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Theme Changer

 Topic: The New Testament

 (Read 9167 times)
  • 12 Next page « Previous thread | Next thread »
  • The New Testament
     OP - January 07, 2011, 04:20 AM

    Is it really all that nice and lovely? does it contain verses that are cruel, intolerant, bigoted, sexist, homophobic....etc ?

    Because I have a Christian friend who's like "the New Testament is the best ! I don't believe in the Old Testament though".. is this true?
  • Re: The New Testament
     Reply #1 - January 07, 2011, 04:23 AM

    http://skepticsannotatedbible.com/ Search the NT according to the categories you just mentioned.

    fuck you
  • Re: The New Testament
     Reply #2 - January 07, 2011, 04:44 AM

    I think one of the best things you can do is the following.

    Read each of the 4 Gospels (Matthew, Mark, Luke & John)

    Write down what happens in each, step by step.

    Take the 4 lists and try to make them a coherent story.

    You can't Tongue

     

    El bien mas preciado / es la libertad
    hay que defenderla / con fe y valor.
  • Re: The New Testament
     Reply #3 - January 07, 2011, 04:45 AM

    Also, at the link Q-man left, you'll find the funny stuff where Jesus (God, Man/God, Son of God) misquotes the Torah.

     

    El bien mas preciado / es la libertad
    hay que defenderla / con fe y valor.
  • Re: The New Testament
     Reply #4 - January 07, 2011, 05:04 AM

    Is it really all that nice and lovely? does it contain verses that are cruel, intolerant, bigoted, sexist, homophobic....etc ?

    Because I have a Christian friend who's like "the New Testament is the best ! I don't believe in the Old Testament though".. is this true?


    generally it is "good" as in totally unrealistic, but like q man said read the skeptics bible.  Jesus does say some useless or pointless things in there.

    So once again I'm left with the classic Irish man's dilemma, do I eat the potato or do I let it ferment so I can drink it later?
    My political philosophy below
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bwGat4i8pJI&feature=g-vrec
    Just kidding, here are some true heros
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dBTgvK6LQqA
  • Re: The New Testament
     Reply #5 - January 07, 2011, 07:46 AM

    Is it really all that nice and lovely? does it contain verses that are cruel, intolerant, bigoted, sexist, homophobic....etc ?

    Because I have a Christian friend who's like "the New Testament is the best ! I don't believe in the Old Testament though".. is this true?

    Yes it all lovely. It has lovely support of slavery, lovely ways of telling women to STFU and behave themselves, lovely ranting against unbelievers, and lovely hellfire and damnation and wailing and gnashing of teeth on judgement day. All sorts of lovely stuff.   Afro

    Devious, treacherous, murderous, neanderthal, sub-human of the West. bunny
  • Re: The New Testament
     Reply #6 - January 07, 2011, 11:09 AM

    Interesting. Thanks for sharing.

    I've been debating this Iraqi Christian about Islam and religion in general on an Iraqi forum. I told everyone I was an atheist which got me into a heated discussion with some members.
    Of all people it was the Christian dude who most vehemently defended religion. He's always like all "theses terrorists are not Muslims, they shouldn't be considered Muslims" even though he's from a community that is facing terrorist attacks in Iraq. You know, one of those don't-blame-the-religion-blame-the-people types.
    In one post he portrayed the historic treatment of Christians as very tolerant....blah blah blah  I mean if I hadn't known him a little better, I would've thought he's a Muslim disguised as a Christian.

    Anyway, so I posted a couple of long ass replies and exposed Islam for what it is. You know death for apostates, 4:34, stoning to death....etc the usual. Many members left the discussion. One replied with "you can take verses from any holy book out of context to justify your arguments and make religion look bad, even form the Bible" to which I replied "yeah which is why I don't follow any religion"  so the Christian dude was like "Really? But wouldn't they all be from the old testament not the new testament, which is the one thats used by Christians."

    Hopefully now the link will help me show him some of those verses.
  • Re: The New Testament
     Reply #7 - January 07, 2011, 11:11 AM

    Is it really all that nice and lovely? does it contain verses that are cruel, intolerant, bigoted, sexist, homophobic....etc ?

    Because I have a Christian friend who's like "the New Testament is the best ! I don't believe in the Old Testament though".. is this true?

    Which christian denomination does your friend belong to?
  • Re: The New Testament
     Reply #8 - January 07, 2011, 11:17 AM

    hmm I love when Christians in defense of themselves try to distance themselves from the Old Testament... Yet the same Christians accept the creation myth, Noah's myth, 10 comandments etc etc, all stories of the old Testament....

    But hey that's every "rational" believer has got to do... If they don't cherry pick the verses, use context and time as a scapegoat, they would have turned atheist a long time ago...

    Just look at the sun and the moon, rotating around the earth perfectly! Out of all the never ending space in the universe, the sun and moon ended up close to earth rotating around it perfectly.!!

  • Re: The New Testament
     Reply #9 - January 07, 2011, 11:19 AM

    ..Yes it all lovely. lovely ways of telling women to STFU and behave themselves,........


    Do not let silence become your legacy.. Question everything   
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim
     
  • Re: The New Testament
     Reply #10 - January 07, 2011, 11:40 AM

    Interesting. Thanks for sharing.

    I've been debating this Iraqi Christian about Islam and religion in general on an Iraqi forum. I told everyone I was an atheist which got me into a heated discussion with some members.
    Of all people it was the Christian dude who most vehemently defended religion. He's always like all "theses terrorists are not Muslims, they shouldn't be considered Muslims" even though he's from a community that is facing terrorist attacks in Iraq. You know, one of those don't-blame-the-religion-blame-the-people types.
    In one post he portrayed the historic treatment of Christians as very tolerant....blah blah blah  I mean if I hadn't known him a little better, I would've thought he's a Muslim disguised as a Christian.

    Anyway, so I posted a couple of long ass replies and exposed Islam for what it is. You know death for apostates, 4:34, stoning to death....etc the usual. Many members left the discussion. One replied with "you can take verses from any holy book out of context to justify your arguments and make religion look bad, even form the Bible" to which I replied "yeah which is why I don't follow any religion"  so the Christian dude was like "Really? But wouldn't they all be from the old testament not the new testament, which is the one thats used by Christians."

    Hopefully now the link will help me show him some of those verses.


    I have a female Coptic friend JUST like that - makes you want to bang your head against a brick wall.
  • Re: The New Testament
     Reply #11 - January 07, 2011, 11:54 AM

    It would be dishonest to say Christian scripture is as bad as Islamic. Without a doubt Christians have a better role model in Christ than Muslims do in Mohammed, and the central themes of Christ's teachings is that of love, forgiveness, non-violence, and it is so no matter how far you try and stretch it. You'll still burn in Hell if you do not accept his divinity and call him Lord, though. But overall, Jesus wins hands down. If all the Christians in the world suddenly decided to act like more Jesus, the world would instantly be a better place. If all the Muslims of the world suddenly decided to act more like Mohammed, we’d all be royally fucked over and out.

    Where the New Testament fails is in the writings of Paul, who was a massive arsehole and managed to ruin (with the help of other charlatans and chancers) what could have been a decently reformed religion. Incidently, he never even met Jesus, never preached his Gospel, never mentions the life of a living Jesus, the virgin birth, the miracles, never quotes any of his actual teachings or sermons, never repeats any of the parables, doesn't seem to know anything about him at all. It's like Paul invents his own religion one day after his epileptic fit and it somehow got mixed in with the other books of the New Testament, apparently from the same source. It follows that the Gospels were manufactured after the writings of Paul.

    This is the kind of thing that makes Christian churches such misogynistic institutions:

    But I would have you know, that the head of every man is Christ; and the head of the woman is the man; and the head of Christ is God. Every man praying or prophesying, having his head covered, dishonoureth his head. But every woman that prayeth or prophesieth with her head uncovered dishonoureth her head: for that is even all one as if she were shaven. For if the woman be not covered, let her also be shorn: but if it be a shame for a woman to be shorn or shaven, let her be covered. For a man indeed ought not to cover his head, forasmuch as he is the image and glory of God: but the woman is the glory of the man. For the man is not of the woman; but the woman of the man. Neither was the man created for the woman; but the woman for the man. For this cause ought the woman to have power on her head because of the angels.
    ~ I Corinthians 11:3-10

    Let your women keep silence in the churches: for it is not permitted unto them to speak; but they are commanded to be under obedience, as also saith the law. And if they will learn any thing, let them ask their husbands at home: for it is a shame for women to speak in the church.
    ~ I Corinthians 14:34-35

    Let the woman learn in silence with all subjection. But I suffer not a woman to teach, nor to usurp authority over the man, but to be in silence. For Adam was first formed, then Eve. And Adam was not deceived, but the woman being deceived was in the transgression. Notwithstanding she shall be saved in childbearing, if they continue in faith and charity and holiness with sobriety.
    ~ I Timothy 2:11-15

    And much more. This is the bread and butter of Catholic faith.

    Too fucking busy, and vice versa.
  • Re: The New Testament
     Reply #12 - January 07, 2011, 11:55 AM

    I have a female Coptic friend JUST like that - makes you want to bang your head against a brick wall.

    Who is stopping you hitting your head Hassan., try that in front of your coptic female friend and with with an atheist male friend .,  See who will stop you hitting your head against a brick wall.

    You guys want everyone to be an atheist and Godless society ., where as over 6 billion believers of one religion or other are out there looking and thinking about/for god in this life god after this life . So you are not going win that game quickly unless you clone a billion Richard Dawkins  and spread them around the planet..  

    Do not let silence become your legacy.. Question everything   
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim
     
  • Re: The New Testament
     Reply #13 - January 07, 2011, 12:55 PM

    It would be dishonest to say Christian scripture is as bad as Islamic. Without a doubt Christians have a better role model in Christ than Muslims do in Mohammed, and the central themes of Christ's teachings is that of love, forgiveness, non-violence, and it is so no matter how far you try and stretch it. You'll still burn in Hell if you do not accept his divinity and call him Lord, though. But overall, Jesus wins hands down. If all the Christians in the world suddenly decided to act like more Jesus, the world would instantly be a better place. If all the Muslims of the world suddenly decided to act more like Mohammed, we’d all be royally fucked over and out.

    Where the New Testament fails is in the writings of Paul, who was a massive arsehole and managed to ruin (with the help of other charlatans and chancers) what could have been a decently reformed religion. Incidently, he never even met Jesus, never preached his Gospel, never mentions the life of a living Jesus, the virgin birth, the miracles, never quotes any of his actual teachings or sermons, never repeats any of the parables, doesn't seem to know anything about him at all. It's like Paul invents his own religion one day after his epileptic fit and it somehow got mixed in with the other books of the New Testament, apparently from the same source. It follows that the Gospels were manufactured after the writings of Paul.

    Well said.

    But you forgot to mention the other source of creepiness that made the Christian religion a giant "WTF?!"... the Book of Revelation aka the Apocalypse ^_^

    It's kinda lol-worthy.

    Do not look directly at the operational end of the device.
  • Re: The New Testament
     Reply #14 - January 07, 2011, 01:04 PM

    Yeah, as a mythology it is its own special brand of crazy, but I was thinking more of the actual ruleset proposed in its scripture.

    I actually quite like Revelation, its a decent book of myths and fiction. I like the Gospel according to John too. Those two books are the only readable ones in the Bible. The rest is fucking boring. Then again, I like Paradise Lost, and mythology in general I find quite fascinating.

    Too fucking busy, and vice versa.
  • Re: The New Testament
     Reply #15 - January 07, 2011, 06:43 PM

    The obligatory threats of Hell:

    20 Then Jesus began to denounce the towns in which most of his miracles had been performed, because they did not repent. 21 “Woe to you, Chorazin! Woe to you, Bethsaida! For if the miracles that were performed in you had been performed in Tyre and Sidon, they would have repented long ago in sackcloth and ashes. 22 But I tell you, it will be more bearable for Tyre and Sidon on the day of judgment than for you. 23 And you, Capernaum, will you be lifted to the heavens? No, you will go down to Hades.[e] For if the miracles that were performed in you had been performed in Sodom, it would have remained to this day. 24 But I tell you that it will be more bearable for Sodom on the day of judgment than for you.” -- Matthew 11: 20-24

    41 “Then he will say to those on his left, ‘Depart from me, you who are cursed, into the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his angels. -- Matthew 25:41

    34 “Do not suppose that I have come to bring peace to the earth. I did not come to bring peace, but a sword. 35 For I have come to turn

       “‘a man against his father,
       a daughter against her mother,
    a daughter-in-law against her mother-in-law—
       36 a man’s enemies will be the members of his own household.’[c]

       37 “Anyone who loves their father or mother more than me is not worthy of me; anyone who loves their son or daughter more than me is not worthy of me. 38 Whoever does not take up their cross and follow me is not worthy of me. 39 Whoever finds their life will lose it, and whoever loses their life for my sake will find it.
    -- Matthew 10: 34-39

    You have to love Big Brother more than your own family and all that shite.

    Although, I would say that these batty passages are interspersed with some rather more agreeable proverbs and injunctions. Literary-wise, the NT is better than the Qur'an. Not in terms of the poetic quality but it's simply more varied, less repetitive and doesn't quite have to stress the whole 'Hell Fire and brimstone' thing every other friggin' chapter.
  • Re: The New Testament
     Reply #16 - January 07, 2011, 06:48 PM

    Well said.

    But you forgot to mention the other source of creepiness that made the Christian religion a giant "WTF?!"... the Book of Revelation aka the Apocalypse ^_^

    It's kinda lol-worthy.


    The Book of Revelations is the best bit of the Bible.  Its definitely written under the influence of some substance that would probly be class A in this day and age, and its very lol worthy that such a tract made it into the Bible.

    "Befriend them not, Oh murtads, and give them neither parrot nor bunny."  - happymurtad's advice on trolls.
  • Re: The New Testament
     Reply #17 - January 07, 2011, 06:53 PM

    For all the flaws of Christianity and Christians, it is good that there is a space in which people who practise Christianity can, if they want to, ignore, marginalise, criticise and refute parts of the scriptures and not take them literally. I would love it if Islam was at a similar place.

    Of course Christianity only reached this space after great struggles for secularism and against the priveliging of religion, the enlightenment, and so on.

    "we can smell traitors and country haters"


    God is Love.
    Love is Blind. Stevie Wonder is blind. Therefore, Stevie Wonder is God.

  • Re: The New Testament
     Reply #18 - January 07, 2011, 08:22 PM

    Which christian denomination does your friend belong to?

    He's Iraqi and not of Armenian descent so he's probably either Chaldean Catholic or Assyrian Eastern Orthodox most likely the latter as he originates from the North of Iraq.

    He's been coming up with all sorts of shit. One thing he said is that Greek Orthodox Christians in the Levant always sided with the Muslims during the Crusades.  wacko
  • Re: The New Testament
     Reply #19 - January 07, 2011, 08:29 PM

    He's Iraqi and not of Armenian descent so he's probably either Chaldean Catholic or Assyrian Eastern Orthodox most likely the latter as he originates from the North of Iraq.

    He's been coming up with all sorts of shit. One thing he said is that Greek Orthodox Christians in the Levant always sided with the Muslims during the Crusades.  wacko


    There were examples of local Arab Christians siding with Muslim States/Rulers against what they regarded as ignorant barbarians and foreign invaders.

    The crusaders didn't always distinguish who they plundered and put to the sword - and they had no love for Arabicised Eastern Christians.
  • Re: The New Testament
     Reply #20 - January 07, 2011, 08:42 PM

    That's what he said. But I still find it hard to believe that the Christians of Iraq and the Levant welcomed the Muslim conquests as they wanted to get rid of Persian and Byzantine rule respectively, which is what he argues.
  • Re: The New Testament
     Reply #21 - January 07, 2011, 08:48 PM

    That's what he said. But I still find it hard to believe that the Christians of Iraq and the Levant welcomed the Muslim conquests as they wanted to get rid of Persian and Byzantine rule respectively, which is what he argues.


    Welcoming the Muslim invaders is a different question - I also doubt that, since the stories come from Muslim chroniclers.

    But the history of the crusades is well documented by all sides and it is well known they sacked, pillaged and robbed their way through many Christian lands before doing the same when they got to Muslim lands.

    From the Arab Christians point of view they were only protecting their homes against invaders.

    The East was the more wealthy place then and the West were poor and backward.
  • Re: The New Testament
     Reply #22 - January 07, 2011, 09:59 PM

    One entire crusade was directed at Constantinople Cheesy.... After they plundered it they didn't even bother to go in Levant, instead they got back home...

    Just look at the sun and the moon, rotating around the earth perfectly! Out of all the never ending space in the universe, the sun and moon ended up close to earth rotating around it perfectly.!!

  • Re: The New Testament
     Reply #23 - January 08, 2011, 12:40 AM

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4eafLkpD37k
  • Re: The New Testament
     Reply #24 - January 08, 2011, 02:23 AM

    Slaves, in reverent fear of God submit yourselves to your masters, not only to those who are good and considerate, but also to those who are harsh

    and

    Slaves, obey your earthly masters with respect and fear, and with sincerity of heart, just as you would obey Christ. 6 Obey them not only to win their favor when their eye is on you, but as slaves of Christ, doing the will of God from your heart. 7 Serve wholeheartedly, as if you were serving the Lord, not people, 8 because you know that the Lord will reward each one for whatever good they do, whether they are slave or free.

    are my favourites. Yes, they caused me anguish initially, but now I just worship and cum all over the place. Yeah. Verily in hardship there is ease.

    Turn the other cheek when you're getting slapped. Yes, that's another good one.

    The language of the mob was only the language of public opinion cleansed of hypocrisy and restraint - Hannah Arendt.
  • Re: The New Testament
     Reply #25 - January 08, 2011, 02:37 AM

    http://www.bricktestament.com/epistles/index.html  Tongue
  • Re: The New Testament
     Reply #26 - January 08, 2011, 03:06 AM

    http://www.lolcatbible.com/index.php?title=Main_Page


    El bien mas preciado / es la libertad
    hay que defenderla / con fe y valor.
  • Re: The New Testament
     Reply #27 - January 08, 2011, 03:33 AM

    sw
  • Re: The New Testament
     Reply #28 - January 09, 2011, 12:25 AM

    Thanks for the links everyone  Afro
  • Re: The New Testament
     Reply #29 - January 09, 2011, 12:53 AM

    d
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