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Theme Changer

 Topic: Was Mohamed rich?

 (Read 8609 times)
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  • Re: Was Mohamed rich?
     Reply #30 - December 09, 2009, 10:26 PM

    With his trousers on?  Maybe he was giving Aisha oral, and jizzed all over his pants.  Being a prophet and a gentelmen, and all that, he got Aisha to clean it up - he was giving her head after all..

    My Book     news002       
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  • Re: Was Mohamed rich?
     Reply #31 - December 09, 2009, 10:31 PM


    Quote
    I have x-rated porn from the bible, wanna see it?

    Always assume it's a Christian and that they give a shit about what's in the bible, Roll Eyes.

    I chose to get circumcised at 17, don't tell me I never believed.
  • Re: Was Mohamed rich?
     Reply #32 - December 09, 2009, 10:33 PM

    Mo if just fucking crazy.  eddie

    Iblis has mad debaterin' skillz. Best not step up unless you're prepared to recieve da pain.

  • Re: Was Mohamed rich?
     Reply #33 - December 10, 2009, 01:53 AM

    Apparently he performed ablution with wine too.

    Narrated by Abdullah bin Masoud (May God be pleased with him):
    He was with the Messenger of Allah peace be upon him on the night of the jinn when he asked him if he had water. He answered that he had wine in a pot. Mohammed said: Pour me some to do ablution and he did. [The] Prophet peace be upon him [said]: "O Abdullah bin Masood it is a purified drink."

    Musnad Ahmad - Hadith #3594

    http://www.wikiislam.com/wiki/Muhammad_drank_wine_and_performed_ablution_with_it
    http://hadith.al-islam.com/Display/Display.asp?hnum=3594&doc=6

    "We were married by a Reform rabbi in Long Island. A very Reform rabbi. A Nazi."-- Woody Allen
  • Re: Was Mohamed rich?
     Reply #34 - December 10, 2009, 02:01 AM

    Just to play devils advocate for the moment, what we understand about Muhammad is pretty unreliable given the way it is transmitted. What one knows about him is heavily reliant on his companions and first caliphs which brings up the question as to how much of his life has been embellished as to justify successors policies? I'm not claiming that Muhammad was a holy joe by any stretch of the imagination but when one looks at the some of the stuff his companions got up to - and the fact that Sunni's hold them in such high regard, I can't help but want to bring out my trademark bullshit detector and see whether it explodes on first sniff of the narrative.

    "It's just a job. Grass grows, birds fly, waves pound the sand. I beat people up." - Muhammad Ali
  • Re: Was Mohamed rich?
     Reply #35 - December 10, 2009, 02:06 AM

    That's a good point Kawai. However, its not just Muhammad. Any one-sided account of a single ancient/medieval figure is always highly doubtful and at the end unreliable. Half the time we can't figure out whats real about the personality of great emperors and kings, so imagine how unreliable and open to fabrication the accounts by illiterate desert people can be. Its just one of those things about the pre-modern era that is always up for debate.

    Iblis has mad debaterin' skillz. Best not step up unless you're prepared to recieve da pain.

  • Re: Was Mohamed rich?
     Reply #36 - December 10, 2009, 02:57 AM

    That's a good point Kawai. However, its not just Muhammad. Any one-sided account of a single ancient/medieval figure is always highly doubtful and at the end unreliable. Half the time we can't figure out whats real about the personality of great emperors and kings, so imagine how unreliable and open to fabrication the accounts by illiterate desert people can be. Its just one of those things about the pre-modern era that is always up for debate.


    I think it is more so ever since Muslims elevated Muhammad beyond a man with a message to the most perfect human being ever existed. As soon as you make grandiose statements like that then you need to start creating a whole new history that conforms to your paradigm of thinking. There was quite an interesting discussion between Salman Rushdie and Irshad Manji regarding Muhammad and the situation of that time.

    I am confused as to why Muslims feel the need to embellish their history given that there is no need on the part of the Jews or the Christians to claim that their prophets (well, except for Christians and Jesus)  were perfect and sinless. I've yet to see, therefore a single quotation that denotes the elevated status given to Muhammad through words coming from Muhammad's own mouth. The closest I have come to, however, is the verse of purification in the Qur'an but that is only automatic forgiveness of sins - not that he won't sin at all.

    "It's just a job. Grass grows, birds fly, waves pound the sand. I beat people up." - Muhammad Ali
  • Re: Was Mohamed rich?
     Reply #37 - December 10, 2009, 07:22 AM

    What was the prophet doing cumming in his trousers?  Did he suffer from P.E when this young thing removed her niqab?


    I think I might have the answer; Nocturnal emissions. I heard that having sex dreams is either shatian whispering dirty things in your ears (you little perv iblis!) or god blessing you :S
  • Re: Was Mohamed rich?
     Reply #38 - December 10, 2009, 07:27 AM

    Just to play devils advocate for the moment, what we understand about Muhammad is pretty unreliable given the way it is transmitted. What one knows about him is heavily reliant on his companions and first caliphs which brings up the question as to how much of his life has been embellished as to justify successors policies? I'm not claiming that Muhammad was a holy joe by any stretch of the imagination but when one looks at the some of the stuff his companions got up to - and the fact that Sunni's hold them in such high regard, I can't help but want to bring out my trademark bullshit detector and see whether it explodes on first sniff of the narrative.


    Yeah  I agree but how are we supposed to know what's what then? Scholars choose all the good hadiths and leave out all the bad ones because they conflict with the message of the Quran or with the message of those good hadiths, how is one supposed to have an accurate picture of a man? Or a fair representation? Not to mention the Sira, which was written before the hadiths.

    Question, those years before the sira and the hadith how were muslims living according to sunna?
  • Re: Was Mohamed rich?
     Reply #39 - December 10, 2009, 07:38 AM

    I've just added two more videos to my video thread:

    http://www.councilofexmuslims.com/index.php?topic=7492.0

    I talk about Muhammad but soon I'll upload a couple regarding the Qur'an and the nature of reality.

    "It's just a job. Grass grows, birds fly, waves pound the sand. I beat people up." - Muhammad Ali
  • Re: Was Mohamed rich?
     Reply #40 - December 10, 2009, 09:13 AM

    I'm not sure. I mean he was offered power by the Arab tribes but only under one condition. If he gave up Islam, they would give him whatever he wanted. But he rejected it and just preached on. Who knows what really happened.


    Muhammad was born into a place which before him had complete freedom of religion & many religions, only they protested against hate speech, which is perfectly reasonable, even many Western nations having full religious freedom today put hate speech in a different category.

    Remember, Muhammad discussed Abrahamic religions with his wife's cousin Waraqa, a convert to Christianity, also we know of Jewish leaders like Kaab ibn al Ashraf, son of a Jewish mother, Arab father who was brought up  Jewish, according to halacha wherein religion is determined matrilineally.

    So both conversions to another religion & interfaith marriage was acceptable to the Arabs then, also unlike the anti Semitism after Islam, Jewesses could marry Arab men & raise their kids Jewish.

    Also, Arabs didn't object to Muhammad preaching a new religion, only when he started uttering rampant hate speech that they felt the need to oppose him.

    When the apostle openly displayed Islam as Allah ordered him, his people did not withdraw or turn against him, so far as I have heard, until he spoke disparagingly of their gods.   When he did that, they took great offence and resolved unanimously to treat him as an enemy. (Ibn Ishaq 167)


    Although asked to stop, Muhammad continued to stir up trouble by ?condemning? the local religion, causing the Meccans great anxiety:

    [The Meccans] said they had never known anything like the trouble they had endured from this fellow.  He had declared their mode of life foolish, insulted their forefathers, reviled their religion, divided the community and cursed their gods (Ibn Ishaq 183).

    Muhammad was offered power, but what sort of power?He could probably at most have become their 361st God, so an idol of him would be put beside the others in the kaaba, or he could've ruled that little place. Also, we don't know how far Arabs would've given him power once he gave up his hate speech & threats, they might've reneged on the deal & even his followers would've abandoned him once they saw that he'd stopped preaching, so he'd be left with no followers. Muhammad ultimately snatched power forcibly, when he ordered the Banu Quraiza massacre & destroyed the idolators idols-declaring that only Islam is the truth. By giving up Islam, he couldn't have the same kind of all encompassing power.

    Declaring himself last Abrahamic Prophet gave him real power, power to destroy all the Meccan idols, power to cleanse the Arabian peninsula of Jews & Christians & letting only his faith remain, power to be remembered with the One God-Allah in the Shahada.

    Thats' real power. Tongue

    World renowned historian Will Durant"...the Islamic conquest of India is probably the bloodiest story in history. It is a discouraging tale, for its evident moral is that civilization is a precious good, whose delicate complex order and freedom can at any moment be overthrown..."
  • Re: Was Mohamed rich?
     Reply #41 - December 10, 2009, 01:26 PM

    Why would he need moeny, why does anyone want money? Surely it is to get what they need and want.

    So what does a man need/want, Power? hhe had it, drop a hint and it was done. Influence? His word was law and divine law at that!  Women? How many wives did he have? And slave girls? Recognition,well when a foreign king he had never met sent him slave girls, in tribute that is that taken care of, So why not take it easy do a bit of gardening enjoy the nightswith your favouite wife/ concubine and watch your God given share of the booty roll in. Wealth? what need did he have of money? I mean seriously what did he need money for?
  • Re: Was Mohamed rich?
     Reply #42 - December 10, 2009, 04:25 PM

    With his trousers on?  Maybe he was giving Aisha oral, and jizzed all over his pants.  Being a prophet and a gentelmen, and all that, he got Aisha to clean it up - he was giving her head after all..


    Nothing like being blunt about it is there?
  • Re: Was Mohamed rich?
     Reply #43 - December 11, 2009, 12:16 AM

    Nice analysis Rubayat  Afro


    Do you know the verse where it says "God and angels praise Muhammad. Believers praise Muhammad and give him an worthy salute?"
    A sublime expression of vanity? Narcissism?


    Challenge All Ideologies but don't Hate People.
  • Re: Was Mohamed rich?
     Reply #44 - December 11, 2009, 07:33 AM

    @
    Rubaiyat

    +1

    In Arabic the word used is salawat, which means praises, right?

    But there is another expression that goes Allah homa sali ala mohamed wa ali mohamed. Sali in this case sounds exactly like sali in other cases, sali means pray, rah a-sali, im going to pray. Can any of the Arabic experts please talk about this, as a kid I thought it meant god prays on/for Mohamed and his family, but I was told it means something else, more like praises, rather than prayers?
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