Skip navigation
Sidebar -

Advanced search options →

Welcome

Welcome to CEMB forum.
Please login or register. Did you miss your activation email?

Donations

Help keep the Forum going!
Click on Kitty to donate:

Kitty is lost

Recent Posts


New Britain
Today at 01:54 PM

Gaza assault
January 26, 2025, 10:05 AM

اضواء على الطريق ....... ...
by akay
January 26, 2025, 08:55 AM

Lights on the way
by akay
January 25, 2025, 03:08 PM

Do humans have needed kno...
January 23, 2025, 06:32 AM

AMRIKAAA Land of Free .....
January 20, 2025, 05:08 PM

Random Islamic History Po...
by zeca
December 29, 2024, 12:03 PM

Qur'anic studies today
by zeca
December 29, 2024, 11:55 AM

News From Syria
by zeca
December 28, 2024, 12:29 AM

Mo Salah
December 26, 2024, 05:30 AM

What music are you listen...
by zeca
December 25, 2024, 10:58 AM

What's happened to the fo...
December 25, 2024, 02:29 AM

Theme Changer

 Topic: Saudi Arabia: Hundreds accused of 'immorality'

 (Read 4306 times)
  • 1« Previous thread | Next thread »
  • Saudi Arabia: Hundreds accused of 'immorality'
     OP - November 25, 2008, 04:26 PM

    Saudi Arabia: Hundreds accused of 'immorality'
    Quote

    Riyadh, 25 Nov. (AKI) - The Saudi religious police has over the past year detained 434 people accused of 'immorality' - a 19 percent increase on the previous year - according to a report issued by Saudi Arabia's Authority for the Prohibition of Vice and the Promotion of Virtue.

    Only a quarter of those arrested have Saudi citizenship. Most are foreigners, who were subsequently released with a caution after promising to lead a 'virtuous' life in future.

    Only those detained for alleged use of drugs or alcohol were sent to appear before magistrates. The highest number of people arrested by the religious police was in the holy city of Mecca (photo), followed by the capital, Riyadh.

    Instead of handing out custodial sentences, a number of Saudi judges have recently ordered offenders to clean buildings and cars, memorise the Koran (the Muslim holy book) or do community work.

    The religious police recently asked the government to increase their funding as they claim they do not have the manpower to go after all those suspected of 'immoral' behaviour.

    Such behaviour includes skipping prayers, consuming alcohol and appearing in public with members of the opposite sex who are not close family members.



    I was not blessed with the ability to have blind faith. I cant beleive something just because someone says its true.
  • Re: Saudi Arabia: Hundreds accused of 'immorality'
     Reply #1 - November 25, 2008, 04:32 PM

    No, they do not need more funding from the government.  These idiots need reining in!  Remember the schoolgirls who burnt to death a few years ago because of these morons?

    Quote
    Such behaviour includes skipping prayers, consuming alcohol and appearing in public with members of the opposite sex who are not close family members.


    Say, whatever happened to no compulsion in religion?  The Wahabbis are the ultimate hypocrites, accusing non-Wahabbis of picking and choosing from the Qu'ran and hadith as they will and at the same time they conveniently forget the above mentioned hadith when chasing people into the mosques at prayer time.

    Atheism is a non-prophet organization.

    The sleeper has awakened -  Dune

    Give a man a fish, and you'll feed him for a day Give him a religion, and he'll starve to death while praying for a fish!
  • Re: Saudi Arabia: Hundreds accused of 'immorality'
     Reply #2 - November 25, 2008, 04:56 PM

    Well, if you're salafi, that ayah doesn't mean much, unless you pay the jizyah in submission and humiliation.

    I chose to get circumcised at 17, don't tell me I never believed.
  • Re: Saudi Arabia: Hundreds accused of 'immorality'
     Reply #3 - November 25, 2008, 06:01 PM

    If you are a salafi you will read the verse in its historical context <Read the previous post by Awais>.

    "Ask the slave girl; she will tell you the truth.' So the Apostle called Burayra to ask her. Ali got up and gave her a violent beating first, saying, 'Tell the Apostle the truth.'"
  • Re: Saudi Arabia: Hundreds accused of 'immorality'
     Reply #4 - November 25, 2008, 10:10 PM

    Say, whatever happened to no compulsion in religion?   The Wahabbis are the ultimate hypocrites, accusing non-Wahabbis of picking and choosing from the Qu'ran and hadith as they will and at the same time they conveniently forget the above mentioned hadith when chasing people into the mosques at prayer time.


    The Wahabis are the one's that take the literature at face value. Others are the ones who cherry pick and re-interepret to conform to humane standards of morality and ethics.

    BTW No compulsion in Religion is a Qur'anic verse, not a hadith.

    And that verse when taken in its proper context does not mean what you think it means. Here is an analysis of the verse I made for the book I'm writing:

    Quote
    Firstly there is the verse that tells us there is no compulsion in religion.

    2:256 There is no compulsion in religion. The right direction is henceforth distinct from error. And he who rejecteth false deities and believeth in Allah hath grasped a firm handhold which will never break.

    This verse is used by Islamic apologists to provide an assurance to the uninformed non-Muslim that Islam honours the rights of all and sundry to believe as their conscience dictates. However when taken in its historical context we arrive at quite a different conclusion. From Islamic scriptures we are told exactly when this verse was revealed to Muhammad:

    When the children of a woman (in pre-islamic days) did not survive, she took a vow on herself that if her child survives, she would convert it to a Jew. When Banu an-Nadir were expelled (from Arabia), there were some children of the Ansar (helpers)
    among them. They said: We shall not leave our children. So Allah the Exalted revealed; ?Let there be no compulsion in religion. Truth stands out clear from error.? (SAD 14:2676)

    It is reported here that Muhammad revealed this verse to counter the conversion of children to Judaism. In those times, when there was no formalised religion among some of the tribes of Arabia, should a contagious illnesses strike, the women would pray that if their children survived such epidemics they would convert them to Judaism. Also when Muhammad arrived in Medina many of the new converts were concerned about the religion of their children as in that time they respected the right for an individual to choose their religion.

    To this end Muhammad revealed the verse giving Allah's guidance that people were not compelled to convert their children to Judaism should they survive an illness, nor are their children compelled to stay in their Pagan believe because they
    were born in it.

    This no compulsion in religion is strictly a one way affair. You are not compelled to stay in any non-Islamic religion, hence allowing the conversion to Islam. However once you are a Muslim you are compelled to remain in Islam.

    At this time Muhammad was still relatively weak in numbers and power. He could not use force to bring non-believers to Islam. This verse sought to give God's sanction that it was acceptable to leave a religion and come to Islam, 'the right direction' as he puts it. However not too long after this we find Muhammad as a warlord commanding armies that would bring terror to those who did not accept his message.

    This is evident from reading the Qur?an as a complete doctrine where Muhammad plainly declares, 'kill the unbelievers wherever you find them', 'Fight against those who believe not in Allah until they pay the Jizya with willing submission', 'fight them until disbelieve is no more, and religion is for Allah.'.

    Or if we read from the Hadiths we find Muhammad declaring: ?I have been ordered to fight with the people till they say, none has the right to be worshipped but Allah?, ?Whoever changes his Islamic religion, kill him.?

    In Islamic nations, it is a criminal offence for a Muslim to convert to another religion. If Islamic countries understood 'no compulsion in religion' to mean that a person had the right to adopt the religion of his/her choice, then Sharia laws preventing apostasy would not exist.

    It should also be noted that within this verse, although the first sentence says ?there is no compulsion??, it continues with, ?condemn those who do not accept Allah for they are in error and accept false deities.?

    Even the very next verse denounces non-Muslims as being patrons of false deities who lead them into darkness and ultimately to be residents of hell

    2:257 Allah is the Protecting Guardian of those who believe. He bringeth them out of darkness into light. As for those who disbelieve, their patrons are false deities. They bring them out of light into darkness. Such are rightful owners of the Fire. They will abide therein.

    And after all the apologies that attempt to bring some impression of tolerance in Islam are exhausted, one can always quote Qur?an 3:85: If anyone desires a religion other than Islam, never will it be accepted of him; and in the Hereafter he will be in the ranks of those who are losers.

    Never can a religion, other than Islam, be acceptable in society. So where is the concept of no compulsion unless it is only in the direction of moving into Islam?


    Knowing Islam is the only true religion we do not allow propagation of any other religion. How can we allow building of churches and temples when their religion is wrong? Thus we will not allow such wrong things in our countries. - Zakir Naik
  • Re: Saudi Arabia: Hundreds accused of 'immorality'
     Reply #5 - November 26, 2008, 09:45 AM

    You know, there was a royal decree, that banned the virtu police from entering malls and restaurants in Jeddah.

    and no, a royal decree is not what they call a quarter pounder with cheese at mc'donalds in saudi, we call it a "quartar boundar with sheese" unlike Holland who call it a "royal"

    Feeling funny for some reason today... don't worry it will pass
     thnkyu
  • Re: Saudi Arabia: Hundreds accused of 'immorality'
     Reply #6 - November 26, 2008, 11:01 AM

    The Wahabis are the one's that take the literature at face value. Others are the ones who cherry pick and re-interepret to conform to humane standards of morality and ethics.

    BTW No compulsion in Religion is a Qur'anic verse, not a hadith.

    And that verse when taken in its proper context does not mean what you think it means. Here is an analysis of the verse I made for the book I'm writing:



    Hey Ghazali,  Could you please provide us with your source material?  I have never heard about the Arabs 'promising' their children to Judaism before.

    Cheers!

    Atheism is a non-prophet organization.

    The sleeper has awakened -  Dune

    Give a man a fish, and you'll feed him for a day Give him a religion, and he'll starve to death while praying for a fish!
  • 1« Previous thread | Next thread »