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Theme Changer

 Topic: polytheism / monotheism

 (Read 16786 times)
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  • polytheism / monotheism
     Reply #90 - October 20, 2012, 12:23 AM

    Look what up? I know this is not the case from Islam's point of view. As Iblis is a created being.

    "Allah does not want to stop Iblis (which means Allah is as evil as Iblis). Which one is true, you think?"

    This is not a good argument to forward. Why would this automatically mean Allah is as evil as Iblis? According Islam - he is the test. The whole point - he isn't stopped.


    The whole point is, Allah either CAN NOT or WILL NOT stop Iblis. Think about it, seriously. If you had the power to stop all evil in the world, you wouldn't do it? Allah is omnipotent, no? If he is omnipotent he CAN stop Iblis but he won't, which means he is evil like Iblis and wants evil to continue. Or Allah does not have the power to stop Iblis, which means he is not all-powerful.


    Yes - I know what all the terms mean.  


    Ok then let us know what you think all those terms mean. And how you make them fit into the false dichotomy of "belief vs non belief".

    "Blessed are they who can laugh at themselves, for they shall never cease to be amused."
  • polytheism / monotheism
     Reply #91 - October 20, 2012, 12:26 AM

    If it is a good argument - then you can illustrate why? Something, Which you repeatedly fail to do.


    You are being deliberately obtuse. My argument is sound and I've expounded it clearly. Its difficult to see how it could have been explained more explicitly or clearly. Go back and read it again.


    "we can smell traitors and country haters"


    God is Love.
    Love is Blind. Stevie Wonder is blind. Therefore, Stevie Wonder is God.

  • polytheism / monotheism
     Reply #92 - October 20, 2012, 12:26 AM

    Quote
    Amin, this discussion consists of you saying things, which I respond to, and then you deny saying the things you say, or reply by saying it ain't so, it ain't so, it just ain't so, without substantively saying why. I kind of think the cul-de-sac of engagement with a true believer has been reached. Its fruitful discussing these things and I know you won't change your mind over them off a discussion in one night.


    Ah . . .arrogant and patronizing! Isn't that what you were decrying earlier? Yet, seemingly, you practice what you don't preach.

    For example - you have no idea as to the extent of my knowledge - or er . . . how many forums I have been to - and why I visited this in the 1st place.
  • polytheism / monotheism
     Reply #93 - October 20, 2012, 12:28 AM

    I never looked at it like that before, but its staring us in the face!

    Almost like a form of Manichaeism

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Manichaeism




    Yeah Islam and Christianity are like football games where their followers refuse to admit the team their team is supposedly against is an actual football team too. Grin

    Muslims and Christians: "We're monotheists! We're monotheists!"
    Thinking people: "Why doesn't your god just get rid of the devil?"
    Muslims and Christians: "Cause he don't wanna! He want us to suffer! Cause he all-powerful and he love us!"
    Thinking people: "How can he make someone he loves want to suffer?"
    Muslims and Christians: "Cause he testing us to make sure we believe in him!"
    Thinking people: "Doesn't he already know how the tests will turn out cause he's y'know all-knowing and all-powerful?"
    Muslims and Christians: "Ummmm... why you hate God so much? Why you asking questions? WAH WAH WAH"

    "Blessed are they who can laugh at themselves, for they shall never cease to be amused."
  • polytheism / monotheism
     Reply #94 - October 20, 2012, 12:28 AM

    Quote
    Yep! It's built right into Christianity and Islam and they are the first to deny it, although they never can explain why their idea of an omnipotent god is impotent when it comes to his arch-rival.


    Simply re-asserting something won't make it true - or give your words any more merit.
  • polytheism / monotheism
     Reply #95 - October 20, 2012, 12:29 AM

     You're a blast, Amin Grin

    "we can smell traitors and country haters"


    God is Love.
    Love is Blind. Stevie Wonder is blind. Therefore, Stevie Wonder is God.

  • polytheism / monotheism
     Reply #96 - October 20, 2012, 12:30 AM

    Simply re-asserting something won't make it true - or give your words any more merit.


    I've given lots of logical reasoning and what I wrote makes perfect sense to me and to others.

    You simply saying "No it's not! No it's not!" does not a counter-argument make. Give reasons otherwise.... well otherwise, you don't know what you are talking about.

    "Blessed are they who can laugh at themselves, for they shall never cease to be amused."
  • polytheism / monotheism
     Reply #97 - October 20, 2012, 12:30 AM

    Quote
    Also - I can claim say something of Buddhism was from Allah - and we can argue till the end of Earth - but to an avail - as neither will have any conclusive proof.


    I doubt you can convince me that Buddhism is from Allah, I doubt you can convince any Buddhists of this. If you want to make a claim that Buddhism is from Allah then the burden of proof is on you, you are the one making the positive claim, not me.
     

    Quote
    Which discrepancies have you brought forward? None.


    Gabriel, circumcision, dogs, idolatry, hijab, etc.

    The only reasonable response you gave to any of these was the one about the Hijab, and for that you had to argue that Islam only mandates moderate dress code not Hijab, which is fine, but you did not identify any other cultures from other continents that also mandate moderate dress code.

    Quote
    Look you can whatever attitude you wish - the person's name was Mohammed.


    Well that is one of the many anglicized ways of saying his name, but what is the reason for even putting 2 ms there? There are only 4 letters in Arabic, so why make it so long? "Mo" is short hand and less time consuming. If you prefer I can use Mhmd.


    Quote
    Sorry - but that is not true - as you say "think" - that implies you don't either. Ancient cultures before Islam that are non-semitic did used to practice circumcision - but {!Important} - I do not know - and neither can you - whether that was down to Allah or not. hence I said plainly - No. Rather than making things up.


    Which ancient, non Semitic cultures practiced circumcision? Obviously no knowledge is absolute, you can never be 100% certain of anything, but there is always a body of evidence that lends weight to one theory over another. Currently there is no evidence for Islam outside of any area that was in contact with it. Therefore we can "think" that it is highly unlikely that a Prophet was sent to any other people with the message of Islam.

    Now you could say that the people in other continents simply ignored the true Prophets and that is why we have no knowledge of them. But that is a claim you are making without any evidence to support it. You are simply making up stories. Besides we already know that the same thing happened to Mhmd anyway. Many did not listen to him. So what did God do? He sent down an army of angels to make sure Mhmd won the Battle of Badr and defeated his enemies. So according to Islamic history, when the people don't heed the message then God intervenes to insure that the Muslims win. So why did God never intervene on any other continents to insure the Muslims won?

    Is it not somewhat suspicious that God only intervened to insure the true religion won out in the areas of the Middle East? Surely a more plausible explanation is that these peoples (Jews, Christians, and Muslims) share the same religious traditions because they were in contact with each other and so they heard the same fairy tales, rather than that they all Got the same message independently from God?

    Quote
    Those ancient communities too were sent messengers. That is according to Islam. But how do you know - that they don't have different names for them? For example - Judaism, Aramaic and Arabic are sister langauges - hence the name Gabriel - is recognizable.  


    According to your religion and the other Abrahamic faiths, the name Gabriel/Jbril comes from God and Gabriel himself not from the people of the area.

    "The angel answered, "I am Gabriel. I stand in the presence of God, and I have been sent to speak to you and to tell you this good news." Luke 1:19

    "Whoever is an enemy to Allah and His angels and His messengers and Gabriel and Michael - then indeed, Allah is an enemy to the disbelievers." Baqarah 98

    Quote
    Ah? How do you know? Just because similarities exist . . . that still isn't definitive proof - one way or the other.


    Because for a historical account to be believable, there has to be a source for the information. Either a discovery of hard evidence such as an inscription that can be scientifically dated to the time when these prophets were sent, or a written account that is contemporary to, or near contemporary to, when these events occurred. And there are ways to determine with a reasonable level of certainty whether those written accounts are genuinely from that time period, or fakes created later. Based on the style of the writing, the words and language used, etc.

    Simply stating that Sufis from the late Medieval Era believe these prophets went to India is not a source, unless they themselves are basing that information on verifiable sources like the ones I just described. Otherwise they are just making stuff up 1,000s of years after these events supposedly occurred.
  • polytheism / monotheism
     Reply #98 - October 20, 2012, 12:41 AM

    Quote
    The whole point is, Allah either CAN NOT or WILL NOT stop Iblis. Think about it, seriously. If you had the power to stop all evil in the world, you wouldn't do it? Allah is omnipotent, no? If he is omnipotent he CAN stop Iblis but he won't, which means he is evil like Iblis and wants evil to continue. Or Allah does not have the power to stop Iblis, which means he is not all-powerful.


    Or he created and allows Iblis to be there for a purpose - and this is the stance of Islam. Also - Iblis is not considered to be the source of all evil..  

    - - -

    Ok then let us know what you think all those terms mean. And how you make them fit into the false dichotomy of "belief vs non belief".

    polytheism - multiple gods

    pantheism - all-encompassing God - non-personal,

    panentheism - god to be the force behind Universe - somewhat similar to panentheism - but God and universe aren't synonymous,

    agnosticism - cannot make mind up either way conclusively ,

    deism - reason and the universe are enough to believe in god - reveled text like Quran isn't necessary,

    atheism - no god.

    - - -

    [Believe in God] - polytheism, deism, both pans

    [Don't Believe in God] Atheism, Agnostic [only because as far I have come across most claim to be more atheist leaning.]

  • polytheism / monotheism
     Reply #99 - October 20, 2012, 12:43 AM

    Quote
    You are being deliberately obtuse. My argument is sound and I've expounded it clearly. Its difficult to see how it could have been explained more explicitly or clearly. Go back and read it again.


    To you - again this is your claim . . . if you believed this so strongly - you would have re-phrased or repeated it. And even you know - how much you rely on mere statements. . .  such attempts at demonising don't make a difference.
  • polytheism / monotheism
     Reply #100 - October 20, 2012, 12:46 AM

    Quote
    To you - again this is your claim . . . if you believed this so strongly - you would have re-phrased or repeated it. And even you know - how much you rely on mere statements. . .  such attempts at demonising don't make a difference.


    There is no demonising in anything I said.

    Where there is demonising is in the beliefs you express that human beings belong to a category deserving of pain, torture, violence and sadism simply beacause they do not submit to the deity and prophet you submit to.

    That is a LITERAL example of demonisation.

    Pointing that out is not demonisation.


    "we can smell traitors and country haters"


    God is Love.
    Love is Blind. Stevie Wonder is blind. Therefore, Stevie Wonder is God.

  • polytheism / monotheism
     Reply #101 - October 20, 2012, 12:47 AM

    99% of human civilizations that we know of were Polytheistic and practiced Idolatry. The Jewish civilization is the only civilization we know of that was Monotheistic, and even that seems to have started off as a Polytheistic religion.

    And yet Muslims claim that all peoples received prophets telling them about the one true God. That means that either God's message system is seriously screwed up or that Monotheism is simply a human created belief system.
  • polytheism / monotheism
     Reply #102 - October 20, 2012, 12:48 AM

    I've given lots of logical reasoning and what I wrote makes perfect sense to me and to others.

    You simply saying "No it's not! No it's not!" does not a counter-argument make. Give reasons otherwise.... well otherwise, you don't know what you are talking about.


    "to others" . . .which others?

    "Yep! It's built right into Christianity and Islam and they are the first to deny it, although they never can explain why their idea of an omnipotent god is impotent when it comes to his arch-rival."

    Claiming this - which you said look it up - I asked - look what up? . . .  you did not answer - nor gave any proofs. Your logical proofs do not equal - that it is a claim from Islam - which I need to look up.

    Your 'logical proofs' are just that . . . yours.

    - - -

    Saying just because God doesn't stop Satan - doesn't equal to Either Allah cannot stop or they are both equal. Islam claims - Satan will not be stopped until the day of judgement. And tho choice of doing evil is down the the individual.
  • polytheism / monotheism
     Reply #103 - October 20, 2012, 12:50 AM

    Or he created and allows Iblis to be there for a purpose - and this is the stance of Islam. Also - Iblis is not considered to be the source of all evil..  


    So what is the "source of evil" according to you?

    If he creates and allows evil, then such a god is also evil.


    polytheism - multiple gods

    pantheism - all-encompassing God - non-personal,

    panentheism - god to be the force behind Universe - somewhat similar to panentheism - but God and universe aren't synonymous,

    agnosticism - cannot make mind up either way conclusively ,

    deism - reason and the universe are enough to believe in god - reveled text like Quran isn't necessary,


    None of the above are ideas of god that are like Allah. Hence your initial false dichotomy is wrong because you are basing the entire idea of "god" as ONLY possibly meaning "Allah". The polytheists believe in many gods. Pantheism is about believing that the Universe itself is divine (no god outside of universe). Agnosticism and Deism also do not work with the concept of "Allah" which is a vengeful, jealous, human-like personal god.

    atheism - no god.


    Wrong again. Atheism is not belief in no god, but in the non-belief of god or gods. I.e. Atheism does not posit that there are no gods, it is about saying "when there is proof, we'll see".

    - - -

    [Believe in God] - polytheism, deism, both pans


    Again, incorrect, because the god or gods in these are not the same. Hence you can not divide these into 1 group. Most pantheists are also atheists or agnostic.

    [Don't Believe in God] Atheism, Agnostic [only because as far I have come across most claim to be more atheist leaning.]


    Most agnostics are in between belief and non-belief and also in different contexts, so e.g. many logical people know that the abrahamic sky-daddy is impossible. But they may not rule out other ideas of transcendent or immanent realities.

    Point again is, when you divide the world into "belief vs non-belief", it is very very naive and uneducated.

    "Blessed are they who can laugh at themselves, for they shall never cease to be amused."
  • polytheism / monotheism
     Reply #104 - October 20, 2012, 12:50 AM

    If Satan is part of Allah's plan then he actually serves Allah....so Allah is Satanic.

    "we can smell traitors and country haters"


    God is Love.
    Love is Blind. Stevie Wonder is blind. Therefore, Stevie Wonder is God.

  • polytheism / monotheism
     Reply #105 - October 20, 2012, 12:52 AM

    "to others" . . .which others?

    "Yep! It's built right into Christianity and Islam and they are the first to deny it, although they never can explain why their idea of an omnipotent god is impotent when it comes to his arch-rival."

    Claiming this - which you said look it up - I asked - look what up? . . .  you did not answer - nor gave any proofs. Your logical proofs do not equal - that it is a claim from Islam - which I need to look up.

    Your 'logical proofs' are just that . . . yours.


    Nope. It makes sense; you just are afraid of going where this line of questioning leads. Don't worry, we were all where you are now Wink We got over our fears of really questioning Islamic dogma, if you are brave, you will too.

    Saying just because God doesn't stop Satan - doesn't equal to Either Allah cannot stop or they are both equal. Islam claims - Satan will not be stopped until the day of judgement. And tho choice of doing evil is down the the individual.


    I'll bet you can not answer the question WHY? Why would a loving god do all this? Being all powerful and all knowing, why would he play such charades with his creations? He knows what they'll do, so why do the testing?

    "Blessed are they who can laugh at themselves, for they shall never cease to be amused."
  • polytheism / monotheism
     Reply #106 - October 20, 2012, 12:58 AM

    allat - I've heard your question answered by Muslims in this way:

    (1) Ours is not to question why

    (2) It is what it is

    (3) Allah knows best

    (4) Who said Allah loves us?

    (5) Its all a test so that we can pass into heaven having deserved to by avoiding the evils that Allah set up like a booby trap with Satan

    I like the honesty of (4) - because its so stark and plain.


    "we can smell traitors and country haters"


    God is Love.
    Love is Blind. Stevie Wonder is blind. Therefore, Stevie Wonder is God.

  • polytheism / monotheism
     Reply #107 - October 20, 2012, 01:00 AM

    You're right billy, that is exactly what Muslims will say.

    I just want them to admit they worship an idea that is either false or inherently evil. That is, I think, a good starting point, a real measure of one's conscience. A good human being can not continue to follow a belief system based on evil. Muslims who dare not question things to this extent know this and are afraid of having to confront this.

    "Blessed are they who can laugh at themselves, for they shall never cease to be amused."
  • polytheism / monotheism
     Reply #108 - October 20, 2012, 01:01 AM

    99% of human civilizations that we know of were Polytheistic and practiced Idolatry. The Jewish civilization is the only civilization we know of that was Monotheistic, and even that seems to have started off as a Polytheistic religion.

    And yet Muslims claim that all peoples received prophets telling them about the one true God. That means that either God's message system is seriously screwed up or that Monotheism is simply a human created belief system.


    You made the number 99% up.

    " The Jewish civilization is the only civilization we know of that was Monotheistic, and even that seems to have started off as a Polytheistic religion."

    No it isn't.

    - - -

    Early Hellenistic - before Judaism were monotheistic. Dionysus as practiced in Cyprus around 4bc.  Mitharism, Hypsistarians, Zoroastrians, Many form of Hinduism - were monotheists. American Indians - belief in the great creator. Henotheism - some form were Mono. Henotheism - but they accepted other Gods - but devoted just to one. Then there are many form of mono - in China before Confucianism and Taoism.  
  • polytheism / monotheism
     Reply #109 - October 20, 2012, 01:04 AM

    Quote
    Early Hellenistic - before Judaism were monotheistic


    Amin, how can you make such outrageously incorrect claims like this? Its not even lying, its just ridiculous. A lie is something you might realistically expect to get away with. How do you think you can say something like this and expect to be taken seriously?

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hellenistic_religion


    "we can smell traitors and country haters"


    God is Love.
    Love is Blind. Stevie Wonder is blind. Therefore, Stevie Wonder is God.

  • polytheism / monotheism
     Reply #110 - October 20, 2012, 01:05 AM

    Early Hellenistic - before Judaism were monotheistic. Dionysus as practiced in Cyprus around 4bc.  Mitharism, Hypsistarians, Zoroastrians, Many form of Hinduism - were monotheists. American Indians - belief in the great creator. Henotheism - some form were Mono. Henotheism - but they accepted other Gods - but devoted just to one. Then there are many form of mono - in China before Confucianism and Taoism.  


    Everything in this paragraph is factually incorrect. Seriously, where are you getting this from? Every single one of those cultures practiced polytheism. Henotheism is NOT monotheism.

    "Blessed are they who can laugh at themselves, for they shall never cease to be amused."
  • polytheism / monotheism
     Reply #111 - October 20, 2012, 01:11 AM


    Seriously, the intellectual catastrophe of trying to re-write history and facts and philosophy in order to shoe-horn it into the grand narrative that leads to Islam being the final religion that they all lead up to, and Muhammad being the 'seal of all prophets'

    This is what a belief in the finality and supremacy of Islam leads to - this kind of intellectual train wreck.

    "we can smell traitors and country haters"


    God is Love.
    Love is Blind. Stevie Wonder is blind. Therefore, Stevie Wonder is God.

  • polytheism / monotheism
     Reply #112 - October 20, 2012, 01:12 AM

    Islam is like narcissism to the umpteenth degree. The entire universe revolves around Mohammed, literally, according to Islam. What a bunch of bollocks. Grin

    "Blessed are they who can laugh at themselves, for they shall never cease to be amused."
  • polytheism / monotheism
     Reply #113 - October 20, 2012, 01:14 AM

    You made the number 99% up.

    " The Jewish civilization is the only civilization we know of that was Monotheistic, and even that seems to have started off as a Polytheistic religion."

    No it isn't.

    - - -

    Early Hellenistic - before Judaism were monotheistic. Dionysus as practiced in Cyprus around 4bc.  Mitharism, Hypsistarians, Zoroastrians, Many form of Hinduism - were monotheists. American Indians - belief in the great creator. Henotheism - some form were Mono. Henotheism - but they accepted other Gods - but devoted just to one. Then there are many form of mono - in China before Confucianism and Taoism.  


    Lol, you have made some really outlandish claims. None of those religions that you mentioned were monotheistic. I think you mean to say "Hellenic" rather than "Hellenistic" which means something else in English. What is 4bc?

    I have to go now, so we can discuss more later, in the meantime please provide some sources for these ancient "monotheistic" religions
  • polytheism / monotheism
     Reply #114 - October 20, 2012, 01:16 AM

    Quote
    I doubt you can convince me that Buddhism is from Allah, I doubt you can convince any Buddhists of this. If you want to make a claim that Buddhism is from Allah then the burden of proof is on you, you are the one making the positive claim, not me.


    Sorry - but did you bother to read what i said - or were too busy preparing an answer?

    "Also - I can claim say something of Buddhism was from Allah - and we can argue till the end of Earth - but to an avail - as neither will have any conclusive proof."

    "we can argue till the end of Earth" - already implied what you stated.

    "as neither will have any conclusive proof." - and i acknowledge the question of proof too.

    - - -

    Quote
    Gabriel, circumcision, dogs, idolatry, hijab, etc.

    The only reasonable response you gave to any of these was the one about the Hijab, and for that you had to argue that Islam only mandates moderate dress code not Hijab, which is fine, but you did not identify any other cultures from other continents that also mandate moderate dress code.


    Hang on - your whole stance on dogs is/was wrong. I pointed that out - why the rough shod over this?

    Circumcision was practiced outside of Hebrew faiths.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_male_circumcision#Circumcision_in_the_Ancient_world

    And Gabriel?

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Angels

    Concept of Angels - predates Islam and the like.

    - - - -

    Quote
    Well that is one of the many anglicized ways of saying his name, but what is the reason for even putting 2 ms there? There are only 4 letters in Arabic, so why make it so long? "Mo" is short hand and less time consuming. If you prefer I can use Mhmd.


    But if you can write so much . . . why not go the whole 'hog'?

    - - -

     "According to your religion and the other Abrahamic faiths, the name Gabriel/Jbril comes from God and Gabriel himself not from the people of the area. "

    Also that each message was sent in that tongue. Hence Gabriel - is Arabized for Arabs as Jibrael . . . original word is different. Aramaic word too is different.

    - - -

    Quote
    Because for a historical account to be believable, there has to be a source for the information. Either a discovery of hard evidence such as an inscription that can be scientifically dated to the time when these prophets were sent, or a written account that is contemporary to, or near contemporary to, when these events occurred. And there are ways to determine with a reasonable level of certainty whether those written accounts are genuinely from that time period, or fakes created later. Based on the style of the writing, the words and language used, etc.


    But what you seem to be missing is . . . there are other monotheistic faiths . . . and historical evidence - but that doesn't make them necessarily from Allah.

  • polytheism / monotheism
     Reply #115 - October 20, 2012, 01:18 AM

    Islam is like narcissism to the umpteenth degree. The entire universe revolves around Mohammed, literally, according to Islam. What a bunch of bollocks. Grin


    Exactly! It doesn't even revolve around 'Islam' or 'Allah'......it revolves around this one man called Muhammad! Everything has to be made to fit into this narrative to substantiate his centrality to everything! Everything before led up to him, everything else needs to be brought back to him, nothing has any legitimacy or existence outside of how it can be fitted into 'justifying' the claims made for Muhammad - and you can just lie and say what you want in order to do so!

    Its so embarassing to watch!


    "we can smell traitors and country haters"


    God is Love.
    Love is Blind. Stevie Wonder is blind. Therefore, Stevie Wonder is God.

  • polytheism / monotheism
     Reply #116 - October 20, 2012, 01:20 AM

    Lol, you have made some really outlandish claims. None of those religions that you mentioned were monotheistic. I think you mean to say "Hellenic" rather than "Hellenistic" which means something else in English. What is 4bc?

    I have to go now, so we can discuss more later, in the meantime please provide some sources for these ancient "monotheistic" religions. And I meant Hellenistic - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hellenistic_religion


    According to your own logic - simply "lol" and saying I have made rubbish up is no proof - these WERE forms of Monotheism. Proof?
  • polytheism / monotheism
     Reply #117 - October 20, 2012, 01:22 AM

    Exactly! It doesn't even revolve around 'Islam' or 'Allah'......it revolves around this one man called Muhammad! Everything has to be made to fit into this narrative to substantiate his centrality to everything! Everything before led up to him, everything else needs to be brought back to him, nothing has any legitimacy or existence outside of how it can be fitted into 'justifying' the claims made for Muhammad - and you can just lie and say what you want in order to do so!

    Its so embarassing to watch!


    Muslims basically have become idolators of Mohammed. That is why you can write the name of Allah with dog feces on a beer batter-roasted ham and nobody will care. But make so much as a peep about Mo's sundry adventures with slave girls or his ride on a flying horse or his warlord-like behaviour, and Muslims will go berserk. Hence, they may think they're worshipping Allah, but it's clear who really gets under their skin.

    "Blessed are they who can laugh at themselves, for they shall never cease to be amused."
  • polytheism / monotheism
     Reply #118 - October 20, 2012, 01:23 AM

    Exactly! It doesn't even revolve around 'Islam' or 'Allah'......it revolves around this one man called Muhammad! Everything has to be made to fit into this narrative to substantiate his centrality to everything! Everything before led up to him, everything else needs to be brought back to him, nothing has any legitimacy or existence outside of how it can be fitted into 'justifying' the claims made for Muhammad - and you can just lie and say what you want in order to do so!

    Its so embarassing to watch!




    And what is then even more embarrassing for you not to able to articulate this . . . er supposed embarrassment sufficiently - other than to keep adding "adjectives" to your statements. . . and implying them to be great arguments.
  • polytheism / monotheism
     Reply #119 - October 20, 2012, 01:24 AM

    billy I think someone has a real crush on you Wink

    "Blessed are they who can laugh at themselves, for they shall never cease to be amused."
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