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Theme Changer

 Topic: The Benefits of Superstition

 (Read 3312 times)
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  • The Benefits of Superstition
     OP - May 28, 2011, 05:22 PM

    An inconvenient truth for the atheists, agnostics, freethinkers and humanists out there: the superstitious have a performance advantage over you and they'll likely live longer too. Interesting implications and considerations for the evolutionary hypotheses of enduring superstition and the survival of religiosity and religion.

    Article reads:

    "At the Champions League final there is likely to be evidence of faith, with players making the sign of the cross and other religious gestures. But does belief really boost sporting performance, asks Matthew Syed.

    All eyes will be on Lionel Messi, the world's greatest footballer, when he walks out with Barcelona in the Champions League final. If you watch carefully, you may see him crossing himself as he strides onto the pitch.

    On the opposing side, Manchester United striker Javier Hernandez has been known to pray on the pitch.

    Messi and Hernandez are not the only footballers to reveal their beliefs during the pursuit of their sport. Real Madrid star Kaka has often talked about his faith, praying on the pitch and thanking God for his rapid recovery from a broken back.

    Other sportsmen, from Muhammad Ali to Jonathan Edwards, the triple jumper, have also spoken about the power of faith. They believe in different theologies, but all would assert they have benefited from their convictions. As Ali put it in the build-up to his clash with George Foreman in 1974: "How can I lose with Allah on my side?"

    Atheists will regard the idea that religion can make a difference to outcomes in sport as fanciful. But it is possible to put aside the issue of whether or not God exists and just examine the impact of faith on performance.

    This is what Jeong-Keun Park of Seoul University did in 2000 by studying the performances of Korean athletes. He found that prayer was not only a key factor in coping with anxiety but also in attaining peak performance.

    A quote from a participant in Park's study encapsulates the findings: "I always prepared my game with prayer. I committed all things to God, without worry. These prayers make me calmer and more secure and I forget the fear of losing. It resulted in good play."

    This echoes extraordinary research about the power of faith from the world of medicine. In the 1960s, a series of studies found that heart disease is far less common among the religious than in the general population, even after controlling for different lifestyles. Later studies extended this finding, including a paper in 1996 which found that mortality rates in secular kibbutzim are nearly twice that of their religious counterparts.

    It seemed that religious beliefs conferred real health benefits.

    How is this possible? You can look for answers in one of the most perplexing of all psychological mysteries - the placebo effect, a phenomenon that has transfixed doctors since Theodor Kocker, a Swiss surgeon, performed 1,600 operations without anaesthesia in Berne in the 1890s.

    Kocker's patients were told that anaesthesia had been administered and were able to endure surgery without even clenching their teeth, despite the fact that they had nothing beyond saltwater running through their veins.

    In recent years, the placebo effect has been found to extend way beyond pain relief. It can cure ulcers, combat nausea and much else besides. It can also boost concentration, so long as the pill is dispensed in the right colour. Pink placebos, it turns out, have better concentration-boosting qualities than blue ones.

    All of which hints at how the placebo effect works. Its power has nothing to do with the pharmacology of the drug (which is, by definition, non-existent); rather, its effect derives from the power of belief in the drug.

    But this belief is not created out of nowhere, it is manufactured within a context. Anything that imbues the treatment with greater authenticity will strengthen belief. Colour, for example, is strongly connected in certain cultures with certain types of effect: red is buzzy, white is soothing. Drug companies play on these meanings. Stimulant medication tends to come in red or orange, antidepressants in white, and so on.

    The placebo effect provides one possible explanation as to why those with religious beliefs have better health outcomes. Instead of a belief in the efficacy of sugar pills, patients have a belief in the healing power of God. And it is not just Christians who have better outcomes, but also those who hold different beliefs, such as Muslims. It would seem that it is not the content, but the strength of belief that matters.

    As Anne Harrington, Professor of Medical History at Harvard University, puts it: "There is an innate capacity for our bodies to bring into being, to the best of their ability, the optimistic scenarios in which we fervently believe".

    The results from the study of South Korean athletes have been replicated again and again, and across religious boundaries. The belief that a higher power is guiding one's performance seems to boost performance and remove doubt, something which can help sports people just as much as it helps patients.

    Even away from faith, there are examples where belief can appear to change outcomes in sport. England midfielder Paul Ince used to leave it until the last moment to put his shirt on. Goalkeeper Mark Schwarzer has worn the same shin pads since he was 16. Nani, the Manchester United winger, plays with his socks the wrong way round.

    Of course, these superstitions have little relevance to performance - unless you really believe they do. As Edwards, who lost his faith after retirement, put it: "Any belief can have powerful effects, so long as it is held with sufficient conviction".

    All of which suggests that religious conviction really can boost performance, but only if you truly believe."

    Source: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-13575702
  • Re: The Benefits of Superstition
     Reply #1 - May 28, 2011, 05:32 PM

    Quote
    "Any belief can have powerful effects, so long as it is held with sufficient conviction"


    That's the most important bit to me. It's not so much about religion, but how much you have 'faith' in something - whether it's god or your own abilities or the capabilities of the doctors to treat you etc.
    The power of placebo is amazing.... it's awesome and scary how easily the mind can be manipulated so that people can withstand terrible pain and disease, and sometimes it actually reverses the effects of illness.

  • Re: The Benefits of Superstition
     Reply #2 - May 28, 2011, 05:43 PM

    That's the most important bit to me. It's not so much about religion, but how much you have 'faith' in something - whether it's god or your own abilities or the capabilities of the doctors to treat you etc.

    Totally agree. The problem though is that the ability to hold such unwavering faith seems dependent on the individual and the subject of the faith. The irreligious, I would imagine, are less capable of having such utter conviction without doubt. Sceptics tend not to be devout, the pious do. And in the subject of the conviction, I should think, again without evidence, that ultimate confidence in god is easier to achieve than in our own abilities. This may not be helped by the social conditioning we receive in our formative years: utter confidence in oneself is undesirable arrogance, but the same belief in god is virtuous and to be aspired to.

    And yes, the placebo effect is fascinating. I've been thinking recently about how to ethically incorporate placebo therapy into prescribing health care models. Thus far I've not come up with much that doesn't have unpleasant and/or immoral consequences.
  • Re: The Benefits of Superstition
     Reply #3 - May 28, 2011, 06:03 PM

    Yes it's probably quite true that the less skeptical you are, the more likely you are to cling to certain hopes and ideas. Since atheists and other non-religious people tend to think things through a bit more logically, it can be hard to hold on to a certain opinion, especially if the odds are against you.

    Like anything in life, there are always pros and cons.

    But I think a lot of ex-religious people have gone through a lot of hardship and pain and depression on their spiritual journey, and yet as we see on this forum and many other places, they have not given up or given in. Their families and friends might have been nasty to them but they still manage to find solace and happiness and peace. And they did all of this without having a god on their side. Now that's worth a standing ovation!

  • Re: The Benefits of Superstition
     Reply #4 - May 28, 2011, 06:18 PM

    But I think a lot of ex-religious people have gone through a lot of hardship and pain and depression on their spiritual journey, and yet as we see on this forum and many other places, they have not given up or given in. Their families and friends might have been nasty to them but they still manage to find solace and happiness and peace. And they did all of this without having a god on their side. Now that's worth a standing ovation!

    I stood up and clapped but the other person in the room looked scared. I second your sentiment; standing up for oneself without the false comfort of having an invisible all powerful creator on your side is to be applauded. Self congratulatory circle jerks all round Smiley.

    Your comments led me to the idea that maybe one can have faith in the processes of sceptical enquiry and the relentless search for truth. Maybe we can have faith in truth itself. I like this idea, I think. Tell me more!
  • Re: The Benefits of Superstition
     Reply #5 - May 28, 2011, 06:43 PM

    Tell me more!



    Umm... that was the sum of my intellectual outburst Grin

  • Re: The Benefits of Superstition
     Reply #6 - May 28, 2011, 06:56 PM

    Umm... that was the sum of my intellectual outburst Grin

    Nonsense. I have faith in you Wink
  • Re: The Benefits of Superstition
     Reply #7 - May 28, 2011, 07:01 PM

    Nonsense. I have faith in you Wink


    hahaha touché!

    *puts on philosophical hat*

    What is truth though? Wink

  • Re: The Benefits of Superstition
     Reply #8 - May 28, 2011, 07:06 PM


    In recent years, the placebo effect has been found to extend way beyond pain relief. It can cure ulcers, combat nausea and much else besides. It can also boost concentration, so long as the pill is dispensed in the right colour. Pink placebos, it turns out, have better concentration-boosting qualities than blue ones.



    I knew there was some truth to the matrix.  It's the blue ones that set you free.   Tongue

    I think having faith can be beneficial.  Two of the calmest happiest people I know are believers, one is a muslim and one is a pagan, but both seem to radiate a sense of self peace and happiness I have never seen in anyone else.

    I love being around them even if I don't believe, simply because of this 'thing' they radiate with.

    I just wish I could believe in something again, I don't believe in anything.

    Inhale the good shit, exhale the bullshit.
  • Re: The Benefits of Superstition
     Reply #9 - May 28, 2011, 07:26 PM

    What is truth though? Wink

    It is precisely this tendency to ask pertinent probing questions, which cast doubt on all that is 'known', that puts the likes of you at a disadvantage in the context of the article. That is, of course, not to say that there are not many advantages to being a freethinker, a doubter by nature, a habitual sceptic...but clearly the possession of such a personality type has its perils too.

    I just wish I could believe in something again, I don't believe in anything.

    Berbs I don't know your story so I can't offer too much here, other than to say that being awake is quite an experience isn't it! Believe that we're incredibly lucky to exist, to be able to reflect on this improbability and to be able to share the experience with others who cohabit our reality.
  • Re: The Benefits of Superstition
     Reply #10 - May 28, 2011, 08:11 PM

    It is precisely this tendency to ask pertinent probing questions, which cast doubt on all that is 'known', that puts the likes of you at a disadvantage in the context of the article. That is, of course, not to say that there are not many advantages to being a freethinker, a doubter by nature, a habitual sceptic...but clearly the possession of such a personality type has its perils too.


    Of course it does, but I wouldn't want it any other way  Smiley

  • Re: The Benefits of Superstition
     Reply #11 - May 28, 2011, 09:47 PM

    Mate, we ironically evolved to utilize faith as a human specie.

    The Evolutionary Advantages of Faith
    http://www.bbc.co.uk/h2g2/approved_entry/A934283

    Also check out sections of
    The Biological Basis of Belief
    Why do we have Beliefs?
    Why are Beliefs held so Dearly?
    The Stages of Belief

    Anyway, even if you aren't religious, I certainly do believe in the power of believing in yourself, that you're more capable than what you think you are capable of, and when you have this much faith in yourself to excel, you might just surprise yourself when magic happens! Smiley

    PS: And you know what else, a Christian friend from Cyprus motivated me (and others) to believe in ourselves. An atheist can't (usually) do that! Tongue And this is a serious point in a way - for all the reality atheism brings, I feel it takes away the spiritual essence that the advantages of faith can bring. Though I'm not saying a religion is required, an inspirational transformational leader is usually good enough. E.g. "I know what you can do. Go out there and do your magic. You're the best!".  Grin

  • Re: The Benefits of Superstition
     Reply #12 - May 29, 2011, 10:42 AM

    An inconvenient truth for the atheists, agnostics, freethinkers and humanists out there: the superstitious have a performance advantage over you and they'll likely live longer too.

    An insight into why this isn't true:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G31GuUOegek

    Too fucking busy, and vice versa.
  • Re: The Benefits of Superstition
     Reply #13 - May 29, 2011, 11:14 AM

    Nice video...I'll be more alert to that little trick in future! However, I don't think it applies to this piece. The research referred to an article in the American Journal of Public Health entitled "Does religious observance promote health? Mortality in secular vs. religious kibbutzim in Israel" by Blondheim et al.  I've copied the article abstract below. I don't think the longevity gambit, as presented in the video, is relevant to this research, as mean life expectancy at birth is not used for comparison. I would accept, however, that this is a relatively small sample size in only one country. I recall similar studies that gathered data from the US populace, but I don't have the time right now to look them up. It is an interesting topic so I'll add it to my to do list!

    OBJECTIVES. This study assessed the association of Jewish religious observance with mortality by comparing religious and secular kibbutzim. These collectives are highly similar in social structure and economic function and are cohesive and supportive communities. METHODS. In a 16-year (1970 through 1985) historical prospective study of mortality in 11 religious and 11 matched secular kibbutzim in Israel, 268 deaths occurred among 3900 men and women 35 years of age and older during 41347 person-years of observation. RESULTS. Mortality was considerably higher in secular kibbutzim. Cox proportional hazards analysis was used to adjust for age and the matched design; rate ratios were 1.67 (95% confidence interval [CI]=1.17, 2.39) for men, 2.67 (95% CI=1.55, 4.60) for women, and 1.93 (95% CI=1.44, 2.59) overall. Kaplan-Meier survival analysis of birth cohorts confirmed the association. The lower mortality in religious kibbutzim was consistent for all major causes of death. CONCLUSIONS. Belonging to a religious collective was associated with a strong protective effect not attributable to confounding by sociodemographic factors. Elucidation of mechanisms mediating this effect may provide etiologic insights and leads for intervention.
  • Re: The Benefits of Superstition
     Reply #14 - May 29, 2011, 11:31 AM

    Mate, we ironically evolved to utilize faith as a human specie.

    The Evolutionary Advantages of Faith
    http://www.bbc.co.uk/h2g2/approved_entry/A934283

    Thanks HO! I'll read this too, at some point!!
  • Re: The Benefits of Superstition
     Reply #15 - May 29, 2011, 12:01 PM

    Nice video...I'll be more alert to that little trick in future! However, I don't think it applies to this piece. The research referred to an article in the American Journal of Public Health entitled "Does religious observance promote health? Mortality in secular vs. religious kibbutzim in Israel" by Blondheim et al.  I've copied the article abstract below. I don't think the longevity gambit, as presented in the video, is relevant to this research, as mean life expectancy at birth is not used for comparison. I would accept, however, that this is a relatively small sample size in only one country. I recall similar studies that gathered data from the US populace, but I don't have the time right now to look them up. It is an interesting topic so I'll add it to my to do list!

    It might prove that a person of faith can expect to live longer and perform better in Israel. We might say that’s trivially obvious anyway. But a fairer and broader study on mortality and faith would have to account for the relatively longer life expectancies in countries that are predominantly atheist and secular. That’s an inconvenient truth for the faithful, not the faithless.

    Too fucking busy, and vice versa.
  • Re: The Benefits of Superstition
     Reply #16 - May 29, 2011, 12:15 PM

    And this is a serious point in a way - for all the reality atheism brings, I feel it takes away the spiritual essence that the advantages of faith can bring.

    Atheism tells you nothing about a person's spiritual path. Atheist simply means non-theist. There are uncountable varieties of non-theistic spirituality.

    Too fucking busy, and vice versa.
  • Re: The Benefits of Superstition
     Reply #17 - May 29, 2011, 12:15 PM

    An inconvenient truth for the atheists, agnostics, freethinkers and humanists out there: the superstitious have a performance advantage over you and they'll likely live longer too.

    Tell that to Tay–Sachs sufferers.
  • Re: The Benefits of Superstition
     Reply #18 - May 29, 2011, 12:55 PM

    It might prove that a person of faith can expect to live longer and perform better in Israel. We might say that’s trivially obvious anyway.

    That article says nothing about performance, only mortality, in Israel. Why is this trivially obvious?

    That’s an inconvenient truth for the faithful, not the faithless.

    Or perhaps there are inconvenient truths for both!

    Tell that to Tay–Sachs sufferers.

    Yes, I wouldn't doubt that the specifics of religion cause numerous disadvantages. The article does not touch on this, and that is a valid criticism, but it does seem that for some religious folk their belief contributes positively to their health.
  • Re: The Benefits of Superstition
     Reply #19 - May 29, 2011, 02:01 PM

    That article says nothing about performance, only mortality, in Israel. Why is this trivially obvious?

    So, back to my main point then: A fairer and broader study on mortality and faith would have to account for the relatively longer life expectancies in countries that are predominantly atheist and secular. That’s an inconvenient truth for the faithful, not the faithless.

    Or perhaps there are inconvenient truths for both!

    Well, you tell me. I’m not feeling very inconvenienced yet.

    Too fucking busy, and vice versa.
  • Re: The Benefits of Superstition
     Reply #20 - May 29, 2011, 03:08 PM

    So, back to my main point then: A fairer and broader study on mortality and faith would have to account for the relatively longer life expectancies in countries that are predominantly atheist and secular. That’s an inconvenient truth for the faithful, not the faithless.
    Well, you tell me. I’m not feeling very inconvenienced yet.

    I'm not sure you've answered the question of why the conclusions of the study in Israel are trivially obvious. Your main point doesn't address that, does it? However, maybe the answer to the question wouldn't contribute to this particular discussion, so best leave it alone here me thinks.

    Whilst I am glad you're not personally inconvenienced I hope you realised that I was speaking figuratively. I consider secular societies to convey many advantages to their citizens. Similarly I would consider being an atheist and, more generally, a sceptical thinker, to have its advantages too. However, as the original post demonstrates, there appears also to be utility in having faith. How the advantages of one mindset over the other play out is something else; my initial comment, that the religious live longer, was intended to be somewhat tongue in cheek. My apologies that this was not made clear. So any other thoughts most sincerely welcome but there'll be no need for a descent into stubborn polemic. Smiley
  • Re: The Benefits of Superstition
     Reply #21 - May 29, 2011, 03:25 PM

    Apology accepted.

    Too fucking busy, and vice versa.
  • Re: The Benefits of Superstition
     Reply #22 - May 29, 2011, 06:47 PM

    Yes it's probably quite true that the less skeptical you are, the more likely you are to cling to certain hopes and ideas. Since atheists and other non-religious people tend to think things through a bit more logically, it can be hard to hold on to a certain opinion, especially if the odds are against you.

    Like anything in life, there are always pros and cons.

    But I think a lot of ex-religious people have gone through a lot of hardship and pain and depression on their spiritual journey, and yet as we see on this forum and many other places, they have not given up or given in. Their families and friends might have been nasty to them but they still manage to find solace and happiness and peace. And they did all of this without having a god on their side. Now that's worth a standing ovation!

    +1

    "I'm standing here like an asshole holding my Charles Dickens"

    "No theory,No ready made system,no book that has ever been written to save the world. i cleave to no system.."-Bakunin
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