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 Topic: A controversial take on depression

 (Read 10174 times)
  • 12 Next page « Previous thread | Next thread »
  • A controversial take on depression
     OP - March 14, 2012, 03:10 PM
    I've got alot of time for this perspective (dude has a degree in psychology, and has worked as a counsellor)...

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RLMKpCxIBe0
    An alternative to religion;

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i2nfXfTg92E

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dWNW-NXEudk
  • Re: A controversial take on depression
     Reply #1 - March 14, 2012, 05:17 PM
    sorry but my computer does not have speakers, and I won't be able to hear. What is his position?
  • Re: A controversial take on depression
     Reply #2 - March 14, 2012, 06:17 PM
    ^^ The gist of it is that depression is not genetic or hereditary, and is easily fixed with lifestyle changes such as exercise and a healthy diet.  However if you look around there is a conspiracy between the governments and the big pharmaceutical companies that keeps pushing anti depressants on us inspite of knowing the real cure is lifestyle.

    I'm not really one for conspiracy theories but I do agree that anti depressants are pushed too regularly, when tbh I am completely leaning in the direction that it is my diet and lifestyle that adds to my depression.

    Not saying that a healthy diet and lifestyle change will cure my BDD, but my mood would improve at least.
    Inhale the good shit, exhale the bullshit.
  • Re: A controversial take on depression
     Reply #3 - March 14, 2012, 06:34 PM
    I watched the first two minutes but it's something like hollistic, lifestyle, nutrition, daily behaivour etc as opposed to a biological condition?

    Correct me if I'm wrong

    If that is what he's saying, then it seems he's wrong, neuroscientists have quite a lot of data showing the link between depression and 'faulty connections' in some areas of the brain, this situation  is usually helped with anti-depressents, but holistic approaches can be a good suplement.

    Again, I'll have to watch it (can't be bothered to watch every guy on youtube with a degree and a controversial opinion) or wait for a full summary.
    "Nobody who lived through the '50s thought the '60s could've existed. So there's always hope."-Tuli Kupferberg

    What apple stores are like.....

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S8QmZWv-eBI
  • Re: A controversial take on depression
     Reply #4 - March 14, 2012, 06:36 PM
    Quote from: BerberElla on March 14, 2012, 06:17 PM
    ^^ The gist of it is that depression is not genetic or hereditary, and is easily fixed with lifestyle changes such as exercise and a healthy diet.  However if you look around there is a conspiracy between the governments and the big pharmaceutical companies that keeps pushing anti depressants on us inspite of knowing the real cure is lifestyle.

    I'm not really one for conspiracy theories but I do agree that anti depressants are pushed too regularly, when tbh I am completely leaning in the direction that it is my diet and lifestyle that adds to my depression.

    Not saying that a healthy diet and lifestyle change will cure my BDD, but my mood would improve at least.


    It's no conspiarcy theory, doctors work for a government agency, the government is usually interested in the easiest and most cost-effective 'solutions' to long term problems, which often means that long term complex problems are plastered over with cheap solutions. So yes, anti-depressents are pushed too easily, but it's no surprise.
    "Nobody who lived through the '50s thought the '60s could've existed. So there's always hope."-Tuli Kupferberg

    What apple stores are like.....

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S8QmZWv-eBI
  • Re: A controversial take on depression
     Reply #5 - March 14, 2012, 08:45 PM
    The only problem with recommending diet and lifestyle changes is that they are difficult and daunting even for the best of us. Breaking behaviour cycles is even harder when depressed. Easier to pop a pill, and easier to fall into a new pattern of behaviour involving quick-fix drugs as a crutch rather than mustering the motivation required to make long-term changes to diet and lifestyle that entail constant upkeep and wont show the benefit immediately.
    Too fucking busy, and vice versa.
  • Re: A controversial take on depression
     Reply #6 - March 14, 2012, 09:32 PM
    Yes, and it's sort of a rough cycle anyway, because if you are that depressed and lacking motivation to do anything else, I doubt changing lifestyle would be a picnic.
    "Nobody who lived through the '50s thought the '60s could've existed. So there's always hope."-Tuli Kupferberg

    What apple stores are like.....

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S8QmZWv-eBI
  • Re: A controversial take on depression
     Reply #7 - March 14, 2012, 09:41 PM
    Just out of curiosity, Is it possible that some psychiatrists might scam their patients by prescribing pills that maybe more harm than benefit?

    I dont really believe in taking pills for a quick fix because of the addiction.
    "I'm standing here like an asshole holding my Charles Dickens"

    "No theory,No ready made system,no book that has ever been written to save the world. i cleave to no system.."-Bakunin
  • Re: A controversial take on depression
     Reply #8 - March 14, 2012, 09:43 PM
    Limited scope in countries like the UK, prescribing pills that are more useless than beneficial may happen though.

    I can't take for the US.
    "Nobody who lived through the '50s thought the '60s could've existed. So there's always hope."-Tuli Kupferberg

    What apple stores are like.....

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S8QmZWv-eBI
  • Re: A controversial take on depression
     Reply #9 - March 15, 2012, 11:51 AM
    Quote from: BerberElla on March 14, 2012, 06:17 PM
    ^^ The gist of it is that depression is not genetic or hereditary, and is easily fixed with lifestyle changes such as exercise and a healthy diet.


    To be fair, I've been listening to the dude for a few years, and he hasn't indicated to me that he thinks it can be easily fixed.

    This is the basic gist of his recommended lifestyle changes;
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W3qBJesRUVg

    Lacking the 'will' to make changes is one of the challenges of depression though - I know from personal experience.
    An alternative to religion;

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i2nfXfTg92E

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dWNW-NXEudk
  • Re: A controversial take on depression
     Reply #10 - March 15, 2012, 11:53 AM
    'Will' is a result of brain chemistry, I don't see how one could think that the right medication couldn't solve that if it's a chemical issue. Also, psychotherapy, electrical therapy and other forms of therapy. Either way, it isn't just something someone can wish away.
    "Nobody who lived through the '50s thought the '60s could've existed. So there's always hope."-Tuli Kupferberg

    What apple stores are like.....

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S8QmZWv-eBI
  • Re: A controversial take on depression
     Reply #11 - March 15, 2012, 11:59 AM
    You either work for pharmaceutical industry or have been brain washed by it Smiley
    "That it is indeed the speech of an illustrious messenger" (The Koran 69:40)
  • Re: A controversial take on depression
     Reply #12 - March 15, 2012, 12:03 PM
    Expletive deleted.
    "Nobody who lived through the '50s thought the '60s could've existed. So there's always hope."-Tuli Kupferberg

    What apple stores are like.....

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S8QmZWv-eBI
  • Re: A controversial take on depression
     Reply #13 - March 15, 2012, 12:05 PM
    ^^ from where I am sitting, not a good answer sprout.  Lets lay off the swearing until he swears at you.   Wink
    Inhale the good shit, exhale the bullshit.
  • Re: A controversial take on depression
     Reply #14 - March 15, 2012, 12:07 PM
    My apologies to you, Berberella.
    "Nobody who lived through the '50s thought the '60s could've existed. So there's always hope."-Tuli Kupferberg

    What apple stores are like.....

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S8QmZWv-eBI
  • Re: A controversial take on depression
     Reply #15 - March 15, 2012, 12:07 PM
    His position isn't that it couldn't, it's that it's not probably needed. Will can also be cultviated in other 'natural' ways like; social support, reading and listening to inspirational material, etc.  
    An alternative to religion;

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i2nfXfTg92E

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dWNW-NXEudk
  • Re: A controversial take on depression
     Reply #16 - March 15, 2012, 12:09 PM
    Sounds like a generalisation as it seems to depend on the person, but ok, fair enough, I should watch the video in full first, but it's hard to sit through 20 minutes of a 'controversial' opinion, has he ever wrote a paper or anything?
    "Nobody who lived through the '50s thought the '60s could've existed. So there's always hope."-Tuli Kupferberg

    What apple stores are like.....

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S8QmZWv-eBI
  • Re: A controversial take on depression
     Reply #17 - March 15, 2012, 12:12 PM
    I also completely agree that anti-depressant pills may (or may not) only have a placebo effect or worse, but the problem is for the depressed subject to accept the bitter truth that he/she is a lazy slob. This truth has to be delivered in an agreeable fashion and carefully weighed against the risk of suicide. Not a psychiatrist opinion, just someone who took the pills and tried a different lifestyle.
    "That it is indeed the speech of an illustrious messenger" (The Koran 69:40)
  • Re: A controversial take on depression
     Reply #18 - March 15, 2012, 12:13 PM
    No.
    Quote
    but it's hard to sit through 20 minutes of a 'controversial' opinion,


    Don't watch it then dude.  wacko
    An alternative to religion;

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i2nfXfTg92E

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dWNW-NXEudk
  • Re: A controversial take on depression
     Reply #19 - March 15, 2012, 12:15 PM
    Quote from: Alex Lam Meem on March 15, 2012, 12:12 PM
    I also completely agree that anti-depressant pills may (or may not) only have a placebo effect or worse, but the problem is for the depressed subject to accept the bitter truth that he/she is a lazy slob. This truth has to be delivered in an agreeable fashion and carefully weighed against the risk of suicide. Not a psychiatrist opinion, just someone who took the pills and tried a different lifestyle.


    Yes, this is scientific truth. Incidentally, have you burned any witches lately?




    Oh, and sorry strangestdude, I didn't mean to sound rude about the video, I shouldn't have posted anything in the thread in the first place.
    "Nobody who lived through the '50s thought the '60s could've existed. So there's always hope."-Tuli Kupferberg

    What apple stores are like.....

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S8QmZWv-eBI
  • Re: A controversial take on depression
     Reply #20 - March 15, 2012, 12:16 PM
    Quote from: Alex Lam Meem on March 15, 2012, 12:12 PM
    I also completely agree that anti-depressant pills may (or may not) only have a placebo effect or worse, but the problem is for the depressed subject to accept the bitter truth that he/she is a lazy slob. This truth has to be delivered in an agreeable fashion and carefully weighed against the risk of suicide. Not a psychiatrist opinion, just someone who took the pills and tried a different lifestyle.


    Where did you get the impression that people who advocate 'natural' depression cures, think that people who are depressed are lazy slobs?
    An alternative to religion;

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i2nfXfTg92E

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dWNW-NXEudk
  • Re: A controversial take on depression
     Reply #21 - March 15, 2012, 12:19 PM
    Well of course you may not say it out loud! However, were the depressed subjects forced to choose the wrong lifestyle with no exercise and healthy food in the first place?
    "That it is indeed the speech of an illustrious messenger" (The Koran 69:40)
  • Re: A controversial take on depression
     Reply #22 - March 15, 2012, 12:22 PM
    Quote from: Sprout on March 15, 2012, 12:15 PM
    Yes, this is scientific truth. Incidentally, have you burned any witches lately?



    I don't burn witches - they are more effective than modern science sometimes. In other words, after loosing faith, it's easy to make science one's new religion... Must never forget that both were made by men.
    "That it is indeed the speech of an illustrious messenger" (The Koran 69:40)
  • Re: A controversial take on depression
     Reply #23 - March 15, 2012, 12:23 PM
    I think that depends on an inviduals perspective on the free-will vs determinism debate. I'm a determinist (not a fatalist though), so I don't see them as 'lazy slobs', or decision making process is more complicated than simply exercising our 'conscious will'.
    An alternative to religion;

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i2nfXfTg92E

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dWNW-NXEudk
  • Re: A controversial take on depression
     Reply #24 - March 15, 2012, 12:26 PM
    I think believing that your will is an illusion is a very prominent cause of depression. (Again not a shrink opinion, just personal observations.) 
    "That it is indeed the speech of an illustrious messenger" (The Koran 69:40)
  • Re: A controversial take on depression
     Reply #25 - March 15, 2012, 12:33 PM
    Quote from: Sprout on March 15, 2012, 12:15 PM
    Oh, and sorry strangestdude, I didn't mean to sound rude about the video, I shouldn't have posted anything in the thread in the first place.


    No probs.

    I respect the scientific method a great deal, but I'm pretty sceptical of the chemical approach/big pharma. When I went to the doctors about depression a decade ago, the first 'solution' presented was pills. Maybe things have got better.

    I went to my doctors about a long term shoulder injury and the dude immediately brought up the approach of injecting me with cortisol periodically! I tried NHS physio (which made the problem worse, the dude had me exercising muscle groups that aggravated the problem lol), and never went back because I'm not going down the chemical path.  
    An alternative to religion;

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i2nfXfTg92E

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dWNW-NXEudk
  • Re: A controversial take on depression
     Reply #26 - March 15, 2012, 12:35 PM
    Quote from: Alex Lam Meem on March 15, 2012, 12:26 PM
    I think believing that your will is an illusion is a very prominent cause of depression. (Again not a shrink opinion, just personal observations.)  


    I don't see the correlation. I've been depressed for about 7 years, and have known others who suffered from depression, and that's never come up - but that's my personal experience.

    Have you known people cite that as a reason why they are depressed?
    An alternative to religion;

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i2nfXfTg92E

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dWNW-NXEudk
  • Re: A controversial take on depression
     Reply #27 - March 15, 2012, 12:37 PM
    I also want to emphasize that being a determinist doesn't mean you have to adopt fatalism.
    An alternative to religion;

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i2nfXfTg92E

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dWNW-NXEudk
  • Re: A controversial take on depression
     Reply #28 - March 15, 2012, 12:42 PM
    No strangestdude, like I said, it's only one unprofessional personal opinion... I though it may be worth sharing nevertheless, since stranger things have been uttered.
    "That it is indeed the speech of an illustrious messenger" (The Koran 69:40)
  • Re: A controversial take on depression
     Reply #29 - March 15, 2012, 12:45 PM
    Oh, concerning fatalism vs determinism - I haven't had the opportunity/will to analyze those or anything philosophical in several years so I can't add to that discussion. (Seriously) Life goes on and decisions have to be made however, even if you don't consider the meaning of it all.
    "That it is indeed the speech of an illustrious messenger" (The Koran 69:40)
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