Hi from strangestdude

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- strangestdude
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Hi from strangestdude
OP - June 20, 2011, 08:25 AM

Hi guys,

I hope everyone is well.

I used to be a muslim up until, well I said it out loud yesterday for the first time. But I pretty much have wanted to renounce Islam for a while, fear of a lack of emotional support (which admittedly Islam gave me) is what stopped me from officially becoming an apostate - although many muslims would consider me to be one a long time ago due to me disagreeing with them.

I converted six year ago and have a muslim wife (no kids) but I've been seriously doubting and not practicing Islam for over a year. I couldn't reconcile the beautiful contemplative practices, and moving rituals found in Sufism (which converted me to the religion), with the brutality that I saw in the actions of Muhammad, and the early Sahaba. Especially the topics of Aisha, slavery, having sex with slaves, and the torture and murder of people who verbally insulted Muhammad.

For years I rationalized them, but after I witnessed (and in all honestly had my heart broken) by the group-think and tribalism that is rife in the muslim community, I separated myself from the muslim community. I stopped going to the mosque and mixing with muslims, and had the 'mental space' to contemplate the religion, but also other perspectives on the universe.

I began to look into other theories on the universe, human nature, religion, etc and I began to remember how honest and great it felt to say to myself 'I don't know' instead of being filled with anxiety because I was 'doubting Allah!'.

Recently I have been seriously working on my self esteem issues and finally had the courage to begin looking at online ex-muslim stories. I gained courage and the recognition of shared experiences from them and so decided to make a youtube channel, to get things off my chest and let others know they aren't alone...

youtube.com/strangestdude

Anyway guys, thanks for sharing your perspective of things for people like myself to read and gain strength from.

An alternative to religion;

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i2nfXfTg92E

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dWNW-NXEudk
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Re: Hi from strangestdude
Reply #1 - June 20, 2011, 08:37 AM

Welcome to the forum strangestdude. I just subscribed to your Youtube channel and look forward watching/listening to them.
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Re: Hi from strangestdude
Reply #2 - June 20, 2011, 08:37 AM

Welcome onboard dude.

"What you do speaks so loud that I cannot hear what you say."
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Re: Hi from strangestdude
Reply #3 - June 20, 2011, 09:12 AM

Thanks for subscription and welcome guys.

Quote from: Lara91 on June 20, 2011, 08:44 AM
Welcome strangedude are you strange?

Yeah I'm a pretty strange dude, I'm into Graham Hancock type stuff, and I believe that a global economic collapse began in 2008... to most people I'm weird

An alternative to religion;

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i2nfXfTg92E

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dWNW-NXEudk
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Re: Hi from strangestdude
Reply #4 - June 20, 2011, 09:38 AM

Hi mate, welcome.

Fascinating journey you've been on; thanks for sharing. Have you any plans in sharing news of your apostasy with your wife and with any remaining muslim friends you have?

And when you say you believe an economic meltdown has started, are you inferring that this downturn may never end? As far as my quick google search shows, the tiger economies actually managed to keep world economic growth positive throughout the recent turmoil (apart from in 2010, when there was a minor contraction), so maybe things are not as doomed as you may imagine?

Hi
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Re: Hi from strangestdude
Reply #5 - June 20, 2011, 09:59 AM

Welcome Strangestdude.

Where on the globe do you reside? If you don't mind telling us how are things with your wife? Is she a devout muslim? Does she know about your apostasy? What do think your future holds for you in your marriage?

Really hope you enjoy your time here, we can be a bit nosy so I apologise if I'm getting too personal, you're not obliged to answer of course.
- Hallakuf
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Re: Hi from strangestdude
Reply #6 - June 20, 2011, 10:08 AM

Welcome Strangestdude! Let's start with the Interesting to think that to many Muslims you are not an apostate, because you never were a real Muslim (Sufis are not generally regarded as Muslims). Anyway, enjoy your stay here

Religion is organized superstition
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Re: Hi from strangestdude
Reply #7 - June 20, 2011, 10:13 AM

Welcome, strangestdude.

"I know where I'm going and I know the truth, and I don't have to be what you want me to be. I'm free to be what I want."
Muhammad Ali
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Re: Hi from strangestdude
Reply #8 - June 20, 2011, 11:32 AM

welcome to the cemb, buddy
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Re: Hi from strangestdude
Reply #9 - June 20, 2011, 07:24 PM

Welcome. Checking out your YT right now.

Rather be forgotten than remembered for giving in.
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Re: Hi from strangestdude
Reply #10 - June 20, 2011, 07:39 PM

Hiya!
Welcome to the forum.
Enjoy ur stay.
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Re: Hi from strangestdude
Reply #11 - June 20, 2011, 07:49 PM

Welcome to the forum, dude.

"Many people would sooner die than think; In fact, they do so." -- Bertrand Russell

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Re: Hi from strangestdude
Reply #12 - June 20, 2011, 09:56 PM

Quote from: strangestdude on June 20, 2011, 08:25 AM
Hi guys,

I hope everyone is well.

I used to be a muslim up until, well I said it out loud yesterday for the first time. But I pretty much have wanted to renounce Islam for a while, fear of a lack of emotional support (which admittedly Islam gave me) is what stopped me from officially becoming an apostate - although many muslims would consider me to be one a long time ago due to me disagreeing with them.

I converted six year ago and have a muslim wife (no kids) but I've been seriously doubting and not practicing Islam for over a year. I couldn't reconcile the beautiful contemplative practices, and moving rituals found in Sufism (which converted me to the religion), with the brutality that I saw in the actions of Muhammad, and the early Sahaba. Especially the topics of Aisha, slavery, having sex with slaves, and the torture and murder of people who verbally insulted Muhammad.

For years I rationalized them, but after I witnessed (and in all honestly had my heart broken) by the group-think and tribalism that is rife in the muslim community, I separated myself from the muslim community. I stopped going to the mosque and mixing with muslims, and had the 'mental space' to contemplate the religion, but also other perspectives on the universe.

I began to look into other theories on the universe, human nature, religion, etc and I began to remember how honest and great it felt to say to myself 'I don't know' instead of being filled with anxiety because I was 'doubting Allah!'.

Recently I have been seriously working on my self esteem issues and finally had the courage to begin looking at online ex-muslim stories. I gained courage and the recognition of shared experiences from them and so decided to make a youtube channel, to get things off my chest and let others know they aren't alone...

youtube.com/strangestdude

Anyway guys, thanks for sharing your perspective of things for people like myself to read and gain strength from.

Hi strangedude. I ran into your youtube videos a day ago independent of the forum and found your introduction here Normally I don't listen to a "confessional" youtube video style but I enjoyed your stream of consciousness. Stay around and have fun

So once again I'm left with the classic Irish man's dilemma, do I eat the potato or do I let it ferment so I can drink it later?
My political philosophy below
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bwGat4i8pJI&feature=g-vrec
Just kidding, here are some true heros
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dBTgvK6LQqA
- strangestdude
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Re: Hi from strangestdude
Reply #13 - June 20, 2011, 11:53 PM

Thanks for the welcomes everyone.

Quote from: musivore on June 20, 2011, 09:38 AM
Hi mate, welcome.

Fascinating journey you've been on; thanks for sharing. Have you any plans in sharing news of your apostasy with your wife and with any remaining muslim friends you have?

And when you say you believe an economic meltdown has started, are you inferring that this downturn may never end? As far as my quick google search shows, the tiger economies actually managed to keep world economic growth positive throughout the recent turmoil (apart from in 2010, when there was a minor contraction), so maybe things are not as doomed as you may imagine?

My wife knows and still want to be with me, she isn't practising but wears a head scarf. Her family are a bit crazy so when we tell them there probably will be fireworks.

If you're a laymen check this out...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q5dDQQ76zTc

Did I remember right that you are studying economics? If so this dude will break it down (professor of economics Steve Keen, who is on record predicting the global meltdown of 2008)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E0YC2PLnWRA

An alternative to religion;

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i2nfXfTg92E

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dWNW-NXEudk
- Jinn and Tonic
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Re: Hi from strangestdude
Reply #14 - June 21, 2011, 12:00 AM

welcome strangedude! Nice there are more ex converts finally
coming to the rational realization of it all. Find yourself a comfy
couch, and kick back with us for a while

When one door of happiness closes, another opens; but often we look so long at the closed door that we do not see the one which has been opened for us.
Helen Keller
- strangestdude
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Re: Hi from strangestdude
Reply #15 - June 21, 2011, 12:14 AM

Quote from: Zaiba on June 20, 2011, 09:59 AM
Welcome Strangestdude.

Where on the globe do you reside? If you don't mind telling us how are things with your wife? Is she a devout muslim? Does she know about your apostasy? What do think your future holds for you in your marriage?

Really hope you enjoy your time here, we can be a bit nosy so I apologise if I'm getting too personal, you're not obliged to answer of course.

Thanks for the welcome. I'm in the UK.

She knows and still wants to be with me, but I know her family will flip. Not sure what the future holds for us though in all honesty, we live in the heart of the local muslim community, they could make her life very difficult for being married to a Kafir.

Nosy.

Quote from: Hallakuf on June 20, 2011, 10:08 AM
Welcome Strangestdude! Let's start with the   Interesting to think that to many Muslims you are not an apostate, because you never were a real Muslim (Sufis are not generally regarded as Muslims). Anyway, enjoy your stay here  

Thanks.

That's one of the reasons why I left, the petty squabbles between the sects (BIDA! SHIRK!). I remember having a heated argument with my father in law where he almost threatened me with violence because I wanted to celebrate Muhammad's birthday.

Quote from: Lara91 on June 20, 2011, 01:50 PM
actually that sounds interesting not strange at all, if thats what people consider strange im more than just strange

Glad to see you appreciate that kind thing.

Quote from: deusvult on June 20, 2011, 09:56 PM
Hi strangedude. I ran into your youtube videos a day ago independent of the forum and found your introduction here Normally I don't listen to a "confessional" youtube video style but I enjoyed your stream of consciousness. Stay around and have fun

Thanks for your appreciation of my vids.

An alternative to religion;

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i2nfXfTg92E

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dWNW-NXEudk
- Jinn and Tonic
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Re: Hi from strangestdude
Reply #16 - June 21, 2011, 02:34 AM

Ive been listening to your vids and I experienced the same things
re: racism, especially in my masjid. Im a white american, woman.
They were so rude and cold towards me! They also were very
suspicious of me, which really pissed me off.

When one door of happiness closes, another opens; but often we look so long at the closed door that we do not see the one which has been opened for us.
Helen Keller
- musivore
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Re: Hi from strangestdude
Reply #17 - June 22, 2011, 02:45 PM

Quote from: strangestdude on June 20, 2011, 11:53 PM
Thanks for the welcomes everyone.

My wife knows and still want to be with me, she isn't practising but wears a head scarf. Her family are a bit crazy so when we tell them there probably will be fireworks.

If you're a laymen check this out...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q5dDQQ76zTc

Did I remember right that you are studying economics? If so this dude will break it down (professor of economics Steve Keen, who is on record predicting the global meltdown of 2008)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E0YC2PLnWRA

Just seen this mate.

Is it not an option to not tell her family and just to keep it to yourselves? The same goes for the local muslim community that you live within?

Thanks for the links, I’ll watch them later when I get home. I did study economics, before moving on to computing. I’ve forgotten much of what I learnt. But I have a feeling I will find these clips very interesting.

Hi
- strangestdude
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Re: Hi from strangestdude
Reply #18 - June 22, 2011, 05:19 PM

Quote from: Jinn and Tonic on June 21, 2011, 02:34 AM
Ive been listening to your vids and I experienced the same things
re: racism, especially in my masjid. Im a white american, woman.
They were so rude and cold towards me! They also were very
suspicious of me, which really pissed me off.

Sorry to hear about your experience. What was it like in the women's part of the masjid?

What was the sect and predominant ethnicity in your community? They must of thought you were black ops .

Quote from: musivore on June 22, 2011, 02:45 PM

Is it not an option to not tell her family and just to keep it to yourselves? The same goes for the local muslim community that you live within?

I personally don't want to pretend I'm a muslim. Thank God I'm not a born muslim, I understand why those guys sometimes keep their apostasy under wraps. We are going to tell them soon.

Let me know your thoughts.

An alternative to religion;

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i2nfXfTg92E

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dWNW-NXEudk
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Re: Hi from strangestdude
Reply #19 - June 22, 2011, 08:50 PM

You seem mature enough and intelligent enough to know what the right thing is to do for you. And it sounds like you are prepared to face the storm that will come from her family, and to a lesser degree, from the local community. I have a feeling that you personally will weather these storms okay. But how will your wife cope, I wonder? Is she prepared (and this is the worst case scenario), to be ostracised from both her family and from the community she belongs to? I also can’t help but worry that what is to come could possibly put a fair bit of strain on your marriage also?

When you mention local community, does that mean you are only going to tell the close Muslim friends that you can trust somewhat? Is it not an option to just become quietly non-practising? That way, you won’t have to pretend about anything, or lie about anything?

Your situation reminds me a lot of Azuremist’s circumstances. She also joined our forum recently. You should check her intro out?

Btw, I watched the second link you provided. No, you are not a weirdo: that makes a lot of sense. However, the less pessimistic approach from other schools can also make some sense though, when presented convincingly enough. But I will read up more on this now that you have sparked my interest, and may come back to you one day to exchange opinions?

Hi
- strangestdude
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Re: Hi from strangestdude
Reply #20 - June 23, 2011, 10:59 AM

Thanks for sharing your thoughts, and thanks for the compliments... but the key word is seem .

I personally don't want to be identified as a muslim, and I've discussed this with my wife and she wants to stand by me.

We've also discussed the problems that she may encounter from her family and the community, and she has still said she wants to stand by me. However (of course) saying that before the emotional weight bears down, and maintaining that desire during are 2 different things. I'll do my best to accept whatever the outcome is.

Another tough thing is I personally don't want to be responsible for a major breakdown in relations with her family (getting emotional thinking about it)... maybe I'll have to make a tough decision in the future. She doesn't feel close to her parents anyway, but these things change and this may make relations far far more difficult to repair.

But staying with me is what she wants right now, but she is 21 (I'm 26, married 3 years. She was 18 when we met before anyone asks) and I have a feeling she will regret it later on.

Sure we can discuss it, but I am a laymen. My research on economics is self educated, and comes from dudes like Jim Rogers, Peter Schiff, Michael Ruppert, Steve Keen and Paul Gringon (money as debt producer) - they are all on public record predicting the meltdown of '08.

An alternative to religion;

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i2nfXfTg92E

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dWNW-NXEudk
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Re: Hi from strangestdude
Reply #21 - June 23, 2011, 11:01 AM

Here's a funny video musivore. BTW he never got an apology from any of them...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2I0QN-FYkpw

An alternative to religion;

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i2nfXfTg92E

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dWNW-NXEudk
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Re: Hi from strangestdude
Reply #22 - June 23, 2011, 11:21 AM

welcome, tell us where you are from and how you found this place

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- musivore
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Re: Hi from strangestdude
Reply #23 - June 24, 2011, 11:14 AM

Just seen you logged on strangeguy.

Best of luck mate. Keep us informed. If you hit rocky shores, come and see if members on here can help you (I did the same when I ran into problems with my wife. The advice, sympathy and solidarity that I got from people on here helped me no end).

I'll check out that video when I get home...

Hi
- Jinn and Tonic
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Re: Hi from strangestdude
Reply #24 - June 24, 2011, 03:20 PM

Quote from: strangestdude on June 22, 2011, 05:19 PM
Sorry to hear about your experience. What was it like in the women's part of the masjid?

What was the sect and predominant ethnicity in your community? They must of thought you were black ops .

I was sunni. And the majority of the masjid was bengali. But there were others, moroccan,
african, jordanian, egyptian, as well. Only one other white american in there, a white dude
married a muslimah. But it was frowned upon for us to have convos. No Imam, just dudes
getting up every week for jummah. It was very cold and hostile in the back :( I tried so
hard to press thru the bs. Im no spring chicken lol (im 51 now), and my intent was purely
spiritual in my quest. I stopped going there, but continued my studies from home, online
with my dawagandists, and prayed five times a day. I couldnt fast for ramadan (awwww!)
because of the meds Im taking required me to eat , or so I told them LOL.

When one door of happiness closes, another opens; but often we look so long at the closed door that we do not see the one which has been opened for us.
Helen Keller
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Re: Hi from strangestdude
Reply #25 - June 24, 2011, 04:39 PM

Quote from: IsLame on June 23, 2011, 11:21 AM
welcome, tell us where you are from and how you found this place

I'm from the UK, and I google ex muslims, I was prompted to join by a youtuber called primordalatom.

Quote from: musivore on June 24, 2011, 11:14 AM
Best of luck mate. Keep us informed. If you hit rocky shores, come and see if members on here can help you (I did the same when I ran into problems with my wife. The advice, sympathy and solidarity that I got from people on here helped me no end).

I'll check out that video when I get home...

Thanks for the support dude, I'll keep you guys updated.

An alternative to religion;

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i2nfXfTg92E

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dWNW-NXEudk
- strangestdude
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Re: Hi from strangestdude
Reply #26 - June 24, 2011, 05:22 PM

Quote from: Jinn and Tonic on June 24, 2011, 03:20 PM
I was sunni. And the majority of the masjid was bengali. But there were others, moroccan,
african, jordanian, egyptian, as well. Only one other white american in there, a white dude
married a muslimah. But it was frowned upon for us to have convos. No Imam, just dudes
getting up every week for jummah. It was very cold and hostile in the back :( I tried so
hard to press thru the bs. Im no spring chicken lol (im 51 now), and my intent was purely
spiritual in my quest. I stopped going there, but continued my studies from home, online
with my dawagandists, and prayed five times a day. I couldnt fast for ramadan (awwww!)
because of the meds Im taking required me to eat , or so I told them LOL.

Thanks for sharing your experience. I don't consider 50 old personally, I've seen people in their 60's who are in significantly better shape than myself, and many people I know in their 20's.

Are you pursing a spiritual path or practices now?

The group think, and tribalism are so incredibly entrenched in muslim communities IMO, that I went into denial as a coping mechanism. I kept discovering community schism due to differing opinion, nationality and race, I simply couldn't believe it.

An alternative to religion;

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i2nfXfTg92E

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dWNW-NXEudk
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Re: Hi from strangestdude
Reply #27 - June 25, 2011, 04:11 PM

welcome strangestdude and thanks for sharing! Me too, I entered islam from sufism, step by step I turned more and more orthodox and found out that I have mistaken islam for something it IS NOT! It is very good to hear that your wife will stay with you in spite of your doubts! This is the way a real marriage should be!
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Re: Hi from strangestdude
Reply #28 - June 26, 2011, 10:32 PM

Quote from: petals on June 25, 2011, 04:11 PM
welcome strangestdude and thanks for sharing! Me too, I entered islam from sufism, step by step I turned more and more orthodox and found out that I have mistaken islam for something it IS NOT! It is very good to hear that your wife will stay with you in spite of your doubts! This is the way a real marriage should be!

Yeah that mirrors my experience! Did you follow a Tariqat?

From what you've written it sounds like exactly what happened to me. I was practiced Sufism but I wanted to mix and adhere to the more orthodox aspects of Islam - to be safe. But eventually I had to face up to the disrespect of human dignity, lack of compassion, and brutality I found in the Quran, and Hadith. In all honestly whenever I read the Quran I found it frankly uninspiring and harsh in tone, I only liked it when it was accompanied by a Sufi based Tafsir.

IMO sufi orders tend to be benign personality cults. I remember hearing many things that the majority of muslims would vehemently disagree with, but were lapped up by followers.

An alternative to religion;

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i2nfXfTg92E

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dWNW-NXEudk
- strangestdude
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Re: Hi from strangestdude
Reply #29 - June 26, 2011, 10:40 PM

Update

Hey guys we told her parents.

The mum seems cool with me. Her dad hasn't spoken to her in days, and expressed shock at hearing that I've apostated. We think he will come round, but it may take a while.

I found out that my next door neighbour who was a born muslim form Iran also apostated for similar reasons to me. He is also married to a muslim woman. He hid his apostasy from me, lol.

An alternative to religion;

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i2nfXfTg92E

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dWNW-NXEudk
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