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Theme Changer

 Topic: Inter faith Marriage OK

 (Read 3742 times)
  • 1« Previous thread | Next thread »
  • Inter faith Marriage OK
     OP - December 07, 2012, 08:31 AM
    Quote
    Christian pastors and Muslim imams have come together to draw up guidelines detailing advice on how to deal with inter-faith marriages.

    Although marrying between faiths is entirely legal in Britain, couples often face resistance and hostility, both from family members and religious leaders. Occasionally both Muslims and Christians feel pressure to convert to another's faith in order to avoid fallouts and ostracism.

    The new guidelines by the Christian-Muslim forum reinforce the need for religious leaders to accept inter-faith marriages and warn that no one should ever feel forced to convert. The publication of the document, which will receive a high-profile launch at Westminster Abbey today, is significant because those supporting it include imams from the more orthodox Islamic schools of thought and evangelical Christians.


    http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/how-christians-and-muslims-can-marry--the-official-guide-8348954.html
    When you are a Bear of Very Little Brain, and you Think of Things, you find sometimes that a Thing which seemed very Thingish inside you is quite different when it gets out into the open and has other people looking at it.


    A.A. Milne,

    "We cannot slaughter each other out of the human impasse"
  • Inter faith Marriage OK
     Reply #1 - December 07, 2012, 09:29 AM
    Good stuff
  • Inter faith Marriage OK
     Reply #2 - December 07, 2012, 10:44 AM
    I found the article quite funny really. 

    As far as I am concerned and aware, Islam is specific, muslim woman can not marry outside of the faith at all.  Unless he converts and only after he converts.  Yet they use in the story an example of a muslim woman and catholic man.  Err how is this actually islam?  Grin

    Not that I am against reinterpretation, and attempts to move with the times but sometimes I just find it all so pathetic.
    Inhale the good shit, exhale the bullshit.
  • Inter faith Marriage OK
     Reply #3 - December 07, 2012, 11:24 AM
    ^This. It's nice to "interpret" (or altogether ignore) dogma when it comes to things like interfaith marriage but it's so contrary to Islam (even the most liberal strands) that it's slightly cringe-worthy.
  • Inter faith Marriage OK
     Reply #4 - December 07, 2012, 11:33 AM
    Quote
    Although marrying between faiths is entirely legal in Britain, couples often face resistance and hostility, both from family members and religious leaders. Occasionally both Muslims and Christians feel pressure to convert to another's faith in order to avoid fallouts and ostracism.


    Doesn't this suggest a degree of equivalency in 'pressure' and resistance and hostility between Muslims and non Muslims that is usually more weighted towards one side? Especially when it is a Muslim woman who is involved?

    Just wondering if only I noticed that.
    "we can smell traitors and country haters"


    Quote from: arX on May 01, 2011, 03:33 AM
    God is Love.
    Love is Blind. Stevie Wonder is blind. Therefore, Stevie Wonder is God.

  • Inter faith Marriage OK
     Reply #5 - December 07, 2012, 12:01 PM
    Quote
    Doesn't this suggest a degree of equivalency in 'pressure' and resistance and hostility between Muslims and non Muslims that is usually more weighted towards one side? Especially when it is a Muslim woman who is involved?
    Just wondering if only I noticed that.


    Nope. I noticed that too.
  • Inter faith Marriage OK
     Reply #6 - December 07, 2012, 12:25 PM
    I honestly don't think I could be with someone who differs so much to me on how they view the nature of the universe and the human condition. Friends, sure. But life partners? There'd be too much of a disconnect. 
    Too fucking busy, and vice versa.
  • Inter faith Marriage OK
     Reply #7 - December 07, 2012, 12:55 PM
    ^I completely agree; I would personally never want to be in such a relationship because of all the potential for drama and I don't think it's a a good idea in general for two people with radically different beliefs to marry but whatever floats your boat.
  • Inter faith Marriage OK
     Reply #8 - December 07, 2012, 01:01 PM
    Sometimes it depresses me that i cant be with someone just because we have different beliefs and outlooks on life.
    "I'm standing here like an asshole holding my Charles Dickens"

    "No theory,No ready made system,no book that has ever been written to save the world. i cleave to no system.."-Bakunin
  • Inter faith Marriage OK
     Reply #9 - December 07, 2012, 01:04 PM
    Isn't it for show, for family and community mostly?

    "we can smell traitors and country haters"


    Quote from: arX on May 01, 2011, 03:33 AM
    God is Love.
    Love is Blind. Stevie Wonder is blind. Therefore, Stevie Wonder is God.

  • Inter faith Marriage OK
     Reply #10 - December 07, 2012, 01:50 PM
    Intellectually dishonest? Sure, good for progress? Probably.

    I've known many muslim women who have married non-muslim men and stayed muslim, it's better to have some progress than none at all.
    "Nobody who lived through the '50s thought the '60s could've existed. So there's always hope."-Tuli Kupferberg

    What apple stores are like.....

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S8QmZWv-eBI
  • Inter faith Marriage OK
     Reply #11 - December 07, 2012, 01:53 PM
    Quote from: moi on December 07, 2012, 08:31 AM
    http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/how-christians-and-muslims-can-marry--the-official-guide-8348954.html

     Well until the end of 20th century "Islam played games with that subject" but now people are going to put breaks.

    On that Islamic interfaith marriage and the product of that matrimony "THE ZEBRAS",...    Only fools specially Pagan fools or  converted pagan fools ` don't understand that the Islamic  system is thoroughly constructed to expand the Mosques and dorms and Political Islam .  Unlike other faiths this aspect is very unique to Islam,  The rules are simple.  

    Muslim men  can marry a non-Muslim women or Muslim women ..1.2..3..4.... and produce more Muslims.  In  the case of Muslim women,  they usually cannot marry a non-Muslim men,  If it happens (the odds are heavily loaded against them) then  "He Must convert into Islam before the marriage"  and children must be brought up under Islam.  So  everything perfectly  designed to expand the Islamic Empire. Joining Islam is fine but  we know the rules   of leaving  Islam.  It is wonderful  and fine  to start a Muslim community in so-called non-Muslim lands and grow your numbers, but don’t try  that on so-called  Muslim lands.    You will have this..



    And that is  72 year old lady and that news is couple of days old  Read all about her

    Fools talk nonsense.  before you talk such things clean up the mess from silly books.. other wise get  rid of all them.  Any way they are filled with nonsense and some children stories..
    Do not let silence become your legacy.. Question everything   
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim     
  • Inter faith Marriage OK
     Reply #12 - December 07, 2012, 02:40 PM
    Quote from: BerberElla on December 07, 2012, 10:44 AM
    I found the article quite funny really. 

    As far as I am concerned and aware, Islam is specific, muslim woman can not marry outside of the faith at all.  Unless he converts and only after he converts.  Yet they use in the story an example of a muslim woman and catholic man.  Err how is this actually islam?  Grin

    Not that I am against reinterpretation, and attempts to move with the times but sometimes I just find it all so pathetic.


    That's how I always felt but I have quite recently discovered that there is a significant number of muslims (including men and scgholars) who do believe that muslim women can marry non muslim men. Dishonest? maybe, but it does show that the mainstream dogma in Islam is not as concrete as you would think it is and is being questioned.

    Also, I know someone who recently got married to a non muslim woman and the guy who performed it was a salafi. A couple of Sufi guys refused to do it before they found this guy said he would. The idea of the tolerant peace loving sufi, and the hardline, intolerant Salafi is not necessarily always true.
    Religion - The hot potato that looked delicious but ended up burning your mouth!

    Knock your head on the ground, don't be miserly in your prayers, listen to your Sidi Sheikh, Allahu Akbar! - Lounes Matoub
  • Inter faith Marriage OK
     Reply #13 - December 07, 2012, 07:57 PM
    Of course it's pathetic and contrary to tennets of their religions.

    What's next? Christian gay Steve and muslim gay Hameed exchanging vows in a ceremony where sufis and catholic nuns sing ''Hallelujah'' in one voice?
    Isn't it funny how cats can understand people without ever reading a single psychology book?
  • Inter faith Marriage OK
     Reply #14 - December 07, 2012, 09:23 PM
    Quote from: Al-Alethia on December 07, 2012, 11:24 AM
    ^This. It's nice to "interpret" (or altogether ignore) dogma when it comes to things like interfaith marriage but it's so contrary to Islam (even the most liberal strands) that it's slightly cringe-worthy.


    I posted this article in one muslim vs atheist group on FB and muslim guy commented :   A muslim man is allowed to marry non muslim woman provided that she'll convert to Islam later on .. not by force but by conviction ... So what's the problem here ?
    Isn't it funny how cats can understand people without ever reading a single psychology book?
  • Inter faith Marriage OK
     Reply #15 - December 08, 2012, 12:09 AM
    Quote from: Merry_Squirell on December 07, 2012, 07:57 PM
    What's next? Christian gay Steve and muslim gay Hameed exchanging vows in a ceremony where sufis and catholic nuns sing ''Hallelujah'' in one voice?

    I vote for Jew gay Moshe, Muslim gay Mohamed, Christian women Sarah Palin and Piggy the Pig ( piggy ) get married altogether in a Las Vegas natural scale reproduction of Meccah !
  • Inter faith Marriage OK
     Reply #16 - December 08, 2012, 03:00 AM
    Quote from: Merry_Squirell on December 07, 2012, 09:23 PM
    I posted this article in one muslim vs atheist group on FB and muslim guy commented :   A muslim man is allowed to marry non muslim woman provided that she'll convert to Islam later on .. not by force but by conviction ... So what's the problem here ?


    I meant the Catholic man/Muslim woman union described in the article; that is completely un-Islamic. Only Muslim men can marry Jewish and Christian women but Muslim women can only marry Muslim men. 
  • Inter faith Marriage OK
     Reply #17 - December 08, 2012, 03:06 AM
    Quote from: Al-Alethia on December 08, 2012, 03:00 AM
    I meant the Catholic man/Muslim woman union described in the article; that is completely un-Islamic. Only Muslim men can marry Jewish and Christian women but Muslim women can only marry Muslim men.

    It is true Idolators and infidels are out of question., those guys have no chance in Islam.  But where is  verse from Quran or a statement from hadith on that Muslim women marriage ..  Al-Alethia ?   
    Do not let silence become your legacy.. Question everything   
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim     
  • Inter faith Marriage OK
     Reply #18 - December 08, 2012, 04:00 AM
    @yeez


    Wed not idolatresses till they believe; for lo! a believing bondwoman is better than an idolatress though she please you; and give not your daughters in marriage to idolaters till they believe, for lo! a believing slave is better than an idolater though he please you    . These invite unto the Fire, and Allah inviteth unto the Garden, and unto forgiveness by His grace, and expoundeth His revelations to mankind that haply they may remember.
    (Quran 2:221)

    ^ This verse forbids Muslims (men and women) from marrying mushrikeen (the dreaded polytheists, idol worshipppers, etc).

    This day are (all) good things made lawful for you. The food of those who have received the Scripture is lawful for you, and your food is lawful for them. And so are the virtuous women of the believers and the virtuous women of those who received the Scripture before you (lawful for you) when ye give them their marriage portions and live with them in honour, not in fornication, nor taking them as secret concubines. Whoso denieth the faith, his work is vain and he will be among the losers in the Hereafter.
    (Quran 5:5)

    ^ This one allows Muslim men to marry ahl-al-kitab women (Jews and Christians) but does not extend the same allowance to Muslim women so it's deduced that they can only marry Muslim men.
  • Inter faith Marriage OK
     Reply #19 - December 08, 2012, 04:09 AM
    Quote from: Al-Alethia on December 08, 2012, 04:00 AM
    @yeez


    Wed not idolatresses till they believe; for lo! a believing bondwoman is better than an idolatress though she please you; and give not your daughters in marriage to idolaters till they believe, for lo! a believing slave is better than an idolater though he please you    . These invite unto the Fire, and Allah inviteth unto the Garden, and unto forgiveness by His grace, and expoundeth His revelations to mankind that haply they may remember.
    (Quran 2:221)

    ^ This verse forbids Muslims (men and women) from marrying mushrikeen (the dreaded polytheists, idol worshipppers, etc).

    This day are (all) good things made lawful for you. The food of those who have received the Scripture is lawful for you, and your food is lawful for them. And so are the virtuous women of the believers and the virtuous women of those who received the Scripture before you (lawful for you) when ye give them their marriage portions and live with them in honour, not in fornication, nor taking them as secret concubines. Whoso denieth the faith, his work is vain and he will be among the losers in the Hereafter.
    (Quran 5:5)

    ^ This one allows Muslim men to marry ahl-al-kitab women (Jews and Christians) but does not extend the same allowance to Muslim women so it's deduced that they can only marry Muslim men.

    No...no..no..nooooooooooo.,   This deducing business is NOT allowed in Quran..  No assumptions and no extrapolations Al-Alethia.,  
    So your search for those words/verses  on Muslimah  marriage rules should continue..
    Do not let silence become your legacy.. Question everything   
    I renounced my faith to become a kafir, 
    the beloved betrayed me and turned in to  a Muslim     
  • Inter faith Marriage OK
     Reply #20 - December 08, 2012, 04:27 AM
    But Allah never allowed Muslim women to marry non-Muslim men. He specifically forbade them from marrying mushrikeen and allowed Muslim men to marry Christians/Jews but only allowed Muslim women to marry "believers".

    http://www.onislam.net/english/ask-the-scholar/family/marital-relationships/175519-a-muslim-woman-married-to-a-non-muslim-is-she-still-considered-a-muslim.html
  • Inter faith Marriage OK
     Reply #21 - December 08, 2012, 08:55 AM
    In many legal systems, if something is silent on a matter, a judge will propose something.  But there are always a set, a number of possible solutions.

    I think here it is perfectly legitimate to deduce a muslim woman can marry a person of the book, the other deduction that they cannot was only one of the possible deductions.

    I agree that pagans and other non pobs are destined for hell, but they were in any case weren't they?
    When you are a Bear of Very Little Brain, and you Think of Things, you find sometimes that a Thing which seemed very Thingish inside you is quite different when it gets out into the open and has other people looking at it.


    A.A. Milne,

    "We cannot slaughter each other out of the human impasse"
  • Inter faith Marriage OK
     Reply #22 - December 08, 2012, 09:03 AM
    Which makes me wonder why anyone calls Islam a religion.

    As I see it it is a set of rules - something nation states do, designed to be imperialist and conquering, with a few rituals as add ons and decorations, like square bashing in the army.

    Has anyone seriously discussed Islam as a political and legal system, I see it as a form of tyranny - submission - comparing it with others and asking where did it get its rules from?
    When you are a Bear of Very Little Brain, and you Think of Things, you find sometimes that a Thing which seemed very Thingish inside you is quite different when it gets out into the open and has other people looking at it.


    A.A. Milne,

    "We cannot slaughter each other out of the human impasse"
  • Inter faith Marriage OK
     Reply #23 - December 11, 2012, 02:57 PM
    I am told in India Msulim/Hindu marriages (men/women of either) are very common (Hindu is not a biblical religion i.e not people of the book) so its been practiced a lot there and no one has an issue with it.
    Teach us to care and not to care / Teach us to sit still.
    What do we live for; if it is not to make life less difficult to each other
    You are the music while the music lasts.
    T.S.Eliot
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