizens who seem to feel no loyalty toward their country and who, on the contrary, often seem to despise it.

    The first step forward is that from school-age upward our societies must reassert a shared national narrative—including a common national culture. Some years ago the German Muslim writer Bassam Tibi coined the term "Leitkultur"—core culture—to describe this. It is the most decent and properly liberal antidote to multiculturalism. It concedes that in societies that have had high immigration there are all sorts of different cultures—which will only work together if they are united by a common theme.

    The Muslim communities that Mr. Cameron focused on will not reform themselves. So the British government will have to shut down and prosecute terrorist and extremist organizations, including some "charities." There are groups that are banned in the U.S. but can and do still operate with charitable status in the U.K. Clerics and other individuals who come from abroad to preach hate and division should be deported.

    Will Mr. Cameron manage to do any of this? There is reason to be skeptical. In the wake of the 2005 subway and bus bombings in London—attacks carried out by British-born Muslims—Tony Blair announced that "the rules of the game are changing." They then stayed the same.

    It is possible that Mr. Cameron will show more political courage. If he does, he will undoubtedly be lambasted by the defenders of multiculturalism. He will also become a leader of significance. If he doesn't, then future generations may well associate him with Munich. But it will not be for Saturday's speech. It will be with a previous prime minister who also went to that city and who returned with an honor that proved deeply temporary.

    Mr. Murray is director of the Center for Social Cohesion in London.





    http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748704364004576131940794840176.html?mod=googlenews_wsj


    Quote
    Will Mr. Cameron manage to do any of this? There is reason to be skeptical. In the wake of the 2005 subway and bus bombings in London—attacks carried out by British-born Muslims—Tony Blair announced that "the rules of the game are changing." They then stayed the same

    .

    Hopefully it will be different now, Mr. Cameron can start by scutinizing the faith schools that will be portrayed in this Channel 4 program :Dispatches: Lessons In Hate & Violence, to be sent Monday at 8,00pm.

     


    Like a compass needle that points north, a man?s accusing finger always finds a woman. Always.

    Khaled Hosseini - A thousand splendid suns.
  • Re: An opinion piece: Cameron is right on the failures of multiculturalism.
     Reply #23 - February 11, 2011, 01:44 PM


    Pat Condell on the failures of multiculturalism

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=SReDcW0fokE

    Like a compass needle that points north, a man?s accusing finger always finds a woman. Always.

    Khaled Hosseini - A thousand splendid suns.
  • Re: An opinion piece: Cameron is right on the failures of multiculturalism.
     Reply #24 - February 11, 2011, 02:31 PM

    After watching that video I have had enough of Pat Condell , its now pretty obvious that he does not know what he is talking about . Since when do Muslim torture animals ?? thats completely against Islam , he doesn't even know how animals are killed in Islamic law . Apparently halal meat is wide spread now that people don't even know if they are eating halal meat , I have been to Asda and the labels are clear , I dont think people notice or care . I think he has crossed the line he needs to stop labeling Muslims and stop exaggerating certain things , he used be funny but now he just looks stupid .

    "its fashionable to be an ex Muslim these days"
  • Re: An opinion piece: Cameron is right on the failures of multiculturalism.
     Reply #25 - February 11, 2011, 03:42 PM

    After watching that video I have had enough of Pat Condell , its now pretty obvious that he does not know what he is talking about . Since when do Muslim torture animals ?? thats completely against Islam , he doesn't even know how animals are killed in Islamic law . Apparently halal meat is wide spread now that people don't even know if they are eating halal meat , I have been to Asda and the labels are clear , I dont think people notice or care . I think he has crossed the line he needs to stop labeling Muslims and stop exaggerating certain things , he used be funny but now he just looks stupid .

    The halal method of killing animals (as with kosher) would be illegal if considered on an animal ethics basis only - on the basis of unnecessary cruelty.  It is only because of religious freedom considerations that it is allowed. 

    The fact that it is widespread simply shows that companies will use whatever is the most efficient legal way at their disposal to process meat.  The fact that people don't notice or care says much about those people.
  • Re: An opinion piece: Cameron is right on the failures of multiculturalism.
     Reply #26 - February 13, 2011, 02:02 PM

    After watching that video I have had enough of Pat Condell , its now pretty obvious that he does not know what he is talking about . Since when do Muslim torture animals ?? thats completely against Islam , he doesn't even know how animals are killed in Islamic law . Apparently halal meat is wide spread now that people don't even know if they are eating halal meat , I have been to Asda and the labels are clear , I dont think people notice or care . I think he has crossed the line he needs to stop labeling Muslims and stop exaggerating certain things , he used be funny but now he just looks stupid .


    The RSPCA notice and care.

    Too fucking busy, and vice versa.
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