If you could kill Muhammad, would you?

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If you could kill Muhammad, would you?
Reply #60 - July 10, 2013, 04:35 PM

Quote from: Stuff on July 10, 2013, 02:04 PM
Nah. I'd rather not meddle with the past at all, since it's impossible to predict the effects it will have on the future. Just because Mo was a huge asshole does not mean the world would have been better off without him.

This is exactly what I think. The Butterfly effect and all that shizz. Perhaps Mo being murdered would've paved the way for an even more fucked up 'prophet' to emerge from Arabia (especially considering how messed up everyone was back then), the end result being the creation of an even nastier religion. Think Umar bin Khattab founding a religion for instance
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Reply #61 - July 10, 2013, 04:52 PM

^I dunno Ally, Musaylimah actually doesn't seem all that bad. He was pro-alcohol and pretty liberal about sex. He has one surah, I foget the whole thing, but it goes something like "If you like, do it standing on two legs, or if you like, down on all fours." Sounds like my kinda prophet! Not only that, but his people actually LIKED him and didn't call him insane.
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Reply #62 - July 10, 2013, 05:42 PM

^ I still think some brutal Mo-like figure would've come about eventually.
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Reply #63 - July 10, 2013, 05:44 PM

Quote from: happymurtad on July 10, 2013, 03:41 PM
I wouldn’t kill him either. I would travel back in time with all sorts of modern marvels and counter his claims of prophethood. I’d then challenge him to a battle rap session and vanquish his weak Qur’anic verses with my own wahhy.

I don't think you would win HM, firstly you would be rapping against a guy using his first language of birth, so his lyrical flow is naturally going to be better than yours. And as for bringing back 'modern marvels', what exactly did you have in mind? It is hard enough to persuade people about evolution today when you have all the fossils and can actually see it happening with bacteria in microscopes, there is no way you could persuade people of the veracity of secular science back in those times.

There were plenty of poets that did criticize Muhammad and they all came to a sticky end.
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Reply #64 - July 10, 2013, 05:49 PM

Quote from: happymurtad on July 10, 2013, 03:41 PM
I wouldn’t kill him either. I would travel back in time with all sorts of modern marvels and counter his claims of prophethood. I’d then challenge him to a battle rap session and vanquish his weak Qur’anic verses with my own wahhy.

Once I had all the followers on my side, I’d let them know that no god exists and that religion was all BS. I’d show them just how far humanity leapt once we started to embrace secular principles. Makkah would be the world’s first liberal democracy.

Considering how primitive people were at that time.

They would then start worshiping you after you left.

The statues of pagan gods would be replaced with a painting of you with the caption " The holy Prophet of Atheism"

In my opinion a life without curiosity is not a life worth living
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Reply #65 - July 10, 2013, 05:55 PM

Quote from: Al-Alethia on July 10, 2013, 04:35 PM
This is exactly what I think. The Butterfly effect and all that shizz. Perhaps Mo being murdered would've paved the way for an even more fucked up 'prophet' to emerge from Arabia (especially considering how messed up everyone was back then), the end result being the creation of an even nastier religion. Think Umar bin Khattab founding a religion for instance

Yep that is a possibility. So here's a thought:

According to historians like Tom Holland, one of the main reasons why the Arab armies were able to vanquish the Persians and the Byzantines so easily was because of the plagues like the Justinian Plague that decimated the urban populations and so ruined the economy and the size of the armies. So if you really wanted to neutralize the Islamic threat, you would go back to before the time of Muhammad and teach people how to treat and prevent plagues using modern medical practices. That way the Persians and Byzantines might be strong enough to resist or defeat the Arab armies. Of course there is no guarantee that those societies would evolve into something better than Islamic societies.

In fact some have suggested that Epidemics were one of the main causes of the spread of Christianity too, so more effective medical knowledge might have resulted in less religious societies in general back then.

But then again, there is no guarantee that you could persuade people to put faith in modern medicine. It is hard enough today to get people in poor parts of the world to trust vaccination programs or to use condoms to prevent HIV, even when it is so blatantly obvious that it is in their best interest. Just because you are armed with the truth, that doesn't necessarily make you persuasive.
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Reply #66 - July 10, 2013, 06:19 PM

Quote from: Tonyt on July 10, 2013, 05:44 PM
I don't think you would win HM, firstly you would be rapping against a guy using his first language of birth, so his lyrical flow is naturally going to be better than yours. And as for bringing back 'modern marvels', what exactly did you have in mind? It is hard enough to persuade people about evolution today when you have all the fossils and can actually see it happening with bacteria in microscopes, there is no way you could persuade people of the veracity of secular science back in those times.

There were plenty of poets that did criticize Muhammad and they all came to a sticky end.

So Tonyt is the first kafir to reject my religion...
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Reply #67 - July 10, 2013, 06:22 PM

Mate I would follow you to Medina any day. But you need to win over 7th Century Bedouins, not me.
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Reply #68 - July 10, 2013, 06:29 PM

Quote from: happymurtad on July 10, 2013, 06:19 PM
So Tonyt is the first kafir to reject my religion...

So, how will you go about decorating his room in hell?

Also, we need an Abu-Lahab style Surah.
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Reply #69 - July 10, 2013, 07:18 PM

Quote from: Toona on July 10, 2013, 06:29 PM
So, how will you go about decorating his room in hell?

Also, we need an Abu-Lahab style Surah.

that is already there toona.. here is the list of surahs/verses reveled to prophet Murtad..

Quote
Suratul-Parrot-11 verses
Suratul Donut- 8 verses
Surat An-Najm (Remix)-11 verses
Suratul Pirate- 26 verses
Suratul Jibreel-11 verses
Suratul 10 Commandments-14verses
SURAT ABRAHAM-27 verses
Surat of Sexual Desire-10 verses
Surah Tahreem, Remix--Spicy Chicken Style-13 verses
Surat al-Ahmed-18 verses
SURATUL HIGH-20verses
Surat ul-Haram-10 verses
Suratul Munafiqoon (The Hypocrites)-17verses
Surat Dawahman-27verses
Suratul Oral Sex-21verses
Surat Yeezevee-11verses
Surat Restricted Clown-Dahir -15verses
Surat Ishina--4 verses
Suratul Evolution-29verses
Surat Rave-adan-18verses

Nameless Suarh on capitalism-16verses
nameless surah-2 Jibreel says y'all are gonna like this one! dance -14 verses

see that Surat Yeezevee should be renamed as Surat AbYee Lahabzevee ., couple of nameless surahs are there which needs name and and that Surat Restricted Clown-Dahir needs new name., So name them Toona., This renaming and rephrasing we can also do that when we compile the Quran after it is fully revealed and after the death of Prophet Murtad..

And here are the surahs from other prophets., these guys are fringe prophets..

Quote
Suratul-Harley-9 verses
Surat al-Beyonce 12 verse
Suratul-Bacon-12 verses
Surat of the Chicken -22 verses
Suratul-Fish and Chips-12 verses
Surat Al-Lipgloss (Based on Al-Asr)
Surat Al-Belly Dance (Based on Al-Zalzalah)
Surah hello.jpg
Surah Al Motor
Surah Al Feels. With commentary by Sheik Diem(Surah al Fil)

So we got to compile of all of them and write tafsir to all of them .. So there is lots of lots of work to do Toona..

Hmmmmm is that Toona or Tuna?

Sandwitch from that form those Gujarati 7-11 is really good. don't know what they add in it..

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the beloved betrayed me and turned in to a Muslim
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Reply #70 - July 11, 2013, 02:56 AM

Quote from: Tonyt on July 10, 2013, 02:16 PM
What were the Arabs doing? Burying children alive?

I would not take the traditional Muslim account of the Pagan Arabs too literally. It is supposed to be a tale of good against evil. A totalitizing account designed to entertain and inspire awe in the listeners. But even by Muslim's own stories, the Pagan Arabs do not come out as much worse than the Muslims, which just goes to show how much morals can change over the centuries.

I'm not a history buff, so I don't know. I wouldn't meddle in the past anyhow. I could end up not existing in the future.

Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former.~Albert Einstein

Good people do not need laws to tell them to act responsibly, while bad people will find a way around the laws. ~Plato
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Reply #71 - July 11, 2013, 03:00 AM

Quote from: ILuvChocolate on July 11, 2013, 02:56 AM
I'm not a history buff, so I don't know. I wouldn't meddle in the past anyhow. I could end up not existing in the future.

Interesting statement ILuvChocolate...

"I will not meddle in the past, so I would not end up not existing in the future"

It is filled with chocolate. But the fact a 40 year old lady Khadija RA.. a successful business woman who could marry a 25 year old young guy "Muhammad" (PUBH) speaks volume on the status women folks in and around Mecca during the early times of Islam.

Do not let silence become your legacy.. Question everything
I renounced my faith to become a kafir,
the beloved betrayed me and turned in to a Muslim
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Reply #72 - July 11, 2013, 03:17 AM

^ Well, yeah. History is written by the winners. Who really knows what happened back then?

Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former.~Albert Einstein

Good people do not need laws to tell them to act responsibly, while bad people will find a way around the laws. ~Plato
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Reply #73 - July 11, 2013, 03:21 AM

Quote from: ILuvChocolate on July 11, 2013, 03:17 AM
^ Well, yeah. History is written by the winners. Who really knows what happened back then?

Yap you are right Chocolate,

Clearly, the winners were Prophet Muhammad and his followers. We can see lot of history in Hadith, Sunnah and even in Quran. I wonder who wrote all that stuff? Muslims or Non-Muslims?

Do not let silence become your legacy.. Question everything
I renounced my faith to become a kafir,
the beloved betrayed me and turned in to a Muslim
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Reply #74 - July 11, 2013, 08:34 AM

Quote from: mohsinali32 on April 05, 2011, 12:38 AM
Imagine you live in 7th century Arabia...
Imagine you are very religious and seek truth...
Imagine you run into a Muslim in Mecca who tells you about Islam...
Imagine you convert because you like the peaceful message...
But..

Imagine while time goes by you watch as Muhammad changes...
He starts asking super obedience and asks for his followers including you to start butchering those who do not believe him (most Arabs)
Imagine you thinking to yourself, Islam is no longer a religion but a political ideology being imposed by force...
Imagine you watch as Muhammad breaks his own rules and marries whoever he wants, asks the murder of whoever he wants... has sex with a kid, thousands are slaughtered because he said so... he begins stealing from others, kills anyone who is critical of his actions... you watch as your fellow muslims turn into fanatic murderers who fantasize over murdering those who see Muhammad for what he is, a warlord wanting to gain more power through violence...

Would you kill him to stop the madness?

So the question is not would I kill him if I could go back in time, it is would I kill him as a person who lived in that time already and was a witness to his change from peaceful to maniac?

Well others tried, and they died. I would try and most likely die too.

Depends though, if I lived in that time, would I not just be a product of my own society, think the way they do, behave the way they do? would I have the education that allows me to break from religion now? Can't guarantee I would.

For all I know, as a product of my society, I might have fallen for the bullshit or been one of the victims by fighting against it.

If the question is would I go back in time, then my answer is no. History is gone, as Al-Alethia said, there is no guarantee there wouldn't be another tyrant to replace him, no guarantee that the future I returned to would be better.

I think instead of wishing death on the past, we need to wish change upon the future that is coming, and just keep on seeking to educate the young, and spread that education across the world, since education inevitably leads to the death of primitive religions.

Inhale the good shit, exhale the bullshit.
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Reply #75 - July 12, 2013, 07:18 AM

Quote from: Tonyt on July 10, 2013, 06:22 PM
Mate I would follow you to Medina any day. But you need to win over 7th Century Bedouins, not me.

You say that as if it's difficult. Bring a laser pointer, dude. At worst you'll get them to believe that you're a real magician and not Muhammad.

Quote from: yeezevee on February 11, 2016, 02:05 PM
how fuck works without shit??

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harakaat, friend, RIP
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