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Theme Changer

 Topic: I Want a New Way

 (Read 18815 times)
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  • Re: I Want a New Way
     Reply #120 - February 26, 2011, 03:19 PM

    No no their hearts are open our hearts are sealed by god himself but somehow we still have free will.


    Sorry, I was being ironic.

    Muslims are emotional people, so are human beings. If we don't confront Islam then who will?


    You are talking about "confronting" Islam like it is a physical person or being. You can't "confront" Islam, just like you can't fight a "war on terror". Islam is not a homogenous mass, it is a memplex designed to spread and grow through victimhood mentality.

    Quote
    Did you see that milkshake who came forward, in a room full of jihadist, and accepted evolution. But the whole room erupted because he accepted evolution.


    If you're talking abut Osama Hassan, the room was not full of jihadists, unless you interviewed them all and confirmed this?

    Quote
    Now where is the compassionate Muslims (young university educated) to step in and at least address the milkshake using facts. But they don't instead it moves into the realm of emotions and tears. This is an audience of young British men not living in the third world with no access to information. So we can't make excuses for Muslims not knowing about science. Muslim have been asleep for more than 600 years so our culture has not really moved forward in real terms.

    It's a tricky thing when dealing with Muslims because you are dealing with people who have emotional problems. One way to shock a Muslim (when something bad happens) is too ask "WHERE'S ALLAH!?"


    Shock tactics? Really? If you criticise someone like that, in my experience it is just going to create resentment and anger. By embarrassing people do you really expect them to take on board your arguments or to just retreat into their victim mentality?

    Just before I left Islam I was frequently on an Islamic forum were there were quite a few atheists. These atheists were not talking about paeophile prophets or the fact that the god doesn't exist, but were instead speaking politely, not directly criticising Islam - just asking the right questions (of course, they were conscious of being banned but that is not the point). On the other hand, you had Muslims were using the harshest language, derogatory remarks and hadith-blasting the atheists with walls of text. Which do you think had the most effect?

    Looking back this had a huge effect on me leaving Islam.

    It is a well known fact that positive language trumps criticism and is a much more likely way to convince people to your way of thinking.



  • Re: I Want a New Way
     Reply #121 - February 27, 2011, 06:43 AM

    It is not ex Muslims who will make change it must come from within. If we have not announced our apostacy then we may very well still be able to make a change from within. But if we are considered outsiders they view it as an attack and will not listen they need progressive voices from their ranks.
  • Re: I Want a New Way
     Reply #122 - February 27, 2011, 10:20 AM

    @ superomario

    Yeah i agree change as to come from within. But i will not be there to assist simple for the reason you stated we are outsiders. So to be honest i don't understand what Hassan means...reach out to muslims...when we are already betrayed them by leaving Islam.

    Through Logic, truth can be ascertained.
  • Re: I Want a New Way
     Reply #123 - February 27, 2011, 03:29 PM

    It is not ex Muslims who will make change it must come from within. If we have not announced our apostacy then we may very well still be able to make a change from within. But if we are considered outsiders they view it as an attack and will not listen they need progressive voices from their ranks.

    True,  but we apostates put pressure on them by our mere existence because they will be worried that if they don't reform then Muslims will leave Islam.  They need to know that the threat is real, and Muslims are truly leaving Islam.

    @ superomario

    Yeah i agree change as to come from within. But i will not be there to assist simple for the reason you stated we are outsiders. So to be honest i don't understand what Hassan means...reach out to muslims...when we are already betrayed them by leaving Islam.

    +1
    Another good point.

    "Many people would sooner die than think; In fact, they do so." -- Bertrand Russell

    Baloney Detection Kit
  • Re: I Want a New Way
     Reply #124 - February 27, 2011, 05:24 PM

    The problem is, even the most reasonable, reasoned, polite and rational criticisms of Islam will meet a response of offence, and upset from some (many?) Muslims.

    Ultimately the only way to ensure that no Muslim is gravely offended by the scrutiny of Islam is to never scrutinise or criticise Islam, to allow it free reign to make dawah and total truth claims, including the judgments it makes of individuals, and the efforts it makes to influence the lives of individuals and the shape of societies, and the judgments it makes of non Muslims, secular Muslims, ex Muslims etc etc.

    For example, Shahid describes how today Mohammads birthday is being celebrated in Birmingham today with mass rallies and the display of green flags everywhere. What kind of reasoned criticism of Mohammad would not offend those attending that party? Anything less than full obeisance to him is an affront to those who celebrate him like that.


    "we can smell traitors and country haters"


    God is Love.
    Love is Blind. Stevie Wonder is blind. Therefore, Stevie Wonder is God.

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