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Theme Changer

 Poll

  • Question: Death Penalty
  • In support of it - 4 (8.7%)
  • Against it - 33 (71.7%)
  • Undecided - 9 (19.6%)
  • Total Voters: 46

 Topic: Death Penalty

 (Read 13141 times)
  • 12 3 ... 5 Next page « Previous thread | Next thread »
  • Death Penalty
     OP - September 23, 2011, 03:17 PM
    I would like to know your reasons.
    "I'm standing here like an asshole holding my Charles Dickens"

    "No theory,No ready made system,no book that has ever been written to save the world. i cleave to no system.."-Bakunin
  • Re: Death Penalty
     Reply #1 - September 23, 2011, 03:23 PM
    You should've added "Undecided" or "I don't know".
    قل للمليحة في الخمار الأسود
    مـاذا فـعــلت بــناسـك مـتـعـبد

    قـد كـان شـمّر لــلـصلاة ثـيابه
    حتى خـطرت له بباب المسجد

    ردي عليـه صـلاتـه وصيـامــه
    لا تـقــتـلــيه بـحـق ديــن محمد
  • Re: Death Penalty
     Reply #2 - September 23, 2011, 03:27 PM
    Totally against it!
    Admin of following facebook pages and groups:
    Islam's Last Stand (page)
    Islam's Last Stand (group)
    and many others...
  • Re: Death Penalty
     Reply #3 - September 23, 2011, 03:28 PM
    Against.

    (Though when despots like Ceaucescu and Saddam are killed, I think it's somehow for the best.)
  • Re: Death Penalty
     Reply #4 - September 23, 2011, 03:30 PM
    Even if its a serial killer, I would go with give his life full reboot, or selective memory killing.
    Admin of following facebook pages and groups:
    Islam's Last Stand (page)
    Islam's Last Stand (group)
    and many others...
  • Re: Death Penalty
     Reply #5 - September 23, 2011, 03:35 PM
    Quote from: harakaat on September 23, 2011, 03:23 PM
    You should've added "Undecided" or "I don't know".


    Thanks for the suggestion Afro
    "I'm standing here like an asshole holding my Charles Dickens"

    "No theory,No ready made system,no book that has ever been written to save the world. i cleave to no system.."-Bakunin
  • Re: Death Penalty
     Reply #6 - September 23, 2011, 03:41 PM
    Quote from: muddy on September 23, 2011, 03:30 PM
    Even if its a serial killer, I would go with give his life full reboot, or selective memory killing.

    Yap I too., I just want take his/her organs out and transplant to some good people who need them
    Do not let silence become your legacy.. Question everything   
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim     
  • Re: Death Penalty
     Reply #7 - September 23, 2011, 04:09 PM
    The cost to the taxpayers is an important deciding factor for me. In US, it costs much more to sentence a person to death than it costs to sustain them for life in prison. Hence, I'm against it.

    If it was cheaper to execute a person, I would prefer it to be painless (preferably nitrogen asphyxiation). As it stands in the United States, lethal injection is made purposefully painful (although the inmate can't express signs of pain because they are paralyzed). Americans sure love their vengeance.
    Have you heard the good news? There is no God!
  • Re: Death Penalty
     Reply #8 - September 23, 2011, 04:10 PM
    Killing someone for a crime is giving them easy way out. Let them work hard for community for rest of their lives.
    Admin of following facebook pages and groups:
    Islam's Last Stand (page)
    Islam's Last Stand (group)
    and many others...
  • Re: Death Penalty
     Reply #9 - September 23, 2011, 05:15 PM
    Among other well trodden reasons, I don't trust the state to make irreversible decisions.
  • Re: Death Penalty
     Reply #10 - September 23, 2011, 05:56 PM
    from the police to the court system, nothing is perfect.  I can remember many 'guilty' murderers who turned out to be completely innocent in the UK and who maintained their innocence in prison until it was proved, in one case for 27 miserable years during which time this completely innocent individual had one indignity and act of violence ( including rape) heaped on top of another committed against him.
    Imagine that you yourself were arrested, charged and convicted for something you know nothing about. I think I would probably go insane.
    Considerations like 'saving tax money' are beneath contempt in these circumstances.  If it were possible to prove guilt 100% I would go with the Death Penalty, but it's not and never will be. I'd rather see a thousand murderers in prison than to see one innocent person done to death by an imperfect legal system.
    Religion is ignorance giftwrapped in lyricism.
  • Re: Death Penalty
     Reply #11 - September 23, 2011, 08:36 PM
    I'm against the death penalty because I don't want to live somewhere where the state has the power to kill people.
  • Re: Death Penalty
     Reply #12 - September 23, 2011, 08:38 PM
    Quote from: muddy on September 23, 2011, 04:10 PM
    Killing someone for a crime is giving them easy way out. Let them work hard for community for rest of their lives.


    +1
    Little Fly, Thy summer's play
    My thoughtless hand has brushed away.

    I too dance and drink, and sing,
    Till some blind hand shall brush my wing.

    Therefore I am a happy fly,
    If I live or if I die.
  • Re: Death Penalty
     Reply #13 - September 23, 2011, 08:47 PM
    The case of Troy Davis convinced me once and for all that the death penalty brings no justice, but only many possible instances of injustice.
    I make it rain - apparently?

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nh_I19_mKkU&list=SP1665576E7498BAB7&index=2&feature=plcp
  • Re: Death Penalty
     Reply #14 - September 24, 2011, 02:16 AM
    Earlier this year I began working in the corrections system in the US as a nurse. As such I have gotten to know many of the 2,500 plus men that live at the facility where I work. Some of them are lifers and some of those would have quaified for the death penalty had it been available at the time of their sentencing.

    I don't say this easily but the death sentence would have been then kindest, most merciful, just and reasonable thing that could have been done for a few of these men.
    Some end up in lock down units because of their in ablility to follow instructions or because their antisocial behavior makes them a danger to themsef in genral population.
    Take a moment to think what this means. Twenty two hours a day locked in an 8 by 8 foot cell. Don't count on view, that room  has an 8 by 24 inch safety glass window with bar that looks outside. There another window and a small slat passthrough door in the door . Those two hours not locked in that cell don't think they get them both every day. One hour is to shower. However the minimum full shower allowance is every three days. So any security or disciple problem, they can be sure that it took up their shower time. The other hour is for outdoor recreation. This is interesting stuff. I'm guessing those cages are about 12 by 12 by 12 feet they get they're cellie and a basketball and  no hoop to play with. Oh yeh that 8 by 8 wasn't a private room. Don't  think there is rec every day there are more reasons to not have it then not have a shower. Some of these men have such antisocial behavior there is no one on the outside who comes to see them or write them or that they can call with their phone points.
    Doesn't sound bad? Think if that was the rest of your life.
    You never got to change channel on the TV.
    You had to earn points to have a pen and paper.
    You only have three changes of clothes and they all look the same.
    No one every hugged
     you and said I are care.
    In no one ever touched you.

    There are cases when innocent men and women serve time. There are cases of first time offenders  who did do much getting 50 yrs which could well be life because of the hard life style in prisons.

    However there are offenders who are guilty, who have no desire or ability to function even in a contolled environment.  They do not what to learn the skills needed to work and care for themself. They perfer to  be takers, murdering doesn't bother them. They are a danger to have around. Even in the prison.
    If at first you succeed...try something harder.

    Failing isn't falling down. Failing is not getting back up again.
  • Re: Death Penalty
     Reply #15 - September 24, 2011, 02:28 AM
    Quote from: sojournerlumus on September 23, 2011, 05:56 PM
    from the police to the court system, nothing is perfect.  I can remember many 'guilty' murderers who turned out to be completely innocent in the UK and who maintained their innocence in prison until it was proved, in one case for 27 miserable years during which time this completely innocent individual had one indignity and act of violence ( including rape) heaped on top of another committed against him.
    Imagine that you yourself were arrested, charged and convicted for something you know nothing about. I think I would probably go insane.
    Considerations like 'saving tax money' are beneath contempt in these circumstances.  If it were possible to prove guilt 100% I would go with the Death Penalty, but it's not and never will be. I'd rather see a thousand murderers in prison than to see one innocent person done to death by an imperfect legal system.

    Very well said..
    Admin of following facebook pages and groups:
    Islam's Last Stand (page)
    Islam's Last Stand (group)
    and many others...
  • Re: Death Penalty
     Reply #16 - September 24, 2011, 02:37 AM
    Quote from: muddy on September 24, 2011, 02:28 AM
    Very well said..

    muddy is there anything that is worse than death in life??  I SUPPORT  that to certain people ., So I could not vote in your poll
    Do not let silence become your legacy.. Question everything   
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim     
  • Re: Death Penalty
     Reply #17 - September 24, 2011, 02:45 AM
    Quote from: muddy on September 23, 2011, 03:30 PM
    Even if its a serial killer, I would go with give his life full reboot, or selective memory killing.


    Dearest Muddy,
    You have some most amazing ideas. As a nurse who works with offender I would be most interested in understanding how you would give a human a full life reboot and how to safely preform selective memory killing. Please do rush the infrmation to me because I would like to learn these techniques before my sick leave comes to an end. 
    looking forward to hearin from you.
    Lynna
    If at first you succeed...try something harder.

    Failing isn't falling down. Failing is not getting back up again.
  • Re: Death Penalty
     Reply #18 - September 24, 2011, 03:15 AM
    Quote from: Gladfly on September 23, 2011, 08:38 PM
    +1


    Quote from: muddy on September 23, 2011, 04:10 PM
    Killing someone for a crime is giving them easy way out. Let them work hard for community for rest of their lives.


    to Gladfly
    I noticed you agreed with Muddy that those committing crimes befitting the death penalty should not so be sentenced but enstead should work hard for the community. Do you actually live someplce where this is an existing lw or do yolu just think it is a goo idea,?
    lookingforward to earig from you.
    If at first you succeed...try something harder.

    Failing isn't falling down. Failing is not getting back up again.
  • Re: Death Penalty
     Reply #19 - September 24, 2011, 04:00 AM
    Quote from: Lynna on September 24, 2011, 02:16 AM
    Earlier this year I began working in the corrections system in the US as a nurse. As such I have gotten to know many of the 2,500 plus men that live at the facility where I work. Some of them are lifers and some of those would have quaified for the death penalty had it been available at the time of their sentencing.

    I don't say this easily but the death sentence would have been then kindest, most merciful, just and reasonable thing that could have been done for a few of these men.
    Some end up in lock down units because of their in ablility to follow instructions or because their antisocial behavior makes them a danger to themsef in genral population.
    Take a moment to think what this means. Twenty two hours a day locked in an 8 by 8 foot cell. Don't count on view, that room  has an 8 by 24 inch safety glass window with bar that looks outside. There another window and a small slat passthrough door in the door . Those two hours not locked in that cell don't think they get them both every day. One hour is to shower. However the minimum full shower allowance is every three days. So any security or disciple problem, they can be sure that it took up their shower time. The other hour is for outdoor recreation. This is interesting stuff. I'm guessing those cages are about 12 by 12 by 12 feet they get they're cellie and a basketball and  no hoop to play with. Oh yeh that 8 by 8 wasn't a private room. Don't  think there is rec every day there are more reasons to not have it then not have a shower. Some of these men have such antisocial behavior there is no one on the outside who comes to see them or write them or that they can call with their phone points.
    Doesn't sound bad? Think if that was the rest of your life.
    You never got to change channel on the TV.
    You had to earn points to have a pen and paper.
    You only have three changes of clothes and they all look the same.
    No one every hugged
     you and said I are care.
    In no one ever touched you.

    There are cases when innocent men and women serve time. There are cases of first time offenders  who did do much getting 50 yrs which could well be life because of the hard life style in prisons.

    However there are offenders who are guilty, who have no desire or ability to function even in a contolled environment.  They do not what to learn the skills needed to work and care for themself. They perfer to  be takers, murdering doesn't bother them. They are a danger to have around. Even in the prison.

    Yeah we could have improve the system, providing them proper air and sunlight once a day from the money saved from giving them death sentences.
    Admin of following facebook pages and groups:
    Islam's Last Stand (page)
    Islam's Last Stand (group)
    and many others...
  • Re: Death Penalty
     Reply #20 - September 24, 2011, 04:04 AM
    Quote from: Lynna on September 24, 2011, 02:45 AM
    Dearest Muddy,
    You have some most amazing ideas. As a nurse who works with offender I would be most interested in understanding how you would give a human a full life reboot and how to safely preform selective memory killing. Please do rush the infrmation to me because I would like to learn these techniques before my sick leave comes to an end. 
    looking forward to hearin from you.
    Lynna

    The only medical knowledge I have is from occasional internet surfing, and some from TV, movies etc. I can not give you proper medical opinion about that. (I got the selective memory killing from the movie Paycheck. And they also mentioned that in Big Bang Theory, so I assume that technology is either available now or will be in future.)
    Admin of following facebook pages and groups:
    Islam's Last Stand (page)
    Islam's Last Stand (group)
    and many others...
  • Re: Death Penalty
     Reply #21 - September 24, 2011, 04:06 AM
    Quote from: Lynna on September 24, 2011, 03:15 AM
    to Gladfly
    I noticed you agreed with Muddy that those committing crimes befitting the death penalty should not so be sentenced but enstead should work hard for the community. Do you actually live someplce where this is an existing lw or do yolu just think it is a goo idea,?
    lookingforward to earig from you.

    I only saw some TV shows that make these people work for ministery of transportation or something. I saw similar thing in pakistani show where the kid prisoners were taught and made to work as mechanics.)
    Admin of following facebook pages and groups:
    Islam's Last Stand (page)
    Islam's Last Stand (group)
    and many others...
  • Re: Death Penalty
     Reply #22 - September 24, 2011, 04:07 AM
    I voted against it.  The death penalty is utterly, completely wrong.  Not because nobody deserves it, some people, (eg. Richard Ramirez and similar scumbags), totally deserve it.  I'd kill those fuckers myself.

    Its wrong because we cannot trust the criminal justice system to get it right.  I see somebody in this thread brought up Troy Davis, but frankly I think he was guilty.  I wouldn't be shedding any tears over him, but what about Cameron Todd Wallingham?  What about Damien Echols?  What about Earl Washington?

    Look up those  names on google, and tell me with a straight face that  the US justice system is fit to deliver an irreversible penalty.  
    "Befriend them not, Oh murtads, and give them neither parrot nor bunny."  - happymurtad's advice on trolls.
  • Re: Death Penalty
     Reply #23 - September 24, 2011, 04:15 AM
    Quote from: Cheetah on September 24, 2011, 04:07 AM
     US justice system....

    US has NO JUSTICE system.. it is dollars based justice.., and you can see that in number of  high profiles cases  similar to that of Mr. O.J. Simson. But I agree The death penalty  to an individual does not solve the criminal/ Social/political/economical/religious problems of humanity..
    Do not let silence become your legacy.. Question everything   
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim     
  • Re: Death Penalty
     Reply #24 - September 24, 2011, 04:21 AM
    That's rubbish, Yeezevee.  The US has a very sophisticated criminal justice system.  However, its run by human beings, which means it makes mistakes.  And OJ is the least of their mistakes, he is outnumbered at least 10 to 1 by the innocent people who end up in prison for crimes they didn't commit.

    When they know they are still capable of mistakes, and they keep the death penalty, that is truly disturbing.
    "Befriend them not, Oh murtads, and give them neither parrot nor bunny."  - happymurtad's advice on trolls.
  • Re: Death Penalty
     Reply #25 - September 24, 2011, 04:57 AM
    Never thought I'd say this but I think yeezevee makes more sense than Cheetah here. Tongue

    As to the OP, my answer is "Other"

    I do not oppose the idea that a life may be taken for another life on a moral basis, however I do not think, on a practical basis, that the state taking someone's life serves justice. Until such time as an error and bias-free system of conviction and sentencing is achieved (which I think is highly unlikely to ever occur), I do not agree with including capital punishment as a punishment for any crime.
    fuck you
  • Re: Death Penalty
     Reply #26 - September 24, 2011, 05:37 AM
    Quote from: muddy on September 24, 2011, 04:06 AM
    I only saw some TV shows that make these people work for ministery of transportation or something. I saw similar thing in pakistani show where the kid prisoners were taught and made to work as mechanics.)


    Oh okay. As far I as I am aware this is a very normal/common type program for people who have minor offences. For example traffic tricket or drunk in public without additional charges that would make them a danger to themself or the public.

    Most offenders who are able to receive the death penalty are a danger to the public and have shown themself unlikely to be successuly rehabilitated.

    I believe we would be talking about to very different groups of people.

    It is only a very very small group of the popultaion that would/should ever be considered for the death penalty.
    If at first you succeed...try something harder.

    Failing isn't falling down. Failing is not getting back up again.
  • Re: Death Penalty
     Reply #27 - September 24, 2011, 05:57 AM
    Quote from: muddy on September 24, 2011, 04:04 AM
    The only medical knowledge I have is from occasional internet surfing, and some from TV, movies etc. I can not give you proper medical opinion about that. (I got the selective memory killing from the movie Paycheck. And they also mentioned that in Big Bang Theory, so I assume that technology is either available now or will be in future.)


    Thank you Muddy I weeded a good laugh today. I took a nap to relieve a headache to day.  The pleasure of sick leave. As far as I know rebooting and selective memory killing are not treatments available for human. I will however speak to my neurologist in November when I see her. I'll let you know what I find out.
    If at first you succeed...try something harder.

    Failing isn't falling down. Failing is not getting back up again.
  • Re: Death Penalty
     Reply #28 - September 24, 2011, 07:15 AM
    Quote from: Gladfly on September 23, 2011, 08:38 PM
    +1

     I repeat, how can we be sure they did it?
    Religion is ignorance giftwrapped in lyricism.
  • Re: Death Penalty
     Reply #29 - September 24, 2011, 07:18 AM
    Quote from: Colonel Q-Daffi on September 24, 2011, 04:57 AM
    Never thought I'd say this but I think yeezevee makes more sense than Cheetah here. Tongue

    As to the OP, my answer is "Other"

    I do not oppose the idea that a life may be taken for another life on a moral basis, however I do not think, on a practical basis, that the state taking someone's life serves justice. Until such time as an error and bias-free system of conviction and sentencing is achieved (which I think is highly unlikely to ever occur), I do not agree with including capital punishment as a punishment for any crime.


    As for the  OP I voted 'other'.
    I'm actually kind of surpised to find myself arguing the sometimes the death sentence is the right thing side of this.

    I don't know alot about the high profile cases that make the news.

    I do know the living conditions of 2,500 or so men who live at the facility where worked before my sick leave. I know many of these men on a daily conversaion level. There is but but two or three of them that are claiming innocent. That is not 100% innocent. That is innocent of the crime they ere convicted of. Two totally different things.
    If you got to know how dangerous some of these men are maybe you would have different feeling about them. Some of them would rape and torture to death your 3 month old son or your 80 year old grandma and then say they willingly took part.  They'd do the same to you, they do not want to stop.  They rape other offenders if ever they would get the chance. They would hurt anyone.

    At work I am considered offender friendly because I will always try to get programs to help them. I listen to what they would say even  when it was hard to hear.

    But there is reality to be faced. Some people are so damaged and so dangerous that the quality of their life will be so low that there would be mercy in death.
    If at first you succeed...try something harder.

    Failing isn't falling down. Failing is not getting back up again.
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