Skip navigation
Sidebar -

Advanced search options →

Welcome

Welcome to CEMB forum.
Please login or register. Did you miss your activation email?

Donations

Help keep the Forum going!
Click on Kitty to donate:

Kitty is lost

Recent Posts


New Britain
Yesterday at 01:46 PM

Islam and Science Fiction
by zeca
February 09, 2025, 11:06 PM

اضواء على الطريق ....... ...
by akay
February 08, 2025, 01:38 PM

German nationalist party ...
February 07, 2025, 01:11 PM

Do humans have needed kno...
February 06, 2025, 03:13 PM

Lights on the way
by akay
February 05, 2025, 10:04 PM

Gaza assault
February 05, 2025, 10:04 AM

AMRIKAAA Land of Free .....
February 03, 2025, 09:25 AM

The origins of Judaism
by zeca
February 02, 2025, 04:29 PM

Qur'anic studies today
by zeca
February 01, 2025, 11:48 PM

Random Islamic History Po...
by zeca
February 01, 2025, 07:29 PM

News From Syria
by zeca
December 28, 2024, 12:29 AM

Theme Changer

 Topic: Sam Harris... In defense of Profiling...

 (Read 10864 times)
  • 12 Next page « Previous thread | Next thread »
  • Sam Harris... In defense of Profiling...
     OP - May 03, 2012, 01:30 PM

    oh sammy...
     
    http://www.samharris.org/blog/item/in-defense-of-profiling

    Much has been written about how insulting and depressing it is, more than a decade after the events of 9/11, to be met by “security theater” at our nation’s airports. The current system appears so inane that one hopes it really is a sham, concealing more-ingenious intrusions into our privacy. The spirit of political correctness hangs over the whole enterprise like the Angel of Death—indeed, more closely than death, or than the actual fear of terrorism. And political correctness requires that TSA employees direct the spotlight of their attention at random—or appear to do so—while making rote use of irrational procedures and dubious technology.

    Although I don’t think I look like a jihadi, or like a man pretending not to be one, I do not mean to suggest that a person like me should be exempt from scrutiny. But other travelers fit the profile far less than I do. One glance at these innocents reveals that they are no more likely to be terrorists than walruses in disguise. I make it a point to notice such people while queuing for security at the airport, just to see what sort of treatment they receive at the hands of the TSA.

    While leaving JFK last week, I found myself standing in line behind an elderly couple who couldn’t have been less threatening had they been already dead and boarding in their coffins. I would have bet my life that they were not waging jihad. Both appeared to be in their mid-eighties and infirm. The woman rode in a wheelchair attended by an airport employee as her husband struggled to comply with TSA regulations—removing various items from their luggage, arranging them in separate bins, and loading the bins and bags onto the conveyor belt bound for x-ray.

    After much preparation, the couple proceeded toward the body scanner, only to encounter resistance. It seems that they had neglected to take off their shoes. A pair of TSA screeners stepped forward to prevent this dangerous breach of security—removing what appeared to be orthopedic footwear from both the woman in the wheelchair and the man now staggering at her side. This imposed obvious stress on two harmless and bewildered people and caused considerable delay for everyone in my line. I turned to see if anyone else was amazed by such a perversion of vigilance. The man behind me, who could have played the villain in a Bollywood film, looked unconcerned.

    I have noticed such incongruities before. In fact, my wife and I once accidentally used a bag for carry-on in which I had once stored a handgun—and passed through three airport checkpoints with nearly 75 rounds of 9 mm ammunition. While we were inadvertently smuggling bullets, one TSA screener had the presence of mind to escort a terrified three-year-old away from her parents so that he could remove her sandals (sandals!). Presumably, a scanner that had just missed 2.5 pounds of ammunition would determine whether these objects were the most clever bombs ever wrought. Needless to say, a glance at the girl’s family was all one needed to know that they hadn’t rigged her to explode. (The infuriating scene played out very much like this one.)

    Is there nothing we can do to stop this tyranny of fairness? Some semblance of fairness makes sense—and, needless to say, everyone’s bags should be screened, if only because it is possible to put a bomb in someone else’s luggage. But the TSA has a finite amount of attention: Every moment spent frisking the Mormon Tabernacle Choir subtracts from the scrutiny paid to more likely threats. Who could fail to understand this?

    Imagine how fatuous it would be to fight a war against the IRA and yet refuse to profile the Irish? And yet this is how we seem to be fighting our war against Islamic terrorism.

    Granted, I haven’t had to endure the experience of being continually profiled. No doubt it would be frustrating. But if someone who looked vaguely like Ben Stiller were wanted for crimes against humanity, I would understand if I turned a few heads at the airport. However, if I were forced to wait in line behind a sham search of everyone else, I would surely resent this additional theft of my time.

    We should profile Muslims, or anyone who looks like he or she could conceivably be Muslim, and we should be honest about it. And, again, I wouldn’t put someone who looks like me entirely outside the bull’s-eye (after all, what would Adam Gadahn look like if he cleaned himself up?) But there are people who do not stand a chance of being jihadists, and TSA screeners can know this at a glance.

    Needless to say, a devout Muslim should be free to show up at the airport dressed like Osama bin Laden, and his wives should be free to wear burqas. But if their goal is simply to travel safely and efficiently, wouldn’t they, too, want a system that notices people like themselves? At a minimum, wouldn’t they want a system that anti-profiles—applying the minimum of attention to people who obviously pose no threat?  

    Watch some of the TSA screening videos on YouTube—like this one—and then imagine how this infernal stupidity will appear if we ever suffer another terrorist incident involving an airplane.


    Addendum (5/1/12):

    Many readers found this blog post stunning for its lack of sensitivity. The article has been called “racist,” “dreadful,” “sickening,” “appalling,” “frighteningly ignorant,” etc. by (former) fans who profess to have loved everything I’ve written until this moment. I find this reaction difficult to understand. Of course, anyone who imagines that there is no link between Islam and suicidal terrorism might object to what I’ve written here, but I say far more offensive things about Islam in The End of Faith and in many of my essays and lectures.

    In any case, it is simply a fact that, in the year 2012, suicidal terrorism is overwhelmingly a Muslim phenomenon. If you grant this, it follows that applying equal scrutiny to Mennonites would be a dangerous waste of time.

    I suspect that it will surprise neither my fans nor my critics that I view the furor over this article to be symptomatic of the very political correctness that I decry in it. However, it seems that when one speaks candidly about the problem of Islam misunderstandings easily multiply. So I’d like to clarify a couple of points here:

    1. When I speak of profiling “Muslims, or anyone who looks like he or she could conceivably be Muslim,” I am not narrowly focused on people with dark skin. In fact, I included myself in the description of the type of person I think should be profiled (twice). To say that ethnicity, gender, age, nationality, dress, traveling companions, behavior in the terminal, and other outward appearances offer no indication of a person’s beliefs or terrorist potential is either quite crazy or totally dishonest. It is the charm of political correctness that it blends these sins against reasonableness so seamlessly. We are paying a very high price for this obscurantism—and the price could grow much higher in an instant. We have limited resources, and every moment spent searching a woman like the one pictured above, or the children seen in the linked videos, is a moment in which someone or something else goes unobserved.

    2. There is no conflict between what I have written here and “behavioral profiling” or other forms of threat detection. And if we can catch terrorists before they reach the airport, I am all for it. But the methods we use to do this tend to be even more focused and invasive (and, therefore, offensive) than profiling done by the TSA. Many readers who were horrified by my article seem to believe that there is nothing wrong with “gathering intelligence.” One wonders just how they think that is done
  • Re: Sam Harris... In defense of Profiling...
     Reply #1 - May 03, 2012, 01:53 PM

    Well colour me not surprised...
  • Re: Sam Harris... In defense of Profiling...
     Reply #2 - May 03, 2012, 01:56 PM

    Well colour me not surprised...

    Yep. He also supports torture.

    19:46   <zizo>: hugs could pimp u into sex

    Quote from: yeezevee
    well I am neither ex-Muslim nor absolute 100% Non-Muslim.. I am fucking Zebra

  • Re: Sam Harris... In defense of Profiling...
     Reply #3 - May 03, 2012, 02:10 PM

    oh sammy...
     
    http://www.samharris.org/blog/item/in-defense-of-profiling


    Quote
    "We should profile Muslims, or anyone who looks like he or she could conceivably be Muslim, and we should be honest about it. And, again, I wouldn’t put someone who looks like me entirely outside the bull’s-eye (after all, what would Adam Gadahn look like if he cleaned himself up?) But there are people who do not stand a chance of being jihadists, and TSA screeners can know this at a glance. [/i] "

     


    Clearly .. A picture like this one is appalling



    And many of these people at Airport over do things. But what Mr. Sam Harris wrote there is WRONG., And I am willing to educate him on that and I will.. ., In fact the following examples proves that he is wrong..

    He must note fellows like   Richard Reid was British. Germaine Lindsay  are not  young Arab males with LONG BEARDS. He must realize, ISLAM IS NOT RACE.,  And he must note millions of Flight travelers with Muslim name is nothing to do with Islamic  Baboons..

    He must realize

       That 32-year-old Irish pregnant woman who was try board that  El Al flight from London to Tel Aviv  in 1986, on whom security agents discovered an explosive device hidden in the false bottom of her bag is nothing to with her but her boy friend    the father of her unborn child hidden that  bomb.
     
      That  Korean Air flight from Baghdad to Thailand   that exploded In 1987 killing all on board has been traced to a  a 70-year-old man and a 25-year-old woman who posed as   father and daughter and brought a bomb aboard

        In 1999, men dressed as businessmen (and one dressed as a Catholic priest) turned out to be terrorist hijackers, who forced an Avianca flight to divert to an airstrip in Colombia, where some passengers were held as hostages for more than a year-and-half.

     Bali terrorists were Indonesian don't look like Middle Eastern or Pakistani Males., and  The Chechnyan terrorists who downed the Russian planes were good looking white women  and  That  Timothy McVeigh and the Unibomber were Americans.  And the guys whop killed That Indian Prime minister   Mr. Gandhi were Tamil hindus...

    So Sam Harris is wrong there..

    Do not let silence become your legacy.. Question everything   
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim
     
  • Re: Sam Harris... In defense of Profiling...
     Reply #4 - May 03, 2012, 02:10 PM

    like dawkins as well the guy makes me yawn

    ''we are morally and philisophically in the best position to win the league'' - Arsene Wenger
  • Re: Sam Harris... In defense of Profiling...
     Reply #5 - May 03, 2012, 02:39 PM

    I suspect that there are elements that everyone can agree on that are half way between the current situation and Harris'.
    The big problem with Harris' position is that it would antagonise a bunch of innocent people and would single them out as "different".
    Nevertheless, I believe most studies show that crime for example is mostly committed by males between the age of 15-40. I suspect the same applies to terrorists - though I've read a little on the psychology of female suicide bombers as well.
    There should be no need to check up on elderly or kids.
  • Re: Sam Harris... In defense of Profiling...
     Reply #6 - May 03, 2012, 02:53 PM

    As a security matter, I don't think general profiling works in a diverse country like the US.  By that I mean Muslims with a beard or something like that.    The terrorists will simply find people who don't fit the profile.

    But I don't see anything wrong with profiling in general.
    If it actually produced results, I see nothing wrong with it.

    Countries could use profiling for immigration for example.  If people from country X integrate well on average and prosper... while people from country Y don't or commit crimes... I think it's proper for the government to have a  policy encouraging immigration from country X and limiting that from country Y.



  • Re: Sam Harris... In defense of Profiling...
     Reply #7 - May 03, 2012, 03:11 PM

    I prefer Spencer over Harris (and I don't like Spencer that much)

    "That it is indeed the speech of an illustrious messenger" (The Koran 69:40)
  • Re: Sam Harris... In defense of Profiling...
     Reply #8 - May 03, 2012, 03:18 PM

    Sam Harris got some shitty opinions. I recommend PZ Myers reply to him: http://freethoughtblogs.com/pharyngula/2012/04/30/no-racial-profiling-please/

    "Beauty is truth, truth beauty," - that is all
            Ye know on earth, and all ye need to know.

    - John Keats
  • Re: Sam Harris... In defense of Profiling...
     Reply #9 - May 03, 2012, 03:20 PM

     If people from country X integrate well on average and prosper... while people from country Y don't or commit crimes... I think it's proper for the government to have a  policy encouraging immigration from country X and limiting that from country Y.

    Japan do this and make no bones about it.


    I'm hoping that when I apply for residency I'll be an X not a Y, but I'm taking nothing for granted.
  • Re: Sam Harris... In defense of Profiling...
     Reply #10 - May 03, 2012, 03:34 PM

    aww.. David you're an A in my book!.. good luck even though i'm sure you won't need it..

    i must have really missed something, because sam harris took me by surprise with this one...
    Sam Harris got some shitty opinions. I recommend PZ Myers reply to him: http://freethoughtblogs.com/pharyngula/2012/04/30/no-racial-profiling-please/

     thanks Al-Ma'arri .. great response by PZ Myers
  • Re: Sam Harris... In defense of Profiling...
     Reply #11 - May 03, 2012, 04:09 PM



    So there's been Pakistani, Arab, African, Jamaican and mixed-race jehadis. There will be white European jehadis, convert Chinese jehadis, and eventually even Inuit and Maori jehadis.

    And then when thats done, they'll groom female jehadis.

    You profile a specific group and all of a sudden the jehadis know exactly how to circumvent the profiling by grooming terrorists from outside the profiled group. And your security system is useless.

    Security has to be focussed on intelligence and normal security checks at airports and flights and so on, not on a generalised policy of profiling, which would lead to laziness anyway. Why do the intelligence work if you can just tick quota boxes of profiles & act as if you're making things safer that way?



    "we can smell traitors and country haters"


    God is Love.
    Love is Blind. Stevie Wonder is blind. Therefore, Stevie Wonder is God.

  • Re: Sam Harris... In defense of Profiling...
     Reply #12 - May 03, 2012, 11:57 PM

    Yup. Harris is partly right, in that the way it is done now doesn't make sense either. However, his proposal isn't going to improve things.

    Devious, treacherous, murderous, neanderthal, sub-human of the West. bunny
  • Re: Sam Harris... In defense of Profiling...
     Reply #13 - May 04, 2012, 12:20 AM


    So there's been Pakistani, Arab, African, Jamaican and mixed-race jehadis. There will be white European jehadis, convert Chinese jehadis, and eventually even Inuit and Maori jehadis.

    And then when thats done, they'll groom female jehadis.

    You profile a specific group and all of a sudden the jehadis know exactly how to circumvent the profiling by grooming terrorists from outside the profiled group. And your security system is useless.

    Security has to be focussed on intelligence and normal security checks at airports and flights and so on, not on a generalised policy of profiling, which would lead to laziness anyway. Why do the intelligence work if you can just tick quota boxes of profiles & act as if you're making things safer that way?




    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adam_Yahiye_Gadahn

    This guy is a spokesman for Al Qaida.  Sam Harris your argument is invalid.

    Personally I like this response. 

    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/chris-stedman/sam-harris-racial-profiling_b_1472360.html

    The problem I have with Sam Harris's article is that anyone with a brain would have figured out the flaws in Sam Harris's article by the time they themselves got done writing it.  For being a scientist of the brain, Sam Harris is pretty dumb. 

    So once again I'm left with the classic Irish man's dilemma, do I eat the potato or do I let it ferment so I can drink it later?
    My political philosophy below
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bwGat4i8pJI&feature=g-vrec
    Just kidding, here are some true heros
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dBTgvK6LQqA
  • Re: Sam Harris... In defense of Profiling...
     Reply #14 - May 04, 2012, 12:23 AM

    Sam Harris' idea won't work, for the reasons already mentioned.  But did he really call for racial profiling?  He puts himself in the group that should be profiled so what race is he picking on?  The male race?

    "Befriend them not, Oh murtads, and give them neither parrot nor bunny."  - happymurtad's advice on trolls.
  • Re: Sam Harris... In defense of Profiling...
     Reply #15 - May 04, 2012, 12:33 AM

    He's so transparent that his attempts to obfuscate are way to transparent. He's talking about profiling Muslims full stop.  When he get's called out on that and retreats to "behavior profiling"but  how is that different that what authorities are already doing? It's not! So why advocate anything different? The answer is obvious.  Because Sam Harris wants to profile Muslims but got called out on being a bigot so he retreated to a position that's already the status quo while trying to sound like he has a new and original idea. 

    So once again I'm left with the classic Irish man's dilemma, do I eat the potato or do I let it ferment so I can drink it later?
    My political philosophy below
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bwGat4i8pJI&feature=g-vrec
    Just kidding, here are some true heros
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dBTgvK6LQqA
  • Re: Sam Harris... In defense of Profiling...
     Reply #16 - May 04, 2012, 12:38 AM

    I dunno, he says he should be profiled in the original article.  I think he's just waffling really.  I don't rate his opinion much anyway since I heard he supported torture, I think he's just Fox News' pet atheist.

    "Befriend them not, Oh murtads, and give them neither parrot nor bunny."  - happymurtad's advice on trolls.
  • Re: Sam Harris... In defense of Profiling...
     Reply #17 - May 04, 2012, 01:14 AM

    He says he wouldn't mind being profiled, but saying you won't mind being profiled isn't the same as actually being profiled like millions of Muslims actually are.  If we are to go on the actual profile of a Muslim terrorist than he should be profiled as most violent Muslim extremists are Western educated in the sciences.  In this case I don't think Sam Harris is an express racist or actual Islamophobe in the true meaning of the word, but I think he's got caught up in the false data and hysteria of anti Muslim sentiment.  This isn't the first time he's advocated anti liberal sentiments towards Muslims.  I get the sense from him that he isn't using Western liberal ideas as a trans cultural idea of rights but in the same vein of Muslim Fundamentalists in that he believes that he and "the West" have the "true" way so he uses enlightenment values not as a way of ensuring rights for all, but as an another token in the tribalistic anti liberal sentiment that says that Muslims aren't worthy of enlightenment rights so they should be profiled.  

    If he isn't advocating this, but advocating "behavior profiling" then he's really advocating the status quo because the security forces already keep track of young men and women who go to Pakistan or Yemen for a few weeks or months for a "wedding" or "Islamic training" get flagged anyways.  So why put forth an argument in the first place?  

    So once again I'm left with the classic Irish man's dilemma, do I eat the potato or do I let it ferment so I can drink it later?
    My political philosophy below
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bwGat4i8pJI&feature=g-vrec
    Just kidding, here are some true heros
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dBTgvK6LQqA
  • Re: Sam Harris... In defense of Profiling...
     Reply #18 - May 04, 2012, 01:38 AM


    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gUW7aX8l8-g


    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ithwFvPFP_w


    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eeFhehcUPBc


    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dGADl8vkOj8

    Do not let silence become your legacy.. Question everything   
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim
     
  • Re: Sam Harris... In defense of Profiling...
     Reply #19 - May 04, 2012, 01:48 AM

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ly-lioHOZlc

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OPQVhdC328c

    Do not let silence become your legacy.. Question everything   
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim
     
  • Re: Sam Harris... In defense of Profiling...
     Reply #20 - May 04, 2012, 01:52 AM

    aww.. David you're an A in my book!..

  • Re: Sam Harris... In defense of Profiling...
     Reply #21 - May 05, 2012, 05:10 AM

    I don't get it with this guy. Not read any of his books (and don't plan to) but I know a lot of people here seem fond him (or at least have seemed). Every time I hear something from him though he sounds like a bit of a tard. I'd quite like to know what positive things he's done...

    like dawkins as well the guy makes me yawn


    What you got against dawkins, brown man? -_-
  • Re: Sam Harris... In defense of Profiling...
     Reply #22 - May 05, 2012, 05:13 AM

    It's an unfortunate opinion to have but then it is just a blog piece - it's not as if he has to qualify his opinion on a blog.

    At evening, casual flocks of pigeons make
    Ambiguous undulations as they sink,
    Downward to darkness, on extended wings. - Stevens
  • Re: Sam Harris... In defense of Profiling...
     Reply #23 - May 05, 2012, 05:35 AM

    Quote
    We should profile Muslims, or anyone who looks like he or she could conceivably be Muslim, and we should be honest about it.


     Cheesy This bit sounds hilariously stupid the way he's put it (not giving any more incentive to read something he's written...). 'Cos that would be like, everybody everywhere, like...
  • Re: Sam Harris... In defense of Profiling...
     Reply #24 - May 05, 2012, 05:56 AM

    I remember hearing from "good" sources that it is permitted for a man to shave his beard and for a woman to take off her niqab/and or hijab and even feigning being non-muslim (such as with drinking alcohol) when leading up to and attempting a terrorist attack. Think sheikh Abdul Azzam or what's ever his name was, glazed over it briefly in his book Join the Caravan  Huh? maybe?

    So profiling in these cases would be pointless anyway.

  • Re: Sam Harris... In defense of Profiling...
     Reply #25 - May 05, 2012, 11:55 AM

    Da_Dude:

    That is exactly the point. Jihadis follow the hadith where Muhammad said "War is deceit". I think Awlaki have said the same also?

    "Beauty is truth, truth beauty," - that is all
            Ye know on earth, and all ye need to know.

    - John Keats
  • Re: Sam Harris... In defense of Profiling...
     Reply #26 - May 10, 2012, 11:28 PM

    Maryam Nazamie's response...
    http://freethoughtblogs.com/maryamnamazie/2012/05/10/yes-to-profiling-of-muslims/
    *********

    The atheist author Sam Harris says:
     

    We should profile Muslims, or anyone who looks like he or she could conceivably be Muslim, and we should be honest about it. And, again, I wouldn’t put someone who looks like me entirely outside the bull’s-eye… But there are people who do not stand a chance of being jihadists, and [airport] screeners can know this at a glance.
     
    In his addendum addressing the uproar, he says that those who ‘don’t see the link between Islam and suicidal terrorism’ might object to this but that it is a fact that ‘suicidal terrorism is overwhelmingly a Muslim phenomenon.’ He adds:
     

    To say that ethnicity, gender, age, nationality, dress, traveling companions, behavior in the terminal, and other outward appearances offer no indication of a person’s beliefs or terrorist potential is either quite crazy or totally dishonest. It is the charm of political correctness that it blends these sins against reasonableness so seamlessly…
     
    I suppose Sam Harris has a point – that is if you believe that one’s ethnicity, dress, gender and nationality (very different things from behaviour) can give some indication of one’s potential.
     
    If so, we might take him up on his suggestion and profile Christians in order to avert the real risks of far-Right extremism in Europe and the USA. Of course this is absurd because – in most instances – you can’t tell who is Christian, atheist, Sikh, Muslim, Hindu, animist, or humanist just by looking at them. And even if you do manage to herd all the Christians into one special screening area (maybe after an interview as this information is not on one’s passport) how can you assume that they (or Norwegians for that matter) are potential Breiviks or far-Right terrorists?
     
    You can’t.
     
    It’s the same with Muslims.
     
    Harris will find my example of profiling Christians incomparable because he will say that Islamic terrorism is a greater risk. Of course it is today but the first victims of Islamic terrorism – and for many decades and long before September 11 – are Muslims themselves or those deemed to be such. In any case, which threat is greater is irrelevant if we agree that profiling is an absurd and racist way to address far-Right political movements like Islamism.
     
    This is exactly what I keep banging on about when I speak of what can happen if you allow the far-Right to have hegemony on the debate on Islam, terrorism, and Sharia law because the post-modernist left and many liberals are too pathetic to stand for social justice, citizenship rights and equality.
     
    Sam Harris’ argument shows clearly how far-Right discourse has crept into the language and politics of some atheists and secularists.
     
    Like Harris, the far-Right conflates Islam, Muslims, terrorism and Islamism so as to make it seem as if they are all one and the same. And like them, he blames all Muslims for Islamic terrorism. Profiling can only be an acceptable response if one allocates collective blame.
     
    If you want to know more about the distinctions between Muslims and Islamists you can read my speech on the Islamic inquisition though I talk about this in many speeches, articles and blog entries but it’s basically the difference between Christians and far-Right extremists.
     
    As an aside, it’s interesting how the concept of profiling always and only comes up with regards to minorities. Harris says he doesn’t mean that non-whites alone must be profiled but now he is the one who is being totally dishonest.
  • Sam Harris... In defense of Profiling...
     Reply #27 - January 20, 2013, 01:09 PM

    I mean I didn't like me or my family being pulled to the side when I was a Muslim and I still don't like it, in the end of faith he makes an argument about that it is ok to attack Iran if they become nuclear armed which despite what your beliefs are it is moral contradiction to say I'm against using violence but then im ok with using the us military to kill people often civilians. So I mean his views on religion are great but I wouldn't say they come from his morals per say. On another note I think being generally anti war can aid our view that religion is evil. I think if people aren't getting bombed, people who radicals will have less excuse to attract youth and maybe people will leave more often. This isn't why I'm anti war but I'm looking at a possible benefit of being that way.

    Tell people that there's an invisible man in the sky who created the universe, and the vast majority will believe you.

    Tell them the paint is wet, and they have to touch it to be sure.
    - George Carlin
  • Sam Harris... In defense of Profiling...
     Reply #28 - January 20, 2013, 01:21 PM

    Anyone flown El Al here?

    When you are a Bear of Very Little Brain, and you Think of Things, you find sometimes that a Thing which seemed very Thingish inside you is quite different when it gets out into the open and has other people looking at it.


    A.A. Milne,

    "We cannot slaughter each other out of the human impasse"
  • Sam Harris... In defense of Profiling...
     Reply #29 - January 20, 2013, 01:28 PM

    Best response to Sam Harris:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TdnAaQ0n5-8

    Quote from: ZooBear 

    • Surah Al-Fil: In an epic game of Angry Birds, Allah uses birds (that drop pebbles) to destroy an army riding elephants whose intentions were to destroy the Kaaba. No one has beaten the high score.

  • 12 Next page « Previous thread | Next thread »