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Theme Changer

 Topic: Prayer direction and flat earth!

 (Read 25963 times)
  • 12 3 Next page « Previous thread | Next thread »
  • Prayer direction and flat earth!
     OP - September 10, 2010, 04:37 PM




    Do prayers bend around the earth to reach Kabba? Or do Muslims actually pray to the stars?

    I wonder what the Muslim Mullahs think?

    I think all this "face Mecca" thingy during prayers is due to the old belief that the earth is flat!

    Also if Muslims to progress (one day) and explore the space, where do they face when praying from outer space?

    ETA: http://www.councilofexmuslims.com/index.php?topic=12316.msg342757#msg342757

    ...
  • Re: Prayer direction and flat earth!
     Reply #1 - September 10, 2010, 04:40 PM

     Cheesy  Nice picture.

    "Many people would sooner die than think; In fact, they do so." -- Bertrand Russell

    Baloney Detection Kit
  • Re: Prayer direction and flat earth!
     Reply #2 - September 10, 2010, 04:49 PM

    Good work ! lol Afro

    "Tomorrow is the today you were worried about yesterday" Unknown
  • Re: Prayer direction and flat earth!
     Reply #3 - September 10, 2010, 04:50 PM

    Dont you know the kabba sucks our spiritual energy and targets it to itself?
  • Re: Prayer direction and flat earth!
     Reply #4 - September 10, 2010, 04:55 PM

    Omg it is a car battery!



    ^*Car Battery



    ^*Kabba
  • Re: Prayer direction and flat earth!
     Reply #5 - September 10, 2010, 05:07 PM

    TR, surely can make an awesome video regarding this idea, or may be he already have...  Afro

    ...
  • Re: Prayer direction and flat earth!
     Reply #6 - September 10, 2010, 07:06 PM

    The prophet peace be upon him prayed upon the earth. At no point on the earth is it straight, it is always curved, even if at an extremely small percent. So we pray upon the curved surface by default.

    There is no contradiction.

  • Re: Prayer direction and flat earth!
     Reply #7 - September 10, 2010, 07:17 PM

    The prophet peace be upon him prayed upon the earth. At no point on the earth is it straight, it is always curved, even if at an extremely small percent. So we pray upon the curved surface by default.

    There is no contradiction.




    The prophet peas be upon him was a few hundred Km away from the kabba. He did not think of people who would be praying from the other parts of the world. Nor he thought about the possibility of muslims praying from a space station! If there will ever be a Muslim astronaut.

    ...
  • Re: Prayer direction and flat earth!
     Reply #8 - September 10, 2010, 07:22 PM

    Did you know that God's throne is directly above the Kaaba? I guess he has a spinning throne. Maybe it's on a merry-go-round.
  • Re: Prayer direction and flat earth!
     Reply #9 - September 10, 2010, 07:38 PM

    Interesting article to read:



    Sheikh Muszaphar Shukor has a problem. Two problems. The first is that Mecca keeps moving. Well, not really. It's Shukor who'll be moving. As Malaysia's first astronaut, he's scheduled to lift off October 10 in a Russian Soyuz spacecraft for a nine-day visit during the holy month of Ramadan to the International Space Station. He's a devout Muslim and when he says his daily prayers he wants to face Mecca, specifically the Ka'aba, the holiest place in Islam ("Turn then thy face towards the Sacred Mosque: wherever ye are, turn your faces towards it .... " The Quran, Al-Baqarah, 2:149).

    That's where the trouble comes in. From ISS, orbiting 220 miles above the surface of the Earth, the qibla (an Arabic word meaning the direction a Muslim should pray toward Mecca) changes from second to second. During some parts of the space station's orbit, the qibla can move nearly 180 degrees during the course of a single prayer. What's a devout Muslim to do?

    "As a Muslim, I do hope to do my responsibilities," Shukor says. "I do hope to fast in space." Malaysia's space agency, Angkasa, convened a conference of 150 Islamic scientists and scholars last year to wrestle with these and other questions. The resulting document (.doc), "A Guideline of Performing Ibadah (worship) at the International Space Station (ISS)", was approved by Malaysia's National Fatwa Council earlier this year. According to the report, determining the qibla should be "based on what is possible" for the astronaut, and can be prioritized this way: 1) the Ka'aba, 2) the projection of Ka'aba, 3) the Earth, 4) wherever.

    This leads to Shukor's second problem. There are two distinct schools of thought for determining the qibla: the commonly used Great Circle method, and the less common rhumb-line method. Looking at a flat map using any standard projection shows that a rhumb line (a line that cuts equal angles across all lines of longitude) drawn from, say, the Johnson Space Center in Houston to Mecca runs east-southeast. The numbers also bear this out -- the space center is to the north and west of the Ka'aba, so any travel to the holy city should naturally be to the southeast.

    Lay a string across a globe, however, and everything changes. A great circle -- the shortest distance between two points on a sphere -- between Houston and Mecca initially arcs to the northeast, then curves southward to the Saudi peninsula. Islamic scientists knew as early as the ninth century CE that the great circle route provided the shortest path to Mecca from anywhere in the world, even though it may in some places seem counterintuitive (Muslims in Alaska, for example, pray facing almost due north). Great circle formulae are at the root of nearly every online qibla compass.

    Dr. Kamal Abdali, a cartographer who is also Muslim and who has written (.pdf) extensively on determining the qibla, favors the great circle route, but adds, "Prayer is not supposed to be a gymnastic exercise. One is supposed to concentrate on the prayer rather the exact orientation." He points out that in a train or plane, it's customary to start in the qibla direction but then continue the prayer without worrying about possible changes in position.

    But how does that work in space? Mathematically, Shukor would need to place both ISS and Mecca on the same imaginary sphere -- by either comparing the place on Earth directly beneath ISS with the real Ka'aba, or by projecting the Ka'aba into space (the option recommended by the Fatwa Council).

    Yet the option to pray while facing a point in space brings up another problem. Muslims face the ground to pray, in part to avoid any hint of pagan sun or moon worship ("Prostrate yourselves not to the sun nor to the moon, but prostrate yourselves to Allah Who created them, if you (really) worship Him" (The Quran, Fussilat 41:37). If the Ka'aba projection happens to line up with the sun or moon, purists might believe the prayer invalid.

    For now, Shukor is keeping the details of his plans fluid until he is actually on board ISS, a point with which Dr. Khaleel Mohammed, assistant professor of religion at San Diego State University, concurs. "In space," Mohammed points out, "the ritual prayer might be offset for more of a prayer that is allowed when on jihad ... for the lack of gravity and directional accuracy makes it legitimate to do as one sees fit. God does not take a person to task for that which is beyond his/her ability to work with."

    Questions like these will continue as more and more religious astronauts travel into space. When is sunset in low Earth orbit if you're experiencing a dozen sunrises and sunsets in every 24-hour period? When does Sabbath begin on the moon, where the sun sets once a month? When is the first sighting of the crescent moon if you're on Mars? Religious councils of all faiths will have plenty to keep them busy for years.

    ------


    source

    ...
  • Re: Prayer direction and flat earth!
     Reply #10 - September 10, 2010, 08:33 PM

    The prophet peace be upon him prayed upon the earth. At no point on the earth is it straight, it is always curved, even if at an extremely small percent. So we pray upon the curved surface by default.

    There is no contradiction.




    The prophet, lard upon him, wasnt aware that the earth was a sphere. If an All-Knowing Being was communicating with him, He would have given details about how silly it is to slam's one head thinking it is alignment to some black box despite the surface of the earth not being level.
  • Re: Prayer direction and flat earth!
     Reply #11 - September 10, 2010, 08:36 PM

    Did you know that God's throne is directly above the Kaaba? I guess he has a spinning throne. Maybe it's on a merry-go-round.


    You need to stop thinking too much Abood! Dont try to outsmart Allah!
  • Re: Prayer direction and flat earth!
     Reply #12 - September 10, 2010, 09:06 PM

    Is it just me of is the grand mosque flooded in that pic?
  • Re: Prayer direction and flat earth!
     Reply #13 - September 10, 2010, 09:11 PM

    You posted it. What you think?  Cheesy

    ...
  • Re: Prayer direction and flat earth!
     Reply #14 - September 10, 2010, 09:14 PM

    Is it just me of is the grand mosque flooded in that pic?




    ...
  • Re: Prayer direction and flat earth!
     Reply #15 - September 10, 2010, 09:16 PM


    ...
  • Re: Prayer direction and flat earth!
     Reply #16 - September 10, 2010, 09:26 PM

    Epic stuff, mosque converted into a swimming pool.
  • Re: Prayer direction and flat earth!
     Reply #17 - September 10, 2010, 09:43 PM

    Allah likes to go skinny dipping once in a while. Tongue Thankfully he's invisible. whistling2
  • Re: Prayer direction and flat earth!
     Reply #18 - September 10, 2010, 09:45 PM

    Ooo, what if somebody pees in there? Allah is bathing in diluted Wee!
  • Re: Prayer direction and flat earth!
     Reply #19 - September 10, 2010, 09:52 PM

    Makes you wonder, what do the people who say things like "All natural disasters like quakes and floods are punishments from god" mean? Was he punishing himself then? Thinking hard

    ...
  • Re: Prayer direction and flat earth!
     Reply #20 - September 10, 2010, 09:54 PM

     Cheesy

    19:46   <zizo>: hugs could pimp u into sex

    Quote from: yeezevee
    well I am neither ex-Muslim nor absolute 100% Non-Muslim.. I am fucking Zebra

  • Re: Prayer direction and flat earth!
     Reply #21 - September 10, 2010, 09:58 PM

    Well at least people would've known if anyone farted in the water.
  • Re: Prayer direction and flat earth!
     Reply #22 - September 10, 2010, 10:29 PM

    Lol at the prayer in space article.  What is going to happen when we colonize Mars?

    So once again I'm left with the classic Irish man's dilemma, do I eat the potato or do I let it ferment so I can drink it later?
    My political philosophy below
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bwGat4i8pJI&feature=g-vrec
    Just kidding, here are some true heros
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dBTgvK6LQqA
  • Re: Prayer direction and flat earth!
     Reply #23 - September 10, 2010, 10:39 PM

    They are going to be in prayer pods which move to face mecca by gps somehow
  • Re: Prayer direction and flat earth!
     Reply #24 - September 11, 2010, 01:03 AM

    Do prayers bend around the earth to reach Kabba? Or do Muslims actually pray to the stars? I wonder what the Muslim Mullahs think?

    I think all this "face Mecca" thingy during prayers is due to the old belief that the earth is flat!

    Also if Muslims to progress (one day) and explore the space, where do they face when praying from outer space?

    ETA: http://www.councilofexmuslims.com/index.php?topic=12316.msg342757#msg342757

    Got caught out with this argument today.  I mentioned it to a muslim, and he said if compasses work for marine travel, & get you from A to B, then why cant it work for the direction of prayers.  Couldnt think of an answer on the spot, can you help me??

    My Book     news002       
    My Blog  pccoffee
  • Re: Prayer direction and flat earth!
     Reply #25 - September 11, 2010, 01:17 AM

    Omg it is a car battery!

    (Clicky for piccy!)

    ^*Car Battery

    (Clicky for piccy!)

    ^*Kabba


     hahaha  Priceless!

    Atheism is a non-prophet organization.

    The sleeper has awakened -  Dune

    Give a man a fish, and you'll feed him for a day Give him a religion, and he'll starve to death while praying for a fish!
  • Re: Prayer direction and flat earth!
     Reply #26 - September 11, 2010, 02:05 AM

    ...
  • Re: Prayer direction and flat earth!
     Reply #27 - September 11, 2010, 02:42 AM

    ...
  • Re: Prayer direction and flat earth!
     Reply #28 - September 11, 2010, 07:25 AM

    Got caught out with this argument today.  I mentioned it to a muslim, and he said if compasses work for marine travel, & get you from A to B, then why cant it work for the direction of prayers.  Couldnt think of an answer on the spot, can you help me??


    Yeah, compasses and GPSes get you from "A" to "B", alright, but you have to go around islands and continents, and when on land you move around buildings and go up a hill then down a hill to reach that "B". And when "A" is located several thousands of miles from "B", your route actually bend around the globe. 

    So my question still stands, do prayers bend? And since neither Mr Moe nor his immediate successors to his throne mentioned anything about that, doesn't it show that they actually believed the earth was flat?

    Having said that, this verse do not make any sense:

    ("Prostrate yourselves not to the sun nor to the moon, but prostrate yourselves to Allah Who created them, if you (really) worship Him" (The Quran, Fussilat 41:37)

    Especially when you look at this illustration:





    ...
  • Re: Prayer direction and flat earth!
     Reply #29 - September 11, 2010, 07:40 AM

    Got caught out with this argument today.  I mentioned it to a muslim, and he said if compasses work for marine travel, & get you from A to B, then why cant it work for the direction of prayers.  Couldnt think of an answer on the spot, can you help me??

    Actually, travellers normally use a different compass depending on what part of the world they are in. They are normally geared for specific zones, and magnetic north varies depending on where on the globe you are. Using a compass set up for a northern hemisphere zone, for example, would be inclined to point at your feet if you were travelling in the southern hemisphere going north.

    You can buy multi-zone compasses for this very reason.

    Too fucking busy, and vice versa.
  • 12 3 Next page « Previous thread | Next thread »